Thinking about it, I think the odds are fairly high that the first FNM with Modern will have a promo for all participants, just to get more people playing it. A nice uncommon or common or something...
Or if they haven't planned that, they really should (hint for the MTG brand team. You're welcome)
Niv is going to lure Jace into a maze, that was the whole reason he tricked Jace to get back to Ravnica in the first place.
There Jace will be locked up forever. Since the world needs a COOL blue mage, Niv-Mizzet then phones over Ral to come and join the celebration party.
Everyone in Ravnica rejoices as Ral is elected the new face of Magic at the party in Ravnica, breaking both the 4th wall and sales records everywhere.
Eventually the Eldrazi also get captured and put in the maze, so that Jace has is tortured for an eternity.
Since Dimir is the guild of information, I also expect one of the modes to either look at a player's hand or even discard a card. Like:
1. Look at target player's hand, that player then discards a card. (BU)
2. Target creature gets -2/-2 (B)
3. Target creature is unblockable until end of turn (U)
However the reason is partly because it was announced that Modern Masters has staples of the format, except for Zendikar (it's until Shards I believe).
This means it will be easier for new players to enter modern (Tarmo might drop a few dollars). However, people still need their fetch lands. So, higher demand, same supply... presto, raise in price.
I'm in luck as I bought a playset of both in the last 3 months.
I find it funny you say smiter is better vs grixis, as I actually played Grixis for the last weeks, and find the other 3 drops a lot better. Grixis nowadays doesn't make you discard cards (except rakdos return, but q good grixis player will side those out against selesnya or not run them at all)
Again, you want stuff that does something, even if your opponent has a kill spell. The fact that smiter is just a 4/4 is relevant in tha5 your opponent can play a 1-1 spell (of which there are a lot) without any downside for him. And 3 life (more with angel shenanigans) is extremely relevant vs zombies.
Nearly all the kill spells that kill a smiter also kill the Wolfir Avenger and Centaur healer (Mortars, Dreadbore, Tragic Slip etc etc), but those two have very relevant upsides. Wolfir Avenger is great against control because most removal spells are sorceries nowadays. Plus it can regen through a Verdict or Dreadbore.
Centaur healers 3 life is very relevant vs zombies, plus it works with Resto Angel.
The only card right now that makes these cards worse I think are Annihilating Fire (not played much) and Brimstone Volley (non-morbid).
I definitely think Healer and Avenger are the 3 drops for most Selesnya decks. Paladin is better in a more white aggro build which splashes green for rancor.
Have people playtested against the Midrange Jund list that came second at the latest SCG? It isn't unwinnable but it can be pretty rough, especially if they Rakdos's Return you.
They share a lot of the same threats and accelerate quicker. Your Olivia's basically end up being removal for theirs, and Thragtusk is a real pain in their lists compared to in other lists as they have answers for your answers.
Rakdos's Return is one of the few cards that can seriously impact us. However there is a reasonable chance we have a Jace, Architect of thought already on the board then, which can generate quite a bit of CA.
Post board counters should hold the Return in check.
Thragtusk is not the end of the world for us. With Tamiyo, Nighthawks, Barters, the only thing they really gain is a bit of life, which is usually not a problem at all.
Vraska is pretty good against us though... but there are apetites for brains for that.
Overall I wouldn't say we have that bad of a matchup. I believe Grixis is one of the stronger control vs (aggro-)control decks.
Zombies remains worse.
@rdb: Izzet charm seems meh at best. It seems like a lot of versatility, but in reality not enough. Against Selesnya or other midrange you will only use the cycling.
Nighthawk is one of the cards I added in my latest version and improved the deck a LOT. He holds the fort really well (also protects your walkers!) and sometimes can even race if you want. Be sure you have your manabase in order though.
I took the list I posted earlier (with a little bit of SB tweaking) to FNM last Friday.
I went 1-1-1 there:
First match was against a new player with an out of the box deck. Pretty easy and not really relevant (went 2-1 because I was manascrewed one game where she made 3 silvercoat lions. Yes, I was embaressed).
