I haven't been able to look through the entire M20 spoiler, though there seem to be few goodies. I'm sure some gems are sneaking around, but I haven't seen anything immediately.
Until then, some small updates are here in the form of Modern Horizon cards! I was able to get my hands on both the 'Splice into...' spells, which I am eager to test out. Everdream should be amazing, though Splicer's Skill may prove more conditional. The others are either givens, or tests. I'm unsure if Dragon Hatchling is too much, but he seems fragile enough to be balanced, if strong.
Hopefully I can get a play of the stack in soon to see some of these in action!
Phew, what a fun spoiler season! Core Set 20 is in full swing, but I'm a set behind. Modern Horizons was quite a gift for modern and traditional cube, but for Type 4, is was slim pickings. Turns out under-costed and efficient cards aren't what we care about in limited infinity land. Still, on with the discussion - I'm ignoring those cards that are too weak and too strong (Fireballs etc.), and focusing on those that are more interesting:
Astral Drift - This is more specific to my interests, but cycling is an interesting feature when playing with a shared library. Instant speed, uncounterable draw that doesn't use your spell for the turn is nifty, especially when paired with niche effects. I had a suite of about 40 cycling cards when I first started the stack, which was slowly sided out as I acquired more cards. A card that can reward that draw is interested, but ultimately too narrow for drafting, and untenable in communal stack.
Splicer's Skill/Everdream - What an interesting and deceptively powerful design! Everdream was the first spell that caught my eye in the spoiler, as adding a(n additional) cantrip to every single instant and sorcery you play is damned powerful. The comparison to Whispers of the Muse is obvious, though this might be even better (and together, they seem absolutely insane). Slicer's Skill didn't set off my alarm in the same way, but making a continual stream of 3/3 tokens seems like a substantial enough threat. I love the spells matter archetype in draft, and these are synergistic payoff cards that you can cast as a last resort.
Archmage's Charm - I've been waiting for a hard counter with cycling for years, and while this isn't quite that, it comes close. Having the mixture of either a counter or a divination is a fantastically flexible combination, and something that deserves a space in a stack. No, the last ability isn't playable.
Echo of Eons/Rain of Revelation - You can tell a lot about a type 4 stack just by looking at its card draw. Recently, the other stacks I follow have been reevaluating the power of their card draw suite, a process that I'm also considering and plan on posting about soon. Limiting the number of total number of cards drawn to 3 or 4 without drawback seems to settle as the standard, which makes these two cards fall on either side of the spectrum. Rain of Revelation is fine, but fine is what many stacks are looking for. Draw two with slight selection isn't amazing (think Thoughtflare), but perfectly serviceable for larger stacks. Echo of Eons is far on the other side, living with the wheels in the strongest of stacks. Draw sevens are wary for me, allowing your opponents to get first crack at their new hands with a symmetrical effect. The flashback is super powerful, too much so for my stack I believe, but if you support wheels (and five minute shuffling sessions) this is a huge pick up.
Spell Snuff - Hard counters with upside are always in consideration, though a sometimes Dismiss is likely not good enough. Strictly better cancel for what it's worth.
Endling - The cycle of X-lings are all sweet, and this new edition is no exception. Where Endling fails is in it's ability to protect itself. Undying is sweet, but a one-time protection of a medium-small body is subpar compared to the flicker and shroud of Aetherling/Morphling and the indestructibility on Thornling.
Mind Rake - What a cool card! This set is like Time Spiral revisited, and I adored Time Spiral. A pseudo-Delirium Skeins with a targeted mode is interesting, though it's main draw is its cost, something that doesn't mater here. Ultimately too underpowered.
Aria of Flame - Is this good? It may be too slow, especially as it is 'target opponent' as opposed to 'each opponent'. If Baneful Omen and company are too strong for your control deck finishers, this may be a solid solution.
Urza's Rage - Reprint, but a reminder that I still don't have this in my stack. A staple burn spell.
