I think Modern has changed significantly from even 2 years ago. For a lot of people, I think modern has finally become the pro-format that they prefer. Pros really like formats that are smaller in scopes to leverage deck decision and sideboards. Modern has finally shrunk what is good to be able to do that compared to before. There are a lot less random decks out there. You still see them on occasion, but I think the TIER 2 and 3 plethora of decks which defined Modern for years are essentially shoved down thanks to Humans, Phoenix, Hogaak, Jund, UW Control, and an artifact deck and some variations inbetween.
It is really tough to play a brew anymore or a tier 2 net deck and win more and having trouble competitng. The velocity of deck search, the power, and the amount of removal have drastically impacted what could be played, especially for decks with little interaction such as Merfolk, Elves, Mono-Green devotion, Ponza, and all the rest of the tier 2 and 3 decks that are played.
It is fine to modern to be this way for the pros. Professionals LIKE smaller fields of play. This way they can leverage game skill, deck building, and all the other tiny skills that make you have percentage win chances against the field. it is why standard is generally well liked by pros let alone the generally money and attention lavished on it.
Modern has finally become that pro-format that really competitive pros wanted it to be.
I just don't like it. I liked the more casual 60 decks a week modern. It really isn't that anymore I don't think. There might be non-games due to the deck style of modern, but there really is a tightening of what is good or bad or what works or doesn't. Winning a couple games here or there and spiking a tournament with a deck just doesn't work as much if you aren't playing the clear best decks. It is much much harder to take a wierd brew or a tier 3-4 deck and do well. There is a much smaller tier 2 and tier 3 list. Staples on that list are no longer as good. They can still win and occasionally spike, but I bet it is less before.
I'm going to stick with my CoCo version of Slivers along with Blasphemous Act - Spiteful Sliver "combo", even without Blasphemous Act, the ability of Spiteful stacks if we have multiple of them in the battlefield.
I think that Horizon lands can help a bit drawing an extra card (mostly a creature) to add a bit more pressure to the opponent. With mana generator slivers, it should not punish us that much, as we can generate tons of it.
I think your biggest problem might be casting CoCo or blaesphemous act. Good Luck though and tell us the results!
I think people are still experimenting on lists and cards. Since, no major sliver deck so far has seen any results after the new slivers have been provided and tantalizingly fewer results even post-Adam Bowman's now traditional list.
Once somebody has success with a Sliver deck and that result is reproducible (like Adam Bowman's list was), then we will get around to a coalescing down to a list.
I am using Adam Bowman's list as an example because it had reproducable results on the big stages, at Modern Leagues, and Modern Challenges as well as local tournaments as I personally can attest.
I know you think your list is the best and it might even be the most competitive, but a lot of people aren't convinced. Want people to be convinced? Start winning with it in a way that the results are public. This is the answer to pretty much any list, my meme list and traditional list included.
Until then, we will certainly critque and not acknowledge your list as the best until then. I for one prefer something else, but I do like your 8 dorks list. I think though it could be slow despite the explosiveness to other lists. I also use Virulent Sliver over Striking Sliver to help hands that aren't lord heavy get quick wins against Tron and other few threat lists.
Also: I want to make it clear that I value the input and dedication you are willing to put in this forgotten in a competitive sense tribe. It takes a lot of testing and work to make a new archetype competitive that hasn't been there before. However, the new cards have only been out a few weeks and aren't the true game changers like Crystalline Sliver would have been. It is ok to be skeptical of any one true competitive list yet.
There are a lot of new tools including Spiteful Sliver that could provide interesting new avenues such as the Elf-Like 8 Sliver dork list or Fast Sliver lists or Dregscape-focused lists.
It's the new Karn from the set. He can combo with it. Fetch it and the shut off the opponent doing anything due to his static ability to shut off all activations from artifacts that your opponents control.
Harmonic x 3
Frenetic x 2
Warping Wail x 2
Chalice x 3-4
Telekinetic x 1-2
Syphon x 1-2
Striking x 1-2
What is Damping Sphere for that Chalice can't cover? Tron or Storm? Storm isn't as good as it once was and I am not sure how reasonable Storm hate is in the side. Tron is rough, but I think we can just perhaps Chalice/Telekinetic and rush um. Necrotic and Mutavaults are good in that match up.
Main
20 Lands
4 Galerider
4 Manaweft (Gemhide)
8 Lords
4 Diffusion (i think is better than 3 now)
4 Sedge
2 Blur
2 Necrotic
1-2 Darkheart
1-2 Striking
4 Collected Company
4 Aether Vial
2 Dismember
This is just probably something that I would play at the moment.
As for Grixis Whirl - its basically lantern control with better card selection and less mill.
So Harmonic/Necrotic/Telekinetic are probably the biggest winners. For the matchup, Flying, Mana, Sedge, Blur, Necrotic are the only main deck cards after sideboard that probably matter. Diffusion might matter as well.
