Any advice on how to beat leyline of the void? Idk if it's just because the sideboards on cockatrice are typically ridiculous or if it's because the decks getting some attention but man I am constantly losing to turn 0 leyline of the void game 2 and 3 as if they have like 4 in the board just for me. Rey of revelation in the opener or bust it seems tbh.
Hey guys. I have enjoyed oath of Nissa in zoo and I have been trying to take it a step further. I'm playing 4 oath 4 traverse the ulvenwald and one of hatebears to search up with dilerium. I'm also playing misha's bauble and gitaxian probe to get info on what bears to protect and achieve early delirium.
Anyone else try this yet? Seems awesome in a known meta.
I've been wanting to try out traverse, but I think getting delirium is hard, and I don't like the idea of playing probe and bauble just to turn it on. I would love to see a build that can consistently make it a GSZ, but it might be too much work.
I think there's a toolboxy list pretty far from a traditional zoo list hiding somewhere in this thought line. Some kind of hatey bant list that can win with the Knight + Retreat combo but isn't married to it. Idk, I haven't had the time due to finals to really brew anything creative, but I will be looking into it soon. The card has the potential to free us from the deck building constraints of coco and the more shotgun blast style of a coco creature deck. Maybe oath, traverse, serum visions, in some amounts, paths which we'll actually have room for due to no coco. In the right deck it's similar to green sun zenith, minus the sweet turn one dryad arbor interaction.
From my experience it's pretty much impossible to get Traverse running consistently in a zoo list without some significant warping of the main game plan, probably to the detriment of the deck as a whole. Man I wish delirium was three card types rather than four, we would probably be turning it easily enough as we often have land creature instant in the grave.
I'm a huge fan of titi, wins me plenty of games, though should NOT be paired with large amounts of delve creatures or chandra's parents. I could see one tasigur just because he's a champion of a card even if he's a nonbo with titi.
I've had success with titi, it just doesn't mix well with thopter sword and is generally unproven so people aren't looking. I still think it's a sweet list.
Just saw your list, I quite like it! However just 1 Snare seems dangerous with Thopter Sword being played.
I could see an additional spell snare. The card's stock definitely went up with the bannings and unbannings.
Thing in the Ice is a card that gets killed a lot in this list, but that's fine considering it usually means they have to spend some amount of time or effort getting it off of the board, which is great for us as it gives us another turn or an additional land (in the case of path to exile) to work with later, and is a resource not spent on developing a board position we might not be able to deal with. I'm really in love with the card. Also gives us main board game against some aggro decks, by bouncing all their dudes back to hand. For whatever reason a lot of people on this board aren't too hot on it and would rather ship the old lists that historically haven't done super well but plus AV and/or Thopter Sword. That's a safe option in my eyes and there's probably some wisdom to upgrading the old lists people know well, but I've always been a brewer at heart who tries to innovate even if it goes down an unproven path. I just can't get over the fact that when thing flips, I always win the game, and that when thing doesn't flip, hell, I'm still usually winning the game. Thing isn't a card that can be your sole wincon but he is an absurdly powerful card that demands that my opponents play around him. He only ever comes out against GBx, where the sheer amount of viable removal against him makes him unlikely to impact the game, in which case I'd rather side into a grindy low creature control deck that naturally blanks their removal spells. So yeah, he has his weaknesses but well worth the inclusion in my eyes.
I've had success with titi, it just doesn't mix well with thopter sword and is generally unproven so people aren't looking. I still think it's a sweet list.
Yeah, that's pretty much the experience I've had with Oath in my blue zoo build. Especially good there as it frees you from the deck building restraints that coco comes saddled with. I love coco, but the deck has just been a more consistent machine with Oath in it. I can go down to 24 creatures which lets me make more room for the Retreat + Knight combo, running an effective amount of removal, and a one of Arlinn and Elspeth for grinding or sick flying/trample beats.
Also, my 4 color oath build took down my fnm last night, 5-0-0. Oath definitely improved the consistency of my mana, and was solid late game for digging for more action as well. Arlinn put in work when she landed, though I wasn't really ever in a position last night where I drew her against a grindy matchup, but against matchups where the opponent needed to die as quickly as possible she pressed my board advantage forward very well.
Has anyone done any testing with Traverse the Ulvenwald? I suspect that delirium will be difficult for us to reliably achieve without warping our foundations somehow, but it has a Green Sun's Zenithisque effect, one green mana, fetch what you want, and even manages to fix our mana in 4 color builds early on. Something to consider I guess.
I'll give that a try. Maybe if I just overload a full 4 in the side board I'll have a chance.
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Knight of the Reliquary
2 Geist of Saint Traft
1 Eternal Witness
1 Voice of Resurgence
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Spellskite
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Path to Exile
Enchantments 6
3 Retreat to Coralhelm
3 Oath of Nissa
Sorcery 8
4 Serum Visions
4 Traverse the Ulvenwald
Planeswalkers 2
2 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
Lands 21
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Windswept Heath
3 Flooded Strand
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Temple Garden
1 Stirring Wildwood
1 Breeding Pool
1 Gavony Township
1 Ghost Quarter
2 Forest
1 Plains
1 Island
Pretty sloppy first draft but that's the idea anyway.
I think there's a toolboxy list pretty far from a traditional zoo list hiding somewhere in this thought line. Some kind of hatey bant list that can win with the Knight + Retreat combo but isn't married to it. Idk, I haven't had the time due to finals to really brew anything creative, but I will be looking into it soon. The card has the potential to free us from the deck building constraints of coco and the more shotgun blast style of a coco creature deck. Maybe oath, traverse, serum visions, in some amounts, paths which we'll actually have room for due to no coco. In the right deck it's similar to green sun zenith, minus the sweet turn one dryad arbor interaction.
From my experience it's pretty much impossible to get Traverse running consistently in a zoo list without some significant warping of the main game plan, probably to the detriment of the deck as a whole. Man I wish delirium was three card types rather than four, we would probably be turning it easily enough as we often have land creature instant in the grave.
Brewing with Thing in the Ice in Grixis colors, tell me what you guys think.
Care to share your list? I'd be interested in knowing what other people are doing with titi.
I could see an additional spell snare. The card's stock definitely went up with the bannings and unbannings.
Thing in the Ice is a card that gets killed a lot in this list, but that's fine considering it usually means they have to spend some amount of time or effort getting it off of the board, which is great for us as it gives us another turn or an additional land (in the case of path to exile) to work with later, and is a resource not spent on developing a board position we might not be able to deal with. I'm really in love with the card. Also gives us main board game against some aggro decks, by bouncing all their dudes back to hand. For whatever reason a lot of people on this board aren't too hot on it and would rather ship the old lists that historically haven't done super well but plus AV and/or Thopter Sword. That's a safe option in my eyes and there's probably some wisdom to upgrading the old lists people know well, but I've always been a brewer at heart who tries to innovate even if it goes down an unproven path. I just can't get over the fact that when thing flips, I always win the game, and that when thing doesn't flip, hell, I'm still usually winning the game. Thing isn't a card that can be your sole wincon but he is an absurdly powerful card that demands that my opponents play around him. He only ever comes out against GBx, where the sheer amount of viable removal against him makes him unlikely to impact the game, in which case I'd rather side into a grindy low creature control deck that naturally blanks their removal spells. So yeah, he has his weaknesses but well worth the inclusion in my eyes.
What does everyone think about this list? Sort of experimenting with Oath in 4-color zoo at the moment.