Second match was against bant control, went 0-2. I used Slaughter games once for Thragtusk, got one out of his hand, but he had so much other good stuff that it didn't matter. Next match I tried Resto Angel (had to hope he didn't have one in hand, but he had and casted it... it was the only card that could screw my strategy at that point). I also used Rakdos return once during one of the matches, and got 2 knights in play with Selesnya Charm and a Resto Angel, before he ditched some lands and one other thing.
Third match was WRB controllish. Went to time and he managed to win game 2 in extra turns where I won game 1 handedly. I probably would have won game 3.
I was not very impressed with the deck so on Saturday I decided to make some changes, as Sunday there was Dutch Nationals Qualifiers.
I removed all the Augurs (didn't really work for me) and replaced with 3 nighthawks +1 Syncopate. I also took out the Cyclonic Rift, Slaughter games and Rakdos return out of main for 1 extra Mizzium mortars and 2 Syncopates (so 3 'pates total in).
In SB I also changed a lot. I actually added in Talrand's Invocation. Reasoning was that that card is better against zombies and control than barter in blood. That turned out pretty well, but I found out later that against control I actually probably want both Invocation and Barter, and probably not some of the single target removal.
On Sunday I went 3-0-2 and I felt pretty good about that.
First match was against B/R zombies. In fact, it was against the player who won the FNM on Friday.
First game I lost pretty fast. Game 2 my opening hand had 3 pillars. I won that one ;). Last game I had pillar and snapcaster in hand, and a syncopate. I managed to kill 2 zombies and countered his Liliana, and then proceeded to make 4 drakes to take over and win unusually fast.
so 2-1
Second Match was against a Bant control player. First game I managed to win with Bolas and the other walkers after a long game and him not drawing his second Detention Sphere (he was down to 10 cards too with all the Sphinx's revelations). Game 2 was ok, but came down to Geist of Saint Traft and me not being able to deal with it in the end. (I think I made a mistake boarding out the barters here).
Game 3 was disappointing... we only had a few minutes left. I kept a 2 land hand with rakdos keyrune and a barter. He had a temple garden and a plains in hand he told afterward, with negate and geist and 2 snappies to go with it... he kept that and topdecked an island on his first draw. I didn't drew my third land and Geist + 2 snappies killed me fast. When I drew the land, he countered my keyrune and that was it. Was very disappointing to lose this way (him topdecking an exact land and me failing to topdeck *any* land)
Third Match was against Stuffy Doll combo with Blasphemous act. I had apetites in my SB which came in and were amazing. I lost game one because I had to take a chance and he managed to get me to 0 with an exact topdeck. Game 2 I won easily and game 3 went to time. Because he made a rules mistake but the Judge there ruled it was too far in the future (which we both found odd as we both had only played lands and attacked once) he managed to keep an extra card with Loothouse. After the 5 extra turns I we debated a bit what to do as we knew any X-1-1 would not get the Dutch Nationals (only top 2 would get) and he conceded to me.
I feel if we did have more time (also because of the rules thing we lost like 5-10 mins) I could have won anyway.
Fourth Match
Against another B/R zombies. This time I never saw any pillar and had to mull to 6 twice. It was over fast.
Fifth (final) Match was against the Bant control player I also played at FNM.
This time I won 2-1, I managed to keep his threats in check and win on Tamiyo ultimate both times.
So I feel the deck did very well. Only zombies needs more attention (what the rest in the thread is also saying), the rest felt really good and it was awesome to play. Also, Syncopate was really good (except vs zombies), nobody expected it ("You are playing *THAT*?").
I had a 2nd Bolas in the board and a Devil's play. I never used those, so I will be replacing those with something else...
Based on the name I'd say it's reasonable to assume it is a creature which does some form of discard (like all specters).
Most likely 4 mana if it is repetative (liliana's one was a one-time discard, most other specters are 4 mana).
The name also suggests that it might be hexproof, which would fit well, because then it would be a Dimir card and a discard hexproof guy definitely has a Dimir vibe.
