I'm really liking Kokusho, the Evening Star in place of Sire. Then again, I do have to run the pain lands and Aggro in my meta is a thing.
I love Voidslime. It's very versatile (and who doesn't love a little flavor?). I'm also a huge fan of the 1 CMC card draw.
I'm thinking of cutting Prophet for Disciple of Bolas. He's a little slow, but saccing Tassy to draw 4 isn't bad at all. I don't like Prophet - if we're casting a 5 CMC spell it had better be Living Death in my opinion
Haven't tested Song of the Dryads, but it seems decent. But maybe just run different removal?
I think we should always keep Phantasmal Image in mind. It's a great card. I have it in place of Spellskite, but I might just keep it like that
EDIT: if you're thinking of cutting Prophet, why not try Jace in that slot?
I meant that Thought Scour doesn't target with the draw, so it can't be used as a wincon...
And I like the utility of Frantic Sesrch to act as a mana filter. If I'm strapped for black mana, I can tap 4 (3 of any and a black) and then untap the black. This has helped out a lot when I need to hit double black for entomb/buried + reanimate effect.
Image is great in a non infinite list to copy terastodons, but he's a little lackluster otherwise. Better in a creature heavy meta I suppose. And I think Delay is better than Remand
Haha I completely forgot Thought Scour doesn't target, damn.
I don't think I'll be testing Shadow of Doubt. It seems to niche and I think I'd rather just have a counterspell. Let me know how testing goes though! I suppose in a tutor heavy meta it's better, but stifling a fetch just seems bad for 2 mana. Why do that when you can prevent a game winning play? I think I'll go with Compulsive Research in E wit's spot, otherwise I'll go with Delay
Thoughts on Sign in Blood as a potential switch for E-wit? I personally would appreciate the extra win con, and I don't think I've ever wanted to cast E-wit...
But then again E-wit has long game potential and it's kind of nice for it to be a 4-5 mama reanimate late game if you cast and get back any of our reanimate spells.
Also double black could be a little rough on the mama base early game I suppose.
But in case you don't want to go through convoluted board states to win with infinite mana and Tasigur, just play another useful piece of card draw or exiling effect that can kill an opponent. Think of Sign in Blood or Sadistic Sacrament. I run Praetor's Grasp in addition to Reality Shift
Big fan of this idea. If Reality Shift doesn't feel like enough for you, I'd run Thought Scour in place of one of the cantrips. You'll sacrifice some consistency, but gain an extra wincon. Plus, playing Tassy on t2 off a thought scour feels great! Also, no one is going to exile a Thought Scour.
So Gilded Drake has rocked in Maelstrom Pulse's slot, it's going to be staying in for a good while.
My ewit testing has shown it to be fairly clunky in my build so far, but I'll keep it in for a bit longer.
I took out Prophet of Kruphix! Not because it's bad, in fact far from it! I just disliked how it made games a bit annoying for the rest of the table (tasigur every turn, to be precise) in terms of time taken. My group hasn't explicitly complained about it yet, but it's in their eyes. Plus there's talk of it getting banned in Januart, and I want to test the deck without it.
Song of the Dryads went in that slot, and it has been an extremely good silver bullet.
Eternal Witness has been fairly clunky for me as well. We already cut Regrowth, so why should ewit stay in? And yeah, Prophet has been getting annoying for me as well. It's always fun when you can say you run a G/U deck without that monster, too
Is Maelstrom Pulse not better than Song of the Dryads? Song ramps your opponents and can be removed, while Maelstrom can't deal with lands but hits tokens hard. I don't have trouble with many lands, so I don't see why Song is that good.
If you're looking for something more competitive, you probably need the draw and protection of blue. Maelstrom Wanderer is probably the best for this, but he's a little overdone. At that point, you might as well play a typical MW deck that focuses on casting and cascading into bombs, not cheating them into play. If you're feeling a little less mainstream, I'd recommend Surrak Dragonclaw, or Intet, the Dreamer. Ideally, you want to protect your cheaty cards with counterspell backup.
Question for any veteran players of the deck (Doom_Blade included, of course!)
