MTG Salvation

Relic, anger of the gods, staticaster, dispel, rest in peace, wrath of god, etc. those are your best bets vs abzan company post sideboard

Quote from Jex »

What are you on about? Vision is not a win condition. It cannot win the game by itself. This is foolish speak. It's card advantage, not a finisher.

Do we probably win the game if a Vision resolves? Probably, but drawing the game long usually results in our win regardless. AV does not speed that up. The decks that can use AV the best are the attrition blue decks like Jund (i.e. Grixis). That deck can utilise AV incredibly well and has enough looters in the deck which work smoothly already that they don't need to make many large changes to the list to get it to work. An issue with AV is that you need to sacrifice the integrity of the already smooth curve and spell list.

Have you ever won matches due to the fact that you revelate for 5? Putting your opponent down so many cards is indeed what wins a game. While it doesn't end the game, like what you are probably thinking of, getting ahead in so many cards in ANY matchup, aggro, control, midrange, combo, etc. puts us in the best position to win the game. AKA Win Condition, not end-the-game condition. AV doesn't need to be in the best attrition decks out there like Grixis, it fits best in a deck that covers ITS weakness, early game use and late game top deck. Both of which are covered by our deck's strengths. Try out my list. I guarantee that you will have a change in thought once you have tried it a few times.

Ok guys, i can't be the only one here who thinks vision is busted in this list right? Everyone here is relegating it to SB play, but I have been non stop testing with it in the more pure control version and dear lord is it busted. Even as a late top deck it puts them in such a tough position its not even funny. The card has won me almost every game i casted it (except for that tron match i told you about, once in G1 vs temur delver before it resolved, and once vs thopter sword G1). Seriously guys, if you haven't had the time to test out my list, DO IT. I have won games where i should have lost due to how it just puts you so far ahead. I was dead on board 4 different times vs RUG delver, and once vision resolved, drew all the lands i needed to cast my wraths and help reestablish control of the field. Here is my 75. Do yourself a favor and try it out. Also, i feel like i am the only one remembering this as well. In the pure control version, you all have said that vision is a bad top deck late game since its a dead draw. I disagree. Its a clock in its own right. 4 Turns, i win. Can you stop it? Even in top deck mode, we have 4 colonnade and lighthouse to keep ourselves busy if we aren't drawing good either way. As a rebuttle to khainn, Vision is a 1 mana investment for 3 cards, Think Twice is 5 for 2. Point to vision. Think twice gives value immediately, rather than vision is waiting. point TT. BOTH allow you to hold up counter magic to interact with the opponent. point both sides. However, only vision wins the game if it resolves, unlike TT. I prefer to think of it instead of a TT replacement, but a better revelation for 1 mana in early games where mana is tight. But like i said, i think i may have broke the deck here. Aggro is easy as per usual. Midrange and control matchups got a ton easier thanks to the vision. Combo is still a difficult one to fight, but vision puts a "clock" out there.

Gideon from my testing has been my favorite planes walker in any matchup (besides grishoalbrand). Against aggro, he is a reusable fog/instigator that can clear a path for your colonnade, against midrange he is card advantage vs creatures, against control he is a 5 mana 6/6 that can't be touched except by terminate or path. While ajani also has game vs most decks like gideon, he is much more fragile. nothing beats a planes walker that ticks to 8 loyalty the turn it comes out.

Not only will jace be good vs that deck, but also izzet staticaster to deal with the tokens repeatedly, and this aforementioned lingering souls problem as well... I know i am adding my staticaster back to the SB in place of anger of the gods since x/1s are going to be relevant again. Also, i cut clique for vision, replaced a ghost quarter with lighthouse, switched elspeth in favor of gideon jura and i am loving the new list. Vision is almost always a good draw from my testing, even in late game top deck wars since we trade 1 for 1 or 2 for 1 so often, our opponent will also be having to be in a similar/worse situation. Even with the lighthouse giving you the ability to loot when you are behind on board, most of the time i have chosen to suspend vision rather than loot it away. Vision is certainly a welcomed edition, and from testing, it kinda feels a bit too good. Not sure if its just from a good streak of playing or the card itself being good. That requires more testing itself.

