Monastery Swiftpsear seems eh with only twelve spells. I wasn't blown away with Atarka's Command after playing two copies at the Modern Premier IQ at SCG Providence. I felt like I wanted Dromoka's Command in most matchups (Tron obviously being the exception). DC is also so good vs burn. Could be a play style preference thing. What do you guys think about Zurgo as a one of? One is obv the perfect number since you never want two, but is he too low impact?
Anyone have any thoughts, the main reason for the two Boros Charms in the sideboard is because the deck is so bad vs Engineered Explosives, so those will come as soon as I see a copy or can reasonably suspect it (UWR, Amulent Bloom, etc.) The 3 Dromoka's Commands main may seem like a lot, but I've had close to zero success versus fish, and the card also seems reasonable versus delver, GR Tron (firespout), and Twin (fight through spellskite, or sac the twin).
I played one drop zoo and finished 32nd our of 150 (5-3 record, one turn away from 6-2) at SCG Providence 6 weeks ago. Had 2 Atarka's Command mainboard and 1 Dromoka's Command sideboard. ALmost every matchup felt like I wanted more Dromoka's Command and less Atarka's.
My matchups on the day were
Jeskai Geist/Control
2 Grixis Control
2 Burn
1 Bogles
1 Through the Breach/Scapeshift
1 Merfolk
Trap seems really interesting. Finks is more for junk and bg/x because it's great at grinding out wars of attrition. I would definitely like my last three sideboard cards to help that matchup. I was thinking maybe Mirran Crusader because he seems great vs pod too, but I hate the anti synergy crusader has with rampager, which seems like one of the better cards against bg/x.
Here's the list I'll be playing tomorrow at a PreTQ. I have 3 sideboard slots open and I'm not sure what I want to do with them. Any input would be great!
I want to play a playset of Firewalkers, but I only own two and plan of making a drive to a store today to see if I can finish my playset. The upside of Thalia is that it can also come in vs storm and living end, while still being okay versus Delver. I was thinking about boarding out my Goyfs versus UR Delver, leaving them with no good Threads targets, but I'm also not sure if that's going too deep.
[quot[i]e from="Suicufnoc" url="http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/the-cube-forum/555088-low-power-cubes?comment=16"]It's also important to distinguish between the idea of a low-powered cube and a flatter powered cube. Some people cut the broken cards to promote the kind of gameplay they like. Other's cut the broken cards to give weaker cards not normal run in cubes a fighting chance[/quote] - This. Both points are the exact reasons I run the cube I do.
Lands are getting replaced asap, I just haven't had the time with finals and finishing up my undergrad. Going to be a combination of lands based on what each guild wants to do. Aggro pairs will get Shocks or Fastlands, Control pairs will get Karoos or tap fetches.
Thanks for all the feedback! I'm not saying that Muldrifter and Shriekmaw fill the same role or are even similar cards. I was just using those two as as examples because they both generate card advantage and can be evoked. It wasn't a perfect comparison and maybe even not a good one at all, those were just the two that came to mind.
I do need to put the entire cube on CubeTutor and will do so as soon as I have the time to.
Muldrifter and Shepherd of the Lost being in the same cube doesn't necessarily mean my cube has a balance problem. Blue has better 5 mana spells than white, which I think is perfectly fine. White has premium removal as well as plenty of efficient creatures. I just happen to really like Shepherd of the Lost so I cube it.
"Blatant 2 for 1's" may not have been the best choice of words. To clarify, I've found that 2 for 1's are fine as long as they are generally "good for the caster" as opposed to being "bad for the opponent". I'm sure most of you get the idea, but I'll discuss it a little more in depth because it's not generally a concept used in Magic.
Muldrifter vs. Shriekmaw
Both of these cards put you up a card, but they do it in a very different way. I cube Muldrifter and don't cube Shriekmaw because Muldrifter gives you two cards while Shriekmaw takes one from your opponent and gives you one. Playing against Muldrifter feels better than playing against Shriekmaw and I want my cube experiences to be enjoyable. Muldrifter involves decision making and upon resolving gives you more choices to make. Shriekmaw is a card that involves decision making, but once it resolves there are less decisions to be made. I want players to think and have many lines of play where the perfect line isn't always clear. Those are games that are most interesting and engaging and some 2 for 1's support this goal better than others.