My meta is pretty light on 1 cmc removal, so mental misstep hasn't been working out for me. It's nice to catch the sol ring or occasional tutor, but it's not helping me combo. My meta is also pretty light on LD (Occasionally they'll be a strip mine or 2 of course). In terms of potential switches, I've been considering Pact of Negation, Delay, or Dispel. I've been leaning towards Pact, since my meta is pretty light on LD. Perhaps Stifle is always an option? That seems even narrower than misstep though.
Also, my meta has a little more aggro, so I'm constantly at a perilous life total. What are some good lifegain options? I've thought of switching Sire of Stagnation for Kokusho, the Evening Star, and maybe cutting something for Disciple of Bolas. When it's good, it's amazing - saccing a reanimated Terastodon is pretty nice.
Hey guys! I'm interested in building Marchesa. Can anyone direct me to an updated list (it doesn't need to be budget). I'm probably going to run a bigger control shell with some counterspells, since I can't for the life of me play EDH without them.
Unfortunately, you need infinite colored mana to go off with tasigur.
Your best option in BUG is Palinchron. Goes infinite with Phantasmal Image any mana doubler, and most importantly Deadeye. Artifact based infinite mana is good, but (usually) isn't colored and tutoring for artifacts is difficult in BUG outside black tutors. You're better off running support creatures... But then again, you said creatureless so artifacts might be the best way to go.
Call me crazy, but seems like this thread ends up being a veritable shouting match rather than a primer discussion.
I think the artifact lands are a bad idea, as does ISB and Swift. Zen disagrees, and I have doubts about convincing him otherwise. And that's fine. That's his business.
Anyway, what do you guys think about the new artifact that exiles power 5 and above? It avoids most of our creatures and can really hurt big green stompy.deck. Probably not worth it but the idea is interesting.
I think the aesthetic reason is the main reason people don't run off color fetches.
I can personally see why people don't run off color fetches. I run a bant edh list and personally hate the death and anger black and red bring to my peaceful deck of sunshine and happiness.
But then I remind myself I'm a Spike at heart and run them anyway.
Heck yeah! I’m super pumped to get a new Jenara primer in the works. ISB’s was fantastic, and I loved seeing the different ideas flow. One problem I always had with ISB’s list (I say this affectionately <3 ) was the lack of combos. Hence I’m extremely excited to see Palinchron and Mirror Entity in this list.
Here’s my list for reference – I think you’ll see some pretty striking similarities. http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/13-08-15-wSI-jenara/. I’ll acknowledge I have a glaring lack of GY hate in my 99, but I rarely run into GY decks anyway.
But of course the differences are what matter the most. I’ll discuss some differences between our decks, and my rationale.
Lands – I have a semi-budget land base. Haven’t quite gotten Tundra or Tropical Island, but haven’t been having too much issue. Very glad to see Boseiju, Who Shelters All in your list, I think not enough people run that card.
However, I don’t see the usefulness of the artifact lands. In my opinion, they’re too much of a liability. Sure, Tezzeret can find them, but I’d almost always rather get Sol Ring. Already have sol ring? Grab a sword and go to town. I think the land use is too narrow, and they’re way to vulnerable to sweepers . How bad is an Austere Command going to hurt when you’re hitting your own lands? I’d run the off color fetches (Polluted Delta, Arid Mesa etc) instead, to give you more shuffle effects for Sylvan and Top.
I’ll also agree with ISB – I don’t think Reliquary Tower warrants a slot. If I have 8+ cards in hand, I’m probably winning with 7 of them regardless. I’ve never had a hand I had trouble discarding.
Also, I’m curious – What do you name with Cavern of Souls? One of the things I love about this list is that not many of our creatures are worth countering – it’s their combined synergy is what kills. I guess angel? Jenara doesn’t get countered much.
Creatures – Like I said, it’s great to see those combo creatures in there. Our differences are (primarily) with the top of your curve
Yavimaya Dryad – I think this card is worse than Farhaven Elf. Sure, she can get duals and give your opponent a land if you’re into that sort of thing, but GG makes me queasy in a hand where I’m using this creature for ramp. What if I need a green source?
Stonecloaker – haven’t tested him. Is he good? He seems kind of mana intensive to me, but I can definitely see the use in the bounce.