Be prepared to for example for them to get Torpor Orb for Harmonic, Pithing Needle for Vial/Mutavault/Necrotic (although it does work all that well, they have to name each and every sliver type for it to truly work), and Ensnaring Bridge. Whirl works as an instant so Warping Wail isn't great. Chalice can be good on Zero, 1, or 3.
They have a faster clock with Thopter Sword Combo, but that can dealt with and we could probably cause a draw with Syphon Sliver, galeride rand lords. They heavily rely on Whirl to get them what they need as they don't have a huge ton of filtering. Its a race, but we tools to defeat them.
One of the reasons that I like Modern is that you can have hatebears, zoo decks, and tribal decks of all different stripes competeting, at least, it was that way a few years ago. Creature heavy decks like Humans and Spirits might have become weaker now thanks to phoenix decks. I hope they continue working with the format to promote and sustain creature-heavy decks compared to spell-heavy decks. There are not many if any other eternal formats that support creature heavy decks like Modern does.
I fear bringing in so many pre-8th edition cards that they will push spells past the point that creature heavy decks can work well enough like already exists in Legacy.
I like tribal decks in modern and they have their place. I am a fan of modern elves of all stripes, merfolk, humans, spirits and off-brands like Shamans, Slivers, and Allies.
I mean they can power-up some of these tribes like Humans or Spirits with new cards (as I don't think there are old humans or spirits that would make a difference), reprints of Conspiracy/Commander humans and spirits. However, I am looking forward to maybe tribal support like Birchlore Ranger, Crystalline Sliver, Hibernation Sliver, Muscle Sliver, Wirewood Symbiote, and perhaps others that could be of help.
This may make Dinosaurs more viable against a control heavy meta while also helping race aggro decks. It helps Thrashing Brontodon and Regisaur Alpha act as a blocker and safe from Lava Coil. It means Ripjaw Raptor can attack as early as turn 3 or Carnage Tyrant turn 4? It can even help you cast Ghalta, Primal Hunger if you play him.
Less Removal on the whole, but a big fatty aggro deck? This helps. I am not sure how many of this effect I want, but I will certainly try 1-2 in the main deck, and definitely in a sideboard.
It can also help Savage Stomp if you play it, to kill bigger creatures and survive.
1
1
1
It is really tough to play a brew anymore or a tier 2 net deck and win more and having trouble competitng. The velocity of deck search, the power, and the amount of removal have drastically impacted what could be played, especially for decks with little interaction such as Merfolk, Elves, Mono-Green devotion, Ponza, and all the rest of the tier 2 and 3 decks that are played.
It is fine to modern to be this way for the pros. Professionals LIKE smaller fields of play. This way they can leverage game skill, deck building, and all the other tiny skills that make you have percentage win chances against the field. it is why standard is generally well liked by pros let alone the generally money and attention lavished on it.
Modern has finally become that pro-format that really competitive pros wanted it to be.
I just don't like it. I liked the more casual 60 decks a week modern. It really isn't that anymore I don't think. There might be non-games due to the deck style of modern, but there really is a tightening of what is good or bad or what works or doesn't. Winning a couple games here or there and spiking a tournament with a deck just doesn't work as much if you aren't playing the clear best decks. It is much much harder to take a wierd brew or a tier 3-4 deck and do well. There is a much smaller tier 2 and tier 3 list. Staples on that list are no longer as good. They can still win and occasionally spike, but I bet it is less before.
1
I think your biggest problem might be casting CoCo or blaesphemous act. Good Luck though and tell us the results!
1
Once somebody has success with a Sliver deck and that result is reproducible (like Adam Bowman's list was), then we will get around to a coalescing down to a list.
I am using Adam Bowman's list as an example because it had reproducable results on the big stages, at Modern Leagues, and Modern Challenges as well as local tournaments as I personally can attest.
I know you think your list is the best and it might even be the most competitive, but a lot of people aren't convinced. Want people to be convinced? Start winning with it in a way that the results are public. This is the answer to pretty much any list, my meme list and traditional list included.
Until then, we will certainly critque and not acknowledge your list as the best until then. I for one prefer something else, but I do like your 8 dorks list. I think though it could be slow despite the explosiveness to other lists. I also use Virulent Sliver over Striking Sliver to help hands that aren't lord heavy get quick wins against Tron and other few threat lists.
Also: I want to make it clear that I value the input and dedication you are willing to put in this forgotten in a competitive sense tribe. It takes a lot of testing and work to make a new archetype competitive that hasn't been there before. However, the new cards have only been out a few weeks and aren't the true game changers like Crystalline Sliver would have been. It is ok to be skeptical of any one true competitive list yet.
There are a lot of new tools including Spiteful Sliver that could provide interesting new avenues such as the Elf-Like 8 Sliver dork list or Fast Sliver lists or Dregscape-focused lists.
1
1
Harmonic x 3
Frenetic x 2
Warping Wail x 2
Chalice x 3-4
Telekinetic x 1-2
Syphon x 1-2
Striking x 1-2
What is Damping Sphere for that Chalice can't cover? Tron or Storm? Storm isn't as good as it once was and I am not sure how reasonable Storm hate is in the side. Tron is rough, but I think we can just perhaps Chalice/Telekinetic and rush um. Necrotic and Mutavaults are good in that match up.
