Arrogance of the Gods5WW
Sorcery {R}
For each opponent, you choose from among the permanents that player controls an artifact, a creature, an enchantment, and a planeswalker. Then each opponent sacrifices all other nonland permanents they control. An ego is only as dangerous as the person it compels.
Here's why I believe Neoform is worth trying. First, I'd reiterate what I mentioned in the primer: T2 Druid is the most threatening thing our deck can do. With 4 Druid, 8 Dorks, and 4 Evo we have a 66% chance of seeing Druid or Dork + Evo in our opening hand, and a 56% chance on 6 cards. With 4 Druid, 9 Dorks, and 7 Evo/Neo, we have an 82% chance of T2 Druid in our 7, and 70% in 6. Improving our best line by ~15% is a huge deal.
Some will be unhappy with my testing list and label it as "making our good matchups better while making bad matchups even worse." I'd argue against this saying if we're so concerned with our poor matchups we should simply be playing Abzan Company instead, not to mention that ignores that consistently threatening T2 Druids just improves what our deck aims to do in general. A deck getting copies 5-8 of a key card has been a classic reason for a large boost in power level for any deck.
You make excellent points. In fact, I think you should be all-in on Neoform for preliminary testing: 0 Incubation, 4 neoform, 10 mana dorks.
I have zero interest in Neoform. The lack of "or less" makes this card very narrow: too narrow for us to rely upon. However, WAR has given us a new toy! Meet the new Green Sun's Zenith!
Druid Charger
Creature - Knight Druid
When ~ enters the battlefield, if G was spent to play ~, put a +1/+1 counter on ~ and ~ gains trample;
When ~ enters the battlefield, if W was spent to play ~, put a +1/+1 counter on ~ and ~ gains first strike;
1/1
Suturemonger2
Creature - Hag {U} , remove a -1/-1 counter from a creature you control: Put a -1/-1 counter on target creature you control. She closes wounds for some, opens wounds for others.
2/3
I would strongly recommend -1 Birds of Paradise, +1 Noble Hierarch. The exalted is important.
For anyone concerned about Whir Prison, try fitting a Mirror Entity in your 75 (though most people play it main these days). Against most decks, its just nice to turn excess mana dorks into Beastmaster Ascension. Against Thing in the Ice, you can mise by making your team into Horrors. And against Whir Prison, you can attack with your 10+ 0-power creatures under their Ensnaring Bridge lock, then turn them all into big beaters before damage.
It is cute, but strictly worse than Collected Company. Possibly sideboard viable if you see a lot of UWx Control and you can't beat it. Though extra SB Sin Collectors would probably provide enough support.
Went with Plaguecrafter in the flex slot for a 6 round event on Sunday.
Beat Valakut (inexperienced pilot), Humans (he kept a bad hand), then Jund (excellent pilot, but I super-mised to steal game 1).
Then lost to Burn by the skin of my teeth. I drew a lot of dead cards game 3. If he had 1 more dead draw or I had one more turn I would have had the comeback.
Then lost to Izzet Phoenix. He wins the die roll. He plays a Turn 2 Titi. I play a turn 2 Druid, with T3 win in hand. He flips Titi on his turn 3 and stands up 2 Phoenix. Ugh. Game 2 I hit a Path to slow him down and a Eidolon of Rhetoric to prevent him from getting up to new shenanigans and eventually get there. Game 3 I misplay multiple times and lose narrowly; I definitely should have won game 3.
R6 I beat Whir Prison easily. He took game 2 because I was exhausted and not playing well.
Going into round 6, there were 4x 13 pointers so they drew in to T8 lock. There were 6x 12 pointers. The top 2 of those drew. If they had played it out, I would have made top 8.
Props: the whole deck
Slops: me
Final notes: Plaguecrafter is great and it is definitely staying in my SB. Still unsure if that 3rd Horizon Canopy causes too much pain and should be a Razorverge Thicket. I'm pretty sure 2x Eldritch Evolution is correct, but switching one for a Sin Collector, an Anafenza, the Foremost, or a Knight of Autumn is probably very good depending on your meta.
Things to note about my list and how it differs from SaintDoom or other stock lists:
22 lands: I live in a land of fair decks where removal is rampant. My early mana dorks don't live long. The second land drop on turn 2 is CRITICAL and 3 lands by turn 4 needs to be reliable. Neither of which happens at 21 land.
3 Horizon Canopy: 22 lands lends itself to flooding sometimes. This is how I hope to mitigate that. However, 3x Canopy is pretty painful and I hope I won't regret it.
No Shalai: I love Shalai but I hate whiffing on Collected Company more.
No SB Abrupt Decay: Abrupt Decay is better than other removal only against Spirits. I find that to be too narrow of a use for a sideboard card.
SB Qasali Pridemage: I know Knight of Autumn is almost strictly better than Pridemage. However, this deck is SUPER weak to Grafdigger's Cage. You can beat Cage by, with Cage on the stack, casting Coco or Chord into Pridemage. Cannot make that line with Knight.