Also, there hasn't been a hexproof specter before, so it's a very easy fit (not too complex either).
So something like:
2BU
Flying, Hexproof
Whenever ~this~ deals combat damage to a player, that player discards a card.
2/3
Thanks for the feedback. I could have sworn Distress was back in 2013. That does leave a (small) hole. I'll have to think what fills it.
Barter is really your first line of defense. The early pillar/mortar/augur should keep you safe until you can cast it. If the coast is still clear, Jace gets to party. But I can see swapping out one for another Mortar or perhaps the last pillar from the side. Maybe a Rift. Hm
Note that I don't yet run Olivia and if you cast Niv (you always cast with at least 2 mana up so you can get card parity) you should not need barter anymore. In that scenario you would probably just Mortars everything or dreadbore or keep stuff tapped with Tamiyo.
Augur is mainly to defend Jace and has a chance to bonus up. It's still around 20 spells in the deck, so only slightly lower than delver would be. I kinda like him better than snapcaster as he fits the curve better and has a better body for this deck.
You don't always get lotus on 5th turn, and Tamiyo answers a lot that Jace can't on his own. Plus it is a win condition that doesn't die to creature removal. I think she is better than she looks.
The Devil's play is just reach and gives you something even if you discard it early with an alchemy. In the side is another to go along with it.
So with Distress gone, and maybe one less barter, I'm thinking
+1 Cyclonic Rift (worth a try, it's also nice against opposing walkers, and I did pre-order a few, so might as well test it)
+2 Syncopate? (I really want some MD answers to some of the bigger threats. Hate the fact that loltroll becomes a bigger issue though)
I'm playing a little more planeswalkers than most. I feel especially Tamiyo is a bit underrated right now. The fact that she can keep Thragtusk at bay profitably (as well and the new angel, among others) is pretty significant. She's also a good win condition with just a pillar of flame if she is ultimate.
Both blue walkers are also good card draw. I really dislike Desperate Ravings, but I do have them and will maybe test them out.
Beside the walkers, I think the Augur, Alchemy and the loothouse is enough card selection.
I also like a few Distress in the main, it can nearly always hit something you need. A big threat (thrag), a lol troll...
And it also gives you some much needed information on how to play out your hand. I wish there was room for one more.
I am still fine-tuning the numbers. I kinda want an Olivia main and another dreadbore, but there is simply no room.
Basically you want the last pillar and more ways to use your removal with the snapcaster (also use it to chump and save time). Shift out some late stuff that is too slow and doesn't do enough to them.
Aggro midrange
+1 Blasphemous Act
+1 Rakdos Return
+3 Slaughter Games
-2 Pillar of Flame
-2 Distress
-1 Dreadbore
Not entirely sure. All I know is that we need to be able to make sure Thrag/Armada Wurm/Resto Angel/New Angel etc are neutralised. Slaughter Games are pretty good at that. I'm not sure the Distress should come out. Maybe some the dreadbores and the last pillar need to leave.
control
+3 Duress
+3 Slaughter Games
+1 Rakdos's Return
+1 Devil's Play
-3 Barter in Blood
-2 Mizzium Mortars
-2 Pillar of Flame
-1 Distress
Siding out a lot of removal, for discards and big effects to go over the top and nuke their hand or life total.
Weird Stuff
+2 Rakdos Charm
So bascially I know some local players might try self-dredge or reanimation. And another guy has a turbofog deck that runs on Otherworld atlas. So this is something that might get those two decks. It might also be decent on a deck leaning on runechanter's pike
I'm actually betting on a Show and Tell reprint.
Not only is it very fun in EDH/multiplayer, it is also a Legacy staple with a pretty high pricetag.
And... never been foil before (also never been Judge promo etc).
Looks like the perfect candidate to sell 'Commander's Arsenal'.
Or if they haven't planned that, they really should (hint for the MTG brand team. You're welcome)
'Second Price Soar modern staples incoming!'
Niv is going to lure Jace into a maze, that was the whole reason he tricked Jace to get back to Ravnica in the first place.
