I think ill take it from here: I'll spend the money first on getting 2-3 jace, 2 mesas, top/balance, 1 tundra, and all the other cheap stuff (swords, entreat, terminus, etc) then see where I am. If I have a bunch left, I might get a clique, as It can also go in my modern deck.
I love how patient you need to be with the deck, and it really rewards that kinda of thoughtful, patient, play style.
I actually think I kinda like the redblast's main, as it seems really helpful to have aiding to get your big spells to resolve in counter wars.
Edit: Whats the consensus on playing some number of stoneforge in miracles? I already own a batterskull.
Wow, that list looks awesome, I'll eventually look into buying the clique's and karaks, as those interactions are just really awesome. I've been following Joe Lossett's list, is he different from what others play?
I'm surprised that force isnt essential to the deck, can you explain more of that with maybe some examples of when you are siding it out?
Edit: I just took a look on the source, and it is kinda strange how similar it looks like the deck sideboards and plays, with modern UWr control. It's like the deck has sweepers or counters, and only one half is good in the deck vs most matchups so you side out the rest.
Would you say its worth it to invest in the fluster storms? Or to try and save up for FoW?
So a little background, been playing magic for about 2 years, seriously getting into modern. Play UWr control in modern and absolutely love the deck. Built most of manaless dredge to get into legacy before realizing that it is extremely linear and in reality I'm a control player at heart. So I proxied up UWr miracles and absolutely fell in love with the deck.
Stuff I own:
4 snapcaster
4 scalding tarn
some of the cheaper cards, terminus, supreme verdict, swords, etc.
Now my question is, with about 600-700 to spend, where do I start?
I'm hesitant to buy into the other fetches barring all the buzz on a reprint, so I'm leaning towards FoW, or the Jace's I need. I could also run the FoW in merfolk, which is about 80% complete (without wastelands unfortunately). I could also get the Clique's as I don't have any and they would be a welcome addition to my modern UWr deck.
I'm happy the deck runs a proportionally small number of duals (two tundra, one volcanic) and have been thinking either, to just play it as UW, or substitute the volcanic with a steam vents temporarily, as the deck only really plays 2 main deck red spells.
So what are your guys thought, where do you think would be the most bang for my buck in investing?
Was playing at an FNM where I won the die-roll. I say the number on the die, and the opposing player quickly asks, "you on the draw?" So I instinctively say "yep" automatically hearing if he is asking if I'm on the play as someone normally would. I balk "no wait, what I meant...", he smiles and goes. "Got ya!...you can be on the play." So cheeky and hysterical. loved it.
The power of this deck lies in the sideboard. Using up precious sideboard space for a combo that might make one matchup better will make others so much worse. Uwr probably has the best board options in modern and imo is what keeps the deck coming back. I hardly lose games wben I draw my sideboard cards.
Agreed. I only have 2 or 1-ofs in the board with the goal that every single one can hit more than one deck. I find myself easily bringing in 4-6 cards for every post sideboard match I play.
What does venser do? What match ups do you want him?
In legacy he's great vs show and tell. He's great vs equipment, and he's great vs liliana. And like you said, karakas is really strong with venser.
Do any of those things apply to modern? There's no show and tell. There's no stoneforge to make equipment popular. However there is a noticeable amount of lilianas being played.
Venser is great vs liliana, but so is the card cryptic command. Cryptic command is also great with the card snapcaster mage.
I don't see a good reason to play venser in modern.
No I totally agree with you. I only own 2 cryptics and they have gotten way to high in price for me to buy another now, so I as thinking of Venser as a nice way to supplement a little of that. Been playing 2/2 counterflux/cryptic split, which I like, but Venser seems like he could be nice in some situations.
Also with Pact I would really really be very worried about being tapped out or almost tapped out on the next turn, which is exactly what this deck fears the most.
Has anyone thought of playing Venser, Shaper Savant as a possible one of, or even in the side? It would seem to be pretty relevant, i.e. can counter uncounterable stuff (such as emrakul, nvm they still get the extra turn from hardcasting it...), bounce any permanent (thinking planeswalkers primarily), at worst he is a 2/2 with flash. Granted he isnt the house that he is in legacy without karakas but he still seems like he could do some work, particularly as flexible as his abilities are.
I'm not totally sure how the dryad arbor green plan is played. Do you just hope to have the dryad arbor in your opener, have it survive, then be able to use it to cast cards to kill hate then be able to sack it to cabal therapy or dread return?
Yeah the games usually go pretty long, thats the norm. And as for when does it win, it takes some practice and understanding of the deck to get a feel when you can flip into the "win" mode, as each game is so different and diverse. For me, thats why I love this deck so much, every game is a puzzle and how you play needs to vary with each match up, keeps it interesting.
Honestly, it sounds like there is a lot going on that is contributing to your decision, and that quitting magic may provide some relief to the stress, particularly financial. But I think you made a great point that it serves as a "night out" for you. I think in the end you need to weigh the intangibles of playing, even if you are unable to be competitive. It can serve as a great way to get your mind of things, interact with others, which may be worth some of the cost of playing at FNM or being unable to buy cards.