SB Eidolon of Rhetoric: It was great in the time of Storm and KCI. It's great again vs Phoenix. Just make sure you apply enough pressure that they can't find an answer by cantripping once on their turn and once on your turn, every turn cycle.
SB Eldritch Evolution: Sometimes, you just need to be faster. Whether its racing Tron or getting hate vs Phoenix or all sorts of similar situations, sometimes you just need all the speed you can get. That's where Eldritch Evolution comes in.
SB flex slot: A 3rd Sin Collector would be nice to help crush control and should be worthwhile against Phoenix. I'd like an Anafenza, the Foremost somewhere in my 75 but that might just replace the SB Scavenging Ooze. Plaguecrafter is rated highly on Discord. Maybe Shalai? Or a 2nd Mirror Entity?
Links? Definitely sounds spicy. I'd be down to try it.
Also, I had been considering Rhythm of the Wild to give Devoted Druid haste. And I finally realized that it also works nicely with Persist! I'll probably be trying Rhythm first. If that doesn't work out, Vial would be next.
Damn, guess the hunt continues. I seem to be seeing a lot of Company and Knightfall lists being one and the same lately, is that normal?
Sorry I missed this earlier. Knight of the Reliquary + Devoted Druid is very popular these days. I ran it for a while but did not do well enough in the matchups that should be strong. After that I tried the all-in combo version and now I'm back on the Kitchen Finks version.
Crooked Court2WB
Creature - Advisor U
Your opponent may only play one spell per turn.
1/2 An ounce of gold in the judge's pocket is worth a pound of gold spent evading the police.
IIW:
Deadpool, Deadpool-related, or Deadpool-themed
All the submissions so far have been great. I'm not sure I can compete.
Stupid But Tough3RG
Enchantment - Aura {R}
Enchant creature
Enchanted creature loses first strike, double strike, vigilance, and reach and cannot gain those abilities.
Enchanted creature gains indestructible, trample, and hexproof.
Enchanted creature gets +0/+5. "He just REFUSES to die."
IIW: Deadpool, Deadpool-themed, or Deadpool-related
After testing shortcake out a bit, i've noticed that it's too mid-rangey to actually be that effective. something about it just makes it feel like it's too slow for a prison deck, and a tad too janky to power through the combo in a hating meta. This is my build thus far. I'm prepping for a small tournament next week, and i wanna try to sleeve up painter. I'm still undecided between mono U, imperial and shortcake. though i'm leaning to between imperial and mono U.
After some brief testing, it has sort of 2 modes: a balls-to-the-wall combo machine (against all forms of decks that don't run counters), and a mana-prison/grind mode using moon effects and if needed, recruiting the one-of ethersworn canonist. the grind/mode has some ways of getting value, mostly around ticking up daretti. The debate about light up the stage has made me cut some number of them, but most of the time when i see it, it's not a bad card to have. casting it for 2R never really feels that bad either, actually, so that's also been nice.
the crater maker has been good, but has somewhat limited use after the painter lands, and the tinkerer has also been good, but is a bit slow. I think there's space for both, and it would be good to pick and choose one post-board.
My sideboard's the messy bit. there are a lot of pet-cards that i've used to great effect, but the problem is that most of them are already artefacts, which makes opposing hate that much more relevant. I was considering trying a transformational sideboard, but i've no idea what i could do that isn't artifact nor creature based. especially against cantrip-heavy decks, i like trinisphere and defense grid, but maybe that's more relevant in vintage than legacy. The chandras and karns are good for those really grindy games, and can close stalemates out after some time.
Does anyone have an opinion about where my SB is going? i feel like i should drop the containment priest and just go up to 3 or 4 pithing needle instead, since they also shut off vials and more. doesn't help against reanimator though, so that's problematic.
How the different versions of Painter end up playing out is always build-dependent, even within a given Painter archetype. For example, you could easily make a very combo-focused Shortcake via 4 Enlightened Tutor and some number of Mother of Runes to protect Painter.
I prefer a hybrid version of Shortcake, which is designed to pivot based on matchup, opening hand, and opponent plays.
If you want to play 4x Blood Moon, you're probably better off with Imperial Painter.
If you want a lot of prison elements, just play Mono Red Prison. You'll find it often called Dragon Stompy, despite the fact that it hasn't played Dragons in nearly 10 years.
Pithing Needle stops Gristlebrand from Sneak and Show and from Reanimator, but doesn't stop Emrakul from Sneak and Show nor the other Reanimation targets.
Sorcery {R}
For each opponent, you choose from among the permanents that player controls an artifact, a creature, an enchantment, and a planeswalker. Then each opponent sacrifices all other nonland permanents they control.
An ego is only as dangerous as the person it compels.
IIW: Planeswalkers with static abilities
Meet the new Green Sun's Zenith!
