Riptide Laboratory is new to me; thanks. It does seem as if it belongs in a wizard-tribal deck. Now I guess I'm headed back to eBay. . .
I suppose Trinket Mage might be worth a mention. He might get a try out once I finally ease up off enough cash to get Sensei's Divining Top. I like my cards less than $20-ish; preferably much less.
The Deputy might be a little weak; perhaps if there were cards one wanted in hand again. Still, flicker just seems better than bounce for one's own permanents.
The token makers might be useful; Meloku could fuel Skullclamp.
Archaeomancer seems like a blue Eternal Witness for one extra mana with a serious limitation; still, redundancy can be good and this guy can enable a infinite-turn combination with Time Warp just about as well as Witness can.
The Maniac looks as if he'd be a super-fun win-condition but it would take some work to set up. Self-mill is probably blue-black territory.
Of my current wizards, the Witch's effect is pricey, but she's an absolute hoot to play and instant-speed flicker is pretty good. The ability to flicker opponents' creatures at instant speed is just nuts. Since flicker is another important theme, she fits very well in my deck.
Pridemage and Snappy are well-regarded and probably need no explanation.
Biovisionary is a win-condition with Infinite Reflection (others are also possible) and a fun one at that. They usually don't see it coming.
Rayne is a question mark; she's relatively inexpensive but I've yet to get a card out of her.
Fathom Mage hasn't deigned to appear for me yet, but she should produce cards and with all of the flicker available to me she should keep on producing cards.
Magus can beat some decks by himself. Granted those are probably not the most competitive of decks, but the moment is priceless when they realize how few answers they have to this guy.
Venser needs no justification; flash-bounce is awesome-sauce. I guess I justified him anyway.
The last three are somewhat dubious due their casting cost, methinks. Aerie Mystics has a nice ability with a reasonable cost but it does seem like the casting cost is awfully high.
Azumi is the whole reason I selected Wizard-tribal as a theme, but she's pricey to cast. Nonetheless, the possibility of multiple cards at instant speed is kinda bonkers.
The Prophets are probably on the block; I expect the Archmage will replace these guys. Still, a card or a land per turn is not too shabby.
As for the aspirants, the Archmage is an auto-include in this list I think. With some flicker, this guy can counter spells all day. It almost makes one consider Melira, Sylvok Outcast just to be absolutely asinine about it.
Æther Adept seems to be a little sweetie but I haven't tried her out yet.
The number of available wizards in Bant colors is staggering, so please don't comment comprehensively, but I'm keen to hear what others think are good candidates.
Removing Karmic Guide was a bad idea, it's back in place of Fiend Hunter. Hunter can be a hoot with Venser but it's probably one of the weaker cards. He is pretty good against tokens though.
Academy Rector seems like he deserves a spot; I sure hope so since he just set me back about as much as I like to pay for cards these days. He's another enabler for the Biovisionary/Infinite Reflection combination. He might also make Omniscience worth adding.
Some of the casting costs are difficult; particularly Azami, Lady of Scrolls and Deadeye Navigator stayed in hand for many terns. Aerie Mystics and Skyward Eye Prophets are steep too, but the first two seem worse because they need something else to of any use; another wizard for Azumi and another creature plus one blue and one colorless for the Navigator. Azami is kind of the whole point, and flicker is the third important theme here - and the one I forgot to mention in the original post - so I will leave them for now.
It seems to me that you need something to deal with pro-white beaters. Artifact creatures or artifact damage sources are one possibility.
Back in the days of the Pump-knight wars, Ihsan's Shade made Karakas mandatory for the white side. Of course, Karakas was affordable then. More recently, Phyrexian Crusader has been a mono-white decks worst nightmare.
Wall of Junk is a silly card that would actually work well against both of these guys. Perhaps more seriously, Maze of Ith would do the trick.
Iona, Shield of Emeria is another possible solution to the pro-white problem - assuming you aren't faced with red and black pro-white creatures together.
This started as the Bant pre-con recently released. I've jettisoned all three commanders in favor of Jenara, Ashura of War, mostly because I really like Jenara, and every deck needs a way to win.
Themes - to the extent there are themes - are card draw and Wizard tribal plus enough control to hopefully make it all workable. If all else fails, Jenara is still there.
It seems to me that a little life-gain ability would be useful. Artifacts or enchantments with re-useable abilities seem like the best plan.
Back in the day, we used Ivory Tower and Zuran Orb. Ivory Tower required a deck built to abuse it, Zuran Orb was, well, broken to the point it really didn't require any effort to abuse it.
The deck I'm planning will be Bant colors, so there will be card draw and there might as well be a couple of cards to allow for an unlimited hand-size; Reliquary Tower, Praetor's Counsel come to mind.