I'll say this on Recurring Nightmare, cards in bananas, nuts, bonkers, absurd, and incredibly unfair once it gets going. For that to happen though, you need at the very least a creature on board and a better creature in the yard. Recurring Nightmare is only as good as what it's bringing into play. I had it in hand last Saturday night and the right play was to cast Shepherd of the Lost instead. Would playing Recurring Nightmare instead have lost me the game? I don't know, but I know I wanted a 5 mana flyer on that board instead.
On the topic of Drana. She would be the best card in this cube and probably the most and probably the least fun. I want players to think "should I kill this?" not "should I kill this on this turn or next turn?"
Shocklands
I think my issue with Shocklands isn't that they aren't interesting enough and I used to cube them, but that I want each guild to feel different and distinct. The more I think about it, I actually like Shocklands in Selesnya, Orzhov, and Boros. Not only do these guilds want untapped colored mana early, but these also have synergy with Flood Plain in Bant, Esper, and UWR decks.
I'd like to start a discussion on low power cubes and how to support various archetypes in them. As of right now, my cube plays great and most games where both players have decent draws are interesting, competitive, and offer various lines of play. This is what I want out of my cube and I honestly have little interest in doing the most broken things imaginable. The main goal of my cube is to force every drafter to think and make decisions at every point in the draft and every point during matches. I'm also fascinated with the idea of designing environments where removal that is usually very good to premium has drawbacks (think Vendetta, Staggershock, and Heat Ray in ROE). Every cube is it's own limited environment and I'd like some feedback if anyone has any experience with similar cubes. I can't post my full list right now, but I'll give some examples of cards I've excluded as well as what I've included with explanations).
FTK - Excluded (Not because it's too "powerful", because I find blatant two for one's are uninteresting)
Lightning Bolt - Included (Cheap one for one removal leads to interesting games)
Staggershock - Included (A two for one, but can't kill anything with 3 toughness ever)
Shriekmaw - Ecluded (I hope you're seeing a trend here)
Profane Command - Excluded (Keeping with the theme)
Recurring Nightmare - Included (Super interesting, can admittedly lead to busted game states, but takes some support and is incredibly mana hungry)
Mind Control Variants - Excluded (I love islands too, this was a sad, but necessary cut)
Fact or Fiction - Included (It doesn't get more interesting)
Planeswalkers - Excluded (I've messed around with the idea of putting the weaker ones in, but I'm not sure if I want to make that jump.)
ABU Duals - Excluded (I don't have a full set anyway)
Fetches - Excluded (Premium fixing should be Green in my opinion)
Shocklands - Exluded (Not great without fethces, have considered them for the hyper-aggressive guilds)
For what it's worth, many of the cards I've just listed hold their own in cubes of higher power levels, but that's just a small sample of cards from my cube. I promise it's full of trash, jk. Anyone have any thoughts?
I don't get upset about mass removal or a board wipe if it has to happen. If i drop a Balefire Dragon and you kill it, I understand that. I do get ticked when I'm doing something sweet that's good for me and not really bad for anyone else and it gets blasted just because that's person is a dick. Even then though, I'm not going to quit the game, but my next Cruel Ultimatum is going their way.
What do you mean by splash hate for fauna shaman? Your mindcensors? Would playing more deathrite shaman over bop be better without fauna shaman? Since deathrite its likely a better top deck that provides reach.
The splash hate like Shadow of Doubt/Mindsensors that are meant for Pod and Scapeshift. The latest list has hate for UWR, Jund, Pod, and Scapeshift mainboard, which are four of the more popular decks. I might try to find room for a dismember since it's so good vs the Twin decks.
New List. Cut Fauna Shamans to avoid getting hit by Splash hate and added more actual hate. Specifically Thrun because UWR literally has no way to deal with it. Looking to squeeze in another Teeg and Finks to the SB.
4 Goblin Guide
4 Kird Ape
4 Loam Lion
1 Zurgo Bellstriker
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Ghor-Clan Rampager
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Path to Exile
4 Lightning Helix
3 Dromoka's Command
4 Arid Mesa
3 Windswept Heath
2 Stomping Ground
2 Sacred Foundry
1 Temple Garden
1 Mountain
1 Plains
1 Forest
1 Horizon Canopy
4 Kor Firewalker
3 Molten Rain
2 Blood Moon
2 Destructive Revelry
2 Volcanic Fallout
2 Boros Charm
Anyone have any thoughts, the main reason for the two Boros Charms in the sideboard is because the deck is so bad vs Engineered Explosives, so those will come as soon as I see a copy or can reasonably suspect it (UWR, Amulent Bloom, etc.) The 3 Dromoka's Commands main may seem like a lot, but I've had close to zero success versus fish, and the card also seems reasonable versus delver, GR Tron (firespout), and Twin (fight through spellskite, or sac the twin).
