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  • posted a message on The State of Modern Thread (B&R 08/07/2019)
    One possible alternative to bridge is sidisi, brood tyrant but 4 CMC is way to slow. Hard to match free.
    Posted in: Modern
  • posted a message on The State of Modern Thread (B&R 08/07/2019)
    I disagree.

    Hogaak often won without the mill plan, so the deck is still powerful. The non-mill good draws are based off filling the graveyard while having two bodies in play. As such carrion feeder is still a key card: it's a one-drop that can sacrifice a stitcher's supplier to fill the graveyard. Stitcher, carrion feeder and any other one-drop allows playing hogaak on turn 2. Carrion feeder is also protection against path to exile, which is the main answer to a turn-two hogaak. One way Hogaak is resilient is to sac hogaak in response to removal and replay it off having multiple 1-drops and way to fill the GY.

    I'm not saying there won't be a better build. The mill plan is still there to fill the GY for the delve requirements of hogaak and to get vengevines.
    Posted in: Modern
  • posted a message on The State of Modern Thread (B&R 08/07/2019)
    Well, that turns off the altar angle. Not entirely, they can still recur gravecrawler a few times per turn, but no more full mill once they hit to bridges.

    This leaves the deck powerful, but eliminates the turn 2 / 3 kill. They can still have a turn 3 virtual kill if you can't manage a Hogaak with a few friends.
    Posted in: Modern
  • posted a message on The State of Modern Thread (B&R 20/05/2019)
    IMO, the only reasons why phoenix is so popular are:
    • The deck is the cheapest tier-1 deck, as long as you forego buying scalding tarns. (Only burn is cheaper, I believe, and not everyone considers burn tier-1.)
    • The deck is very consistent, thanks to all the cantrips.
    • The deck doesn't entirely crumble with GY hate, so it is viable in the meta. TiTi is still a big threat.

    IOW, I don't consider phoenix to be oppressive.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on Lands that cost mana - a hypothetical
    My guess it should work if you give it another additional card type, like enchantment creatures. For example a land sorcery could follow the rules for lands and rules for sorcery.
    Posted in: Custom Card Rulings
  • posted a message on The State of Modern Thread (B&R 20/05/2019)
    Yep, I think I saw hogaak loses to UW control off of monastery mentor twice toward then end. One before top 8, one in the final. That card was just waiting in the wings. UW control is all non-creature-based, so mentor just is great tech.

    That being said, I didn't undersatand why the hogaak player in the final game didn't play his wispmare the turn before. That would have been one damage less that turn and another chump the next. Not that it did matter in the end since the UW player had celestial purge. It seems that final was won off that one card (purge).

    PS: let's not forget timely reinforcements. That card is key in UW SB.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on The State of Modern Thread (B&R 20/05/2019)
    Well, outside of posturing like a cwazy wabbit, the real actual numbers are still valid:

    • 18.6% day 2 metagame
    • 33% conversion rate
    • 2 top 8 placements

    WHat's more, for those who actually watched the matches, hogaak was often piloted by non-pro players making mistakes. I also saw two bad beat. One was a hogaak player on two lands, both got spreading sea'ed on turn 2 and 3 and he didn't draw a single other land for teh rest of the game. In anoher case, a hogaak player self-milled 75% of his deck without milling a single copy of bridge from below.

    I the deck ban worthy? The numbers are not quite there from this GP. I think it won't get anything banned but will put on a watch list.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on The State of Modern Thread (B&R 20/05/2019)
    They just revealed some day 2 metagame percentage and conversion rates for DFW:
    day 1 % -> 2 % (conversion rates)
    Hogaak 11% -> 18.6% (33% conversion)
    human ?% -> 7.3
    phoenix ?% -> 7.3
    company ?% -> 4.4 (25% conversion)

    They gave historical cases:
    Eldrazi conversion rate: 90% - 100%
    Caw blade conversion rate: 90%
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on The State of Modern Thread (B&R 20/05/2019)
    JUst to illustrate why GY hate against hogaak is not the simple answer some may think, here is what happened in a UW control vs Hoogak yesterday in Dallas. UW player sided in multiple RiP. What happened is that the hogaak deck simply hardcasted two vengevines, one on turn 4 and turn 5 and rode them to victory. 4 power with haste for 4 is a fine rate. A UW deck can only hold so many answers: the RiP were taking place in hand instead of removal and hogaak can pivot into being a mid-range deck when its graveyard is gone. It's nicely resilient. (TBH, the UW player made a mistake in not blowing up the 2nd green source right away with its field of ruins which let the hogaak player play the 2nd vengevine. He should have known there were no forest in the deck because in a previous game the hogaak player did not search for no basic when a land was blown up with e fidled of ruins.)