Force of Vigor - The 'force of..' function of the spell doesn't matter much without stack errata, but having a functional spell that can remove one and/or two enchantments and/or artifacts is valuable. I believe the only other spell that can do so is Sylvan Reclamation, though some stacks may want two copies.
Hexdrinker - Mini-Progenitus! Hexdrinker's largest form is arguable good for the stack, it's medium form underpowered, and natural state unplayable. The leveling up mechanic makes it weaker, but more interesting in play. Creatures that require a resolved ability to be good - Nicol Bolas, the Ravager, for example - make for interesting turn interactions, though I'm not sure if Hexdrinker is strong enough. If I open one, I'll try it.
Fallen Shinobi - A card that would shine with stack errata, Fallen Shinobi may still be playable as a way of resetting an ETB creature, getting in some damage, and expanding your hand temporarily. Ultimately, it may be too many hoops to jump through for a minor ability.
Kaya's Guile - I live for these kind of cards - four minor abilities, but taken together at instant speed which may make it playable. It's close to a filler card, but each ability can shine in it's own way, with the Innocent Blood and Bojuka Bog effects being the strongest. If I can find space or another filler card, this is coming in. Play the cards you want to see in the world.
Lesser Masticore - Weirdly enough, Lesser Masticore looks better than OG Masticore. Trading slightly worse protection and a worse body for a one time card investment, you get the same creature killing benefits, which may be a net positive. They are close enough to be interchangeable even if I prefer the new version, and you can do worse than these for a creature based sweeper.
A few weeks into version one of the stack, and we already have a large change. I've been aggressively trading for the cheaper format staples and topped it off with a quick card order. In all, there are 47 card changes and quite a bit of explaining to do. This should be the last of the large changes, as the frequency of effects - wraths, counters, threats, etc. - feels right. At some point I may go up to 450 cards (or even more, depending on how many people get into this format), but I'm happy with 400 at the moment. Now, on to the explanations.
There is no worse feeling than having a counterspell that cannot deal with the threat of the moment. A more narrow counter need to have a hearty upside, and though I like counters that replace themselves, the incoming additions are superior. Countersquall is a bit of a cheat, as its effect is relatively minor for its limitation. Still, removal is for creatures and counters are for spells, so it's got a small pass there, even as I keep an eye on its failure rate.
Many of the replacements are upgrades - better manticores (though the original still eludes me), better card draw, more protection - and some I am quite interested to test out. Akroma, Angel of Fury is a sneaky one-hit-KO that may prove too powerful. Infinite power is the turning point for many stacks, which throws the aggro-contol-combo dynamic into overdrive, though a single creature may just up the stakes rather than destroy them while also enhancing the morph mini game. Price of Knowledge expands the suite of control oriented enchantments that will kill the table if left unchecked, and I'm hoping to expand on the build-around permanents. Not combos as such, but game changers - things like Mirari or Where Ancients Tread. If you have suggestions for more, let me know.
Some of the removed cards may return. Beast Within will probably come back to replace an underperforming removal spell, as a 3/3 toke is inconsequential. Demonlord Belzenlok is a pet card of sorts, and such an event to cast - players don't know whether to counter it, and the sweat that develops as plays draw more and more and lose more and more is exciting, though it usually ends between after 2 to 4 cards. I've seen Aven Fateshaper in multiple stacks as a fun and slightly combo-riffic effect, though it durdles too much for me. It may return if my group enjoys drafting more than a communal stack, but the combo with Magus of the Future has come up several times to people's dismay. Insurrection has been in and out since the inception of the stack as being potentially too powerful. As I acquire more powerful cards, it will likely return.
I still need to finish the philosophy portion of the first post, as I am interested in managing the aggro-control-combo side of the stack effectively. Though that might be more important for a drafted stack, I feel as if a communal stack can also provide each experience depending on how you want to play and your opening hand. Similarly, I am still finessing the power level line with powerful, non-infinite effects and leveraging their answers. Any advice is always welcome.
