Dismember offers flexibility. It also makes the mirror better by killing Tasigur and the Gurmag Angler.
And at least its not completly dead game 1 against control deck and combo, where you can target your own death shadow to make it grow faster.
Here's what I'll be trying out over the next few days. I'm working on the idea that GDS is a bit slower than DSJ, and using Thing in the Ice similar to Tarmagoyf. He starts off a bit weaker (looking at a 0/4 compared to a 3/4 on turn 2), but should come online about the same time (turn 3-4)and his flip effect is nice enough, especially if you have something like TBR in hand. The Clockspinning and Hexmage might be overkill, but we'll see how it plays out in testing. Theoretically, Hexmage is solid as a 2/1 first strike. I felt like Wraiths burned me out too fast, so I dropped them. It's an experiment, we'll see how it plays out.
That's an atrocious list dude. If you want to create a thing in the ice, vampire hexmage deck go ahead, but don't jam it in GDS please. I'm just going to point out that going 18 lands without serum visions nor street wraith is just a recipe for total disaster.
Graveyard hate is shutting down a few alleys for GDS, namely delve creatures and Snapcaster. Your opponent will bring GY hate G2 G3 (Rest in peace, Relic of progenitus, Nihil spellbomb ...) . I would bring 2 Young pyromancer in and remove 2 gurmag angler in that case. Tasigur is easier to play T3 without thought scour and 6 mana is possible while 7 seems out of the realm of possibilities.
The UW control matchup is pretty rough. I was wondering if there is anything to do about it ? Liliana, the last hope is great against them but thats about it. Any ideas ?
I like what @WhiteCobra3 is saying about the black cartouche. Usually landing one is lights out for RR, so having 3 in the SB will helps you immensely G2 and G3. That's what is pushing me to a black splash. For spell pierce, 2 should be enough in the SB. 4 is too much. You still want action and be able to pressure. Ideally we want 8 cards for control in the SB, siding out all the red removals. I'm boarding in 4 negate, 2 spell pierce and 2 Nissa, Vital force. She will ping 5 damages per turn and she does not care about settle the wreckage nor Fumigate. What do you guys think about her ?
I see that you guys are having arguments about Skysovereign. Is it good or not in the meta ? My guess is that it's good against the mirror, RDW and even Dino. It will kill most of the support dino and the tokens, Whirler virtuoso, Rogue refiner and any red creatures. What's also important is the 6/5 body that can attack through glorybringer and helps you close the game really fast. I'm conflicted between the boat and other great 5CMC like Confiscation Coup. THe boat is great at closing the game. Yes abrade is in the format. It's true that most of the MTGO 5-0 lists featured 1 maindeck.
But we can all agree that it's impossible to win g1 on the play against burn. And nearly impossible too on the draw G1. I'm talking normal modern magic burn player who knows the match up.
How did you win against burn ? Bad opponents, bad draws ? I have yet to win a full round against an experienced burn player. Game one is always a beating.
You guys are talking about mainboarding a 3CMC card without any details on what you are cutting for it. Between kolaghan's command and Snapcaster recurring a 1CMC spell we have 6 3CMC spells. I don't see myself adding 2 more.
Mardu vehicule is a very unfavorable matchup for Temur Energy. You can't interact properly with vehicules with only 4 harnessed lightning. Most of your creatures just trade with theirs except Hydra and Rampager.
Realistically the deck is Tier 2.5, no way you can win consistently against GB, Mardu vehicules nor 4c saheeli.
Won Game Day and FNM with this list. It feels like it tears apart Copy Cat, other Control, and Mardu Vehicles, but the matchup isn't favored against GB Snake. I was just lucky on getting removal heavy hands and eating away at their board while they couldn't deal with the Scrapheap Scrounger and Bristling Hydra with their own removal effectively enough. They seem to have difficulty in dealing with our big 5+ CMC bodies when you prevent them or answer them getting their own, but if unchecked they will outgrow by a lot. I also found that dropping the Heart of Kiran after the first match seemed to catch a lot of people off guard as they brought in Natural State, Fragmentize, and such. Not completely convinced I should be taking it out though.
No more Hydra for me. The deck does not generate enough energy. You have just enough for Rampager, brawler activation and mana. The hydra is good when you can drop it with already 3 energy, or else it just dies to removal in response to the trigger. I replaced them with 2 cubs.
4 unlicensed disintegration is the right number. It's the best removal spell in the format. 3 extra damages to the dome or planeswalkers is bonkers.