There Jace will be locked up forever. Since the world needs a COOL blue mage, Niv-Mizzet then phones over Ral to come and join the celebration party.
Everyone in Ravnica rejoices as Ral is elected the new face of Magic at the party in Ravnica, breaking both the 4th wall and sales records everywhere.
Eventually the Eldrazi also get captured and put in the maze, so that Jace has is tortured for an eternity.
I love this set already!
"You thought we wouldn't do another Un set? Hah! Gotcha!"
Unun
"It's a whole new level of un-, we created a new word. Yep. Oh and the 3 letter combo for it is NUN."
1. Look at target player's hand, that player then discards a card. (BU)
2. Target creature gets -2/-2 (B)
3. Target creature is unblockable until end of turn (U)
However the reason is partly because it was announced that Modern Masters has staples of the format, except for Zendikar (it's until Shards I believe).
This means it will be easier for new players to enter modern (Tarmo might drop a few dollars). However, people still need their fetch lands. So, higher demand, same supply... presto, raise in price.
I'm in luck as I bought a playset of both in the last 3 months.
Again, you want stuff that does something, even if your opponent has a kill spell. The fact that smiter is just a 4/4 is relevant in tha5 your opponent can play a 1-1 spell (of which there are a lot) without any downside for him. And 3 life (more with angel shenanigans) is extremely relevant vs zombies.
Have you guys tried a different version with token makers and Burn at the Stake?
Something Like (very rough draft from the top of my head):
4 Gather the Townsfolk
4 Lingering Souls
2 Increasing Devotion
3 Flames of the Firebrand
4 Faithless Looting
2 Increasing Vengeance
3 Epic Experiment
2 Burn at the Stake
2 Sorin, Lord of Innistrad
24 lands
You can probably side out the combo for a more token oriented kill game 2 (or maybe the other way around and hide the combo in your SB for game 2!).
Nearly all the kill spells that kill a smiter also kill the Wolfir Avenger and Centaur healer (Mortars, Dreadbore, Tragic Slip etc etc), but those two have very relevant upsides. Wolfir Avenger is great against control because most removal spells are sorceries nowadays. Plus it can regen through a Verdict or Dreadbore.
Centaur healers 3 life is very relevant vs zombies, plus it works with Resto Angel.
The only card right now that makes these cards worse I think are Annihilating Fire (not played much) and Brimstone Volley (non-morbid).
I definitely think Healer and Avenger are the 3 drops for most Selesnya decks. Paladin is better in a more white aggro build which splashes green for rancor.
Rakdos's Return is one of the few cards that can seriously impact us. However there is a reasonable chance we have a Jace, Architect of thought already on the board then, which can generate quite a bit of CA.
Post board counters should hold the Return in check.
Thragtusk is not the end of the world for us. With Tamiyo, Nighthawks, Barters, the only thing they really gain is a bit of life, which is usually not a problem at all.
Vraska is pretty good against us though... but there are apetites for brains for that.
Overall I wouldn't say we have that bad of a matchup. I believe Grixis is one of the stronger control vs (aggro-)control decks.
Zombies remains worse.
@rdb: Izzet charm seems meh at best. It seems like a lot of versatility, but in reality not enough. Against Selesnya or other midrange you will only use the cycling.
Nighthawk is one of the cards I added in my latest version and improved the deck a LOT. He holds the fort really well (also protects your walkers!) and sometimes can even race if you want. Be sure you have your manabase in order though.
I went 1-1-1 there:
First match was against a new player with an out of the box deck. Pretty easy and not really relevant (went 2-1 because I was manascrewed one game where she made 3 silvercoat lions. Yes, I was embaressed).
Second match was against bant control, went 0-2. I used Slaughter games once for Thragtusk, got one out of his hand, but he had so much other good stuff that it didn't matter. Next match I tried Resto Angel (had to hope he didn't have one in hand, but he had and casted it... it was the only card that could screw my strategy at that point). I also used Rakdos return once during one of the matches, and got 2 knights in play with Selesnya Charm and a Resto Angel, before he ditched some lands and one other thing.