After a few months of throwing cards in a pile and battling them with friends, I've finally hit a point where I'm comfortable sharing the list for my Type 4 Communal Stack. The list is constantly undergoing edits and changes, so any advice, comments, or suggestions are welcome.
Not sure what Type 4 is, or if it's for you? Wizards posted an article here that does a great job showcasing both the format's rules and it's crazy insanity.
Standard Rules Infinite Mana
You are considered to have infinite mana of all colors and types (including snow) at all times. One of thiamin draws of this format is that you can play those cards that are considered unplayable anywhere else, from the jankiest of Fallen Empire commons, to overcosted Standard mythics.
One Spell Per Turn
Each player can only cast one spell per turn. This limits some of the explosiveness of having infinite mana, but also makes a playable format. In fact, the trick of playing Type 4 is finding when to use your spell for turn and finding ways to exploit the rule. Plays that do not require casting a spell - such as playing a land, cycling a card, or using activated abilities - are highly prized.
House Rules No Errata
Some stacks will allow spells that are cast with alternate costs - such as morphs, overloaded spells, etc - as exceptions to the 'one spell per turn' rule. In an effort to keep the stack friendly for folks new to the format, no such rules apply here. You cast a spell, you cast a spell.
Communal Stack
All players draw from the same library, the entire stack. If cards would be put on the bottom or shuffled in, remove them from the game. All other zones - graveyard, hands, etc. - are considered separate.
Hand Size
Players start with 5 cards in their hand, and max hand size is 7 cards.
Handling Infinity
If two spells are infinitely used to top or stop one another, the defender wins and the instigator loses.
Big props to the random gentleman who first introduced me to Type 4 back in 2007, when I was first getting serious about Magic. The itch for crazy plays and even crazier situations was never really satisfied in any other format.
Both Tev's and Kirblinx's stacks have provided a huge inspiration for this stack and my philosophy in building, as well as catching me up on the past ten years of Type 4 goodies. While Tev's stack has unfortunately not been updated in several years, Kirblinx continues to update his CubeTutor information.
I'm thinking of shrinking my cube to an 8 person cube. I almost never get 12 people, so the question is whether the larger card pool is more of a risk to making it imbalanced than the benefit it gives to not seeing the same cards all the time.
I have a cube for 8 people max, and the a diverse commander choice really helps with seeing the same cards. It's fun seeing the same cards being used in different ways for different deck strategies.
Are you gonna post your cube changes? I'd love to see where you end up.
Alright, you've convinced me (though that may be love of Wurmcoil Engine talking) - my cube's up for a big update with the new commander decks coming out, and a BW bleeder package will be coming in. I do love these quirky takes on aggro, whether token pinging or draining opponent's lives away. It's a fun take on the old formula.
Thinking more about it, I also wouldn't dismiss a BW bleeder/lifegain strategy, either. Vizkopa Guildmage is that good.
Huh, I hadn't thought about that. I wonder if that could feed into a more aggressive bleeder strategy. Is the guildmage really that good? It seems like it would take quite a bit of mana just to start the bleeding. I may have enough incidental lifegain in the cube to support it without pouring resources into the guildmage. This might be my inexperience with the card talking though.
I'm going to be revamping and updating my cube when commander 2018 releases, so expect a lot more questions from me in the coming month or so!
Can I get some recommendations on supporting aggro in a multiplayer, commander cube?
I've been working on revamping the cube in general, but midrange and control continue dominate. I know the format gears itself towards longer games anyways, but have you all had any success with supporting other, more aggressive strategies?
I'd agree - it's an eternal struggle to get aggressive kill strategies working in Multiplayer Cube.
If I were to recommend going down any route ATM, I'd probably advocate BR token strategies, along with damage on creatures entering and/or leaving the battlefield. That means Purphoros, God of the Forge, Impact Tremors, Zulaport Cutthroat, Blood Artist, a few others.. along with all the token production (e.g. Pia and Kiran Nalaar, anything that makes a million goblin tokens (e.g. Siege-Gang Commander), anything that makes a million zombie tokens (e.g. Cryptbreaker, Ghoulcaller Gisa)).