Solemn Simulacrum – He just seems so low impact to me. He can’t be skullclamped, rezed from Sun Titan. He makes a nice blocker but he just seems like filler to me.
Duplicant – Removal on a stick is nice, but I think you have enough spot removal already. It’s nice that you can get him from Farhaven Elf, but I’m not sure he’s efficient enough.
Angel of Serenity – I’ve never played with her, but I think there are better options. The double use of removal + GY hate is nice, but 7 mana is a lot to pay for this type of effect.
Sphinx of Uthuun – FoF on a stick is great, no doubt about it. But there’s no way to abuse him, outside of Karmic Guide shenanigans.
Suggestions:
Ixidron – I’d run this over Duplicant. The utility is just so nice, and often I find myself not wanting to kill the commander. Who wants to kill Omnath or Kaalia? Just flip it and leave them stranded. We can also recover from this type of effect much faster.
Consecrated Sphinx – I just don’t think we can avoid running him :/ I think he’s better than Sphinx of Uthuun, because when he’s good, he’s game winning. I’ve never seen a game won off a Sphinx of Uthuun/ Can’t say the same for ol’ Concs.
Stoneforge Mystic – I honestly think 4 targets is enough. I only run 3, and I’m never unhappy to draw him (her?) unless I’m out of targets. The utility is just so good.
Vorinclex – I’d run him over the Angel of Serenity. He’s just so powerful and adds another combo win for Palinchron. Alternatively, he can make Jenara huge and beat face.
Gilded Drake – This card is amazing. Giving them a flying blocker is problematic sometimes, but usually the creature I steal is faaaaarrrr better. I think this definitely needs to be in the list somewhere.
Oracle of Mul Daya – with so many shuffle effects, I’d run this card over Solemn Simulacrum. She gets crazy good with off color fetches, and can ramp a crazy amount. Sometimes she’s bad but I usually get at least 1 land, making her better than Simulacrum in my opinion.
Artifacts: Scrabbling Claws – I’m not an expert on GY removal, since I don’t run any (LOL), but if I were to, I think this is too low impact. I’d much rather run crypt, which can just wreck a GY player. Claws will just delay them a turn at worst.
Lightning Greaves – How has this been working out for you? I used to run it, but I found it unnecessary. Jenara flies low under the radar, and I’ve never found Lightning Greaves to be useful.
Planeswalkers: Jace, the Mind Sculptor – I haven’t tested him, but he just seems like a massive target and not impactful. Great in 1v1, but not in multiplayer.
Tezzeret, the Seeker – Honestly never been a fan. The tutoring is nice, but he’s 5 mana and rarely lasted a turn for me. I respect the inclusion but I just wasn’t impressed when I played him.
Instants:
Love the list. I run Muddle the Mixture over Counterspell. I love a good counterspell, but I love the utility Muddle gives. It fetches Survival, Stoneforge (in my list), Eladamri’s to get any creature, Phantasmal image, and Gilded Drake. Sooooo many good targets.
Sorceries: Tooth and Nail – I don’t see much reason for this to be in the list. What do you normally get with it? Deadeye and Palinchron? That requires that you have an outlet for that infinite mana (Jenara excluding, of course). Whenever I tested this card, I found it just clogged up too many hands for it to be worth it.
Bribery – This card needs to be in the list, in my opinion. It wins games, it’s that good. I can use it as early as T4 to get an early Prophet or use it late game to get a monster.
Time Warp – I run two of these effects (Warp and Aeons for budget reasons). I find that these are great for killing someone with an extra turn with Jenara. Generally, I use them to make sure I can kill the table when I get infinite mana and draw my deck (see below). I can just kill everyone with Jenara by looping the extra turn effects and Witness or Snappy.
With regard to your combos, how do you often use the infinite mana? For some reason whenever I get infinite mana, Jenara never seems to be on the field -_- so I can’t kill anybody. I always use a tutor to get Prime Speaker Zegana and then draw my deck off an arbitrarily big Jenara (be sure to leave yourself a few cards in your deck). I then use extra turn effects to kill everyone!
All in all, great list. I’m super excited to see another Jenara primer (hopefully) and I look forward to the discussions between us all!
