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  • posted a message on Seeking suggestions on UB control


    Hello everyone,

    I'd like to get some constructive feedback on a UB control deck. Any advice or commentary you're willing to give is very much appreciated, and I thank you in advance for taking the time to read through this, give it consideration, and actually give a stranger (me) your thoughts. To those who have the time: thank you!

    What I'm looking for is just people's thoughts on what they would do different were they to take this into some sort of competitive play. I only put it here in the vintage forums because technically it qualifies as vintage because of a Demonic Tutor, Sol Ring and Wasteland. But, though I know it's not competitive in that format, I'm still interested in some thoughts on what you all would do differently to the deck if you were to play it.

    Explanation for Cards
    I'll attempt to explain why I chose certain cards over others, or why they're in there to begin with. Cards not bulleted: either I have nothing to say about it or it seems obvious why I have it. I'm including the sideboard cards in these lists so as not to make it confusing with separate lists.

    Creatures
    Mostly meant for defense while I get some sort of win condition in place. However, the creatures tend to be what wins the game once the rest of the deck does its job in taking control of the board.
    • Havengul Lich — It's fun when it works, though it tends to be a quick target for removal. There's good reason for that though, since when it's combined with Chromatic Lantern, it can ruin anybody's day. Expensive, yes, but at least it requires 2 burn spells typically, potentially saving other stuff. Plus, if you get this late game and have enough mana, you can activate it's ability even if it gets removed right away. Love this with Baleful Strix for the draw.
    • Baleful Strix — Speaking of, Strix is a great defender (except against burn and first strike). If there's lots of burn though, I sometimes sideboard these out. Other than that, the deathtouch tends to keep lots of attackers at bay until they can figure out a solution for a dinky 1/1 flyer.
    • Nightveil Specter — Again, combined with the lantern, this hurts lots of decks. It can also give me more land sometimes. I just like this guy.
    • Wall of Frost — This was the wall I eventually settled on after testing various other ones like Fog Bank, Hover Barrier, Wall of Tears and a few others. Since I usually need time, this wall does the trick while living through most attack/burn combos.
    • Kira, Great Glass-Spinner — Meant to help against decks that rely on removal. It's especially frustrating for the opponent when this is brought back with Havengul Lich.

    Artifacts
    The deck does heavily lean on artifacts, though it doesn't depend on them. If you mess with its artifacts, the deck will go on, albeit now angry.
    • Chromatic Lantern — For use with Havengul Lich, Nightveil Specter, and the occasional Cunning Wished instant that I can't put on a stick, but must use.
    • Isochron Scepter — Some people say it's too slow for legacy/vintage, but when faced against blue bounces, I just sideboard these out. Either way, "the stick" is feared if there's no answer to it.
    • Trading Post — I'm artifact heavy, so this makes sense. Plus, this helps in defense, both with its life gain and 0/1 goat factory. Baaahhh!
    • Elixir of Immortality — Inspired by a mill deck that mopped the floor with me. Its success rate dropped dramatically after this came in. Bonus — burn didn't like this addition either.
    • Ensnaring Bridge — It came into my life because I encountered an Elvish Piper deck. It stayed in my life because it's won me many other match-ups.
    • Chalice of the Void — Not sure about this one, but it sure does come in handy against rockem-sockem robots and anything else that relies heavily on 0 and 1-mana cost cards.

    Instants
    This has grown into a very diverse set of spells, all meant to try to account for any situation I might encounter. Many of these are 1-of because the idea is they'll likely make their way onto a stick. However, the balance has been good enough where there's enough to come along, stick or no stick.
    • Go for the Throat — Too much B out there to bother with Doom Blade, IMHO.
    • Ultimate Price — Variety on the above, and great against mono decks. Traded out for Far // Away when faced with decks that use lots of multi-colored creatures.
    • Surgical Extraction — This is amazing when used on an artifact removal instant. Usually people carry limited artifact/enchantment hate, and often they have up to 4 of whatever one card they're using. So if you catch it early in the game, it lets you breath easy as you allow yourself to become artifact dependent. Of course, there are so many other uses for this it just goes without saying.
    • Bile Blight — Aggro control.
    • Cunning Wish — I use this to get the answer I need. If nothing's "needed" and I have an extra stick lying around, I get out Lightning Helix for life gain or Orim's Chant to earn dagger eyes from the opponent.
    • Far // Away — A god-send when faced against hexproofed or indestructible creatures. Plus, you can cast both from the hand, or either from the stick.
    • Lightning Helix — Lifegainer/removal against aggro.
    • Swords to Plowshares — Bye-bye indestructible. I never notice the life gain, as I never encounter "we're both at 3 life, who will deal damage first" scenarios. Either I control the board and then take my time to win, or I don't control the board and lose. Life doesn't matter. Though, I suppose it could be used to get some life for yourself in an emergency if facing burn.
    • Orim's Chant — I have Isochron Scepter. I can't not have this in here somewhere.
    • Destructive Revelry — For artifact-heavy matchups.
    • Hide // Seek — Useful as an alternative to Destructive Revelry and Surgical Extraction, on one card. Need Chromatic Lantern or a stick to use, but can give you the needed versatility if both of those answers are needed against one deck.
    • Research // Development — Not sure on this. It's a recent addition that sounds cool (especially on a stick), but I haven't actually used it yet. To be determined, for sure.