Does anyone use either of these cards mentioned in the title in Commander?
You definitely want to be running 4 AEther Vials. As I've learned you want 4 or 0 of it. Also, why are you running Flagstones? Unless you have Knight of the Reliquary or multiples of it to Legend rule yourself, it doesn't do anything in the deck. I would suggest running the full 4 Cavern of Souls. 4 Stony Silence is a lot of sideboard hate for Affinity. Maybe go down to 2 and look at including Leonin Arbiter or Aven Mindcensor.
I've already added the third Aether Vial and I'll look for another.
The single Flagstone doesn't really do anything but produce white mana. It doesn't hurt anything. I've got more Caverns around, in other decks. I'm a little leery of running too many lands that don't make white for spells. I suppose I could ditch the Flares for one of the one-cc removal spells.
Aven Mindcensor is definitely something worth looking into.
Perhaps after I've had enough flickering around I'll move towards the other approach.
Many good ideas here; so many Wizards, so few deck slots.
There are a few more interesting wizards with white in the casting cost; Azorius Guildmage looks useful and Aven Mindcensor is a solid card.
Auratouched Mage seems like it would be fun with Eldrazi Conscription, but that would be mean - wouldn't it?
I suppose Trinket Mage might be worth a mention. He might get a try out once I finally ease up off enough cash to get Sensei's Divining Top. I like my cards less than $20-ish; preferably much less.
Another list of maybe's:
The Deputy might be a little weak; perhaps if there were cards one wanted in hand again. Still, flicker just seems better than bounce for one's own permanents.
The token makers might be useful; Meloku could fuel Skullclamp.
Archaeomancer seems like a blue Eternal Witness for one extra mana with a serious limitation; still, redundancy can be good and this guy can enable a infinite-turn combination with Time Warp just about as well as Witness can.
The Maniac looks as if he'd be a super-fun win-condition but it would take some work to set up. Self-mill is probably blue-black territory.
Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir looks like a good man. Triple blue is a little steep - Arcanis has it as well, but then so does Blue Sun's Zenith.
How did I forget Prime Speaker Zegana?
We'll justify that Cavern of Souls yet!
This is the list of Wizards I'm currently using:
Glen Elendra Archmage will be added as soon as he's delivered. Æther Adept is another serious contender.
Of my current wizards, the Witch's effect is pricey, but she's an absolute hoot to play and instant-speed flicker is pretty good. The ability to flicker opponents' creatures at instant speed is just nuts. Since flicker is another important theme, she fits very well in my deck.
Pridemage and Snappy are well-regarded and probably need no explanation.
Biovisionary is a win-condition with Infinite Reflection (others are also possible) and a fun one at that. They usually don't see it coming.
Rayne is a question mark; she's relatively inexpensive but I've yet to get a card out of her.
Fathom Mage hasn't deigned to appear for me yet, but she should produce cards and with all of the flicker available to me she should keep on producing cards.
Magus can beat some decks by himself. Granted those are probably not the most competitive of decks, but the moment is priceless when they realize how few answers they have to this guy.
Venser needs no justification; flash-bounce is awesome-sauce. I guess I justified him anyway.
The last three are somewhat dubious due their casting cost, methinks. Aerie Mystics has a nice ability with a reasonable cost but it does seem like the casting cost is awfully high.
Azumi is the whole reason I selected Wizard-tribal as a theme, but she's pricey to cast. Nonetheless, the possibility of multiple cards at instant speed is kinda bonkers.
The Prophets are probably on the block; I expect the Archmage will replace these guys. Still, a card or a land per turn is not too shabby.
As for the aspirants, the Archmage is an auto-include in this list I think. With some flicker, this guy can counter spells all day. It almost makes one consider Melira, Sylvok Outcast just to be absolutely asinine about it.
Æther Adept seems to be a little sweetie but I haven't tried her out yet.
The number of available wizards in Bant colors is staggering, so please don't comment comprehensively, but I'm keen to hear what others think are good candidates.
Academy Rector seems like he deserves a spot; I sure hope so since he just set me back about as much as I like to pay for cards these days. He's another enabler for the Biovisionary/Infinite Reflection combination. He might also make Omniscience worth adding.
Some other ideas:
Thanks to all the folks who've posted all these wonderful ideas in other threads; this forum is very helpful.
Additional sweepers seem in order. Martial Coup, Planar Cleansing and Terminus are on hand and will go in. I've been looking for Day of Judgment locally so far without without success. I've got a Nevinyrral's Disk somewhere; it might get a spin too. Austere Command seems like a possibility and so does Rout.
Some of the casting costs are difficult; particularly Azami, Lady of Scrolls and Deadeye Navigator stayed in hand for many terns. Aerie Mystics and Skyward Eye Prophets are steep too, but the first two seem worse because they need something else to of any use; another wizard for Azumi and another creature plus one blue and one colorless for the Navigator. Azami is kind of the whole point, and flicker is the third important theme here - and the one I forgot to mention in the original post - so I will leave them for now.
