i think restoration angel is simply to slow for this fast meta we have right now...i would cut all of them an put in like 3 serra avengers and a sword.
Actually restoration angel is a huge part of how you win the game against most decks. I've done testing with and without restoration angel and the math is always short without her. Serra Avenger just gets out performed easily by lingering souls on defense, bolt, trades with delvers, dies to resto/linvala (in pod). I originally forced serra avengers in my list and suffered games because of it. I've done an embarrasing amount of testing and from my personal xp you just need restoration angel. The best strategy to fight against ur delver is to push as much defense in the turns 1-3 even meaning chump blocking until you reach blade splicer + resto or just resto in general. At this point, you can create a block structure that their deck can't fight through and you can begin the draw go game until you reach more resto or flicker wisp. A close friend of mine plays ur delver and we played a gauntlet with it trying to find the decks soft spot against creature decks. UR delver has a really hard time with pro red creatures, life link, and 4 butt.
In a world where serra avenger is the 4 of standard ... sign me up. It's just not her time yet. I can't wait until there is a time where her, spirit of the Lab, & revokers are stapled into the core of the deck.
Just wanted to share my current configuration and get some feedback. The Monday modern tourney I was going to enter didn't fire but we played a mini gauntlet and I got to see my sb in action.
Please feel free to throw your two cents in and offer feedback.
A card that I have been tempted to test recently has been stonecloaker. There seems to be a lot of hatred for my 2-3 drops and this card plays a 2 piece package against removal and snapcaster targets.
Does anyone have any testing with stonecloaker that can share any input? I am currently running 3 aven mindcensor and it feels like over kill. I'm trying to be patient to see what the new khans block will bring to the table but have some back catalog of cards I've never personally given a shot. And with the meta slightly shifting I want to understand why some decent cards are completely out of favor ATM.
@ltglitter @flahertongs is it possible this list was developed with mtgo in mind? It looks exciting but in my realm of paper magic I don't know that lack of blade splicers is viable. I've tested a bunch of configurations and was never able to be resilient without splicer.
I don't really play mtgo but friends of mine have told me it has it's own meta.
I'll be at another modern tournament tomorrow and will do my best to keep track of my rounds. Hope to bring some relevant info back!
I hit up another Monday night modern tournament at a different game store and have some results to share!
Round One: Naya Midrange (1-2 loss)
Game one: on the play I lead with javlineer (opponent read it like 4 times) into a Thalia. Turn 3 blade splicer while my opponent has only assembled a voice of resurgence. I commit a huge combat step, he flashes a resto blocking my golem. I lock first strike and jav spear to catch his resto and he scoop thems up.
Game two: I have a 2 land hand with Thalia and blade splicers galore never draw a third land ... die fashionably to a hunt master.
Game three: we claw back in forth with removal and mid range angel beats. lol he then windmill slams a thundermaw hellkite. There's tears and laughs provoking me to scoop up shorty after.
Round 2: Elfball (2-0 win)
Game 1: main deck Mirran crusader literally is all she wrote. Literally nothing worth noting
Game 2: I have a javlineer and a Mirran crusader in hand. Jav takes out a timely heritage Druid. Within short time i reset jav off a flickerwisp and have stuck double Mirran crusader. Interesting situation was opponent attacking for 19 from a craterhoof and friends. It would have been well over but he forgot his nettle sentinel triggers. I should normally loose to random green nonsense but got lucky this one time.
Round 3: Red Deck Wins (2-1)
Game one: was just bolts at my face with nothing to slow him down.
Game two: I manage to jame a Thalia and spellskite knocking my opponent far too behind.
Game three: I get nervous about being on the draw so I side in hero of blade hold hoping to get free 7+ damage in. It was a game where vial Leonin arbiter and wisp kept him off efficient mana long enough to do just that. Hero of bladehold and friends crashed in for 18 damage.
The loss against naya midrange locked me out from "finals".
It was cool too test against rogue decks and then burn but was sad I didn't get to play against the jeskai ascendancy deck, tron or blue red delver players that showed.
