I could see this in bigger cubes that were running basically every green 2 and 3 with an ETB trigger (visionary, wall of blossoms, ewit, rec sage, wood elves, the elves that get a land in hand when they etb, etc) you could probably have a deck that came together semi-regularly that could cast this for "free" on turn 2 or 3 pretty commonly, and there it's pretty strong. I mean, a turn 2 or 3 where you go wood elves, sac wood elves to this is pretty potent. I think that's not something that you have room for in a normal small to mid size cube.
I would run this as another cultivate in a bigger cube rather than a swap (maybe 1 cultivate and this instead of cultivate and reach) and give players the chance to build around it. I don't know how bad the 1GG casting cost actually is - most of the decks where I was running cultivate were base green with a couple splash colors rather than true 3- or 4-color decks.
I love this card, and 5-6 years ago it would have been a slam dunk. A 3-mana 3/3 that gives you a pretty strong equipment for free was exactly the kind of value 2-for-1 we were looking for. Now I think this card is too slow, and even as someone who doesn't run the best boros card (Comet, because I hate the design) I don't have room for this I don't think.
I mean this feels like a better Inkwell Leviathan, but yah I agree with the consensus on this forum.
Inkwell can't be chumped and can be tinkered, and shroud is better than this protection ability (albeit only slightly - basically against tappers and PW's with removal modes that you somehow kept alive - so just wandering emperor I think lol?)
I find inkwell to STILL be one of the best tinker creature targets because it's so hard for most non-white decks to interact with.
I think this is far and away the worst emrakul. Promised end is gonna be cheaper (this madness cost is a pipe dream, I can't remember the last time I had access to 6 colorless mana without channel) and is just as likely to win the game with the cast trigger, and Aeons Torn is far more impactful and just as easy to cheat into play.
Yeah it's basically impossible to kill, but it can be chumped with flyers which makes it horrendous to cheat into play.
For those that don't know (I didn't), commit a crime targeting your opponent or anything they control (essentially) so in addition to normal draw spells removal will also pump this creature.
This is a cool little creatures. By itself, it attacks as a 3/3 then a 4/4, and if you support energy, it can do even more. Not a fit for my cube, but I appreciate the design.
Yeah, white has some incredible 3's to get back, but my main problem with this is you would have to cut one of those incredible 3's to make room for it. Sure, getting back Adeline, or Blade Splicer, or White Plume, etc with =2/=2 and vigilance is great, but wouldn't you rather just have all those great 3's that don't have a chance to whiff? With so much black removal now being exile based as well, I think this is the fail case of getting a 1-drop back or being a horrendous equipment that I don't want to run it.
Like, how much better is this than the 1-mana white unearth thing? It's certainly better, but I don't think it's an order of magnitude better or anything.
I don’t feel like rad counters are that much of an issue, even without the reminder text. It feels like it’s about as complex as the monarch (a little more complex, but goes away or can just end the game with this card). It’s definitely less complex than initiative/the ring tempts you/daybound.
That said, I dislike that they’re called rad counters but that the reminder card says “radiation”.
It's more that it's just another thing players have to internalize for a couple (at most) cards because the card doesn't tell you what it does. Monarch is extremely easy to internalize because the payoff is just draw a card and the swap condition is simple.
Initiative is not really easy to internalize (if you asked me what all the rooms in the dungeon do I honestly couldn't tell you), but it's easy to remember that it's very strong and there's enough density of high power cards with initiative that it's worth the squeeze.
Rads are another "upkeep" trigger (although it's main phase 1 like sagas for some reasons - I assume to avoid the feel bad of milling a card you scryed to the top?) to keep track of that will have no impact on the game most of the time, is not really easy to remember (you mill and then based on what you mill different things happen, oh and you have to mill a different number of cards next turn based on what you mill), and both players have to track the thing.
Now, if an absurdly powerful and unique card is in one of these decks that uses rads, will I run it? Yeah, and I'll probably consider running this at that point too. But while a scalable languish is certainly powerful, it's not powerful or unique enough to make me want to deal with the mechanic alone. And I'm further frustrated by the fact that this card could have just been in Modern Horizons 3 and completely omitted the rad text and still been great, the only reason it has the rad text is because it has to fit the flavor of the UB fallout decks.
Edit - I also don't run any of the "ring tempts you" cards for the same reason. There are certainly some that are on the edge power level wise, but the ring is annoying to remember and not worth it for me.
You can argue that Daretti and Kolaghan's Command are pretty much equal as generic good stuff cards, but Daretti has the edge in also being an extremely valuable roleplayer for artifacts matters.
Personally I have Chaos Defiler / Daretti / Kolaghan's Command as my top 3 Rakdos cards of choice, and it isn't particularly close. While not 1 to 1 comparisons, there are a good amount of mono red / black cards that does a lot of what Fire Covenant wants to do as a one-sided sweeper.