Third match was WRB controllish. Went to time and he managed to win game 2 in extra turns where I won game 1 handedly. I probably would have won game 3.
I was not very impressed with the deck so on Saturday I decided to make some changes, as Sunday there was Dutch Nationals Qualifiers.
I removed all the Augurs (didn't really work for me) and replaced with 3 nighthawks +1 Syncopate. I also took out the Cyclonic Rift, Slaughter games and Rakdos return out of main for 1 extra Mizzium mortars and 2 Syncopates (so 3 'pates total in).
In SB I also changed a lot. I actually added in Talrand's Invocation. Reasoning was that that card is better against zombies and control than barter in blood. That turned out pretty well, but I found out later that against control I actually probably want both Invocation and Barter, and probably not some of the single target removal.
On Sunday I went 3-0-2 and I felt pretty good about that.
First match was against B/R zombies. In fact, it was against the player who won the FNM on Friday.
First game I lost pretty fast. Game 2 my opening hand had 3 pillars. I won that one ;). Last game I had pillar and snapcaster in hand, and a syncopate. I managed to kill 2 zombies and countered his Liliana, and then proceeded to make 4 drakes to take over and win unusually fast.
so 2-1
Second Match was against a Bant control player. First game I managed to win with Bolas and the other walkers after a long game and him not drawing his second Detention Sphere (he was down to 10 cards too with all the Sphinx's revelations). Game 2 was ok, but came down to Geist of Saint Traft and me not being able to deal with it in the end. (I think I made a mistake boarding out the barters here).
Game 3 was disappointing... we only had a few minutes left. I kept a 2 land hand with rakdos keyrune and a barter. He had a temple garden and a plains in hand he told afterward, with negate and geist and 2 snappies to go with it... he kept that and topdecked an island on his first draw. I didn't drew my third land and Geist + 2 snappies killed me fast. When I drew the land, he countered my keyrune and that was it. Was very disappointing to lose this way (him topdecking an exact land and me failing to topdeck *any* land)
Third Match was against Stuffy Doll combo with Blasphemous act. I had apetites in my SB which came in and were amazing. I lost game one because I had to take a chance and he managed to get me to 0 with an exact topdeck. Game 2 I won easily and game 3 went to time. Because he made a rules mistake but the Judge there ruled it was too far in the future (which we both found odd as we both had only played lands and attacked once) he managed to keep an extra card with Loothouse. After the 5 extra turns I we debated a bit what to do as we knew any X-1-1 would not get the Dutch Nationals (only top 2 would get) and he conceded to me.
I feel if we did have more time (also because of the rules thing we lost like 5-10 mins) I could have won anyway.
Fourth Match
Against another B/R zombies. This time I never saw any pillar and had to mull to 6 twice. It was over fast.
Fifth (final) Match was against the Bant control player I also played at FNM.
This time I won 2-1, I managed to keep his threats in check and win on Tamiyo ultimate both times.
So I feel the deck did very well. Only zombies needs more attention (what the rest in the thread is also saying), the rest felt really good and it was awesome to play. Also, Syncopate was really good (except vs zombies), nobody expected it ("You are playing *THAT*?").
I had a 2nd Bolas in the board and a Devil's play. I never used those, so I will be replacing those with something else...
I'll post the list I ran Sunday later tonight.
Most likely 4 mana if it is repetative (liliana's one was a one-time discard, most other specters are 4 mana).
The name also suggests that it might be hexproof, which would fit well, because then it would be a Dimir card and a discard hexproof guy definitely has a Dimir vibe.
Also, there hasn't been a hexproof specter before, so it's a very easy fit (not too complex either).
So something like:
2BU
Flying, Hexproof
Whenever ~this~ deals combat damage to a player, that player discards a card.
2/3
Barter is really your first line of defense. The early pillar/mortar/augur should keep you safe until you can cast it. If the coast is still clear, Jace gets to party. But I can see swapping out one for another Mortar or perhaps the last pillar from the side. Maybe a Rift. Hm
Note that I don't yet run Olivia and if you cast Niv (you always cast with at least 2 mana up so you can get card parity) you should not need barter anymore. In that scenario you would probably just Mortars everything or dreadbore or keep stuff tapped with Tamiyo.