EDIT: @KillerSOS my win cons for the pure control version are 4 colonnade, 1 gideon jura, and burn MD. Turns out, aggro decks have a rough time with gideon at any of his 3 modes. SB ajani vengeant also spills trouble for aggro and control for his gameplan as well.

Here has been my list i am testing for SOI after hearing about the unbannings. Only loss has been against tron, using Conduit of Ruin as a pseudo eye of ugin replacement


Current wins include 8-rack, mono white death and taxes, affinity, cruel control, jund, and zoo. The large amount of cheap removal to stave off the early offensive coupled with vision is almost always GG. Only loss after casting vision came from that tron deck using conduit of ruin, finding 2 ulamog to eat my white lands after finding/using path on other creatures. BTW perfectly fine with that occurring since it somewhat gives us better late game. Would love to find a spot for the 4th vision, maybe cutting clique or elspeth? Thoughts on the 75?

Have been doing some testing for Ancestral Vision, and boy oh boy is it fun. I don't like it as a 4 of, but as a 3 of for jeskai control. Every time i resolved a vision, it has won me the game except vs tron since i couldn't find answers to the dude's conduit of ruin finding ulamog twice. However, Visions is such a potent card to have, giving us the late game guarantee if we can keep control for it to resolve.

Can insta win with lab maniac if you attempt to draw with an empty deck...

Quote from Smoldy »

So I currently play UWr control build with 4 walls 2/ snaps a P&K 4 restos and a Chandra flamecaller. Everything else is counters and burn. But as of late with the rise of cord.deck and milira going around I have been finding it difficult to win. One of my friend suggested Blue Moon and another suggested UW control that has been going around for a while. I like the removal that white adds but also like P&K and Chandra a lot. Would you guys suggest staying with UWr or switching to blue moon or UW control. I can post my list in a bit if people want to see the 75.

As a Blue Moon player myself, I played against the melira decks twice last night, losing both times 0-2. By NO means does the matchup feel bad, i punted game 2 in the first matchup by not bolting a melira in response to a collected company, but other than that blood moon itself doesn't do much besides shut down Gavony Township since they have birds, hierarch, and wall of roots to hit all of their spells. If you expect company, be sure to run some number of anger of the gods, and maybe magma spray or pillar of flame is there will be a ton. I haven't had too much experience with WUR control, but the matchup still seems feasible if you can shut down township.

Also, just as a quick question for the Jeskai Control forum as a whole, is there any good jeskai control videos that you recommend watching to get a good idea of what to do with the deck?

Has anyone tested/been testing Chandra, Flamecaller? In blue moon, she is a powerhouse that wins the game on her own and wins fast. Does anyone know how she performs in the Jeskai control decks?

Hey guys, just looking for some crowdsourced information. If you had to pick either Blue Moon, Jeskai Control, or URGx Scapeshift as the premier blue red control deck of choice, which one do you think will end up performing the best? Personally, both jeskai and blue moon seem the best positioned to me, jeskai with bolt, helix, and path for the aggro decks and cards like gideon, elspeth, and colonnade for late game while blue moon has bolt, burst lightning, flame slash for early game, and blood moon, chandra flame caller, and batter skull as its late game make both seem well positioned IMO.
Is there any other UR control decks that seem appealing to what you expect the meta to be post SOI? What do you think will be the best way to move forward?

Which list? The one with Titi or without? Never mind, i will just share both!
Without TITI

the list i had with titi is on the last page. Changes i plan on making is switching Jace AOT with new jace. Also, thoughts on the newly spoiled "sweeper"?
"Engulf the Shore"
3U
Instant
Return to their owner's hands all creatures with toughness less than or equal to the number of Islands you control.
"The tides have begun to ignore the moon."
- Tamiyo's journal

First thing i thought of is "by golly, they made an instant bounce sweep spell in blue!" Looking closer, it looks like an option for us to run in blue moon since we run such a high island count to begin with, AND it can be played at instant speed. This is actually the cheapest this has ever been for a blue sweeper. it does good on turn 4, hitting creatures with toughness 1-4, depending on your draw. And late game it hits bigger stuff as well. Certainly something to think about, and it bounces our snapcaster mages and p&k to help squeeze out all the value they can give. Certainly another card to add to the "must test in blue moon" category of SOI. This set has given us quite a few goodies to test out, loving this way more than BFZ block

Well, after testing vs different decks in the format that aren't eldrazi, my results conclude TITI is not all that i hoped it would be. As a control deck, we didn't have enough spells to flip it as much as i would hope. Against aggro decks, it was just a turn delay before they would break through it, and most of the time the opponent had a removal spell targeting it when it had 2 ice counters on it. Against jund, decay and terminate were too much for titi to do anything useful. Against burn, it slowed their attack down a turn until they attacked with a guide and finished it off with a bolt. Against affinity they just went around it. Infect just plowed through it. Control didn't care about it. Overall, was not impressed. Very disappointed to say the least. HOWEVER, new jace did prove to be quite the resource vs midrange and control. much stronger than AOT. Drawing a card each turn with selection, bouncing their creature for the turn, or threatening to ult was the true means of victory vs control mirrors. Think twice was a decent addition as well, allowing more card draw than before helps ensure our top decks get a little better than just hitting serum visions. Serum visions required an extra turn for it to be useful. At least with think twice, we get the top 2 cards in the late game, or 2 cards divided over 2 turns if you are in the early game. I think Think twice may actually stay in my current iteration of the deck since it actually provides CA, unlike serum visions.

Did a little write up on what i expect blue moon decks to do going forward on reddit. Link if you want to read here: https://www.reddit.com/r/ModernURx/comments/4as2uz/blue_moon_going_forward/
Basic TL;DR is that if we want to end up running Thing in the Ice, we have to adjust the 75 a bit. Here is the 75 I have prepared here:

Thoughts on what changes should be made to the 75 is appreciated. Thinking about cutting a land in favor of another P&k. Also, lack of batter skull is due to how grixis and jund will likely Rise to fight the aggressive decks making Kolaghan's Command make a return. Also, the way i perceive it, both Titi and Batterskull are our answers to aggro decks. One is an early wall with a big booty late game if it flips, and the other just about wins games on the spot. I would have to do some heavy testing vs burn, zoo, and affinity if this is the 75 of choice, but i like the power this deck can have

EDIT: just finished some testing against a few midrange/control decks. So far, i dislike the use of 23 lands, and removed lighthouse in favor of another P&K. Thing in the Ice can be a bit slow if you don't have either snapcaster or think twice, but it flips faster than i originally expected without the two cards. Unless we are being slowed down by trinisphere or thalia, expect a flip within a turn or two for playing it. Playing it T2 also feels great against midrange/control. They either have to interact with it on the stack, or remove it before we untap. If they do remove it, Blood moon almost guaranteed resolves and wins the game. If they don't interact with it, hold up removal and counter magic and watch it control the game. Even against abrupt decay decks, Titi and blood moon make it so their removal is stretched thin, making removal of either one not the greatest feeling in the world. Haven't landed new jace to test its merit, but i still like the idea of it more than AOT.

I am likely replacing my SB jace, architect of thought for it. AoT's +1 isn't as good as the new opt each turn. I mainly want to use AoT for the - ability, but this jace synergies more with our deck than old jade does. This jace certainly feels like WOTC's attempt to fix mind sculptor. Card draw, creature "removal" and a game winning ult. This against any midrange deck is going to be fun for sure, don't want this be Aggro though. Still trying to figure out the new 75 for the deck once the set releases, but it's hard figuring that out if we still don't know if eye or Tempple gets the hammer since it alters our SB a bit. Has anyone done testing on TitI yet? Thoughts on how it performs vs non eldrazi decks?