I am very happy with blossoming defense in the main. It's great in the format now, helps you keep the pressure on GB and save life against unlicensed disintegration.
i'm really having a hard time against UB control, even if i'm on the play. the 1-3 drops just dies to removal and sweeps and when the game gets to turn 5 or so, it's basically game over for us, especially when we only have a creature or 2. chandra, hydra and scrapheaps are nice against them but i feel it's still not enough since post-board they have kalitas, yaheeni and flaying tendrils. any tips and tricks?
They were my toughest match up at the GP. I mainboarded 2 Blossoming Defense which helped, but I think Incendiary Flow is a better choice than defense mb most of the time. Lifecrafter's Bestiary helps somewhat. Sideboarding out vehicles and in planeswalkers helps somewhat. It's just a very bad match up for us though. There isn't much to be done (from my strictly r/g perspective.)
First place at my gameday on Saturday! There were 17 participants total. We didn't go to top 8 rounds because there were supposedly 8 clear winners based on the matches. I went 5-0 in matches 10-1 in games.
I didn't see any net decks from the recent grand prix events. There was one person play G/B/W counters with the snake, but it didn't seem like a competitive list.
Recap of more interesting opponents:
My friend has been playing with and occasionally winning deck with a reanimation theme. It features Scrapheap Scrounger, Prized Amalgam, Cryptbreaker, Cathartic Reunion, Fiery Temper, Khalitas? and Volderan Pariah. In addition to temper, it plays black removal of course. The deck gains traction and card advantage rather quickly. 3 Incendiary Flow in my mainboard definitely won me both games. Fatal Push on my elephants made me sad.
The second deck was of a similar reanimation style, though it's main color was blue. It featured [card]Elder Deep-Fiend
[/card] and Kozilek's Return. He'd discard Kozilek's return and Prized amalgam to reanimate Stitchwing Scab. On my next during the upkeep, cast [card]Elder Deep-Fiend
[/card], deal 5 damage to each creature and tap down my 4 lands. It was brutal. A lucky Blossoming Defense, a huge Hydra and 5 lands won me my last game.
Overall I'd say 4 cub, 4 brawler and 4 elephant carried this deck to victory. Longtusk cub was a great performer for the night. I found myself often getting extra energy for Cub with Renegade Rampager. Being able to make him a 3/3 during attacking on turn 3 helped pave the way to victory. Before game day I went down to 21 lands adding Servant of the Conduit in place of a forest. Every time I saw the servant I was glad it wasn't a forest. Heart of Kiran was an allstar as was Chandra, Torch of Defiance.
This will be my mainboard list for next FNM. The sideboard might change a bit.
PS Narnam Renegade seemed to hold his own. He actually won me a game in my final match of the night. He held off attacks for a while before dying. Later with 6 Mana, I played Nissa, brought him into hand and replayed him the same turn. It kept me alive for another turn while making his attack unprofitable. Renegade might be out if I get my hands on another Heart of Kiran.
With all due respect your list is competitive enough to play game day but not for GP or any bigger events. I can't play plain green/Red anymore because having only 4 mainboard answers to heart of kiran just loses you the game. The deck just folds to mardu vehicules. If you don't play against "net decks" that is just fine but take those results with a grain of salt if you are planning to play outside FNM.
I've been doing some more testing with my Naya build and did end up taking the advice on removing Aetherstorm Roc for Heart of Kiran. After giving it some thought, it's a great fit with the planeswalkers I play and any loss in synergy was insignificant. I also dropped a land for another Voltaic Brawler because of constant flooding. Plus he's soooo good.
Scrapheap Scrounger is the strictly for the control match, UB is almost and auto loss for me. I've changed the SB a lot since the last time I tested against a control deck and I feel like I've made solid progress with my issues vs this deck type. While I don't play any black lands, Aether Hub and Servant of the Conduit should be just enough to bring them back a few times.
So if you have problem against pure control I suggest Lathnu hellion in the SB instead of scrapheap. The scrapheap is great but your mana base won't allow you to realistically have black mana on time. To give you an example, when I was splashing blue in my GR energy build I would side in an island (for Attune with aether) and I would already have 4 GU fastland + the 4 aether hub. You can't count on the servant of the conduit since they'll probably be dead.
Lathnu Hellion does the job well
Quarantine field is a great card but it's 6 mana for it to be efficient. It does not fit the same role as release the gremlins. Release is for the mardu vehicules matchup where it can be a huge swing.
And at least its not completly dead game 1 against control deck and combo, where you can target your own death shadow to make it grow faster.
That's an atrocious list dude. If you want to create a thing in the ice, vampire hexmage deck go ahead, but don't jam it in GDS please. I'm just going to point out that going 18 lands without serum visions nor street wraith is just a recipe for total disaster.
