Have you fans of Mana Tithe ever considered Guttural Response? Obviously only good against blue and obviously a side-board-only card and obviously only good if one is playing green, but it brings back good memories of Red Elemental Blast and Pyroblast.
In order for scrying sheets to be useful, it has to be in a color that can't do it better with something else. In modern, that basically means red and white can get best use out of it, with red having additional effects to take advantage of it. I agree that you likely wouldn't want more than two or maybe three, though.
Nabby: In regards to running unmake and the three WWW it costs you, have you had any success with crib swap in its place or is the token problematic?
For the g/w lists running selesyna charm, has any thought been given to reprisal instead? Or is even having it at 4 power instead of 5 still too difficult?
I actually like Reprisal now that you mention it, at least for one of the locations where I play. Crib Swap could also be fine; the token isn't the problem so much as it's 'Goyf chow and I'm not running 'Goyf in my mono-white Knights list. In truth, I rarely run across 'Goyf except when I run Rock or Jund as I sometimes do.
I doubt I'd spend money to get any copies of Crib Swap without a warmer, fuzzier feeling for it but Reprisal may just suit my purposes better than Devouring Light. You've gotta love that exile, though.
The thing I've been trying lately is Day of Judgment, but the cost is a bit high for my tastes.
Scrying Sheets does look like a fun, casual thing to do though, doesn't it? I don't think it's anything more than that. I do wonder if one couldn't get away with two copies; it certainly doesn't hurt to use Snow-Covered Plains instead of the regular ones. Unless of course, you don't have them and would have buy them.
. . . you are right about the utility creatures posing a large problem, creatures like Dark Confidant, Scavenging Ooze etc are those that requires a Path to Exile and Unmake type removal, which Devouring Light is unable to answer to.
If one were worried about Bob or his ilk, Sunlance would be an option. I'm worried about fatties.
Persist and undying are another set of problems that are better addressed via exile. There's no denying exile is better, but Unmake is a real problem to cast with only fifteen white sources - eleven if there's a Bad Moon about. Crib Swap appeals to me more but Journey to Nowhere might be the best of the lot even with it's vulnerability.
The downside of trying out Journey or Swap for me is just money. When WotC prints them in a core set I'll get right on it.
Umm, just a small point, but devouring light has been around since ravnica block, in fact. I've had reasonable good results with it, off and on, but it has the attacking/blocking weakness I don't like. I personally think journey to nowhere is probably the second best white removal in modern for the moment or kick it up to three for crib swap or unmake.
It's true Devouring Light was already Modern-legal, but some of us skipped or missed Ravinica; I hadn't seen it before. It seems worth talking about.
Crib Swap is not a bad idea. It would be especially good in some kind of Junk build with Tarmogoyf, or "Tarmo-who" as one of the kids at one of the LGS referred to it.
Unmake is pretty much a consideration only for mono-white - but hey, that's me anyway. It would make a good card for BW-tokens perhaps if there weren't a million lower-cost black removal spells. It does have the advantage of being castable with only white mana.
Ultimately, I think the forthcoming availability and affordability of Devouring Light will put it over the top for me. The convoke will occasionally help it out too.
I love Condemn in Commander, but the inability to deal with anything but attackers turns me off in Modern. Oust is another one I just can't quite warm-up to.
You don't consider the simpler mana requirement a pro, or for that matter, a con? One would expect the elf to be less expensive and easier to acquire for someone building anew. Not that the Sliver is expensive, but someone would probably give a fellow an uncommon from a core set.
There's certainly nothing wrong with running both, but one would have to replace something else then.
At one of the places where I play, I want more removal than just Path to Exile. What do you think about the soon-to-be Standard Devouring Light for the sideboard? It seems as if it's a little better than Celestial Flare - which I have used on occasion - in most circumstances.
Paladin en-Vec is pretty good in the UWR match-up but Fiendslayer Paladin is probably better. If there are red or black creatures about, en-Vec has a better case.
This is the most recent version of my Knights deck with the Champ. Of course, when I play a Cavern, I say "Humans", not "Knights". The deck does about as well as anything else I play although I'm hoping for better things with my new Jund pile.