- Delayed Blast Fireball (the best of the bunch by far if you're willing to play foretell cards)
Delayed Blast Fireball also went in this update (finally got around to making a big order for cards from the last few years) and I suspect I will settle on Command, Chaos Defiler, and Daretti, but it's cool that fire covenant has come back around from being an auto-include in like 2012 when I started, to being bad in most lists for like 5-7 years, to being back as a contender again that I have a soft spot for it and want to test it lol.
Oh this looks incredible. Languish has been a good card and this is basically Languish with mostly upside.
Even though on balance Rads are a downside for the control deck, I think being scalable is a big enough upside that I'm safe saying this is just a better Languish, so if you are running languish this is an upgrade.
Even if I was running Languish, though, I really wouldn't want to deal with Rad Counters, especially since neither version of the card has reminder text.
Cloak makes a 2/2 with ward 2, if that changes your evaluation. 3 mana for a 2/2 ward 2 isn't the worst base rate. The ward will help it stick till you can flip it.
Your right though, so many creatures have their power in an ETB that uncloaking/flipping them becomes a pretty poor rate if its just for the stat bump.
I completely forgot cloak gave ward 2 (poor manifest, getting outclassed lol). That does make it better, but not enough better. This is one of those cards (absent needing it for artifact synergies) that I consider "air" - never bad, but never more than fine and not worth taking a limited cube slot.
I would run this as another cultivate in a bigger cube rather than a swap (maybe 1 cultivate and this instead of cultivate and reach) and give players the chance to build around it. I don't know how bad the 1GG casting cost actually is - most of the decks where I was running cultivate were base green with a couple splash colors rather than true 3- or 4-color decks.
Inkwell can't be chumped and can be tinkered, and shroud is better than this protection ability (albeit only slightly - basically against tappers and PW's with removal modes that you somehow kept alive - so just wandering emperor I think lol?)
I find inkwell to STILL be one of the best tinker creature targets because it's so hard for most non-white decks to interact with.
True. I was thinking of channel shenanigans to get the cast triggers.
Yeah it's basically impossible to kill, but it can be chumped with flyers which makes it horrendous to cheat into play.
Already saw the Emrakul with madness (although I don't think she's good enough for cube) so I suspect you're right.
In any event, I love this card. If it even hits once it starts snowballing so well. I will definitely test this.
Like, how much better is this than the 1-mana white unearth thing? It's certainly better, but I don't think it's an order of magnitude better or anything.
Helping Hand. That's the white unearth.
It's more that it's just another thing players have to internalize for a couple (at most) cards because the card doesn't tell you what it does. Monarch is extremely easy to internalize because the payoff is just draw a card and the swap condition is simple.
Initiative is not really easy to internalize (if you asked me what all the rooms in the dungeon do I honestly couldn't tell you), but it's easy to remember that it's very strong and there's enough density of high power cards with initiative that it's worth the squeeze.
Rads are another "upkeep" trigger (although it's main phase 1 like sagas for some reasons - I assume to avoid the feel bad of milling a card you scryed to the top?) to keep track of that will have no impact on the game most of the time, is not really easy to remember (you mill and then based on what you mill different things happen, oh and you have to mill a different number of cards next turn based on what you mill), and both players have to track the thing.
Now, if an absurdly powerful and unique card is in one of these decks that uses rads, will I run it? Yeah, and I'll probably consider running this at that point too. But while a scalable languish is certainly powerful, it's not powerful or unique enough to make me want to deal with the mechanic alone. And I'm further frustrated by the fact that this card could have just been in Modern Horizons 3 and completely omitted the rad text and still been great, the only reason it has the rad text is because it has to fit the flavor of the UB fallout decks.
Edit - I also don't run any of the "ring tempts you" cards for the same reason. There are certainly some that are on the edge power level wise, but the ring is annoying to remember and not worth it for me.
Delayed Blast Fireball also went in this update (finally got around to making a big order for cards from the last few years) and I suspect I will settle on Command, Chaos Defiler, and Daretti, but it's cool that fire covenant has come back around from being an auto-include in like 2012 when I started, to being bad in most lists for like 5-7 years, to being back as a contender again that I have a soft spot for it and want to test it lol.
Even though on balance Rads are a downside for the control deck, I think being scalable is a big enough upside that I'm safe saying this is just a better Languish, so if you are running languish this is an upgrade.
Even if I was running Languish, though, I really wouldn't want to deal with Rad Counters, especially since neither version of the card has reminder text.
Other cards in section are Fire Covenant and Chaos Defiler (Covenant is being tested, may not stay).
I completely forgot cloak gave ward 2 (poor manifest, getting outclassed lol). That does make it better, but not enough better. This is one of those cards (absent needing it for artifact synergies) that I consider "air" - never bad, but never more than fine and not worth taking a limited cube slot.