So much combo lately, does anyone run surgical extraction in their sideboard? If you do, how are you using it lately? I've been thinking to up the vendilion clique count to 3 and remand up to 3 to gain knowledge of their hand and then pick away combo pieces once I can counter or send them to thr graveyard...
I ran extraction some time ago, it was good, but not spectacular, against twin, you need to remove splinter twin (Pestermite and deciever also work, but removing them is not as good) and they won´t play it until they have some counters to stop yours, same against storm, unless they discard grapeshot to ravings, extraction is not that good, and removing anything else won´t hurt them that much. I run counterflux, rest in peace and engienieered explosives against combo and it works out.
I run it as a 1 of in the board. Vs combo I usually bring in Relic (I like it better than RIP as it doesn't hose our snapcaster as much but its personal preference with that choice), EE, and surgical. I like surgical as a 1 of, it is relevant in match ups that tend to have one power card, can be good against storm and other combo, and even works against tron as it can hit non-basics. (also can snag the pod combo right out from under them as the creatures hit the yard before getting the -1/-1 counters on them so you can surgical in response.
Vs storm I think its pretty hard for them to go off turn 3 without an electromancer in play, which is easily dealt with. Its all about countering that first ritual effect and trying to timewalk them a turn. Also its pretty hard for them to go off around a counterflux if you play it right. Granted they can past in flames around the counteflux if they play around it, but honestly most people playing storm aren't doing that. It's all about keeping their electromancer and Pyromancer Ascension off the board as it slows them down dramatically. Not the best matchup but one that benefits greatly from practice. I play vs storm really really frequently and I think the first 5 times I played against it I lost before I got a better understanding of how the deck works and how to keep it from working.
He really miss played quite horribly; he had never seen runed halo before and misunderstood it as it preventing targeting of anything I control (and he never asked for a rules check, just kept playing along). Tron with a mediocre pilot is hard to beat, none the less with a very experienced pilot. it has so much inevitability to it that if we don't draw into land hate (the surgical was absolutely amazing in that match-up) we just get blown out.
I actually play 0 spell snare's, but 2 main deck counterflux. Been absolutely loving counterflux as their seems to be a bunch of storm running around in my meta, so it helps a whole ton and is great in the mirror.
A little 3 round lgs tournament again today.
Round 1 vs storm:
G1: Play a turn 2 snapcaster at end of turn and ride him to victory killing electromancers and the like holding up overloaded counterflux.
G2: mull to 6, he goes on bolt plan, I wear//tear his Pyromancer Ascension, he empties for 6 and I have no response. Draw into supreme verdict but only have one white, hold him off with cryptic + snapcaster till I draw into white for verdict, but I'm at 6 and he past in flames bolt bolt for the win.
Sideboard: -path +anger of the gods.
G3: I turn 1 relic, and he plays into my EE for 2.pretty quick from their out, colonnade and snapcaster beats.
Round 2 vs G/R tron:
G1: Horrible matchup, I keep him off tron for 3 turns with tech edge and countering his search spells. I have no clock and he emrakul's for the win.
G2: Draw into triple snap and remand plus lands. Snap beats quick with drawing into remdans and leaks to keep him off karn.
G3: He lands a turn 3 karn and I cant do anything about it. He I guess is drawing into blanks while +4 on karn exiling my hand. Play runed halo naming karn, he miss plays not exiling runed halo. Becuase of this. I manage to get him to 8 with burn + colonnade so he ultimates karn (which I honestly think won me the game.) Draw into sowing salt taking out his tower, then with stony silence and tech edge + surgical, which was totally brutal stranding almost all of his deck in his hand. GG
Round 3 vs U/G control/devotion?
Cool homebrew with lots of counters, walkers, and huge creatures.
G1: Manage to land a turn 5 batterskull through his counters, eventually after dealing with his walkers, tamyo and the likes, I get the win through a good old overloaded counteflux to end a counter war over a lethal bolt + helix play at the end of his turn.
Sideboard???? +1 hallowed burial, -1 anger of the gods.
G2: Bate out the counter to land a turn 4 ajani. Able to plus ajani and through that and defending him with snapcaster + batterskull ultimate him and he scoops.
3-0.
This is the second week in a row I've been able to go 3-0. Granted its a small tournament but the deck is so versatile, and having a good varied sideboard and a strong understanding of the deck make it really awesome. Although a big drawback is that games take FOREVER!!
I love how patient you need to be with the deck, and it really rewards that kinda of thoughtful, patient, play style.
I actually think I kinda like the redblast's main, as it seems really helpful to have aiding to get your big spells to resolve in counter wars.
Edit: Whats the consensus on playing some number of stoneforge in miracles? I already own a batterskull.
I'm surprised that force isnt essential to the deck, can you explain more of that with maybe some examples of when you are siding it out?
Edit: I just took a look on the source, and it is kinda strange how similar it looks like the deck sideboards and plays, with modern UWr control. It's like the deck has sweepers or counters, and only one half is good in the deck vs most matchups so you side out the rest.
Would you say its worth it to invest in the fluster storms? Or to try and save up for FoW?