I've seen that work pretty well in normal Multiplayer - it can clean out an entire table pretty quickly. I just have no idea who the commander would be. I guess you'd probably lean towards Lyzolda, the Blood Witch, Tymaret, the Murder King or Vial Smasher the Fierce.
Thanks for the feedback! Token seems like a great bet, as does any strategy that doesn't have to focus on a single opponent. I have a feeling aggro will center around BR and RW, though RW centers more about equipment for its own tokens. Vial Smasher the Fierce seems the best for this kind of thing, though tokens feed well into the sacrifice theme, and I know others who have had success with Olivia, Mobilized for War.
Can I get some recommendations on supporting aggro in a multiplayer, commander cube?
I've been working on revamping the cube in general, but midrange and control continue dominate. I know the format gears itself towards longer games anyways, but have you all had any success with supporting other, more aggressive strategies?
Dominaria has me super excited, though I don't know that many cards will be coming into the cube. So many cards are more interesting than exciting - the art's great, and the flavor is off the charts. I'm looking forward to pre-releasing the set and potentially drafting.
What's Exciting: Lyra Dawnbringer - I don't have a Baneslayer Angel, but if I did, it would be an easy swap. Everyone loves angels, and Lyra's a great one. Multani, Yavimaya's Avatar - Big green beaters with landfall potential make me and Omnath excited. Blackblade Reforged - Maybe it's too expensive to equip, but it's a huge boost on a cheap to cast equipment, and the more flavor the better. Karn, Scion of Urza - Karn's a card advantage engine and artifact support that doesn't require too much set up. Might replace Coercive Portal, but voting is a lot of fun. Muldrotha, the Gravetide - I love graveyards, Muldrotha loves graveyards. Now the hard part is to find the switch.
What's Possible: Demonlord Belzenlok - Painful black card draw on a body is nice, and the guarantee of business spells is promising. It might be too generic, however. Josu Vess, Lich Knight - That kicker is sweet and super fun, but the normal body is just so...boring. Wish I had an interest in knight tribal. Jaya Ballard - Triple red is tough to swallow, but her ultimate is great and rummaging ability is a nice alternative to her first ability. Squee, the Immortal - Is a cube without a Squee really worth it? A nice recursive option to have, though it might not have enough payoff. Teferi, Hero of Dominaria - Definitely a powerful card, but it might be too generic for a multicolored card, especially competing with Venser, the Sojourner. Grand Warlord Radha - A dedicated ramp general that feeds off creatures, so maybe it will work better than Wort, the Raidmother? Shalai, Voice of Plenty - Not sure if she is worth it, as hexproof is annoying to play with, but the counter ability is exciting. Jhoira, Weatherlight Captain - Very cool psudo-artifact general that looks amazing, but might be too bland. Still, Izzet artifact commander!
It's true, there's little outside of those that I really want. A couple cards interest me - Vraska, Relic Seeker is sort of interesting, and I picked up a Thaumatic Compass which might prove too slow - but pirates and dinosaurs haven't exactly taken over.
Speaking of tribes, has anyone tried out tribal themes in their cubes? After the Commander 2017 decks left me with a bunch of powerful tribal nonsense, I've been wanting to try them out. Past attempts have been a weak, but I want to know if you all have had success.
Hi guys, I've been looking at Ixilan and was wondering about some cards.
Treasure Map: I like it as a source of cheap colorless card advantage/filtering to help white and red decks. It's pretty slow though.
Dowsing Dagger: In a 4 player FFA match, shipping the 2 dudes to someone and finding an opening doesn't seem too tough to accomplish. They payoff is there, but is it worth the effort?
Thoughts?
I like Dowsing Dagger far more than Treasure Map, which is too slow for me to get excited about. The dagger is easy enough to flip while providing a big boost especially when you can flip it early. It might not be as consistent as I'd like, but it's exciting enough to test.