Augur is mainly to defend Jace and has a chance to bonus up. It's still around 20 spells in the deck, so only slightly lower than delver would be. I kinda like him better than snapcaster as he fits the curve better and has a better body for this deck.
You don't always get lotus on 5th turn, and Tamiyo answers a lot that Jace can't on his own. Plus it is a win condition that doesn't die to creature removal. I think she is better than she looks.
The Devil's play is just reach and gives you something even if you discard it early with an alchemy. In the side is another to go along with it.
So with Distress gone, and maybe one less barter, I'm thinking
+1 Cyclonic Rift (worth a try, it's also nice against opposing walkers, and I did pre-order a few, so might as well test it)
+2 Syncopate? (I really want some MD answers to some of the bigger threats. Hate the fact that loltroll becomes a bigger issue though)
I'll sleep on it and test some coming weekend.
Both blue walkers are also good card draw. I really dislike Desperate Ravings, but I do have them and will maybe test them out.
Beside the walkers, I think the Augur, Alchemy and the loothouse is enough card selection.
I also like a few Distress in the main, it can nearly always hit something you need. A big threat (thrag), a lol troll...
And it also gives you some much needed information on how to play out your hand. I wish there was room for one more.
I am still fine-tuning the numbers. I kinda want an Olivia main and another dreadbore, but there is simply no room.
3 Jace, Architect of Thought
2 Tamiyo, the Moon Sage
1 Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker
2 Niv-Mizzet, Dracogenius
4 Augur of Bolas
Removal
4 Barter in Blood
2 Dreadbore
3 Pillar of Flame
2 Mizzium Mortars
Discard and Reach
2 Distress
1 Rakdos's Return
1 Devil's Play
3 Forbidden Alchemy
1 Increasing Ambition
Acceleration
2 Rakdos Keyrune
2 Gilded Lotus
Lands
4 Blood Crypt
3 Steam Vents
3 Drowned Catacomb
3 Dragonskull Summit
4 Sulfur Falls
2 Island
1 Mountain
4 Swamp
1 Desolate Lighthouse
1 Pillar of Flame
3 Snapcaster Mage
1 Blasphemous Act
3 Duress
3 Slaughter Games
1 Devil's Play
1 Rakdos's Return
2 Rakdos Charm
Zombies
+1 Pillar
+3 Snapcaster
+1 Blasphemous Act
-2 Tamiyo
-1 Nicol Bolas
-1 Rakdos's Return
-1 Distress
Basically you want the last pillar and more ways to use your removal with the snapcaster (also use it to chump and save time). Shift out some late stuff that is too slow and doesn't do enough to them.
Aggro midrange
+1 Blasphemous Act
+1 Rakdos Return
+3 Slaughter Games
-2 Pillar of Flame
-2 Distress
-1 Dreadbore
Not entirely sure. All I know is that we need to be able to make sure Thrag/Armada Wurm/Resto Angel/New Angel etc are neutralised. Slaughter Games are pretty good at that. I'm not sure the Distress should come out. Maybe some the dreadbores and the last pillar need to leave.
control
+3 Duress
+3 Slaughter Games
+1 Rakdos's Return
+1 Devil's Play
-3 Barter in Blood
-2 Mizzium Mortars
-2 Pillar of Flame
-1 Distress
Siding out a lot of removal, for discards and big effects to go over the top and nuke their hand or life total.
Weird Stuff
+2 Rakdos Charm
So bascially I know some local players might try self-dredge or reanimation. And another guy has a turbofog deck that runs on Otherworld atlas. So this is something that might get those two decks. It might also be decent on a deck leaning on runechanter's pike
Not only is it very fun in EDH/multiplayer, it is also a Legacy staple with a pretty high pricetag.
And... never been foil before (also never been Judge promo etc).
Looks like the perfect candidate to sell 'Commander's Arsenal'.