Stuff I own:
4 snapcaster
4 scalding tarn
some of the cheaper cards, terminus, supreme verdict, swords, etc.
Now my question is, with about 600-700 to spend, where do I start?
I'm hesitant to buy into the other fetches barring all the buzz on a reprint, so I'm leaning towards FoW, or the Jace's I need. I could also run the FoW in merfolk, which is about 80% complete (without wastelands unfortunately). I could also get the Clique's as I don't have any and they would be a welcome addition to my modern UWr deck.
I'm happy the deck runs a proportionally small number of duals (two tundra, one volcanic) and have been thinking either, to just play it as UW, or substitute the volcanic with a steam vents temporarily, as the deck only really plays 2 main deck red spells.
So what are your guys thought, where do you think would be the most bang for my buck in investing?
Thanks for the help!
- Mike
Thanks
Agreed. I only have 2 or 1-ofs in the board with the goal that every single one can hit more than one deck. I find myself easily bringing in 4-6 cards for every post sideboard match I play.
No I totally agree with you. I only own 2 cryptics and they have gotten way to high in price for me to buy another now, so I as thinking of Venser as a nice way to supplement a little of that. Been playing 2/2 counterflux/cryptic split, which I like, but Venser seems like he could be nice in some situations.
Also with Pact I would really really be very worried about being tapped out or almost tapped out on the next turn, which is exactly what this deck fears the most.
such as emrakul, nvm they still get the extra turn from hardcasting it...), bounce any permanent (thinking planeswalkers primarily), at worst he is a 2/2 with flash. Granted he isnt the house that he is in legacy without karakas but he still seems like he could do some work, particularly as flexible as his abilities are.thoughts?
I run it as a 1 of in the board. Vs combo I usually bring in Relic (I like it better than RIP as it doesn't hose our snapcaster as much but its personal preference with that choice), EE, and surgical. I like surgical as a 1 of, it is relevant in match ups that tend to have one power card, can be good against storm and other combo, and even works against tron as it can hit non-basics. (also can snag the pod combo right out from under them as the creatures hit the yard before getting the -1/-1 counters on them so you can surgical in response.
He really miss played quite horribly; he had never seen runed halo before and misunderstood it as it preventing targeting of anything I control (and he never asked for a rules check, just kept playing along). Tron with a mediocre pilot is hard to beat, none the less with a very experienced pilot. it has so much inevitability to it that if we don't draw into land hate (the surgical was absolutely amazing in that match-up) we just get blown out.
A little 3 round lgs tournament again today.
Round 1 vs storm:
G1: Play a turn 2 snapcaster at end of turn and ride him to victory killing electromancers and the like holding up overloaded counterflux.
Sideboard: +2 runed halo, +2 relic of progenitus, +1 wear//tear, +1 Celestial purge, +1 engineered explosives. - 3 path, -1 electrolyze, -1 batterskull, -1 helix, -1 bolt
G2: mull to 6, he goes on bolt plan, I wear//tear his Pyromancer Ascension, he empties for 6 and I have no response. Draw into supreme verdict but only have one white, hold him off with cryptic + snapcaster till I draw into white for verdict, but I'm at 6 and he past in flames bolt bolt for the win.
Sideboard: -path +anger of the gods.
G3: I turn 1 relic, and he plays into my EE for 2.pretty quick from their out, colonnade and snapcaster beats.
Round 2 vs G/R tron:
G1: Horrible matchup, I keep him off tron for 3 turns with tech edge and countering his search spells. I have no clock and he emrakul's for the win.
Sideboard: +2 runed halo, +1 wear//tear, +1 sowing salt, +2 celestial flair, +1 stony silence. - 2 mana leak, - 2 lightning bolt, -2 lightning helix, -1 electrolyze.
G2: Draw into triple snap and remand plus lands. Snap beats quick with drawing into remdans and leaks to keep him off karn.
G3: He lands a turn 3 karn and I cant do anything about it. He I guess is drawing into blanks while +4 on karn exiling my hand. Play runed halo naming karn, he miss plays not exiling runed halo. Becuase of this. I manage to get him to 8 with burn + colonnade so he ultimates karn (which I honestly think won me the game.) Draw into sowing salt taking out his tower, then with stony silence and tech edge + surgical, which was totally brutal stranding almost all of his deck in his hand. GG
Round 3 vs U/G control/devotion?
Cool homebrew with lots of counters, walkers, and huge creatures.
G1: Manage to land a turn 5 batterskull through his counters, eventually after dealing with his walkers, tamyo and the likes, I get the win through a good old overloaded counteflux to end a counter war over a lethal bolt + helix play at the end of his turn.
Sideboard???? +1 hallowed burial, -1 anger of the gods.
G2: Bate out the counter to land a turn 4 ajani. Able to plus ajani and through that and defending him with snapcaster + batterskull ultimate him and he scoops.
3-0.
This is the second week in a row I've been able to go 3-0. Granted its a small tournament but the deck is so versatile, and having a good varied sideboard and a strong understanding of the deck make it really awesome. Although a big drawback is that games take FOREVER!!