I was thinking about trying out Monarch in a 4 player FFA cube (seems like a fun mechanic to promote attacking) and found Skyline Despot.
I really like having a source of draw in red and think this guy has potential.
Have any of you tried him out (or Monarch for that matter).
Thanks!
Yes. And yes.
Monarch is incredible fun. Really speeds the games up.
And Skyline Despot is a house. My group actually drafted a CNS2 box, and Despot was my buddy for the night. Won me a lot of games.
I've also got Queen Marchesa, Keeper of Keys, Custodi Lich, Regal Behemoth and Throne of the High City in my conspiracy section, but Despot is the one I've seen do the most work so far.
Agreed on all counts - Monarch is a fun mechanic that encourages a bit more aggression, which is something that has influenced some of my recent design choices. Skyline Despot is especially good, not only because it can protect you if you become the monarch, but it elevates the Monarch sub game into a cool thematic archenemy battle, with one side amassing dragons and lording over the rest of the table.
CB, was it you who had suggested starting the game with the Monarch token in the middle of the game for first blood? It's something I want to try soon and see how it plays.
I rarely see Woodfall Primus brought up with the other non-creature removal - is there a reason you're not running it, CB? It not as efficient as the Sage or Slime, or as versatile as Beast Within, but it's always been fine ramp target that can take out troubling permanents for me.
That overwhelming feeling of starting never really goes away, at least not for me. Whenever I sit down to start a new deck, the amount of options means I don't get anything done for about 15 minutes.
Don't forget, EDH decks are never static. I find it's better to just throw in cards you want to play with, even if you're unsure of how they'll work or if they're 'optimal'. The experience of testing and playing is one of the most rewarding parts of EDH, and if you keep a mental (or physical) list of the testing cards, you'll know what to look for when you play.
As for you deck, the whole Blood Artist, Reveillark, Karmic Guide combo/style of play works quite well with smaller creatures and recursion. I'm building a similar style deck with Alesha, and all three of those cards work wonders on their own.
Until then, some small updates are here in the form of Modern Horizon cards! I was able to get my hands on both the 'Splice into...' spells, which I am eager to test out. Everdream should be amazing, though Splicer's Skill may prove more conditional. The others are either givens, or tests. I'm unsure if Dragon Hatchling is too much, but he seems fragile enough to be balanced, if strong.
Hopefully I can get a play of the stack in soon to see some of these in action!
Splicer's Skill/Everdream - What an interesting and deceptively powerful design! Everdream was the first spell that caught my eye in the spoiler, as adding a(n additional) cantrip to every single instant and sorcery you play is damned powerful. The comparison to Whispers of the Muse is obvious, though this might be even better (and together, they seem absolutely insane). Slicer's Skill didn't set off my alarm in the same way, but making a continual stream of 3/3 tokens seems like a substantial enough threat. I love the spells matter archetype in draft, and these are synergistic payoff cards that you can cast as a last resort.
Winds of Abandon - I generally avoid purposeless shuffles - Path to Exile, etc - and Winds of Abandon is the mother of all of them. Sadly, it's shunted by its sorcery speed.
Archmage's Charm - I've been waiting for a hard counter with cycling for years, and while this isn't quite that, it comes close. Having the mixture of either a counter or a divination is a fantastically flexible combination, and something that deserves a space in a stack. No, the last ability isn't playable.
Echo of Eons/Rain of Revelation - You can tell a lot about a type 4 stack just by looking at its card draw. Recently, the other stacks I follow have been reevaluating the power of their card draw suite, a process that I'm also considering and plan on posting about soon. Limiting the number of total number of cards drawn to 3 or 4 without drawback seems to settle as the standard, which makes these two cards fall on either side of the spectrum. Rain of Revelation is fine, but fine is what many stacks are looking for. Draw two with slight selection isn't amazing (think Thoughtflare), but perfectly serviceable for larger stacks. Echo of Eons is far on the other side, living with the wheels in the strongest of stacks. Draw sevens are wary for me, allowing your opponents to get first crack at their new hands with a symmetrical effect. The flashback is super powerful, too much so for my stack I believe, but if you support wheels (and five minute shuffling sessions) this is a huge pick up.
