Should I do a whole rework for this deck to include Sissay? I feel like a lot has come out over the past few weeks that is making me reconsider how the whole deck is approached.
This is actually an interesting planeswalker, in my opinion, because we run all 10 fetchlands. The minus is fairly underwhelming, admittedly, but still.
The problem with Samut + Doubling Season is that Doubling Season is a one card combo that does not need Samut to win the game on the spot. The situation you're describing with Doubling Season works with almost any other planeswalker, so why not use them instead of Samut? Samut should really go into superfriends decks that rely on their general or just in heavier creature decks instead.
Spark double seems like a no brainer auto include. i havent tested it yet, waiting for war mythic to come in b4 i make swaps.
I was thinking of trying a lot though.
I want to try
ashiok
bolas
JtMS
spark double
comand the dread horde
elderspell
deliver unto evil
karns bastion.
i also want to get a copy of teferi's protection.
List is tight though. The only stuff I can really see as being replaceable is the countermagic and the 2cmc library manipulation enchantments.
I think you should try adding Samut to your deck. With doubling season it is insanely gross. Have you ever paid 4 mana to draw 14 gain 14 and put 14 permanents into play? It’s nutted.
I did cut a bunch of the other cards you mentioned.
Her ultimate is good, don't get me wrong, but that's literally the only interaction where she's good: with doubling season. It's waaay too limited in my opinion.
What else do you have in the deck that can do Cleansing Nova's job?
I generally prioritize mass destruction over recursion because in my experience, blowing out a board has more of an impact than recursion with a restriction on top of it. HOWEVER, if you feel you have your destruction bases covered (with Cleansing Nova, I'm specifically referring to the destroy all artifacts and enchantments part), then yes, go ahead. Even though I'm playing skeptic here, it is an excellent recursion card for the deck.
Also, since Cleansing Nova has flexibility, you may want to consider a less flexible mass destruction card in the deck as well.
Yeah, I'm debating here. Possibly considering Sphinx's Revelation as well. But I do run Austere Command, so mass artifact/enchantment removal is covered.
Also, opinions on Aminatou, the Fateshifter? Taking another look at it, as it's plus is alright, and it's minus (not ult) seems really good as it allows us to renew other planeswalkers and activate their abiltiies twice a turn. 3 CMC is also appealing, but the ultimate is fairly mediocre.
Spark double seems like a no brainer auto include. i havent tested it yet, waiting for war mythic to come in b4 i make swaps.
I was thinking of trying a lot though.
I want to try
ashiok
bolas
JtMS
spark double
comand the dread horde
elderspell
deliver unto evil
karns bastion.
i also want to get a copy of teferi's protection.
List is tight though. The only stuff I can really see as being replaceable is the countermagic and the 2cmc library manipulation enchantments.
Mehhhhhhhhhhh. It’s colorless and it’s only busted if we have 4 or more walkers out. It’s seems much worse then other mana rocks, unless we are already winning.
It is super cute though.
That's sort of where I was leaning on for it. I would possibly like to test it, but yeah I would say unless you have at least two out, it's not worth it.
Yeah, I noticed that as well. This deck in general is not very budget friendly, admittedly, but the RL has been doing work over the past few years. The general isn't very relevant, to be honest. You could easily swap in Sliver Hivelord as an indestructible blocker, and possibly even get more success out of him.
I wish they would make either a 5-color planeswalker that can be your general (the new Nicol Bolas being able to do that would have been amazing), or just something that synergizes well with planeswalkers (i.e. five color Atraxa)
Lame. I got rid of my Sliver Queen last year, before the spike. And agreed, the general is less relevant for superfriends - I switched to Ramos, Dragon Engine and honestly feel like he's better.
I admittedly rarely cast Sliver Queen, so the general is pretty much whatever people think works best.
I noticed that Sliver Queen has spiked to $114 unfortunately probably putting it of range of most players. Reserved list doing it's work.
sigh.
Yeah, I noticed that as well. This deck in general is not very budget friendly, admittedly, but the RL has been doing work over the past few years. The general isn't very relevant, to be honest. You could easily swap in Sliver Hivelord as an indestructible blocker, and possibly even get more success out of him.