    Other Spells
    • Bribery — Handy against decks that rely on a creature for their win-con.
    • Engineered Plague — Great against tribal decks; even better against 1/1 utility creatures; best against annoying little elves.
    • Ancestral Vision — I can't afford Ancestral Recall, though I'll admit, it's great to get this in an opening hand as it triggers just around the time I'm starting to run out of cards. Yes, opponents see it coming and like to counter it, but I've found that often to be to my benefit as they save their counters for this and don't use them on things they should have (or they give up their tempo for a turn because they need to keep open enough mana for the counter during my turn).

    Planeswalkers
    I like to play without planeswalkers when possible. Yes, I'm of the "Planeswalkers broke MtG" camp, but sometimes you have to fight fire with fire.
    • Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas — With so many artifacts, this one is obvious. It's mostly a tutor for me, though it breaks stalemates with its ultimate. Oh, it has a middle ability? Never really noticed.
    • Jace, Architect of Thought — Brought in against aggro. Rarely do I ultimate (what's the point when you have Bribery, specters and liches?), though the second ability is handy if you no longer have to worry about attacks.
    • Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver — At first added only because she was UB, but stayed when I was nicely surprised at how she could actually give me a mill win-con. The fact that the mill exiles the deck and that she gets +2 is just messed up if the opponent can't get past the defense. "Awww...was that another goyf exiled?" If I have the luxury of time, she can also help delay aggro if she exiles a creature that you can bring back the next turn. Though, if you do you have to contend with the fact that the creatures goes back into their graveyard if it gets killed, or it can get bounced back into their hand.

    Lands
    As you'll notice, most of the lands are non-basic, which opens this deck up to much of the specialty land hate out there. It's especially susceptible to Wastelands, though often those become targets for Pithing Needle if there isn't anything more heinous I have to worry about. Land control, however, is certainly a vulnerability, and decks like Janosch Kuhn's 2000 top 8 deck give it a good butt-kicking. That said, single-minded land control doesn't seem to be too prevalent, which I can only guess is due to it being a weak meta choice. Thus, I don't worry about this too much.

    In addition, most of these lands come in tapped. I find it difficult to know where the right balance is, but since most of my games go long, the comes-into-play-tapped drawback has, for the most part, been mitigated with the utility I get from most of the lands I included.
    • Academy Ruins — With so many artifacts in this deck, this comes in very handy when it drops. Plus, since most Wastelands get junked on some of my duel land mana producers, this tends to fly under the radar.
    • Halimar Depths — Like an uncounterable Ponder, without the draw. Late game, this land is a welcome sight. I can either stack my draws to answer whatever is on the board, or I can save myself by Elixir of Immortalitying myself out of having to draw three lands when I want something useful. Of course, early on this is a great way to ensure you get some land draws.
    • Bojuka Bog — Hard to argue with its devastation against decks that rely on the graveyard.
    • Urborg — Against first strike match-ups, Baleful Strix doesn't offer much defense. This helps make them useful again.
    • Dimir Aqueduct — This is great with Halimar and Bojuka, and it helps me cheat my way into two less land. Granted, Wastelands love this land, but it sure is nice when this is one of 2-3 lands in your opening hand and you know you have more mana than it looks.

    There you have it. It's missing many vintage staples, obviously, and I don't think it'll get them ever because of the cost. I suppose this is borderline legacy, minus the Demonic Tutor, Strip Mine and Sol ring. The Mine is easy to replace with a Wasteland, but I like Demonic Tutor much better than Vampiric Tutor, so I don't know if I could part with it. I'm open to suggestions for the Sol Ring, though that seems like a really good one, too. Anyways, if you were to run this deck, how would you change it?
    Posted in: Blue-Based Control Decks
  • posted a message on Splendid complication... How do I get more of this?
    Cheap defense against flying (and anything, really): Deadly Recluse
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on trying to make a charge counter deck
    Mmmmm... good idea with the Chimeric Mass. Love that card.
    Posted in: Casual & Multiplayer Formats
  • posted a message on Thorn Elemental deck
    The recluse is a fun, cheap defense. I like that one. And, definitely with JDviant on the Tornado Elemental. Also, don't know if this is of interest, but I've often seen Engulfing Slagwurm in decks that use the Tornado Elemental. Not sure why, but that's been common in my neck of the woods.
    Posted in: Casual & Multiplayer Formats
  • posted a message on Would like some feedback on my Artifact Deck...
    Oh, and, if you're thinking about putting in Icy Manipulator and use B, it seems so tempting to throw in a Royal Assassin.
    Posted in: Casual & Multiplayer Formats
  • posted a message on Would like some feedback on my Artifact Deck...
    I feel like Everflowing Chalice is too slow. It sounds great, but have you had much luck using it? In my experience, I found that when I had enough mana to make it a Sol ring equivalent, I was wishing I had something else in my hand instead. And when I didn't have enough mana to make it more than 1 for X, I hesitated to bring it out because it seemed like a waste.
    Posted in: Casual & Multiplayer Formats
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