Spell Snuff - Hard counters with upside are always in consideration, though a sometimes Dismiss is likely not good enough. Strictly better cancel for what it's worth.
Endling - The cycle of X-lings are all sweet, and this new edition is no exception. Where Endling fails is in it's ability to protect itself. Undying is sweet, but a one-time protection of a medium-small body is subpar compared to the flicker and shroud of Aetherling/Morphling and the indestructibility on Thornling.
Mind Rake - What a cool card! This set is like Time Spiral revisited, and I adored Time Spiral. A pseudo-Delirium Skeins with a targeted mode is interesting, though it's main draw is its cost, something that doesn't mater here. Ultimately too underpowered.
Aria of Flame - Is this good? It may be too slow, especially as it is 'target opponent' as opposed to 'each opponent'. If Baneful Omen and company are too strong for your control deck finishers, this may be a solid solution.
Urza's Rage - Reprint, but a reminder that I still don't have this in my stack. A staple burn spell.
Throes of Chaos - No, this isn't good, but what a design!
Force of Vigor - The 'force of..' function of the spell doesn't matter much without stack errata, but having a functional spell that can remove one and/or two enchantments and/or artifacts is valuable. I believe the only other spell that can do so is Sylvan Reclamation, though some stacks may want two copies.
Hexdrinker - Mini-Progenitus! Hexdrinker's largest form is arguable good for the stack, it's medium form underpowered, and natural state unplayable. The leveling up mechanic makes it weaker, but more interesting in play. Creatures that require a resolved ability to be good - Nicol Bolas, the Ravager, for example - make for interesting turn interactions, though I'm not sure if Hexdrinker is strong enough. If I open one, I'll try it.
Fallen Shinobi - A card that would shine with stack errata, Fallen Shinobi may still be playable as a way of resetting an ETB creature, getting in some damage, and expanding your hand temporarily. Ultimately, it may be too many hoops to jump through for a minor ability.
Kaya's Guile - I live for these kind of cards - four minor abilities, but taken together at instant speed which may make it playable. It's close to a filler card, but each ability can shine in it's own way, with the Innocent Blood and Bojuka Bog effects being the strongest. If I can find space or another filler card, this is coming in. Play the cards you want to see in the world.
Lightning Skelemental - Another card with several hoops and drawbacks, Lightning Skelemental is closer to a conditional, mega-Blightning than a creature. A hard hitting burn spell that packs a real punch.
Lesser Masticore - Weirdly enough, Lesser Masticore looks better than OG Masticore. Trading slightly worse protection and a worse body for a one time card investment, you get the same creature killing benefits, which may be a net positive. They are close enough to be interchangeable even if I prefer the new version, and you can do worse than these for a creature based sweeper.