Creature - Knight Druid
When ~ enters the battlefield, if G was spent to play ~, put a +1/+1 counter on ~ and ~ gains trample;
When ~ enters the battlefield, if W was spent to play ~, put a +1/+1 counter on ~ and ~ gains first strike;
1/1
IIW:
Planeswalkers including static abilities
Creature - Hag {U}
creature you control: Put a -1/-1 counter on target creature you control.She closes wounds for some, opens wounds for others.
2/3
IIW:
Karn or Karn-related
For anyone concerned about Whir Prison, try fitting a Mirror Entity in your 75 (though most people play it main these days). Against most decks, its just nice to turn excess mana dorks into Beastmaster Ascension. Against Thing in the Ice, you can mise by making your team into Horrors. And against Whir Prison, you can attack with your 10+ 0-power creatures under their Ensnaring Bridge lock, then turn them all into big beaters before damage.
Beat Valakut (inexperienced pilot), Humans (he kept a bad hand), then Jund (excellent pilot, but I super-mised to steal game 1).
Then lost to Burn by the skin of my teeth. I drew a lot of dead cards game 3. If he had 1 more dead draw or I had one more turn I would have had the comeback.
Then lost to Izzet Phoenix. He wins the die roll. He plays a Turn 2 Titi. I play a turn 2 Druid, with T3 win in hand. He flips Titi on his turn 3 and stands up 2 Phoenix. Ugh. Game 2 I hit a Path to slow him down and a Eidolon of Rhetoric to prevent him from getting up to new shenanigans and eventually get there. Game 3 I misplay multiple times and lose narrowly; I definitely should have won game 3.
R6 I beat Whir Prison easily. He took game 2 because I was exhausted and not playing well.
Going into round 6, there were 4x 13 pointers so they drew in to T8 lock. There were 6x 12 pointers. The top 2 of those drew. If they had played it out, I would have made top 8.
Props: the whole deck
Slops: me
Final notes: Plaguecrafter is great and it is definitely staying in my SB. Still unsure if that 3rd Horizon Canopy causes too much pain and should be a Razorverge Thicket. I'm pretty sure 2x Eldritch Evolution is correct, but switching one for a Sin Collector, an Anafenza, the Foremost, or a Knight of Autumn is probably very good depending on your meta.
4 Noble Hierarch
2 Viscera Seer
4 Devoted Druid
4 Vizier of Remedies
3 Duskwatch Recruiter
1 Scavenging Ooze
4 Kitchen Finks
3 Eternal Witness
1 Mirror Entity
1 Walking Ballista
4 Collected Company
4 Windswept Heath
4 Verdant Catacombs
2 Temple Garden
2 Overgrown Tomb
3 Forest
1 Plains
1 Swamp
2 Gavony Township
3 Horizon Canopy
4 Path to Exile
1 Assassin's Trophy
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Knight of Autumn
1 Scavenging Ooze
2 Eidolon of Rhetoric
2 Eldritch Evolution
2 Sin Collector
1 flex slot
The Chalice/Thalia shell is great? Because I watched a stream of it and it fell flat really hard. It mulligans terribly.
However, Mirror Entity is indeed amazing.
Also, I had been considering Rhythm of the Wild to give Devoted Druid haste. And I finally realized that it also works nicely with Persist! I'll probably be trying Rhythm first. If that doesn't work out, Vial would be next.
Sorry I missed this earlier. Knight of the Reliquary + Devoted Druid is very popular these days. I ran it for a while but did not do well enough in the matchups that should be strong. After that I tried the all-in combo version and now I'm back on the Kitchen Finks version.
Creature - Advisor U
Your opponent may only play one spell per turn.
1/2
An ounce of gold in the judge's pocket is worth a pound of gold spent evading the police.
IIW:
Deadpool, Deadpool-related, or Deadpool-themed
What is "trinket text"?
Stupid But Tough 3RG
Enchantment - Aura {R}
Enchant creature
Enchanted creature loses first strike, double strike, vigilance, and reach and cannot gain those abilities.
Enchanted creature gains indestructible, trample, and hexproof.
Enchanted creature gets +0/+5.
"He just REFUSES to die."
IIW: Deadpool, Deadpool-themed, or Deadpool-related
How the different versions of Painter end up playing out is always build-dependent, even within a given Painter archetype. For example, you could easily make a very combo-focused Shortcake via 4 Enlightened Tutor and some number of Mother of Runes to protect Painter.
I prefer a hybrid version of Shortcake, which is designed to pivot based on matchup, opening hand, and opponent plays.
If you want to play 4x Blood Moon, you're probably better off with Imperial Painter.
If you want a lot of prison elements, just play Mono Red Prison. You'll find it often called Dragon Stompy, despite the fact that it hasn't played Dragons in nearly 10 years.
Pithing Needle stops Gristlebrand from Sneak and Show and from Reanimator, but doesn't stop Emrakul from Sneak and Show nor the other Reanimation targets.