    So, just filling up with GY hate is a first step, but you still need to hold off the mid-range component.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on The State of Modern Thread (B&R 20/05/2019)
    Bridge in GY off neonate self-sac, getting a 2/2, 2nd neonate on turn ditching vengevine, getting another 2/2, then a stitcher (IIRC), bring back vengevine, then play hogaak.

    Something like that.

    IN 2nd round, hogaak vs UW control. Hoggak 1st turn bridge in GY, UW immediately surgical extration (1st game, extraction in MD). Few turns later UW wipe 4 or 5 creatures on turn 4 with supreme verdict. Hoogak untaps and put 17 power on the board off 1 mana. (involving a gravecrawler, the black vampire that comes back from GY on land drop, double vengevines jumping back then hoogak.)
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on The State of Modern Thread (B&R 20/05/2019)
    Quote from Godrik1374 »
    On SCG versus,
    They tested bridgevine against banned deck.

    TBH, they didn't update the banned decks. Their stoneblane list plays jeskai color but red is only for 4 bolts (and some non essential SB cards.) It plays zero GY hate in main, 2 trap + 4 surgical in SB. It hopes to survive the early turns with permission spells. I doubt a stoneforge deck would look like this.

    (Now, I suppose it would still lose to hogaak.)

    Twin has even less GY hate.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on The State of Modern Thread (B&R 20/05/2019)
    That's because the most vocal and bitter posters tend to fill the thread?

    I personally don't mind GY hate in the main.

    My only concern is that hogaak seems to do fine even with such hate. I really do hope Wizards does nothing on the 8th so that we can see and appreciate what happens when hogaak flexes its muscle on a bigger stage. I don't want a new breed to spring up and keep repeating themselves for three years because they nerf'ed hogaak rapidly.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on The State of Modern Thread (B&R 20/05/2019)
    It had 189 players. (Living in California, I was unable to go.) Jody Keith and Aaron Barich (of SCG Open fame) were in the top 8 and the top 16 from what I heard.

    I cannot understand the maths behind a 189 players tournament with a 1st prize being a mustang.

    That top 8 looks... well it sure doesn't look like a a highly competitive tournament. (I mean, I can understand one, maybe two lower tier decks making a top 8, but sword, burn, infect and rock?)
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on The State of Modern Thread (B&R 20/05/2019)
    Quote from Mtgthewary »
    I hope hoogak is the target. Don't need to see it in dredge after we ban bridge


    IDK. Bridge from Below is obviously both the most efficient engine for the deck and happily jumps in to the GY from self mill. It costs no mana and super-synergize with hogaak + altar.

    Are there other builds that can achieve this without BfB?

    The deck still works as long as you can recur 2 creatures from the GY and use them to play hogaak and/or mill with altar to recur them again. Dredge and various zombies can be brought back from the GY but not for free and not at instant speed. You can play gravecrawler from the graveyard but it needs both another zombie in play and mana. Others tend to only come back only and only at EOT. From this perspective, I don't think hogaak would be abusive without BfB. I don't think it would improve Dredge all that much. (Obviously, it fill their GY, but dredging already does it efficiently.)

    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on The State of Modern Thread (B&R 20/05/2019)
    F2F Hamilton modern open was won by Hogaak, with two copies of the deck placing in the top 8.

    Rhe report says they were surprised it was not played more, being so dominant: "We had two copies of the deck in our Hamilton Top 8, and from where I’m sitting, that number is actually pretty low for how good this deck is compared to the rest of the format."

    Either buy it now or sell it now, I'd say.

    PS: many decks in the top had GY hate in the main, plus extra in SB. Examples: both phoenix 3x surgical main, 3x trap in SB. 2nd place Jund had 2x ooze main, 4x leyline, 1x nihil, SB.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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