Scatter to the Winds > Draining Whelk
Lay Bare > Voidmage Prodigy
Devious Cover-Up > Dismal Failure
Bone to Ash > Punish Ignorance
Scatter Arc > Countersquall
Exclude > Undermine
Disdainful Stroke > Void Shatter
Ethersworn Adjudicator > Plaguebearer
Tidespout Tyrant > Harbinger of the Hunt
Thousand Winds > Hythonia the Cruel
Beast Within > Kalemne's Captain
Butcher of Malakir > Jiwari, the Earth Aflame
Capsize > Arashi, the Sky Asunder
Overwhelming Splendor > Capital Punishment
Custodi Lich > Cruel Ultimatum
Soulscour > Bearer of the Heavens
Gaze of Granite > Sudden Death
Angrath's Marauders > Fight with Fire
Baneslayer Angel > Magmatic Force
Lyra Dawnbringer > Colossus of Akros
Anya, Merciless Angel > Akroma, Angel of Fury
Ethereal Absolution > Price of Knowledge
Vitu-Ghazi, the City-Tree > Crush of Wurms
Charnelhoard Wurm > Throne of the High City
Demonlord Belzenlok > Baleful Force
Shorecrasher Elemental > Tower of Fortunes
Aven Fateshaper > Aeon Chronicler
Skeletal Scrying > Promise of Power
Magus of the Future > Beck // Call
Viscera Dragger > Etched Oracle
Careful Consideration > Heartwarming Redemption
Oketra's Attendant > Sphinx of Lost Truths
Heroic Intervention > Ghost-Lit Stalker
Honored Hydra > Root Elemental
Spiritmonger > Cloudthresher
Cauldron Dance > Restoration Angel
Ethereal Ambush > Miraculous Recovery
Puppeteer Clique > Gravewaker
Den Protector > Grim Harvest
Reviving Vapors > Beacon of Immortality
Insurrection > Granny's Payback
Haazda Shield Mate > Combat Medic
Thalia, Heretic Cathar > Avacyn, Guardian Angel
Consecrate // Consume > Vengeful Archon
Teysa, Envoy of Ghosts > Empyrial Archangel
Seeds of Renewal > Blazing Archon
Linvala, the Preserver > Sunscorch Regent
There is no worse feeling than having a counterspell that cannot deal with the threat of the moment. A more narrow counter need to have a hearty upside, and though I like counters that replace themselves, the incoming additions are superior. Countersquall is a bit of a cheat, as its effect is relatively minor for its limitation. Still, removal is for creatures and counters are for spells, so it's got a small pass there, even as I keep an eye on its failure rate.
Many of the replacements are upgrades - better manticores (though the original still eludes me), better card draw, more protection - and some I am quite interested to test out. Akroma, Angel of Fury is a sneaky one-hit-KO that may prove too powerful. Infinite power is the turning point for many stacks, which throws the aggro-contol-combo dynamic into overdrive, though a single creature may just up the stakes rather than destroy them while also enhancing the morph mini game. Price of Knowledge expands the suite of control oriented enchantments that will kill the table if left unchecked, and I'm hoping to expand on the build-around permanents. Not combos as such, but game changers - things like Mirari or Where Ancients Tread. If you have suggestions for more, let me know.
Some of the removed cards may return. Beast Within will probably come back to replace an underperforming removal spell, as a 3/3 toke is inconsequential. Demonlord Belzenlok is a pet card of sorts, and such an event to cast - players don't know whether to counter it, and the sweat that develops as plays draw more and more and lose more and more is exciting, though it usually ends between after 2 to 4 cards. I've seen Aven Fateshaper in multiple stacks as a fun and slightly combo-riffic effect, though it durdles too much for me. It may return if my group enjoys drafting more than a communal stack, but the combo with Magus of the Future has come up several times to people's dismay. Insurrection has been in and out since the inception of the stack as being potentially too powerful. As I acquire more powerful cards, it will likely return.
I still need to finish the philosophy portion of the first post, as I am interested in managing the aggro-control-combo side of the stack effectively. Though that might be more important for a drafted stack, I feel as if a communal stack can also provide each experience depending on how you want to play and your opening hand. Similarly, I am still finessing the power level line with powerful, non-infinite effects and leveraging their answers. Any advice is always welcome.
Not sure what Type 4 is, or if it's for you? Wizards posted an article here that does a great job showcasing both the format's rules and it's crazy insanity.
Infinite Mana
You are considered to have infinite mana of all colors and types (including snow) at all times. One of thiamin draws of this format is that you can play those cards that are considered unplayable anywhere else, from the jankiest of Fallen Empire commons, to overcosted Standard mythics.
One Spell Per Turn
Each player can only cast one spell per turn. This limits some of the explosiveness of having infinite mana, but also makes a playable format. In fact, the trick of playing Type 4 is finding when to use your spell for turn and finding ways to exploit the rule. Plays that do not require casting a spell - such as playing a land, cycling a card, or using activated abilities - are highly prized.