Is there any chance that we should look at playing a linvala in the main deck of mono white D&T? Is there a chance she is relevant against enough strategies now that she is auto include in the list?
On another note...I'm pretty excited about how well the mono white list has run for me lately and play a lot of modern in my area. The GW list seems to do a better job at creature based match ups but mono white seems to be very potent against all the rest of the format. Has anyone found judges familiar to be that important for any certain type of match ups? I currently still run the icatian jav package (it just works well in my metas) but I am looking at all my options and testing my list multiple ways to ensure I given this deck all of its possible outs for reaching tier 1!
these are some cards I've tested at the four drop that I would like to get some input on!
linvala- she feels too "fair" sometimes but may be the best flex four drop against the field
elspeth knight errant- i was testing her against uwr control as a hard to deal with finisher. Ironically, she was good against midrange strategies as jumping a mirran crusader just finished the game. Didn't really get to play her against any uwr.
heliod- again another card testing against uwr. I had problems with how mana intensive this card was and it felt way too slow.
I played modern last monday and went 3-1 with this list. I played 3 rounds of merfolk (poor for field testing I know) and a round against infect. I lost a round to merfolk and won the rest obviously. I also did some local testing this week and came up with a better sideboard plan (hopefully) which has tested well against the field. Seems to fair well against Jeskai as well. I previously spoke about concerns with green decks in my meta and junk/jund and found ghostly prison to help clog the ground up while my flyers close out the game. I hope to help push this deck a little further with whatever information possible. I have also found with my curve down to 3 (minus restoration angels now) I am able to finish games before my opponents have the time to sweep boards or setup huge tempo plays. Anyone have thoughts or opinions about cutting restoration angel? Any thoughts or questions in general?
I played against u/r delver with swiftspear and TC tonight (testing) and it was a interesting match. We played best of 5 with it being 3/2 (in my favor). The key in the matchup was to turn a mom on with a stone forge mystic protected landing a batter skull. This plan provided me enough time to create a bigger threat density than my opponent's creature base. Also Brimaz was huge at creating a board state with vial + karakas backing him up.
The games I lost were ones with subpar creatures like revoker and thalia (saddens me to say that). That swiftspear is no joke and creates a lot of burdening combat to fight through. Also it made choices of whether to aim removal at her and young pyromancer very tough. The current sb plan didn't seem to be helpful in this match either.
I don't want to revamp my deck based on this new strategy but feels like it may be necessary. At the least this new style of TC deck needs to be respected.
@ltglitter thanks for the feedback. It's much appreciated and I see valid points. I like mutavault for it's being a first striker via blade splicer, colorless blocker against etch champion, and a creature in face of liliana's edict.
I just started playing cavern recently and need more testing before I cut it.
I'm sad to hear the flagstone dream crushing response but I will take it into major consideration.
I haven't tested swords in awhile but may have to reapproach it as I'm getting closer to a finalized list. Is there any justification to a spellskite main deck if running swords?
@ltglitter thanks for getting back to me. The icatian javilineers may be a meta call and aren't globally as good as they particularly are for me. I face a lot of affinity, grim lavamancer, dark confidants, and pod (birds, noble hierarch) and they have been a very helpful one drop. They do a lot of combat work and do support tricks with first strike damage, creatures in combat from vial, flickerwisp resetting them to help against lingering souls and final points of damage. I've tried judges familiar and have had poor results with it. I could see the argument about sunlance and will definitely keep an eye out on whether it's needed or not.
Flagstones have interfered with my mana zero times so far in games//testing. I use them to thin draws and with the decks that don't suffer from mana denial, I'll ghost quarter them for extra deck thinning. If I do find them getting in the way EVER I will cut them.
The Sideboard info seems just about perfect. I've already cut Canonist for eidolon and love the info about kataki vs silence.
I have one follow up question which is ... Is sundering growth reliable enough with double white in casting cost? I want to replace disenchant for the extra value but too scared to get stuck on turns making decisions based on mana availability. If you tested them and seen it work reliably I'm all in.