My matchups on the day were
Jeskai Geist/Control
2 Grixis Control
2 Burn
1 Bogles
1 Through the Breach/Scapeshift
1 Merfolk
4 Kird Ape
4 Loam Lion
4 Goblin Guide
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Ghor-Clan Rampager
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lightning Helix
4 Path to Exile
2 Mutagenic Growth
2 Atarka's Command
3 Windswept Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Sacred Foundry
2 Stomping Ground
1 Temple Garden
1 Mountain
1 Plains
1 Forest
1 Horizon Canopy
4 Kor Firewalker
3 Molten Rain
2 Blood Moon
2 Destructive Revelry
2 Boros Charm
1 Dromoka's Command
1 Volcanic Fallout
I'll write a report tonight once I'm at home. Was a turn away from finishing in the top 16.
4 Wild Nacatl
4 Loam Lion
4 Kird Ape
4 Goblin Guide
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Aven Mindcensor (Mise)
2 Ghor-Clan Rampager
Instants: 12
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lightning Helix
4 Path to Exile
2 Stomping Ground
2 Sacred Foundry
1 Temple Garden
4 Wooded Foothills
4 Arid Mesa
3 Windswept Heath
1 Mountain
1 Plains
1 Forest
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Kessig Wolf Run
3 Molten Rain
2 Kor Firewalker
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Destructive Revelry
2 Pillar of Flame
1 Kitchen Finks
3 ???
I want to play a playset of Firewalkers, but I only own two and plan of making a drive to a store today to see if I can finish my playset. The upside of Thalia is that it can also come in vs storm and living end, while still being okay versus Delver. I was thinking about boarding out my Goyfs versus UR Delver, leaving them with no good Threads targets, but I'm also not sure if that's going too deep.
Also, I managed to load roughly 90%+ of my cube in cube tutor. Here's the link my friends. http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/11421
Lands are getting replaced asap, I just haven't had the time with finals and finishing up my undergrad. Going to be a combination of lands based on what each guild wants to do. Aggro pairs will get Shocks or Fastlands, Control pairs will get Karoos or tap fetches.
I do need to put the entire cube on CubeTutor and will do so as soon as I have the time to.
Muldrifter and Shepherd of the Lost being in the same cube doesn't necessarily mean my cube has a balance problem. Blue has better 5 mana spells than white, which I think is perfectly fine. White has premium removal as well as plenty of efficient creatures. I just happen to really like Shepherd of the Lost so I cube it.
Muldrifter vs. Shriekmaw
Both of these cards put you up a card, but they do it in a very different way. I cube Muldrifter and don't cube Shriekmaw because Muldrifter gives you two cards while Shriekmaw takes one from your opponent and gives you one. Playing against Muldrifter feels better than playing against Shriekmaw and I want my cube experiences to be enjoyable. Muldrifter involves decision making and upon resolving gives you more choices to make. Shriekmaw is a card that involves decision making, but once it resolves there are less decisions to be made. I want players to think and have many lines of play where the perfect line isn't always clear. Those are games that are most interesting and engaging and some 2 for 1's support this goal better than others.
I'll say this on Recurring Nightmare, cards in bananas, nuts, bonkers, absurd, and incredibly unfair once it gets going. For that to happen though, you need at the very least a creature on board and a better creature in the yard. Recurring Nightmare is only as good as what it's bringing into play. I had it in hand last Saturday night and the right play was to cast Shepherd of the Lost instead. Would playing Recurring Nightmare instead have lost me the game? I don't know, but I know I wanted a 5 mana flyer on that board instead.
On the topic of Drana. She would be the best card in this cube and probably the most and probably the least fun. I want players to think "should I kill this?" not "should I kill this on this turn or next turn?"
Shocklands
I think my issue with Shocklands isn't that they aren't interesting enough and I used to cube them, but that I want each guild to feel different and distinct. The more I think about it, I actually like Shocklands in Selesnya, Orzhov, and Boros. Not only do these guilds want untapped colored mana early, but these also have synergy with Flood Plain in Bant, Esper, and UWR decks.