Hey guys! Even though this primer is retired, I'm still having great fun with this deck. I'm unsure if the mods still want us to talk on this thread, but I'll just go ahead and post and they can remove if necessary. I can make a new thread about my list specifically if need be.
Anyway - my story. I ran a (nerfed) version of ISB's list for my LGS's EDH League and found it... lacking. Maybe it was my lack of play skill, but I kept getting blown out by combo decks (Melek, Zegana, Ghave, Damia specifically). It seemed like the goodstuff list I was running didnt quite get there. Because of that, I embraced the ugly truth, and decided to run some combo.
I'll first address the obvious - Bant isn't optimized to run combo. I am aware of this. That distinction belongs to BUG most likely. But the key about Jenara is that Combo isn't NECESSARY. I can still play a nice game of magic by beating people to death. She also doesn't scream combo like most BUG commanders.
The addition of combo wasn't really that difficult to incorporate, and it has worked great. I haven't yet lost a game with it, and I think it takes more skill and fun to play. Here is the list!
There are 2 important comboes in the deck (well 3, but one is pretty janky).
1. Classic Reveillark + Body Double + Venser, Shaper Savant + Mirror Entity. I won't explain it because ISB has already done a nice job of that, but this combo is pretty resilient. This combo almost ALWAYS requires Survival of the Fittest If you have 1 irrelevant creature in hand, it takes 12 mana (5 of it G, which is often hard to achieve) to complete - 1G to play survival, G to get Venser, G to get Mirror, G to get Body Double, G to get Reveillark, and 6 to evoke.
2. Ye old Palinchron + Phantasmal Image/Mirari's Wake/Deadeye Navigator/Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger. This is the main reason I run Vorinclex and Deadeye. Elesh Norn just didn't end games like Vorinclex, and Deadeye just works so well with other ETB creatures. As for Mirari's Wake, the logic is simple - a combo version is by nature more mana hungry, so I use this to supplant the need for mana.
What do I do with the infinite mana? I can usually 1 shot someone with Jenara at least. Admittedly this is a weaker combo, since I need to somehow get Sphinx's Revelation or Primespeaker Zegana to draw my deck (off an infinitely big Jenara). From there I usually just chain together extra turns to kill everyone. Any ETB creature paired with Deadeye will also do the trick. Note that this can actually be done with a lone Fierce Empath, but it costs 18 mana O.O
Cards to support combo - Prophet of Kruphix - I can actually combo off at instant speed with the Reveillark Combo, which is really nice. Boseiju, Who Shelters All - When you play in a meta with combo, it's really nice to see your Time Warp resolve. It also works nicely for tutors that put creatures directly into play (GSZ, Wargate, Chord of Calling). Tolaria West is usually used to get this or Pact of Negation Muddle the Mixture tutors for survival nicely. It also helps win counter wars over its resolution, and strengthens the tutor portion of the deck. Enlightened Tutor fetches Survival, so I run it over Tezzeret, the Seeker
WHERE I NEED HELP
Cards I want to add - Capsize - I like it as an additional wincon for the second combo, but I'm having trouble figuring out what to swap out. I'm thinking Cryptic Command, since it's so expensive and isn't usually cast to defend the combo. It's so versatile though... Karametra, God of Harvests- as a combo deck, we are more mana hungry, and she helps for this greatly. I cut her for Prophet, but I'm unsure of this cut. Can anyone see room for her in the list?
There's a decided lack of grave hate in my list as well, but I just can't see room for Tormod's Crypt. I already run Tolaria West, so my tutoring package is stronger than most, but I can't see room for it.
Any random comments on my decklist are welcome! I just wanted to keep the conversation going for Jenara - she's a great commander and the discussion deserves to be revived. You might be interested in my list if you like a bit more combo or feel that it is best for your meta.
Burntgerbil, do you ever have trouble with evasion? I'm wondering if you have trouble punching through that double strike damage in the face of chump blockers. Tibor and Lumia looks really fun, although its a pretty hard nonbo if you manage to kill your own general :). Mistfire Adept seems a little more consistent. What's the function of Mirror Entity in the deck? Besides a large strike later in the game, it seems underwhelming
I love Voidslime. It's very versatile (and who doesn't love a little flavor?). I'm also a huge fan of the 1 CMC card draw.