I just played a few rounds with Death & Taxes at my local shop and have some finds to share (my list is on page 43). Any insight or shared perspectives are very much welcome.
Round 1: Esper Control* 2-1
It was a "homebrew" for sure and hard a shell of "America" style cards but black support removal spells and Liliana of the veil. I won 2-1 with the hardest part of the matchup being the clock. It took very long time to exhaust them out of resources.
Notes:
-Cavern was abusive naming humans.
-Reset cavern with flickerwisp to hard cast humans, angels and cats in the same game.
-double tec edge/tec edge + ghost quarter happened both games (using leonin arbiter off vial turn 3 with mindcensor backup).
-batterskull was a scary threat that I didn't have a reasonable answer for.
-after match opponent informed me icatian javlineers prevented profitable interactions with casting snapcaster.
Round 2: Blue Tron 2-0
This was a very simple matchup. Tec Edge & Ghost quarter are back breaking.
Notes:
-Didn't cast any spells other than aether vial (preventing remand from drawing answers).
-Saved arbiters and mindcensors for search affects as pseudo counter magic).
-Forced concession both games with cavern of souls on angels.
Round 3: Mono Green Devotion 0-2
Got my waffle stomped. Simply can't apply pressure fast enough and had a hard time with genesis wave.
Notes:
-couldn't beat genesis wave after it resolved either games.
-primeval titan with trample is a beating without a path ...
-just simply feel like this is unwinnable and would possibly need to accept its a bad match thats low in the field.
Round 4: Burn 2-0
I walked over this matchup.
Notes:
-Thalia made most my opponents spells uncastable.
-leoning arbiter shut down fetching multiple times (needing to be seering blazed without having the fetch to a mountain forced lighting bolts at it was great).
-aether vial prevented eidolon from being functional against me and made eidolon kill my opponent.
I'm very pleased with how the list runs but need help against my midrange match ups. I know mirran crusader is a card we want in the 75 but is there any other cards I should be considering against creature based match ups?
I am excited to finally join this thread. I am a longtime "control" player and have been fortunate enough to stumble upon the legacy version of this deck. After realizing it mostly had modern cards in it... you know the rest. Anyway this primer has been key in helping me get my footing with taxing the greedy modern players and landing some very satisfying wins. I think we all know we have a hard time with Jund/GBx shells & affinity at times and I've tweaked my list in favor of getting around them but did my best to not compromise the control/combo matchups.
Contrary to what I thought originally javelineers power up well in current modern. Before I chose to run him I had hard times with steel overseers, dark confidants, grim lavamancers, & so on and so forth (Javs have been very good at killing Liliana as well). Springing them in during ends steps or resetting with flickerwisp and restoration angel has actually closed out games against a few decks. Fiend hunter has faired well against pod and when anger of the gods try to blow me out (I can usually rescue a vital creature to finish out the game).
I'm testing some new cards just to see if they ever have room to grow and input is greatly appreciated. Mortar pod is another jav but can replenish for instant use with flickerwisp (it also doubles as booty when lingering souls shows its face and it pumps butts of avenger and golems from anger the gods. Crucible to close doors on slow WUR matchups. Skite & Prison are self explanatory. Now the divine reckoning is loose but funny... Against mono green devotion I was joking with a friend about gliterring wish for a card out of a stack on the table and the only white card in the stack was DIVINE RECKONING. Would you believe it would have won that game? After a few more matchups against some creature shells like merfolk, black white tokens,dead guy ale, etc. this card always would be a winning card if applied in each of those instances (allowing my opponent to over extend with my vial out then divine a stale board and replenish).
Anyway thank you for such interesting ideas and sharing perspective with your lists!!
Actually restoration angel is a huge part of how you win the game against most decks. I've done testing with and without restoration angel and the math is always short without her. Serra Avenger just gets out performed easily by lingering souls on defense, bolt, trades with delvers, dies to resto/linvala (in pod). I originally forced serra avengers in my list and suffered games because of it. I've done an embarrasing amount of testing and from my personal xp you just need restoration angel. The best strategy to fight against ur delver is to push as much defense in the turns 1-3 even meaning chump blocking until you reach blade splicer + resto or just resto in general. At this point, you can create a block structure that their deck can't fight through and you can begin the draw go game until you reach more resto or flicker wisp. A close friend of mine plays ur delver and we played a gauntlet with it trying to find the decks soft spot against creature decks. UR delver has a really hard time with pro red creatures, life link, and 4 butt.
In a world where serra avenger is the 4 of standard ... sign me up. It's just not her time yet. I can't wait until there is a time where her, spirit of the Lab, & revokers are stapled into the core of the deck.
Just wanted to share my current configuration and get some feedback. The Monday modern tourney I was going to enter didn't fire but we played a mini gauntlet and I got to see my sb in action.
Please feel free to throw your two cents in and offer feedback.
Thanks in advance.
4 x Path to Exile
Artifact
4 x Æther Vial
Land
1 x Flagstones of Trokair
4 x Tectonic Edge
4 x Ghost Quarter
11 x Plains
1 x Cavern of Souls
1 x Eiganjo Castle
4 x Blade Splicer
4 x Leonin Arbiter
4 x Restoration Angel
3 x Aven Mindcensor
4 x Flickerwisp
2 x Mirran Crusader
4 x Icatian Javelineers
4 x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 x Brimaz, King of Oreskos
1 x Spirit of the Labryinth
1 x Ethersworn Canonist
3 x Auriok Champion // Kor Firewalker
2 x Rest in Peace
1 x Dismember
3 x Stony Silence
2 x Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 x Spellskite
Does anyone have any testing with stonecloaker that can share any input? I am currently running 3 aven mindcensor and it feels like over kill. I'm trying to be patient to see what the new khans block will bring to the table but have some back catalog of cards I've never personally given a shot. And with the meta slightly shifting I want to understand why some decent cards are completely out of favor ATM.
I don't really play mtgo but friends of mine have told me it has it's own meta.
I'll be at another modern tournament tomorrow and will do my best to keep track of my rounds. Hope to bring some relevant info back!
I hit up another Monday night modern tournament at a different game store and have some results to share!
Round One: Naya Midrange (1-2 loss)
Game one: on the play I lead with javlineer (opponent read it like 4 times) into a Thalia. Turn 3 blade splicer while my opponent has only assembled a voice of resurgence. I commit a huge combat step, he flashes a resto blocking my golem. I lock first strike and jav spear to catch his resto and he scoop thems up.
Game two: I have a 2 land hand with Thalia and blade splicers galore never draw a third land ... die fashionably to a hunt master.
Game three: we claw back in forth with removal and mid range angel beats. lol he then windmill slams a thundermaw hellkite. There's tears and laughs provoking me to scoop up shorty after.
Round 2: Elfball (2-0 win)
Game 1: main deck Mirran crusader literally is all she wrote. Literally nothing worth noting
Game 2: I have a javlineer and a Mirran crusader in hand. Jav takes out a timely heritage Druid. Within short time i reset jav off a flickerwisp and have stuck double Mirran crusader. Interesting situation was opponent attacking for 19 from a craterhoof and friends. It would have been well over but he forgot his nettle sentinel triggers. I should normally loose to random green nonsense but got lucky this one time.
Round 3: Red Deck Wins (2-1)
Game one: was just bolts at my face with nothing to slow him down.
Game two: I manage to jame a Thalia and spellskite knocking my opponent far too behind.
Game three: I get nervous about being on the draw so I side in hero of blade hold hoping to get free 7+ damage in. It was a game where vial Leonin arbiter and wisp kept him off efficient mana long enough to do just that. Hero of bladehold and friends crashed in for 18 damage.
The loss against naya midrange locked me out from "finals".
It was cool too test against rogue decks and then burn but was sad I didn't get to play against the jeskai ascendancy deck, tron or blue red delver players that showed.
On another note...I'm pretty excited about how well the mono white list has run for me lately and play a lot of modern in my area. The GW list seems to do a better job at creature based match ups but mono white seems to be very potent against all the rest of the format. Has anyone found judges familiar to be that important for any certain type of match ups? I currently still run the icatian jav package (it just works well in my metas) but I am looking at all my options and testing my list multiple ways to ensure I given this deck all of its possible outs for reaching tier 1!
these are some cards I've tested at the four drop that I would like to get some input on!
linvala- she feels too "fair" sometimes but may be the best flex four drop against the field
elspeth knight errant- i was testing her against uwr control as a hard to deal with finisher. Ironically, she was good against midrange strategies as jumping a mirran crusader just finished the game. Didn't really get to play her against any uwr.
heliod- again another card testing against uwr. I had problems with how mana intensive this card was and it felt way too slow.
any info is greatly appreciated!
Thanks!
4 icatian javelineers
4 leonin arbiter
4 thalia, guardian of thraben
3 serra avenger
4 flickerwisp
4 blade splicer
3 mirran crusader
2 aven mindcensor
1 brimaz, king of oreskos
4 aether vial
4 path to exile
1 sunlance
Lands:
1 flagstones of trokair
1 eiganjo castle
1 cavern of souls
4 ghost quarter
4 tectonic edge
11 plains
1 disenchant
1 dismember
1 eidolon of rhetoric
2 ghostly prison
2 kataki, war's wage
3 kor firewalker
2 rest in peace
2 stony silence
1 sunlance
Thanks in advance!
-Catmix
I played against u/r delver with swiftspear and TC tonight (testing) and it was a interesting match. We played best of 5 with it being 3/2 (in my favor). The key in the matchup was to turn a mom on with a stone forge mystic protected landing a batter skull. This plan provided me enough time to create a bigger threat density than my opponent's creature base. Also Brimaz was huge at creating a board state with vial + karakas backing him up.
The games I lost were ones with subpar creatures like revoker and thalia (saddens me to say that). That swiftspear is no joke and creates a lot of burdening combat to fight through. Also it made choices of whether to aim removal at her and young pyromancer very tough. The current sb plan didn't seem to be helpful in this match either.
I don't want to revamp my deck based on this new strategy but feels like it may be necessary. At the least this new style of TC deck needs to be respected.
Any thoughts?
I just started playing cavern recently and need more testing before I cut it.
I'm sad to hear the flagstone dream crushing response but I will take it into major consideration.
I haven't tested swords in awhile but may have to reapproach it as I'm getting closer to a finalized list. Is there any justification to a spellskite main deck if running swords?
Once again thank you!!
-catmix
Flagstones have interfered with my mana zero times so far in games//testing. I use them to thin draws and with the decks that don't suffer from mana denial, I'll ghost quarter them for extra deck thinning. If I do find them getting in the way EVER I will cut them.
The Sideboard info seems just about perfect. I've already cut Canonist for eidolon and love the info about kataki vs silence.
I have one follow up question which is ... Is sundering growth reliable enough with double white in casting cost? I want to replace disenchant for the extra value but too scared to get stuck on turns making decisions based on mana availability. If you tested them and seen it work reliably I'm all in.
Thanks for the help,
-catmix
4 icatian javelineers
4 thalia, guardian of thraben
4 leonin arbiter
3 serra avenger
1 fiend hunter
2 aven mindcensor
4 blade splicer
4 flickerwisp
1 brimaz, king of oreskos
2 restoration angel
1 sunlance
4 path to exile
4 aether vial
Lands: 22
4 ghost quarter
4 tectonic edge
4 flagstones of trokair
1 cavern of souls
1 mutavault
1 eiganjo castle
7 plains
2 disenchant
2 rest in peace
3 stony silence
3 kor firewalker
2 ethersworn canonist
1 kataki, war's wage
2 mirran crusader
I've posted some notes from some recent matches and was hoping to get as much insight from other Tax players. Any contribution is greatly appreciated.
I just played a few rounds with Death & Taxes at my local shop and have some finds to share (my list is on page 43). Any insight or shared perspectives are very much welcome.
Round 1: Esper Control* 2-1
It was a "homebrew" for sure and hard a shell of "America" style cards but black support removal spells and Liliana of the veil. I won 2-1 with the hardest part of the matchup being the clock. It took very long time to exhaust them out of resources.
Notes:
-Cavern was abusive naming humans.
-Reset cavern with flickerwisp to hard cast humans, angels and cats in the same game.
-double tec edge/tec edge + ghost quarter happened both games (using leonin arbiter off vial turn 3 with mindcensor backup).
-batterskull was a scary threat that I didn't have a reasonable answer for.
-after match opponent informed me icatian javlineers prevented profitable interactions with casting snapcaster.
Round 2: Blue Tron 2-0
This was a very simple matchup. Tec Edge & Ghost quarter are back breaking.
Notes:
-Didn't cast any spells other than aether vial (preventing remand from drawing answers).
-Saved arbiters and mindcensors for search affects as pseudo counter magic).
-Forced concession both games with cavern of souls on angels.
Round 3: Mono Green Devotion 0-2
Got my waffle stomped. Simply can't apply pressure fast enough and had a hard time with genesis wave.
Notes:
-couldn't beat genesis wave after it resolved either games.
-primeval titan with trample is a beating without a path ...
-just simply feel like this is unwinnable and would possibly need to accept its a bad match thats low in the field.
Round 4: Burn 2-0
I walked over this matchup.
Notes:
-Thalia made most my opponents spells uncastable.
-leoning arbiter shut down fetching multiple times (needing to be seering blazed without having the fetch to a mountain forced lighting bolts at it was great).
-aether vial prevented eidolon from being functional against me and made eidolon kill my opponent.
I'm very pleased with how the list runs but need help against my midrange match ups. I know mirran crusader is a card we want in the 75 but is there any other cards I should be considering against creature based match ups?
Any help is greatly appreciated.
-Death&CatMix
I am excited to finally join this thread. I am a longtime "control" player and have been fortunate enough to stumble upon the legacy version of this deck. After realizing it mostly had modern cards in it... you know the rest. Anyway this primer has been key in helping me get my footing with taxing the greedy modern players and landing some very satisfying wins. I think we all know we have a hard time with Jund/GBx shells & affinity at times and I've tweaked my list in favor of getting around them but did my best to not compromise the control/combo matchups.
4 icatian javelineers
4 thalia, guardian of thraben
4 leonin arbiter
3 serra avenger
1 fiend hunter
2 aven mindcensor
4 blade splicer
4 flickerwisp
1 brimaz, king of oreskos
2 restoration angels
1 sunlance
4 path to exile
4 aether vial
Lands: 22
4 ghost quarter
4 tectonic edge
4 flagstones of trokair
1 cavern of souls
1 mutavault
1 eiganjo castle
7 plains
2 disenchant
2 rest in peace
3 stony silence
3 kor firewalker
2 ethersworn canonist
1 kataki
2 mirran crusader
Contrary to what I thought originally javelineers power up well in current modern. Before I chose to run him I had hard times with steel overseers, dark confidants, grim lavamancers, & so on and so forth (Javs have been very good at killing Liliana as well). Springing them in during ends steps or resetting with flickerwisp and restoration angel has actually closed out games against a few decks. Fiend hunter has faired well against pod and when anger of the gods try to blow me out (I can usually rescue a vital creature to finish out the game).
I'm testing some new cards just to see if they ever have room to grow and input is greatly appreciated. Mortar pod is another jav but can replenish for instant use with flickerwisp (it also doubles as booty when lingering souls shows its face and it pumps butts of avenger and golems from anger the gods. Crucible to close doors on slow WUR matchups. Skite & Prison are self explanatory. Now the divine reckoning is loose but funny... Against mono green devotion I was joking with a friend about gliterring wish for a card out of a stack on the table and the only white card in the stack was DIVINE RECKONING. Would you believe it would have won that game? After a few more matchups against some creature shells like merfolk, black white tokens,dead guy ale, etc. this card always would be a winning card if applied in each of those instances (allowing my opponent to over extend with my vial out then divine a stale board and replenish).
Anyway thank you for such interesting ideas and sharing perspective with your lists!!
Follow up soon!
-Death n Catmix