I wish they would make either a 5-color planeswalker that can be your general (the new Nicol Bolas being able to do that would have been amazing), or just something that synergizes well with planeswalkers (i.e. five color Atraxa)
Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker -> Nicol Bolas, Dragon-God - Feel a little sad dropping OG Nicol Bolas, but he was one of the most expensive planeswalker, along with Ugin. This new Bolas is fairly similar in nature, as well, but is obviously cheaper and has a more powerful ultimate (and static ability).
Ob Nixilis Reignited -> Liliana, Dreadhorde General - Overall, I feel like Liliana is just better. Her static ability doesn't work too well in our favor, but combines well with her plus. Her two other abilities really work in favor of this deck, as well.
Time Spiral -> Ignite the Beacon - This is something I'm testing for now, to be honest. I have ample card draw, and Ignite the Beacon being an instant is pretty appealing to me. We'll see how it goes.
Tamiyo, Field Researcher -> Dovin, Hand of Control - Another thing I'm testing here. Tamiyo was never somethign I was really happy about drawing, and so I decided that I would test out Dovin. I could see myself quickly dropping him here, but we'll see.
Kher Keep -> Karn's Bastion - Kher Keep was underperforming, and being able to tick up our planeswalkers with mana we have left over will really help the tempo of this deck, I think.
Karn, the Great Creator - Shuts down mana rocks and equipments, which is interesting to think of. Unfortunately, his plus is too artifact centric. On top of that, the effectiveness of his minus working in EDH depends on your playgroup, according to the rules (tutoring outside of the game).
Ugin, the Ineffable – I was really hoping for Ugin to be good, because I love his 8 version. That said, this one just doesn’t fit this deck. This is mainly because his static ability doesn’t work all that well with our deck. His plus is okay, as it provides a little chump blocker that becomes a draw, and his minus isn’t terrible. He’s also 6, which isn’t particularly cheap.
Gideon Blackblade – This deck is very punishing for creatures. So not only does Gideon being a creature during your turn not bode well in this deck, neither does his plus, as it only would work with him and Sliver Queen.
Teyo, the Shieldmage – The static ability really isn’t that strong, and neither are the walls. I love three mana walkers, but this card can’t justify a spot in the 99.
The Wanderer – This card could be relevant if you have a lot of burn in your meta, but that isn’t much of a thing in EDH. The minus is pretty strong, as well. But overall, this card isn’t strong enough to fit in the 99.
Kasmina, Enigmatic Mentor – The passive ability isn’t terrible, but isn’t amazing either. The same goes for the minus. Another uncommon that just can’t justify itself in the 99.
Narset, Parter of Veils – Ah, finally a good uncommon planeswalker. Converted mana cost is three, passive ability is very relevant in the format, and the minus is alright. I wish this card had a super simple plus, like “Scry 1.” as it would make the card much justified in the 99. Even as the best uncommon planesewalker (in my opinion) it still has a hard time justifying itself against other cards.
Davriel, Rogue Shadowmage – This deck doesn’t reliably force discarding, and even if it did, the passive isn’t that powerful. Minus isn’t really either. And 3 loyalty counters isn’t helping.
Liliana, Dreadhorde General – Liliana’s beefiest form, and justifiably. Her passive ability is strong, just not that strong in this deck unfortunately. That being said, it works well with her plus as well as the many other forms of generating tokens in this deck. Her minus is almost a board wipe, and handles indestructible and hexproof, which is a plus. Her ultimate probably is going to win you the game. Overall, I like her a lot and I’m considering finding her a spot in the deck. That being said, I’m trying to avoid stacking up high cmc in this deck.
Ob Nixilis, the Hate-Twisted – At this cost, he’s probably not worth it. That being said, I could imagine him being really powerful if he was slightly cheaper.
Chandra, Fire Artisan – This might be because of the format, but overall I think her static ability is weak and her other abilities do not make up for it. Comparing this Chandra to something like Chandra, Torch of Defiance makes this card seem pretty weak.
Jaya, Venerated Firemage – Burn just isn’t that powerful in EDH, and so this card is pretty underwhelming in the format for the cost and effectiveness.
Sarkhan the Masterless – The static ability is not very effective, that being said, his plus is a possible win condition, and could add some needed pressure to our opponents. That being said, it also turns paints a big Doom Blade target and your planeswalkers’s heads.
Arlinn, Voice of the Pack – 6 converted mana cost, only interacts with wolves. Just doesn’t seem well fitting for this deck, at all.
Jiang Yanggu, Wildcrafter – Since we don’t run any creatures, this card does not interact very well with our deck besides our planeswalkers that generate tokens.
Nissa, Who Shakes the World – We do run a fair amount of forests (10 to be exact) but I don’t think that’s enough to justify this card. Her plus isn’t terrible, but also does not combo well with a high amount of wrath effects superfriend decks typically run.
Vivien, Champion of the Wilds – Another creature centric planeswalker that really doesn’t mesh well with the current list.
Ajani, the Greathearted – This card wouldn’t be so bad in a planeswalker token EDH deck, but the current list it doesn’t work well in.
Domri, Anarch of Bolas – Again, another card that work well with token as it acts as a Crusade on top of having other effects.
Nicol Bolas, Dragon-God – Grand daddy planeswalker. I’ll wait until testing, but I can almost confirm this is the strongest planeswalker card for a superfriends deck, bar none. His static ability is going to be insane for this deck. This means he can come down with a Doubling Season and either activate his ultimate, OR activate an ultimate of another planeswalker on the battlefield with a cost of 8 loyalty. His plus is nothing to scoff at, his minus is just good removal and his ultimate can literally win the game on the spot. I can’t wait to run this card.
Ral, Storm Conduit – I think if this card was maybe cheaper it would be okay, but at four mana, it’s just not that strong. His static ability is really weak, his plus could probably be scry 2 and his minus is just okay.
Sorin, Vengeful Bloodlord – Overall pretty weak planeswalker. He might be better surrounded by a few creatures he can give lifelink/reanimate, but alas, creatureless deck.
Tamiyo, Colllector of Tales – This card isn’t bad, but it’s tough to evaluate otherwise. Her static ability is good, as it protects us from eldrazi and other sacrifice/discard effects, and her minus is a Regrowth, which I get a lot of mileage out of. That being said, her plus is pretty iffy, even with her minus working alongside it. Since commnader is a singleton format, you literally can’t draw more than one card, and you have to hope that you either guess correctly or have a Sensei's Divining Top.
Teferi, Time Raveler – I do love me some 3 converted mana cost planeswalkers, but I’m not sure if Teferi is powerful enough to warrant a spot in the deck. His static ability isn’t bad, his plus can give us some instant speed wraths, which isn’t bad. I think his minus just costs a little too much, and overall I would rather be drawing something else than Teferi.
Angrath, Captain of Chaos – Angrath’s static ability really means nothing to this deck, and his minus is just okay. For four mana, you can do A LOT better.
Ashiok, Dream Render – Shutting off tutors/fetchlands is probably one of, if not the best static ability of all these planeswalkers. And she’s only three mana. Her minus really isn’t that valuable, so I’m not sure if she warrants a spot.
Dovin, Hand of Control – This is another good static ability, and his minus isn’t bad. I would say I’ll keep an eye on this card, as his 3 converted mana cost is appealing. Just not sure where he would fit exactly.
Huatli, the Sun's Heart – Probably one of the more creature centric planeswalkers of the bunch, so it’ll have to be a pass for this list. Not even good in a token planeswalker deck.
Kaya, Bane of the Dead – Six mana is probably a bit too much, even with repeated removal.
Kiora, Behemoth Beckoner – It’s unlikely her static ability will ever fire, and her minus is just okay.
Nahiri, Storm of Stone – Again, static ability just doesn’t work well with our deck and her minus is fairly weak.
Saheeli, Sublime Artificer – If we had more powerful artifacts, this card might be good. Generating chump blockers for each planeswalker you cast is pretty good, especially at 3 mana.
Samut, Tyrant Smasher – Will we ever get a RG planeswalker that isn’t just about creatures?
Vraska, Swarm's Eminence – In general, the ability on the token she creates won’t be that useful for us, but rather against us, so it’s not really worth much to run in this deck.
Tezzeret, Master of the Bridge – This deck doesn’t run enough artifacts to really make use of his abilities, but I could see him being good in a more artifacts centric superfriends deck.
Ignite the Beacon – Similar to Call the Gatewatch, just a little more expensive and two planeswalkers. Overall, I don’t think this is worth it compared to running another black, catch-all tutor. That being said, I think this is better than Call the Gatewatch. EDIT: Just realized this is an instant. That may change things. I'm keeping an eye on this and will consider it for the list.
The Elderspell – Well this is problematic for this deck, right? One reason we might want to run this is because we can pick off our own planeswalkers (and a few of our opponents) and just ult on the spot. This is a dangerous approach. I would rather leave this card out of my graveyard, as I don’t want it to be the target of an opponent’s Spelltwine or something similar.
Niv-Mizzet Reborn – Another five-mana commander, but the ability just doesn’t work that well this deck. There’s definitely better options, especially our Queen.
Oath of Kaya – The enter the battlefield effect isn’t the most powerful but can possibly do some damage such as taking out a Kaalia or another smaller commander. The attack triggered ability isn’t that powerful, though it might deter your opponents enough from attacking your planeswalkers this turn.
Interplanar Beacon – The lifegain on this card isn’t crazy, but could possibly add up over the game. I’m not sure if this is worth a spot or not, though. Filtering mana for planeswalkers is good, but is it worth replacing any of our current lands?
Karn's Bastion – So this card I think we should run. I think it pushes our planeswalkers enough to make them that much more likely to ultimate, and make the overall flow of the deck much better. This works very well with something like Ral Zarek as well.
This is actually an interesting planeswalker, in my opinion, because we run all 10 fetchlands. The minus is fairly underwhelming, admittedly, but still.
Also, opinions on Aminatou, the Fateshifter? Taking another look at it, as it's plus is alright, and it's minus (not ult) seems really good as it allows us to renew other planeswalkers and activate their abiltiies twice a turn. 3 CMC is also appealing, but the ultimate is fairly mediocre.
Also, opinions on Spark Double?
Yeah, I noticed that as well. This deck in general is not very budget friendly, admittedly, but the RL has been doing work over the past few years. The general isn't very relevant, to be honest. You could easily swap in Sliver Hivelord as an indestructible blocker, and possibly even get more success out of him.
I wish they would make either a 5-color planeswalker that can be your general (the new Nicol Bolas being able to do that would have been amazing), or just something that synergizes well with planeswalkers (i.e. five color Atraxa)
Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker -> Nicol Bolas, Dragon-God - Feel a little sad dropping OG Nicol Bolas, but he was one of the most expensive planeswalker, along with Ugin. This new Bolas is fairly similar in nature, as well, but is obviously cheaper and has a more powerful ultimate (and static ability).
Ob Nixilis Reignited -> Liliana, Dreadhorde General - Overall, I feel like Liliana is just better. Her static ability doesn't work too well in our favor, but combines well with her plus. Her two other abilities really work in favor of this deck, as well.
Time Spiral -> Ignite the Beacon - This is something I'm testing for now, to be honest. I have ample card draw, and Ignite the Beacon being an instant is pretty appealing to me. We'll see how it goes.
Tamiyo, Field Researcher -> Dovin, Hand of Control - Another thing I'm testing here. Tamiyo was never somethign I was really happy about drawing, and so I decided that I would test out Dovin. I could see myself quickly dropping him here, but we'll see.
Kher Keep -> Karn's Bastion - Kher Keep was underperforming, and being able to tick up our planeswalkers with mana we have left over will really help the tempo of this deck, I think.
Karn, the Great Creator - Shuts down mana rocks and equipments, which is interesting to think of. Unfortunately, his plus is too artifact centric. On top of that, the effectiveness of his minus working in EDH depends on your playgroup, according to the rules (tutoring outside of the game).
Ugin, the Ineffable – I was really hoping for Ugin to be good, because I love his 8 version. That said, this one just doesn’t fit this deck. This is mainly because his static ability doesn’t work all that well with our deck. His plus is okay, as it provides a little chump blocker that becomes a draw, and his minus isn’t terrible. He’s also 6, which isn’t particularly cheap.
Gideon Blackblade – This deck is very punishing for creatures. So not only does Gideon being a creature during your turn not bode well in this deck, neither does his plus, as it only would work with him and Sliver Queen.
Teyo, the Shieldmage – The static ability really isn’t that strong, and neither are the walls. I love three mana walkers, but this card can’t justify a spot in the 99.
The Wanderer – This card could be relevant if you have a lot of burn in your meta, but that isn’t much of a thing in EDH. The minus is pretty strong, as well. But overall, this card isn’t strong enough to fit in the 99.
Jace, Wielder of Mysteries – Just doesn’t stack up well compared to the other Jace options, unless you’re specifically looking to combo with his Laboratory Maniac passive.
Kasmina, Enigmatic Mentor – The passive ability isn’t terrible, but isn’t amazing either. The same goes for the minus. Another uncommon that just can’t justify itself in the 99.
Narset, Parter of Veils – Ah, finally a good uncommon planeswalker. Converted mana cost is three, passive ability is very relevant in the format, and the minus is alright. I wish this card had a super simple plus, like “Scry 1.” as it would make the card much justified in the 99. Even as the best uncommon planesewalker (in my opinion) it still has a hard time justifying itself against other cards.
Davriel, Rogue Shadowmage – This deck doesn’t reliably force discarding, and even if it did, the passive isn’t that powerful. Minus isn’t really either. And 3 loyalty counters isn’t helping.
Liliana, Dreadhorde General – Liliana’s beefiest form, and justifiably. Her passive ability is strong, just not that strong in this deck unfortunately. That being said, it works well with her plus as well as the many other forms of generating tokens in this deck. Her minus is almost a board wipe, and handles indestructible and hexproof, which is a plus. Her ultimate probably is going to win you the game. Overall, I like her a lot and I’m considering finding her a spot in the deck. That being said, I’m trying to avoid stacking up high cmc in this deck.
Ob Nixilis, the Hate-Twisted – At this cost, he’s probably not worth it. That being said, I could imagine him being really powerful if he was slightly cheaper.
Chandra, Fire Artisan – This might be because of the format, but overall I think her static ability is weak and her other abilities do not make up for it. Comparing this Chandra to something like Chandra, Torch of Defiance makes this card seem pretty weak.
Jaya, Venerated Firemage – Burn just isn’t that powerful in EDH, and so this card is pretty underwhelming in the format for the cost and effectiveness.
Sarkhan the Masterless – The static ability is not very effective, that being said, his plus is a possible win condition, and could add some needed pressure to our opponents. That being said, it also turns paints a big Doom Blade target and your planeswalkers’s heads.
Tibalt, Rakish Instigator – Tibalt still just not that good : /
Arlinn, Voice of the Pack – 6 converted mana cost, only interacts with wolves. Just doesn’t seem well fitting for this deck, at all.
Jiang Yanggu, Wildcrafter – Since we don’t run any creatures, this card does not interact very well with our deck besides our planeswalkers that generate tokens.
Nissa, Who Shakes the World – We do run a fair amount of forests (10 to be exact) but I don’t think that’s enough to justify this card. Her plus isn’t terrible, but also does not combo well with a high amount of wrath effects superfriend decks typically run.
Vivien, Champion of the Wilds – Another creature centric planeswalker that really doesn’t mesh well with the current list.
Ajani, the Greathearted – This card wouldn’t be so bad in a planeswalker token EDH deck, but the current list it doesn’t work well in.
Domri, Anarch of Bolas – Again, another card that work well with token as it acts as a Crusade on top of having other effects.
Nicol Bolas, Dragon-God – Grand daddy planeswalker. I’ll wait until testing, but I can almost confirm this is the strongest planeswalker card for a superfriends deck, bar none. His static ability is going to be insane for this deck. This means he can come down with a Doubling Season and either activate his ultimate, OR activate an ultimate of another planeswalker on the battlefield with a cost of 8 loyalty. His plus is nothing to scoff at, his minus is just good removal and his ultimate can literally win the game on the spot. I can’t wait to run this card.
Ral, Storm Conduit – I think if this card was maybe cheaper it would be okay, but at four mana, it’s just not that strong. His static ability is really weak, his plus could probably be scry 2 and his minus is just okay.
Sorin, Vengeful Bloodlord – Overall pretty weak planeswalker. He might be better surrounded by a few creatures he can give lifelink/reanimate, but alas, creatureless deck.
Tamiyo, Colllector of Tales – This card isn’t bad, but it’s tough to evaluate otherwise. Her static ability is good, as it protects us from eldrazi and other sacrifice/discard effects, and her minus is a Regrowth, which I get a lot of mileage out of. That being said, her plus is pretty iffy, even with her minus working alongside it. Since commnader is a singleton format, you literally can’t draw more than one card, and you have to hope that you either guess correctly or have a Sensei's Divining Top.
Teferi, Time Raveler – I do love me some 3 converted mana cost planeswalkers, but I’m not sure if Teferi is powerful enough to warrant a spot in the deck. His static ability isn’t bad, his plus can give us some instant speed wraths, which isn’t bad. I think his minus just costs a little too much, and overall I would rather be drawing something else than Teferi.
Angrath, Captain of Chaos – Angrath’s static ability really means nothing to this deck, and his minus is just okay. For four mana, you can do A LOT better.
Ashiok, Dream Render – Shutting off tutors/fetchlands is probably one of, if not the best static ability of all these planeswalkers. And she’s only three mana. Her minus really isn’t that valuable, so I’m not sure if she warrants a spot.
Dovin, Hand of Control – This is another good static ability, and his minus isn’t bad. I would say I’ll keep an eye on this card, as his 3 converted mana cost is appealing. Just not sure where he would fit exactly.
Huatli, the Sun's Heart – Probably one of the more creature centric planeswalkers of the bunch, so it’ll have to be a pass for this list. Not even good in a token planeswalker deck.
Kaya, Bane of the Dead – Six mana is probably a bit too much, even with repeated removal.
Kiora, Behemoth Beckoner – It’s unlikely her static ability will ever fire, and her minus is just okay.
Nahiri, Storm of Stone – Again, static ability just doesn’t work well with our deck and her minus is fairly weak.
Saheeli, Sublime Artificer – If we had more powerful artifacts, this card might be good. Generating chump blockers for each planeswalker you cast is pretty good, especially at 3 mana.
Samut, Tyrant Smasher – Will we ever get a RG planeswalker that isn’t just about creatures?
Vraska, Swarm's Eminence – In general, the ability on the token she creates won’t be that useful for us, but rather against us, so it’s not really worth much to run in this deck.
Jace, Arcane Strategist – Now even Jace is a creature centric planeswalker I guess?
Tezzeret, Master of the Bridge – This deck doesn’t run enough artifacts to really make use of his abilities, but I could see him being good in a more artifacts centric superfriends deck.
Ignite the Beacon – Similar to Call the Gatewatch, just a little more expensive and two planeswalkers. Overall, I don’t think this is worth it compared to running another black, catch-all tutor. That being said, I think this is better than Call the Gatewatch. EDIT: Just realized this is an instant. That may change things. I'm keeping an eye on this and will consider it for the list.
The Elderspell – Well this is problematic for this deck, right? One reason we might want to run this is because we can pick off our own planeswalkers (and a few of our opponents) and just ult on the spot. This is a dangerous approach. I would rather leave this card out of my graveyard, as I don’t want it to be the target of an opponent’s Spelltwine or something similar.
Niv-Mizzet Reborn – Another five-mana commander, but the ability just doesn’t work that well this deck. There’s definitely better options, especially our Queen.
Oath of Kaya – The enter the battlefield effect isn’t the most powerful but can possibly do some damage such as taking out a Kaalia or another smaller commander. The attack triggered ability isn’t that powerful, though it might deter your opponents enough from attacking your planeswalkers this turn.
Interplanar Beacon – The lifegain on this card isn’t crazy, but could possibly add up over the game. I’m not sure if this is worth a spot or not, though. Filtering mana for planeswalkers is good, but is it worth replacing any of our current lands?
Karn's Bastion – So this card I think we should run. I think it pushes our planeswalkers enough to make them that much more likely to ultimate, and make the overall flow of the deck much better. This works very well with something like Ral Zarek as well.