I'm thinking of cutting Prophet for Disciple of Bolas. He's a little slow, but saccing Tassy to draw 4 isn't bad at all. I don't like Prophet - if we're casting a 5 CMC spell it had better be Living Death in my opinion
Haven't tested Song of the Dryads, but it seems decent. But maybe just run different removal?
I think we should always keep Phantasmal Image in mind. It's a great card. I have it in place of Spellskite, but I might just keep it like that
EDIT: if you're thinking of cutting Prophet, why not try Jace in that slot?
And I like the utility of Frantic Sesrch to act as a mana filter. If I'm strapped for black mana, I can tap 4 (3 of any and a black) and then untap the black. This has helped out a lot when I need to hit double black for entomb/buried + reanimate effect.
Image is great in a non infinite list to copy terastodons, but he's a little lackluster otherwise. Better in a creature heavy meta I suppose. And I think Delay is better than Remand
I don't think I'll be testing Shadow of Doubt. It seems to niche and I think I'd rather just have a counterspell. Let me know how testing goes though! I suppose in a tutor heavy meta it's better, but stifling a fetch just seems bad for 2 mana. Why do that when you can prevent a game winning play? I think I'll go with Compulsive Research in E wit's spot, otherwise I'll go with Delay
But then again E-wit has long game potential and it's kind of nice for it to be a 4-5 mama reanimate late game if you cast and get back any of our reanimate spells.
Also double black could be a little rough on the mama base early game I suppose.
Big fan of this idea. If Reality Shift doesn't feel like enough for you, I'd run Thought Scour in place of one of the cantrips. You'll sacrifice some consistency, but gain an extra wincon. Plus, playing Tassy on t2 off a thought scour feels great! Also, no one is going to exile a Thought Scour.
Eternal Witness has been fairly clunky for me as well. We already cut Regrowth, so why should ewit stay in? And yeah, Prophet has been getting annoying for me as well. It's always fun when you can say you run a G/U deck without that monster, too
Is Maelstrom Pulse not better than Song of the Dryads? Song ramps your opponents and can be removed, while Maelstrom can't deal with lands but hits tokens hard. I don't have trouble with many lands, so I don't see why Song is that good.
If you're looking for something more competitive, you probably need the draw and protection of blue. Maelstrom Wanderer is probably the best for this, but he's a little overdone. At that point, you might as well play a typical MW deck that focuses on casting and cascading into bombs, not cheating them into play. If you're feeling a little less mainstream, I'd recommend Surrak Dragonclaw, or Intet, the Dreamer. Ideally, you want to protect your cheaty cards with counterspell backup.
My meta is pretty light on 1 cmc removal, so mental misstep hasn't been working out for me. It's nice to catch the sol ring or occasional tutor, but it's not helping me combo. My meta is also pretty light on LD (Occasionally they'll be a strip mine or 2 of course). In terms of potential switches, I've been considering Pact of Negation, Delay, or Dispel. I've been leaning towards Pact, since my meta is pretty light on LD. Perhaps Stifle is always an option? That seems even narrower than misstep though.
Also, my meta has a little more aggro, so I'm constantly at a perilous life total. What are some good lifegain options? I've thought of switching Sire of Stagnation for Kokusho, the Evening Star, and maybe cutting something for Disciple of Bolas. When it's good, it's amazing - saccing a reanimated Terastodon is pretty nice.
Thoughts? Thanks for any help!
Your best option in BUG is Palinchron. Goes infinite with Phantasmal Image any mana doubler, and most importantly Deadeye. Artifact based infinite mana is good, but (usually) isn't colored and tutoring for artifacts is difficult in BUG outside black tutors. You're better off running support creatures... But then again, you said creatureless so artifacts might be the best way to go.
I think the artifact lands are a bad idea, as does ISB and Swift. Zen disagrees, and I have doubts about convincing him otherwise. And that's fine. That's his business.
Anyway, what do you guys think about the new artifact that exiles power 5 and above? It avoids most of our creatures and can really hurt big green stompy.deck. Probably not worth it but the idea is interesting.
I can personally see why people don't run off color fetches. I run a bant edh list and personally hate the death and anger black and red bring to my peaceful deck of sunshine and happiness.
But then I remind myself I'm a Spike at heart and run them anyway.
(The shuffle effects are also nice in lists with Sylvan Library, Sensei's Divining Top, and Scroll Rack)
Here’s my list for reference – I think you’ll see some pretty striking similarities. http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/13-08-15-wSI-jenara/. I’ll acknowledge I have a glaring lack of GY hate in my 99, but I rarely run into GY decks anyway.
But of course the differences are what matter the most. I’ll discuss some differences between our decks, and my rationale.
Lands – I have a semi-budget land base. Haven’t quite gotten Tundra or Tropical Island, but haven’t been having too much issue. Very glad to see Boseiju, Who Shelters All in your list, I think not enough people run that card.
However, I don’t see the usefulness of the artifact lands. In my opinion, they’re too much of a liability. Sure, Tezzeret can find them, but I’d almost always rather get Sol Ring. Already have sol ring? Grab a sword and go to town. I think the land use is too narrow, and they’re way to vulnerable to sweepers . How bad is an Austere Command going to hurt when you’re hitting your own lands? I’d run the off color fetches (Polluted Delta, Arid Mesa etc) instead, to give you more shuffle effects for Sylvan and Top.
I’ll also agree with ISB – I don’t think Reliquary Tower warrants a slot. If I have 8+ cards in hand, I’m probably winning with 7 of them regardless. I’ve never had a hand I had trouble discarding.
Also, I’m curious – What do you name with Cavern of Souls? One of the things I love about this list is that not many of our creatures are worth countering – it’s their combined synergy is what kills. I guess angel? Jenara doesn’t get countered much.
Creatures – Like I said, it’s great to see those combo creatures in there. Our differences are (primarily) with the top of your curve
Yavimaya Dryad – I think this card is worse than Farhaven Elf. Sure, she can get duals and give your opponent a land if you’re into that sort of thing, but GG makes me queasy in a hand where I’m using this creature for ramp. What if I need a green source?
Stonecloaker – haven’t tested him. Is he good? He seems kind of mana intensive to me, but I can definitely see the use in the bounce.
Solemn Simulacrum – He just seems so low impact to me. He can’t be skullclamped, rezed from Sun Titan. He makes a nice blocker but he just seems like filler to me.
Duplicant – Removal on a stick is nice, but I think you have enough spot removal already. It’s nice that you can get him from Farhaven Elf, but I’m not sure he’s efficient enough.
Angel of Serenity – I’ve never played with her, but I think there are better options. The double use of removal + GY hate is nice, but 7 mana is a lot to pay for this type of effect.
Sphinx of Uthuun – FoF on a stick is great, no doubt about it. But there’s no way to abuse him, outside of Karmic Guide shenanigans.
Suggestions:
Ixidron – I’d run this over Duplicant. The utility is just so nice, and often I find myself not wanting to kill the commander. Who wants to kill Omnath or Kaalia? Just flip it and leave them stranded. We can also recover from this type of effect much faster.
Consecrated Sphinx – I just don’t think we can avoid running him :/ I think he’s better than Sphinx of Uthuun, because when he’s good, he’s game winning. I’ve never seen a game won off a Sphinx of Uthuun/ Can’t say the same for ol’ Concs.
Stoneforge Mystic – I honestly think 4 targets is enough. I only run 3, and I’m never unhappy to draw him (her?) unless I’m out of targets. The utility is just so good.
Vorinclex – I’d run him over the Angel of Serenity. He’s just so powerful and adds another combo win for Palinchron. Alternatively, he can make Jenara huge and beat face.
Gilded Drake – This card is amazing. Giving them a flying blocker is problematic sometimes, but usually the creature I steal is faaaaarrrr better. I think this definitely needs to be in the list somewhere.
Oracle of Mul Daya – with so many shuffle effects, I’d run this card over Solemn Simulacrum. She gets crazy good with off color fetches, and can ramp a crazy amount. Sometimes she’s bad but I usually get at least 1 land, making her better than Simulacrum in my opinion.
Artifacts:
Scrabbling Claws – I’m not an expert on GY removal, since I don’t run any (LOL), but if I were to, I think this is too low impact. I’d much rather run crypt, which can just wreck a GY player. Claws will just delay them a turn at worst.
Lightning Greaves – How has this been working out for you? I used to run it, but I found it unnecessary. Jenara flies low under the radar, and I’ve never found Lightning Greaves to be useful.
Planeswalkers:
Jace, the Mind Sculptor – I haven’t tested him, but he just seems like a massive target and not impactful. Great in 1v1, but not in multiplayer.
Tezzeret, the Seeker – Honestly never been a fan. The tutoring is nice, but he’s 5 mana and rarely lasted a turn for me. I respect the inclusion but I just wasn’t impressed when I played him.
Instants:
Love the list. I run Muddle the Mixture over Counterspell. I love a good counterspell, but I love the utility Muddle gives. It fetches Survival, Stoneforge (in my list), Eladamri’s to get any creature, Phantasmal image, and Gilded Drake. Sooooo many good targets.
Sorceries:
Tooth and Nail – I don’t see much reason for this to be in the list. What do you normally get with it? Deadeye and Palinchron? That requires that you have an outlet for that infinite mana (Jenara excluding, of course). Whenever I tested this card, I found it just clogged up too many hands for it to be worth it.
Bribery – This card needs to be in the list, in my opinion. It wins games, it’s that good. I can use it as early as T4 to get an early Prophet or use it late game to get a monster.
Time Warp – I run two of these effects (Warp and Aeons for budget reasons). I find that these are great for killing someone with an extra turn with Jenara. Generally, I use them to make sure I can kill the table when I get infinite mana and draw my deck (see below). I can just kill everyone with Jenara by looping the extra turn effects and Witness or Snappy.
With regard to your combos, how do you often use the infinite mana? For some reason whenever I get infinite mana, Jenara never seems to be on the field -_- so I can’t kill anybody. I always use a tutor to get Prime Speaker Zegana and then draw my deck off an arbitrarily big Jenara (be sure to leave yourself a few cards in your deck). I then use extra turn effects to kill everyone!
All in all, great list. I’m super excited to see another Jenara primer (hopefully) and I look forward to the discussions between us all!
Anyway - my story. I ran a (nerfed) version of ISB's list for my LGS's EDH League and found it... lacking. Maybe it was my lack of play skill, but I kept getting blown out by combo decks (Melek, Zegana, Ghave, Damia specifically). It seemed like the goodstuff list I was running didnt quite get there. Because of that, I embraced the ugly truth, and decided to run some combo.
I'll first address the obvious - Bant isn't optimized to run combo. I am aware of this. That distinction belongs to BUG most likely. But the key about Jenara is that Combo isn't NECESSARY. I can still play a nice game of magic by beating people to death. She also doesn't scream combo like most BUG commanders.
The addition of combo wasn't really that difficult to incorporate, and it has worked great. I haven't yet lost a game with it, and I think it takes more skill and fun to play. Here is the list!
1x Academy Ruins
1x Adarkar Wastes
1x Alchemist's Refuge
1x Arid Mesa
1x Boseiju, Who Shelters All
1x Breeding Pool
1x Brushland
1x Command Tower
1x Flooded Grove
1x Flooded Strand
3x Forest
1x Glacial Fortress
1x Hallowed Fountain
1x Hinterland Harbor
3x Island
1x Kor Haven
1x Marsh Flats
1x Misty Rainforest
1x Mystic Gate
3x Plains
1x Polluted Delta
1x Reflecting Pool
1x Savannah
1x Strip Mine
1x Sunpetal Grove
1x Temple Garden
1x Tolaria West
1x Windswept Heath
1x Wooded Bastion
1x Wooded Foothills
1x Yavimaya Coast
1x Venser, the Sojourner
Creature (29)
1x Acidic Slime
1x Body Double
1x Clever Impersonator
1x Consecrated Sphinx
1x Deadeye Navigator
1x Eternal Witness
1x Farhaven Elf
1x Fierce Empath
1x Gilded Drake
1x Glen Elendra Archmage
1x Harmonic Sliver
1x Ixidron
1x Karmic Guide
1x Mirror Entity
1x Oracle of Mul Daya
1x Palinchron
1x Phantasmal Image
1x Phyrexian Metamorph
1x Prime Speaker Zegana
1x Prophet of Kruphix
1x Reveillark
1x Sakura-Tribe Elder
1x Snapcaster Mage
1x Stoneforge Mystic
1x Sun Titan
1x Trinket Mage
1x Venser, Shaper Savant
1x Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger
1x Wood Elves
Artifact (7)
1x Birthing Pod
1x Oblivion Stone
1x Sensei's Divining Top
1x Skullclamp
1x Sol Ring
1x Sword of Feast and Famine
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Bant Charm
1x Beast Within
1x Chord of Calling
1x Cryptic Command
1x Cyclonic Rift
1x Eladamri's Call
1x Enlightened Tutor
1x Fact or Fiction
1x Mana Drain
1x Muddle the Mixture
1x Mystical Tutor
1x Pact of Negation
1x Sphinx's Revelation
1x Swords to Plowshares
1x Voidslime
Sorcery (7)
1x Austere Command
1x Bribery
1x Green Sun's Zenith
1x Supreme Verdict
1x Time Warp
1x Walk the Aeons
1x Wargate
Enchantment (3)
1x Mirari's Wake
1x Survival of the Fittest
1x Sylvan Library
There are 2 important comboes in the deck (well 3, but one is pretty janky).
1. Classic Reveillark + Body Double + Venser, Shaper Savant + Mirror Entity. I won't explain it because ISB has already done a nice job of that, but this combo is pretty resilient. This combo almost ALWAYS requires Survival of the Fittest If you have 1 irrelevant creature in hand, it takes 12 mana (5 of it G, which is often hard to achieve) to complete - 1G to play survival, G to get Venser, G to get Mirror, G to get Body Double, G to get Reveillark, and 6 to evoke.
2. Ye old Palinchron + Phantasmal Image/Mirari's Wake/Deadeye Navigator/Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger. This is the main reason I run Vorinclex and Deadeye. Elesh Norn just didn't end games like Vorinclex, and Deadeye just works so well with other ETB creatures. As for Mirari's Wake, the logic is simple - a combo version is by nature more mana hungry, so I use this to supplant the need for mana.
What do I do with the infinite mana? I can usually 1 shot someone with Jenara at least. Admittedly this is a weaker combo, since I need to somehow get Sphinx's Revelation or Primespeaker Zegana to draw my deck (off an infinitely big Jenara). From there I usually just chain together extra turns to kill everyone. Any ETB creature paired with Deadeye will also do the trick. Note that this can actually be done with a lone Fierce Empath, but it costs 18 mana O.O
3. Infinite Turns with Eternal Witness + Extra Turn Card + Bounce engine (Venser, the Sojourner or Deadeye Navigator). A pretty janky combo that I've only assembled once. Still, the backup plan is nice.
Cards to support combo - Prophet of Kruphix - I can actually combo off at instant speed with the Reveillark Combo, which is really nice.
Boseiju, Who Shelters All - When you play in a meta with combo, it's really nice to see your Time Warp resolve. It also works nicely for tutors that put creatures directly into play (GSZ, Wargate, Chord of Calling). Tolaria West is usually used to get this or Pact of Negation
Muddle the Mixture tutors for survival nicely. It also helps win counter wars over its resolution, and strengthens the tutor portion of the deck.
Enlightened Tutor fetches Survival, so I run it over Tezzeret, the Seeker
WHERE I NEED HELP
Cards I want to add - Capsize - I like it as an additional wincon for the second combo, but I'm having trouble figuring out what to swap out. I'm thinking Cryptic Command, since it's so expensive and isn't usually cast to defend the combo. It's so versatile though...
Karametra, God of Harvests- as a combo deck, we are more mana hungry, and she helps for this greatly. I cut her for Prophet, but I'm unsure of this cut. Can anyone see room for her in the list?
There's a decided lack of grave hate in my list as well, but I just can't see room for Tormod's Crypt. I already run Tolaria West, so my tutoring package is stronger than most, but I can't see room for it.
Any random comments on my decklist are welcome! I just wanted to keep the conversation going for Jenara - she's a great commander and the discussion deserves to be revived. You might be interested in my list if you like a bit more combo or feel that it is best for your meta.