a your assessment of the B/G/x match up is why I am running Illusory angel and Talrand those are the matches they play out best against. helping to over load their removal. having them to 10 around turn 5 is a near game winning board state for this deck. the problem is that delver is a terrible top deck against them, and YP dies to darkblast. quickling actually is useful for also pulling back Snapcaster to our hand to help with snap/bolting or whatever other snapable spell you might need. you can also target a token with him.
UWR delver is terrible against nearly all the major decks other than pod, with a even worse match up against B/G/x, the best Geist decks don't even run delver they are more a mid-range control deck.
U/R delver cannot win without some type of creature pressure, Illusory Angel and Talrand are very good against UWR and BGx decks exactly because they help insure we have some extra threats after they kill or remove our first two turn threats just hoping you draw one of 6 remaining threats(delver2-4 or YP 2-4) is not a very good plan, snap/bolt is also less effective against these decks. B/G/x tends to stabilize by turn 3-4, UWR by turn 4-5.
I don't find Clique to be helpful against UWR, they don't really mind having you shuffle away a card as they are playing for the long game and Clique doesn't survive long enough to be relevant. its actually good against all the draw-go combo's such as twin and scapeshift as it simply allows us to put them off of combo a bit longer. I find that it is worse against any B/G/x deck with Jund probably being the worse one of the bunch, since you could just draw them into lethal burn damage. (at least against B/G/w you could net a land off of path)
the long list of removal you gave is what I meant by negative redundancy, its a negative form of redundancy that everything dies to all of the same list of removal. this is why I have been enjoying Illusory Angel, Talrand, the Sky Summoner as they break the cycle of negative redundancy while still playing into our synergies. it forces your opponent to utilize their removal better. B/G/x for instance will often slam abrupt decays on our early delver and YP thinking that remanding and/or mana leak will not prevent the bolt/dismembers/etc.. later once they have mana open to pay or recast.
I also wouldn't play delay, its simply better than Deprive because it can be played on 2 without a massive loss of tempo. I don't really care if my opponent gets to resolve his t2 play on 5 because by then you will either have a winning board state or you are just losing anyways, its far better than having them play a must counter t2 spell that you either miss play and allow and lose or counter fall back on mana development and lose.
as far as protection without a massive loss of tempo I like Quickling seems better than both. it breaks the x/1 weakness' its plays at instant speed, it protects our enablers like YP and it also counters abrupt decay which is very nice.
I would have to disagree with cliques being " really good" in U/R delver, they tend to only be good in match ups we already have good chance of winning. while having the negative redundancy of being another easily killed x/1. I run 2 in my sideboard because they are good against draw-go combo decks and can be sided in for in place of some of the removal spells we ship out in those match ups. they are not very useful against B/G/x, U/W/R, U/tron, burn.
deprive is also not very good. this deck is very mana hungry, we want 4 lands out hopefully by turn 4 for snapcaster flashback 2cc counterspells to be available. I played a few mirror matches the other day, the players had some number of deprives in their main deck it felt like I couldn't lose after they cast it and I countered it 2for1ing themselves.
I feel like if you want a "hard" counter that is 2cc Delay is a better choice. sure it replays its self 3 turns later but if 3 turns later you haven't essentially closed out the game I don't think you had much of a chance. (turn 2 will play out on 5, t3-6 etc...)also delay is a straight up hard counter against other counterspells, sphinx's rev, and other cards that have x or care about the method of payment such as sunburst etc...
perilous research is also not that good, simply because as I said we are a mana hungry deck and if you don't have either YP or Talrand out you are going to be setting back your own board, either you will have to sac a creature like delver, clique, or grim; or you will set back your mana base. Its similar to Crack the Earth bonkers value if and only if you have out YP or Talrand. honestly a eot Telling Time seems like a better play since it isn't dead on t2-3 if we miss YP and at least can help us make sure and flip our delver.
this is the basic list I've been running the side board of course shifts depending on the meta, I only play on MTGO at the moment so you can guess what match ups I would gear it too.
I have so far really liked the switches in creatures. previous to the inclusion of Illusory Angel I was beginning to feel as though the major decks had all developed crushingly powerful game plans against UR delver decks, Pod can even afford to main deck Pontiff. Jund seemed like the entire game depended on you sticking a Young Pyromancer and dealing enough damage to pray for Snap Bolt kill. with both Twin and Jund running a massive amount of 1 for 1 removal spells I would often never be able to stick a threat long enough to make any real gains on the board. So far the inclusion of the Angel and Talrand have helped pull past their removal. I had used Talrand in the Past and found that he was often to little to late and that if turn three started with no viable threat on board to apply pressure that I was essentially to far behind on turn 4 when Talrand would hit the table. Illusory Angel really helps fill that gap. Angel also improves a top decked mid game delver; playing delver into angel on 4 is just way stronger and helps stretch our opponents resources even thinner.
Illusory Angel, Talrand, and Gut Shot are all great against pod, Gut shot is particularly good in this match up. with deathrite shaman gone Pod leans very heavy on sticking a 0/1 mana dork in the first turn. I've tried Twisted Image and use it out of the side board, but gut shot essentially gives us a turn 0 play when we are on the draw and allows us to cast Delver and kill their Mana dork. I've had a few games against pod which I gut shot their t1 mana dork, played delver they replay a mana dork t2, I cast snap+gut shot on t2. often they have kept a hand expecting to turn 2 drop a Birthing Pod and many times they brick on the third land or simply lack the board needed to get Birthing Pod going. with such a early hick up to their game plan its easy to stick a Young Pyromancer and start producing tokens, sticking a angel also makes their board recovery strategy much worse as we will be left with a 4/4 flier to likely finish the game out.
Stoke the Flames is also very good so far. it plays a out of no where finisher or a out of no where removal spell. I've closed out a handful of games against players who are likely just assuming they have one more turn, them at 10 life me with Young Pyromancer, Flipped Delver, 1 token ready to attack, 4 or more produced off of serum visions, probes, and any of the other cheap spells. they have verdict or some other sweeper in hand attack for 6, bam tap all the tokens to sneak in the Stoke the Flames. so far its good, but I feel like once its a common enough play it will be factored into more players combat math and it will get played around.
just trying out Void Snare so far it is very useful, I know its slow being a sorcery and all, but it does help with some of the more problematic noncreature permanents. its a main deckable answer to cranial plating, a resolved birthing pod, Lilianna etc.. allowing us a second chance at keeping it off the table for good while still letting us clear the board of creatures if we need it. I board it out often for a more direct answer if one is available but it does a great job game one as a catch all answer that doesn't work against our primary goals.
its a fairly straight up control deck, I've only been playing around with it for a few days. so far it does well against Pod, Affinity, various aggro / burn type decks haven't had a chance to run it against Jund and a few of the random combo decks.
UWR delver is terrible against nearly all the major decks other than pod, with a even worse match up against B/G/x, the best Geist decks don't even run delver they are more a mid-range control deck.
U/R delver cannot win without some type of creature pressure, Illusory Angel and Talrand are very good against UWR and BGx decks exactly because they help insure we have some extra threats after they kill or remove our first two turn threats just hoping you draw one of 6 remaining threats(delver2-4 or YP 2-4) is not a very good plan, snap/bolt is also less effective against these decks. B/G/x tends to stabilize by turn 3-4, UWR by turn 4-5.
the long list of removal you gave is what I meant by negative redundancy, its a negative form of redundancy that everything dies to all of the same list of removal. this is why I have been enjoying Illusory Angel, Talrand, the Sky Summoner as they break the cycle of negative redundancy while still playing into our synergies. it forces your opponent to utilize their removal better. B/G/x for instance will often slam abrupt decays on our early delver and YP thinking that remanding and/or mana leak will not prevent the bolt/dismembers/etc.. later once they have mana open to pay or recast.
I also wouldn't play delay, its simply better than Deprive because it can be played on 2 without a massive loss of tempo. I don't really care if my opponent gets to resolve his t2 play on 5 because by then you will either have a winning board state or you are just losing anyways, its far better than having them play a must counter t2 spell that you either miss play and allow and lose or counter fall back on mana development and lose.
as far as protection without a massive loss of tempo I like Quickling seems better than both. it breaks the x/1 weakness' its plays at instant speed, it protects our enablers like YP and it also counters abrupt decay which is very nice.
deprive is also not very good. this deck is very mana hungry, we want 4 lands out hopefully by turn 4 for snapcaster flashback 2cc counterspells to be available. I played a few mirror matches the other day, the players had some number of deprives in their main deck it felt like I couldn't lose after they cast it and I countered it 2for1ing themselves.
I feel like if you want a "hard" counter that is 2cc Delay is a better choice. sure it replays its self 3 turns later but if 3 turns later you haven't essentially closed out the game I don't think you had much of a chance. (turn 2 will play out on 5, t3-6 etc...)also delay is a straight up hard counter against other counterspells, sphinx's rev, and other cards that have x or care about the method of payment such as sunburst etc...
perilous research is also not that good, simply because as I said we are a mana hungry deck and if you don't have either YP or Talrand out you are going to be setting back your own board, either you will have to sac a creature like delver, clique, or grim; or you will set back your mana base. Its similar to Crack the Earth bonkers value if and only if you have out YP or Talrand. honestly a eot Telling Time seems like a better play since it isn't dead on t2-3 if we miss YP and at least can help us make sure and flip our delver.
4xYoung Pyromancer
4xSnapcaster Mage
2xIllusory Angel
2xTalrand, Sky Summoner
4xGitaxian Probe
4xLighting Bolt
4xSerum Visions
4xRemand
2xVoid Snare
2xStoke The Flames
2xGut Shot
1xVapor Snag
1xSpell Snare
1xSpell Pierce
1xDesolate Lighthouse
4xScalding Tarn
4xSteam Vents
3xSulfur Falls
2xMountain
5xIsland
[/deck]
this is the basic list I've been running the side board of course shifts depending on the meta, I only play on MTGO at the moment so you can guess what match ups I would gear it too.
I have so far really liked the switches in creatures. previous to the inclusion of Illusory Angel I was beginning to feel as though the major decks had all developed crushingly powerful game plans against UR delver decks, Pod can even afford to main deck Pontiff. Jund seemed like the entire game depended on you sticking a Young Pyromancer and dealing enough damage to pray for Snap Bolt kill. with both Twin and Jund running a massive amount of 1 for 1 removal spells I would often never be able to stick a threat long enough to make any real gains on the board. So far the inclusion of the Angel and Talrand have helped pull past their removal. I had used Talrand in the Past and found that he was often to little to late and that if turn three started with no viable threat on board to apply pressure that I was essentially to far behind on turn 4 when Talrand would hit the table. Illusory Angel really helps fill that gap. Angel also improves a top decked mid game delver; playing delver into angel on 4 is just way stronger and helps stretch our opponents resources even thinner.
Illusory Angel, Talrand, and Gut Shot are all great against pod, Gut shot is particularly good in this match up. with deathrite shaman gone Pod leans very heavy on sticking a 0/1 mana dork in the first turn. I've tried Twisted Image and use it out of the side board, but gut shot essentially gives us a turn 0 play when we are on the draw and allows us to cast Delver and kill their Mana dork. I've had a few games against pod which I gut shot their t1 mana dork, played delver they replay a mana dork t2, I cast snap+gut shot on t2. often they have kept a hand expecting to turn 2 drop a Birthing Pod and many times they brick on the third land or simply lack the board needed to get Birthing Pod going. with such a early hick up to their game plan its easy to stick a Young Pyromancer and start producing tokens, sticking a angel also makes their board recovery strategy much worse as we will be left with a 4/4 flier to likely finish the game out.
Stoke the Flames is also very good so far. it plays a out of no where finisher or a out of no where removal spell. I've closed out a handful of games against players who are likely just assuming they have one more turn, them at 10 life me with Young Pyromancer, Flipped Delver, 1 token ready to attack, 4 or more produced off of serum visions, probes, and any of the other cheap spells. they have verdict or some other sweeper in hand attack for 6, bam tap all the tokens to sneak in the Stoke the Flames. so far its good, but I feel like once its a common enough play it will be factored into more players combat math and it will get played around.
just trying out Void Snare so far it is very useful, I know its slow being a sorcery and all, but it does help with some of the more problematic noncreature permanents. its a main deckable answer to cranial plating, a resolved birthing pod, Lilianna etc.. allowing us a second chance at keeping it off the table for good while still letting us clear the board of creatures if we need it. I board it out often for a more direct answer if one is available but it does a great job game one as a catch all answer that doesn't work against our primary goals.
when I looked threw I noticed it was excluded really didn't want to scan entire thread to see if its been mentioned so if this a repeat my bad.
4xSteam Vents
4xSulfur Falls
4xScalding Tarn
2xMisty Rainforest
3xMountain
5xIsland
2xIzzet Boilerworks
4xIzzet Signet
1xIzzet Keyrune
4xLightning Bolt
3xMana Leak
3xElectrolyze
2xCounterflux
2xCyclonic Rift
2xVolcanic Fallout
2xThoughtflare
1xCall the Skybreaker
2xSnapcaster Mage
2xTeferi, Mage of Zhalfir
2xDominus of Realty
2xNiv-Mizzet, Dracogenius
1xDjinn Illuminatus
3xRal Zarek
sb
3xDispel
1xHibernation
2xPithing Needle
1xRatchet Bomb
2xShadow of Doubt
2xSowing Salt
2xToptor Orb
1xTrickbind
1xVedalken Shackles
its a fairly straight up control deck, I've only been playing around with it for a few days. so far it does well against Pod, Affinity, various aggro / burn type decks haven't had a chance to run it against Jund and a few of the random combo decks.