Take the sideboard with a grain of salt; it's tuned for one of the places I play.
Nice list, it looks like something I might play if I was going mono-white and using Champion of the Parish. Not nit-picking here, my personal preference will be to:
- 1 Knight of the White Orchid
- 1 Mutavault
+ 2 White Shield Crusader (I can't think better what 2cc knights to add in other then White Knight or this).
Reason for reducing KotWO is because fetching for lands is less critical in your deck list which doesn't have any 4 drops. I also worry about Mutavault lack of interaction with Student of Warfare, KotWO and with casting the knights thus I cut one out. 3x Mutavault should be enough to keep up the creature count.
You may well be spot-on there; I've thought the deck could use more two-drops as well. I also worry three Caverns may be overkill with the Vials; I built this originally with only two Vials and the Caverns were probably more useful then.
This weekend, I was amazed that Horizon Canopy, which I used in my GW Knights deck, has greatly risen in price on the secondary market. When I got them, it was $5-$6. Is some other deck using these, or is it just an old, rare card?
Green-White Hatebears uses it and I imagine Green-White Death and Taxes would do as well. I'm referring to the Modern versions, of course.
I actually like Reprisal now that you mention it, at least for one of the locations where I play. Crib Swap could also be fine; the token isn't the problem so much as it's 'Goyf chow and I'm not running 'Goyf in my mono-white Knights list. In truth, I rarely run across 'Goyf except when I run Rock or Jund as I sometimes do.
I doubt I'd spend money to get any copies of Crib Swap without a warmer, fuzzier feeling for it but Reprisal may just suit my purposes better than Devouring Light. You've gotta love that exile, though.
The thing I've been trying lately is Day of Judgment, but the cost is a bit high for my tastes.
18 Snow-Covered Plains
4 Scrying Sheets
It's not completely crazy you know. Drawing lands may not sound like such a great idea but it's basically the same effect as scrying.
It's also not original; I stole the idea from someone in the Death-and-Taxes thread.
And, lastly, yes, any color could swing it.
If one were worried about Bob or his ilk, Sunlance would be an option. I'm worried about fatties.
Persist and undying are another set of problems that are better addressed via exile. There's no denying exile is better, but Unmake is a real problem to cast with only fifteen white sources - eleven if there's a Bad Moon about. Crib Swap appeals to me more but Journey to Nowhere might be the best of the lot even with it's vulnerability.
The downside of trying out Journey or Swap for me is just money. When WotC prints them in a core set I'll get right on it.
It's true Devouring Light was already Modern-legal, but some of us skipped or missed Ravinica; I hadn't seen it before. It seems worth talking about.
Journey to Nowhere has advantages but in a format lousy with Abrupt Decay it has disadvantages as well.
Crib Swap is not a bad idea. It would be especially good in some kind of Junk build with Tarmogoyf, or "Tarmo-who" as one of the kids at one of the LGS referred to it.
Unmake is pretty much a consideration only for mono-white - but hey, that's me anyway. It would make a good card for BW-tokens perhaps if there weren't a million lower-cost black removal spells. It does have the advantage of being castable with only white mana.
Ultimately, I think the forthcoming availability and affordability of Devouring Light will put it over the top for me. The convoke will occasionally help it out too.
Or that wretched Stormbreath Dragon.
I love Condemn in Commander, but the inability to deal with anything but attackers turns me off in Modern. Oust is another one I just can't quite warm-up to.
You don't consider the simpler mana requirement a pro, or for that matter, a con? One would expect the elf to be less expensive and easier to acquire for someone building anew. Not that the Sliver is expensive, but someone would probably give a fellow an uncommon from a core set.
There's certainly nothing wrong with running both, but one would have to replace something else then.
Paladin en-Vec is pretty good in the UWR match-up but Fiendslayer Paladin is probably better. If there are red or black creatures about, en-Vec has a better case.
You may well be spot-on there; I've thought the deck could use more two-drops as well. I also worry three Caverns may be overkill with the Vials; I built this originally with only two Vials and the Caverns were probably more useful then.
Thanks for the kind review.:)
Green-White Hatebears uses it and I imagine Green-White Death and Taxes would do as well. I'm referring to the Modern versions, of course.