FTK - Excluded (Not because it's too "powerful", because I find blatant two for one's are uninteresting)
Lightning Bolt - Included (Cheap one for one removal leads to interesting games)
Staggershock - Included (A two for one, but can't kill anything with 3 toughness ever)
Shriekmaw - Ecluded (I hope you're seeing a trend here)
Profane Command - Excluded (Keeping with the theme)
Recurring Nightmare - Included (Super interesting, can admittedly lead to busted game states, but takes some support and is incredibly mana hungry)
Mind Control Variants - Excluded (I love islands too, this was a sad, but necessary cut)
Fact or Fiction - Included (It doesn't get more interesting)
Planeswalkers - Excluded (I've messed around with the idea of putting the weaker ones in, but I'm not sure if I want to make that jump.)
ABU Duals - Excluded (I don't have a full set anyway)
Fetches - Excluded (Premium fixing should be Green in my opinion)
Shocklands - Exluded (Not great without fethces, have considered them for the hyper-aggressive guilds)
For what it's worth, many of the cards I've just listed hold their own in cubes of higher power levels, but that's just a small sample of cards from my cube. I promise it's full of trash, jk. Anyone have any thoughts?
3 Gavony Township
1 Godless Shrine
2 Horizon Canopy
1 Marsh Flats
1 Overgrown Tomb
4 Razorverge Thicket
2 Forest
2 Plains
2 Stirring Wildwood
1 Temple Garden
4 Verdant Catacomb
Creatures (29)
1 Aven Mindscensor
1 Baneslayer Angel
3 Birds of Paradise
1 Deathrite Shaman
4 Fauna Shaman
1 Gaddock Teeg
2 Kitchen Finks
4 Loxodon Smiter
4 Noble Hierarch
1 Orzhov Pontiff
2 Qasali Pridemage
1 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Wilt-Leaf Liege
4 Lingering Souls
Instants (4)
4 Path to Exile
1Aven Mindsensor
1 Baneslayer Angel
2 Dismember
2 Fracturing Gust
1 Gaddock Teeg
2 Linvala, Keeper of Silence
1 Spellskite
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Thrun, the Last Troll
3 Gavony Township
1 Godless Shrine
2 Horizon Canopy
1 Marsh Flats
1 Overgrown Tomb
4 Razorverge Thicket
2 Forest
2 Plains
2 Stirring Wildwood
1 Temple Garden
4 Verdant Catacomb
Creatures (28)
2 Aven Mindscensor
1 Baneslayer Angel
4 Birds of Paradise
2 Kitchen Finks
1 Hero of Bladehold
4 Loxodon Smiter
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Qasali Pridemage
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
4 Wilt-Leaf Liege
4 Lingering Souls
Instants (4)
4 Path to Exile
Artifacts (1)
1 Sword of War and Peace
1 Aven Mindsensor
2 Dismember
2 Fracturing Gust
1 Kitchen Finks
2 Gaddock Teeg
2 Linvala, Keeper of Silence
2 Relic of Pregenitus
1 Spellskite
1 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
The splash hate like Shadow of Doubt/Mindsensors that are meant for Pod and Scapeshift. The latest list has hate for UWR, Jund, Pod, and Scapeshift mainboard, which are four of the more popular decks. I might try to find room for a dismember since it's so good vs the Twin decks.
3 Gavony Township
1 Godless Shrine
2 Horizon Canopy
1 Marsh Flats
1 Overgrown Tomb
4 Razorverge Thicket
2 Forest
1 Plains
3 Stirring Wildwood
1 Temple Garden
4 Verdant Catacomb
Creatures (29)
3 Aven Mindscensor
1 Baneslayer Angel
3 Birds of Paradise
1 Deathrite Shaman
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Linvala, Keeper of Silence
4 Loxodon Smiter
4 Noble Hierarch
2 Qasali Pridemage
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Thrun, the Last Troll
4 Wilt-Leaf Liege
4 Lingering Souls
Instants (4)
4 Path to Exile
1 Baneslayer Angel
2 Chalice of the Void
2 Creeping Corrosion
1 Kataki, War's Wage
1 Kitchen Finks
2 Dismember
4 Rest in Peace
1 Spellskite
1 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben