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  • posted a message on Burn
    Quote from patbou_clone »

    I played a variant of Burn yesterday, with 4 Seeker of the Way, 4 Soulfire Grand Master, 2 Exquisite Firecraft, 2 Anger of the Gods and 3 Deflecting Palm in the main deck, instead of Goblin Guide, Eidolon, Skewer the Critics and some Rift Bolt. I thought these cards would help in the current metagame, heavy with Dredge, Phoenix and UW Control. The deck is obviously slower, but the big life cushion is pseudo card advantage (as is, a lot more turns to top deck the final burn spell).


    I don't think that many of those cards are good at all in Burn. Seeker and Soulfire are way too slow for a Burn deck, and you're going to just get wrecked by damage from fast decks before those cards make an impact at all. I've played board wipes in the side before and never really liked them. I love and hate Deflecting Palm because I've busted someone with an Emrakul with it and I've had it sit dead in my hand while my opponent stabilized and I could have just won with a real burn spell instead of that reactive card. I think it's a significant mistake to take out Guide, Eidolon, Skewer, and Rift for those cards. You're losing your speed (Guide), oppression (Eidolon), and key pieces of the Burn strategy and replacing them with slow cards that don't do enough to justify their slowness.

    UW Control should be kind of straight forward, I think. It comes down to knowing how to play around their counters by bottlenecking their mana.

    I won 2-1 vs CoCo Vizier and Discard Combo, but lost 0-2 vs UW Spirit. This deck bugs me a lot, and there seems to be no way out of it. Between Mausoleum Wanderer, Rattlechains, Drogskol Captain, Selfless Spirit and Spell Queller, it’s pretty hard to interact with the board. Simply ignoring it and going to the face seems the best option. But even then, Wanderer and Queller can counter my spells (and Exquisite Firecraft isn’t even a safe bet against Queller, because it exiles), and it’s super hard to burn Queller and get the spell back.

    Is there any tricks in how to play or sequence the spells? Or special cards that would do the job from the SB?


    They'll gum up the board, so you should unload creatures as fast as you can and get damage out of them before they're irrelevant. Eidolon should do a lot of work in games where they aren't dumping their hand with Vial. However, you're going to have trouble with aggressive decks that are as disruptive as they can be. I think it's just going to be a race. The same "bottleneck mana" strategy should buy you something in this matchup, too. Blaze and Blood should do a good job, too.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Burn
    Quote from hellohero »
    Thoughts on Jared Day's list from last weekends Star City Games Invitational Qualifier.

    What's interesting to me are the zero fetches to, I assume, helps preserve his life total. The major thing I noticed with this list was the cut of Goblin Guides down to 2 to make room for a single lavamancer and shard. Personally I don't think I'd cut guides but I do like the manabase and would properly do something like 4 sunbaked, 3 vantage.


    That's going to feel really bad when an opener has Mountain Mountain Charm Charm. It also makes the Firewalker in the side very hard to cast in time. I also strongly think cutting any Guides is wrong until a better "R: 2/2 Haste" gets printed.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Burn
    R3: vs Grixis Urza (L2-1)
    I don't know anything about the deck. I haven't played modern in two months. It showed. Let's move on

    Me too, man. I've finally got the local Modern night open and I can play some Modern more often. Congrats on the finish. I've also only gotten to play with 2 Canyons, but I have 4 ready for the next time. I'm still on 19 lands though.

    In other news, I've been working on updating the matchup section of the primer. My intention is try to go in depth on important ones like the Humans re-write a bit ago. I think I'll also add a "retired" section to dump less relevant older ones, or perhaps move several up to a "tier matchup" section (let's say the top 10 on goldfish or something). It's coming along, though.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Burn
    Farewell Bridge from Below. That likely means you don't have to have an obscene anti-graveyard sideboard anymore.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Burn
    Updating everything is on the list of things to do. I'll get around to it soon. There's only so much time in the day.

    I'll start updating a handful per day after the holiday weekend. That should mean it's finished within a few weeks. I'll keep it at it is now, though, with a list of playables rather than a 15 card sideboard guide.

    Hogaak probably has a slightly lowered meta presence because people don't want to sink money into something that everyone assumes is going to get banned.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Burn
    Update on the scraper: it seems to be crashing less frequently, and I'm saving copies of the data more frequently so that I can kill the script and restart it where it left off before. I'll be able to make the usual post at the beginning of the month.

    Also, I finally got to play some Modern this past week on the local Modern night. Went 3-0-1, beating humans, tron, and merfolk. I only had 2 Canyons at the time, but I've got 2 more now and I'll be playing with 4 going forward. My manabase for now is 3 mountain, 2 foundry, 4 canyon, 2 vantage, 8 fetches.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Burn
    If the game doesn't go long, you're more likely to see it in your opener than a later draw. If in situations where you're going to steamroll someone with it (say the mirror), it's worth the risk. Another deck that relies on targeting you or your permanents is going to be worth it as well.

    I have been having a hell of a time updating my deck database from mtggoldfish, and I don't know what the problem is. Sometimes, it grabs 3 decks then freezes trying to connect. Sometimes it lasts much longer. It's freezing on an ssl handshake, but it seems that bypassing ssl doesn't help. I'm not sure if I'll be able to continue doing the hate updates (I know I missed the last one, apologies). I don't know if they put in some functionality on their end to stifle scrapers or what. It's possible that I could just rely on mtgtop8 instead, though. There's significant overlap between them.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Burn
    That's likely too dangerous on their end. They should mill themselves to make the zombies and they can likely just wait for the attack step. If they target you with the Leyline in play, they run the risk of getting low enough that you can kill them at instant speed.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Burn
    You're acting as if people have said it's a guaranteed 4-of in every sideboard. All I've said is that it's going to get added the my extended sideboard binder for now. It can join the Deflecting Palm that I don't generally play, the Kor Firewalker that I don't generally play, the Volcanic Fallout/Anger of the Gods that I don't generally play. Surely you've got a pile of potential sideboard cards that aren't part of your 15?

    8rack isn't a problem for Burn, but it certainly flattens that deck in situations where you might find yourself running into it often (perhaps locally). Against Storm (which I also don't think we need help against), it's a must-answer effect that comes down on T0 and can't get remanded. It similarly flattens the mirror, but it does it painlessly where Kor Firewalker doesn't. Kor Firewalker is far more narrow than the Leyline is.

    I don't think it's actually necessary for the Leyline to flip matchups around to be worthwhile. I think it's worthwhile even in situations where it's just a 0 mana Shock, and there are matchups where it's going to either trigger repeatedly or make the opponent stumble.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Burn
    I would also argue that you're somewhat already familiar with sideboard cards that only do something if they're in your opener. Sure, you can topdeck a Rest in Peace by T2 and it's fine, but if you don't see it in your opener, you're not likely to see it this game. In that sense, it's either in your opener and "does something" or it's not in your opener and it "does nothing".

    This Leyline is bad on T4 because you're generally well beyond it's effective period. You'd never want to pay mana for this effect. You want it on T0 when you get Inquisitioned or your Guide gets Bolted. I'd never cast a topdecked one unless I had nothing else to do.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Burn
    It's better than the Deflecting Palm that they can counter 4 times with Pact of Negation and you just drop it on turn 0 and play your game plan otherwise (mana denial against them). Actually, now that I think about it, Angels Grace/Unlife just saves them and they ignore the Leyline.

    This is viable because it's playable for 0. It's straight unplayable at 4 mana. It's far better than Kor Firewalker in the mirror, and it is not remotely as narrow. It wrecks 8rack. It might even be playable against a control deck to turn their removal into shocks. It turns all of BGx interaction into shocks.

    No one is suggesting it's a main deck card, just sideboard. On it's face, it appears broadly relevant.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Burn
    It's also a legitimate way to beat Ad Nauseam, and we didn't really have one before.

    It might be solid enough against Hogaak. They could just mill themselves enough to make a big enough zombie army to win in t4, though.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Burn
    It will definitely deal 2 to Ballista's controller for every counter they remove, and the stack would look like: ballista ping -> leyline shock -> ballista ping -> leyline shock, with the Leyline shocks resolving before the corresponding ballista ping.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Burn
    The new Leyline looks like it's a better alternative to Kor Firewalker in the mirror for when Burn mirrors get big. Incidentally, it's an uncounterable hate card against Storm and they're forced to bounce it and can't Remand it. It also can beat Lantern-style mill decks. As Tyler said, it can go in the extended sideboard part of the binder and wait until it's needed.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Burn
    I think the answer is going to be 4. I'll probably stick to 8 fetches and cut 2 Vantage and 2 fetches to open up the spots. I'm going to wait on the price to calm down before buying foils though.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
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