Additions:
Condemn
Deletions:
I also like to work in some graveyard recursion, but I'm not sure what to remove.
Some other cards I'd really like to include:
Some other thoughts:
As always, good ideas are always welcome.
Back in the days of the Pump-knight wars, Ihsan's Shade made Karakas mandatory for the white side. Of course, Karakas was affordable then. More recently, Phyrexian Crusader has been a mono-white decks worst nightmare.
Wall of Junk is a silly card that would actually work well against both of these guys. Perhaps more seriously, Maze of Ith would do the trick.
Iona, Shield of Emeria is another possible solution to the pro-white problem - assuming you aren't faced with red and black pro-white creatures together.
I would definitely recommend Enlightened Tutor to help get the Land Tax in place
Themes - to the extent there are themes - are card draw and Wizard tribal plus enough control to hopefully make it all workable. If all else fails, Jenara is still there.
EDIT: Add flicker to list of themes.
Any help would be appreciated.
EDIT: A little update, explained in reply
1 Jenara, Asura of War
Wizards
1 Mistmeadow Witch
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Snapcaster Mage
1 Biovisionary
1 Rayne, Academy Chancellor
1 Fathom Mage
1 Magus of the Moat
1 Venser, Shaper Savant
1 Aerie Mystics
1 Azami, Lady of Scrolls
1 Skyward Eye Prophets
Other Creatures
1 Mother of Runes
1 Coiling Oracle
1 Eternal Witness
1 Farhaven Elf
1 Flickerwisp
1 Thassa, God of the Sea
1 Winged Coatl
1 Wood Elves
1 Ephara, God of the Polis
1 Lu Xun, Scholar General
1 Oracle of Mul Daya
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Acidic Slime
1 Karmic Guide
1 Mulldrifter
1 Reveillark
1 Deadeye Navigator
1 Sun Titan
1 Sol Ring
1 Chromatic Lantern
1 Darksteel Ingot
1 Conjurer's Closet
Enchantments
1 Darksteel Mutation
1 Infinite Reflection
Instants
1 Pact of Negation
1 Summoner's Pact
1 Enlightened Tutor
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Path to Exile
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 Arcane Denial
1 Counterspell
1 Cyclonic Rift
1 Deprive
1 Eladamri's Call
1 Unexpectedly Absent
1 Bant Charm
1 Blue Sun's Zenith
1 Hinder
1 Krosan Grip
1 Sphinx's Revelation
Planeswalkers
1 Venser, the Sojourner
1 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
Sorceries
1 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Martial Coup
1 Supreme Verdict
1 Planar Cleansing
1 Terminus
1 Wrath of God
1 Temporal Mastery
1 Academy Ruins
1 Alchemist's Refuge
1 Bant Panorama
1 Breeding Pool
1 Cavern of Souls
1 Command Tower
1 Faerie Conclave
1 Flooded Strand
3 Forest
1 Glacial Fortress
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Hinterland Harbor
4 Island
1 Kor Haven
1 Mystic Gate
1 Opal Palace
1 Polluted Delta
1 Razorverge Thicket
1 Rupture Spire
1 Saltcrusted Steppe
1 Seachrome Coast
1 Seaside Citadel
1 Sejiri Steppe
1 Sunpetal Grove
1 Tectonic Edge
1 Temple of Enlightenment
1 Temple of the False God
1 Transguild Promenade
1 Windswept Heath
1 Wooded Bastion
Back in the day, we used Ivory Tower and Zuran Orb. Ivory Tower required a deck built to abuse it, Zuran Orb was, well, broken to the point it really didn't require any effort to abuse it.
The deck I'm planning will be Bant colors, so there will be card draw and there might as well be a couple of cards to allow for an unlimited hand-size; Reliquary Tower, Praetor's Counsel come to mind.
Does anyone use either of these cards mentioned in the title in Commander?
What sort of things do you like for life-gain?
Kjeldoran Outpost
Thraben Doomsayer
Some random thoughts. Trostani does seem well-suited here.
Based on your logic, isn't Paladin en-Vec better still? Unless lifelink is your thing. Neither can do what MC can do with a sword.
Five-drops with only 19 land? That's very ambitious.
I've already added the third Aether Vial and I'll look for another.
The single Flagstone doesn't really do anything but produce white mana. It doesn't hurt anything. I've got more Caverns around, in other decks. I'm a little leery of running too many lands that don't make white for spells. I suppose I could ditch the Flares for one of the one-cc removal spells.
Aven Mindcensor is definitely something worth looking into.
Thanks for the reply.