2 Nihil spellbomb in the SB is always 100% in. You need gy hate in modern, that's it.
The UW control matchup is pretty rough. I was wondering if there is anything to do about it ? Liliana, the last hope is great against them but thats about it. Any ideas ?
I see that you guys are having arguments about Skysovereign. Is it good or not in the meta ? My guess is that it's good against the mirror, RDW and even Dino. It will kill most of the support dino and the tokens, Whirler virtuoso, Rogue refiner and any red creatures. What's also important is the 6/5 body that can attack through glorybringer and helps you close the game really fast. I'm conflicted between the boat and other great 5CMC like Confiscation Coup. THe boat is great at closing the game. Yes abrade is in the format. It's true that most of the MTGO 5-0 lists featured 1 maindeck.
Realistically the deck is Tier 2.5, no way you can win consistently against GB, Mardu vehicules nor 4c saheeli.
I'm playing a very similar list :
4 Aether Hub
4 Blooming Marsh
1 Forest
4 Game Trail
1 cinder glade
2 Mountain
1 Swamp
//Artifacts
2 Heart of Kiran
1 Skysovereign, Consul Flagship
//Instants
2 shock
2 Harnessed Lightning
4 Unlicensed Disintegration
2 blossoming defense
//Sorceries
4 Attune with Aether
//Planeswalkers
3 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
//Creatures
2 Longtusk cub
4 Greenbelt Rampager
2 Rishkar, Peema Renegade
4 Scrapheap Scrounger
2 Tireless Tracker
1 Verdurous Gearhulk
4 Voltaic Brawler
2 Natural State
2 Release the Gremlins
1 natural obsolescence
1 Verdurous Gearhulk
1 chandra, torch of defiance
1 Skysovereign, Consul Flagship
2 Tireless Tracker
1 Fleetwheel Cruiser
2 lifecrafter bestiary
No more Hydra for me. The deck does not generate enough energy. You have just enough for Rampager, brawler activation and mana. The hydra is good when you can drop it with already 3 energy, or else it just dies to removal in response to the trigger. I replaced them with 2 cubs.
4 unlicensed disintegration is the right number. It's the best removal spell in the format. 3 extra damages to the dome or planeswalkers is bonkers.
I am very happy with blossoming defense in the main. It's great in the format now, helps you keep the pressure on GB and save life against unlicensed disintegration.
I agree with you that GB is the tougher matchup.
SB Plan:
Mardu vehicules :
P -3 chandra -2 tracker +2 natural state +2 release the gremlins +1 natural obsolescence
D -3 chandra -2 tracker +2 natural state +2 release the gremlins +1 natural obsolescence -1 scrapheap -1 unlicensed +2 fatal push
4c Saheeli :
P -1 blossoming defense -1 Harnessed lightning +1 skysovereign +1 verdurous gearhulk
D -1 blossoming defense -1 Harnessed lightning +1 skysovereign +1 verdurous gearhulk
Jeskai saheeli :
P -2 Rishkar -2 harnessed lightning -1 Verdurous gearhulk -1 skysovereign +2 tireless tracker +1 Chandra +1 fleetwheel cruiser +2 lifecrafter bestiary
D -2 Rishkar -2 harnessed lightning -1 Verdurous gearhulk -1 skysovereign +2 tireless tracker +1 Chandra +1 fleetwheel cruiser +2 lifecrafter bestiary
GB :
P -1 Harnessed lightning -1 chandra -2 shock +1 skysovereign +1 verdurous gearhulk +2 fatal push
D -2 scrapheap -1 chandra -2 shock +1 skysovereign +1 verdurous gearhulk + 2 fatal push + 1 tireless tracker
I haven't played enough against BG to see what's good or not. So SB is in progress. I like the mainboard though.
With all due respect your list is competitive enough to play game day but not for GP or any bigger events. I can't play plain green/Red anymore because having only 4 mainboard answers to heart of kiran just loses you the game. The deck just folds to mardu vehicules. If you don't play against "net decks" that is just fine but take those results with a grain of salt if you are planning to play outside FNM.
So if you have problem against pure control I suggest Lathnu hellion in the SB instead of scrapheap. The scrapheap is great but your mana base won't allow you to realistically have black mana on time. To give you an example, when I was splashing blue in my GR energy build I would side in an island (for Attune with aether) and I would already have 4 GU fastland + the 4 aether hub. You can't count on the servant of the conduit since they'll probably be dead.
Lathnu Hellion does the job well
Quarantine field is a great card but it's 6 mana for it to be efficient. It does not fit the same role as release the gremlins. Release is for the mardu vehicules matchup where it can be a huge swing.