Main
20 Lands
4 Galerider
4 Manaweft (Gemhide)
8 Lords
4 Diffusion (i think is better than 3 now)
4 Sedge
2 Blur
2 Necrotic
1-2 Darkheart
1-2 Striking
4 Collected Company
4 Aether Vial
2 Dismember
This is just probably something that I would play at the moment.
As for Grixis Whirl - its basically lantern control with better card selection and less mill.
So Harmonic/Necrotic/Telekinetic are probably the biggest winners. For the matchup, Flying, Mana, Sedge, Blur, Necrotic are the only main deck cards after sideboard that probably matter. Diffusion might matter as well.
Be prepared to for example for them to get Torpor Orb for Harmonic, Pithing Needle for Vial/Mutavault/Necrotic (although it does work all that well, they have to name each and every sliver type for it to truly work), and Ensnaring Bridge. Whirl works as an instant so Warping Wail isn't great. Chalice can be good on Zero, 1, or 3.
They have a faster clock with Thopter Sword Combo, but that can dealt with and we could probably cause a draw with Syphon Sliver, galeride rand lords. They heavily rely on Whirl to get them what they need as they don't have a huge ton of filtering. Its a race, but we tools to defeat them.
1
I fear bringing in so many pre-8th edition cards that they will push spells past the point that creature heavy decks can work well enough like already exists in Legacy.
I like tribal decks in modern and they have their place. I am a fan of modern elves of all stripes, merfolk, humans, spirits and off-brands like Shamans, Slivers, and Allies.
I mean they can power-up some of these tribes like Humans or Spirits with new cards (as I don't think there are old humans or spirits that would make a difference), reprints of Conspiracy/Commander humans and spirits. However, I am looking forward to maybe tribal support like Birchlore Ranger, Crystalline Sliver, Hibernation Sliver, Muscle Sliver, Wirewood Symbiote, and perhaps others that could be of help.
1
This may make Dinosaurs more viable against a control heavy meta while also helping race aggro decks. It helps Thrashing Brontodon and Regisaur Alpha act as a blocker and safe from Lava Coil. It means Ripjaw Raptor can attack as early as turn 3 or Carnage Tyrant turn 4? It can even help you cast Ghalta, Primal Hunger if you play him.
Less Removal on the whole, but a big fatty aggro deck? This helps. I am not sure how many of this effect I want, but I will certainly try 1-2 in the main deck, and definitely in a sideboard.
It can also help Savage Stomp if you play it, to kill bigger creatures and survive.
1
Should we go Big (G/W/r), go black (G/B/r), or run it back (GR)?
This is just speculation on various theorycrafted builds. I am not the best brewer, but here are some ideas for each
Go BIG!
9x Forest
1x Mountain
3x Plains
2x Sacred Foundry
4x Sunpetal Grove
4x Temple Garden
2x Carnage Tyrant
1x Ghalta, Primal Hunger
2x Gishath, Sun's Avatar
4x Llanowar Elves
4x Ranging Raptors
2x Regisaur Alpha
1x Verdant Sun's Avatar
2x Wakening Sun's Avatar
1x Zacama, Primal Calamity
1x Zetalpa, Primal Dawn
4x Circuitous Route
4x Commune with Dinosaurs
2x Savage Stomp
4x Thunderherd Migration
2x Carnage Tyrant
1x Cleansing Nova
2x Deafening Clarion
4x Deathgorge Scavenger
2x Huatli, Warrior Poet
4x Thrashing Brontodon
Settle the Wreckage could be in here or Savage Stomp could be more dinos.
Go Black
7x Forest
1x Mountain
4x Overgrown Tomb
2x Rootbound Crag
3x Swamp
4x Woodland Cemetery
4x Carnage Tyrant
4x Deathgorge Scavenger
2x Ghalta, Primal Hunger
4x Llanowar Elves
4x Regisaur Alpha
4x Ripjaw Raptor
2x Vraska, Relic Seeker
4x Commune with Dinosaurs
4x Thunderherd Migration
4x Assassin's Trophy
1x Angrath, the Flame-Chained
4x Duress
2x Find / Finality
1x Sarkhan's Unsealing
2x Tetzimoc, Primal Death
4x Thrashing Brontodon
1x Vraska, Golgari Queen
Run it Back
11x Forest
6x Mountain
4x Rootbound Crag
3x Burning Sun's Avatar
2x Carnage Tyrant
1x Etali, Primal Storm
2x Ghalta, Primal Hunger
4x Llanowar Elves
4x Ranging Raptors
4x Regisaur Alpha
4x Ripjaw Raptor
2x Savage Stomp
4x Thunderherd Migration
2x Vivien Reid
2x Sarkhan's Unsealing
1x Burning Sun's Avatar
2x Carnage Tyrant
4x Deathgorge Scavenger
2x Raging Swordtooth
4x Thrashing Brontodon
2x Vance's Blasting Cannons
Well here are some of my ideas.