House Rules
No Errata
Some stacks will allow spells that are cast with alternate costs - such as morphs, overloaded spells, etc - as exceptions to the 'one spell per turn' rule. In an effort to keep the stack friendly for folks new to the format, no such rules apply here. You cast a spell, you cast a spell.
Communal Stack
All players draw from the same library, the entire stack. If cards would be put on the bottom or shuffled in, remove them from the game. All other zones - graveyard, hands, etc. - are considered separate.
Hand Size
Players start with 5 cards in their hand, and max hand size is 7 cards.
Handling Infinity
If two spells are infinitely used to top or stop one another, the defender wins and the instigator loses.
1 Aethersnatch
1 Absorb
1 Archmage's Charm
1 Assert Authority
1 Commit // Memory
1 Confirm Suspicions
1 Contradict
1 Controvert
1 Counterflux
1 Countersquall
1 Cryptic Command
1 Decree of Silence
1 Desertion
1 Disallow
1 Discombobulate
1 Dismal Failure
1 Dismiss
1 Dissipate
1 Dissolve
1 Double Negative
1 Draining Whelk
1 Ertai, Wizard Adept
1 Essence Backlash
1 Faerie Trickery
1 Failed Inspection
1 Fall of the Gavel
1 Fervent Denial
1 Forbid
1 Frilled Mystic
1 Glen Elendra Archmage
1 Hinder
1 Insidious Will
1 Ionize
1 Kheru Spellsnatcher
1 Lapse of Certainty
1 Last Word
1 Lost in the Mist
1 Memory Lapse
1 Mystic Genesis
1 Mystic Snake
1 Nimble Obstructionist
1 Ojutai's Command
1 Overwhelming Denial
1 Overwhelming Intellect
1 Punish Ignorance
1 Silumgar's Command
1 Sinister Sabotage
1 Soul Manipulations
1 Spell Jack
1 Spell Crumple
1 Spite // Malice
1 Stratus Dancer
1 Summary Dismissal
1 Time Stop
1 Trickbind
1 Undermine
1 Void Shatter
1 Voidmage Apprentice
1 Voidmage Prodigy
1 Annihilate
1 Blighted Fen
1 Crackling Doom
1 Cruel Ultimatum
1 Dark Intimations
1 Dragonlord Atarka
1 Duplicant
1 Luminate Primordial
1 Noxious Gearhulk
1 Overseer of the Damned
1 Phthisis
1 Phyrexian Ingester
1 Resounding Silence
1 Second Thoughts
1 Spin into Myth
1 Sudden Death
1 Supplant Form
1 The Eldest Reborn
Repeated Creature Removal - 14
1 Consumptive Goo
1 Dark Impostor
1 Deepfire Elemental
1 Fevered Convulsions
1 Flowstone Overseer
1 Harbinger of the Hunt
1 Lesser Masticore
1 Mage-Ring Responder
1 Olivia Voldaren
1 Plaguebearer
1 Profane Procession
1 Scourge of Kher Ridges
1 Smokespew Invoker
1 The Scorpion God
Non-Creature Spot Removal - 27
1 Angel of Despair
1 Anguished Unmaking
1 Ashen Rider
1 Banishing Stroke
1 Banishment Decree
1 Blessed Light
1 Crush Contraband
1 Dismantling Blow
1 Dream Eater
1 Forsake the Worldly
1 Fractured Identity
1 Krosan Grip
1 Mortify
1 Necrotic Sliver
1 Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker
1 Putrefy
1 Resounding Wave
1 Scour from Existence
1 Terastodon
1 Totally Lost
1 Tyrant of Discord
1 Utter End
1 Unexpectedly Absent
1 Venser, Shaper Savant
1 Windgrace's Judgement
1 Woodfall Primus
1 World Breaker
1 Akroma's Vengeance
1 All Is Dust
1 Angel of the Dire Hour
1 Ashari, the Sky Asunder
1 Austere Command
1 Bane of the Living
1 Bearer of the Heavens
1 Capital Punishment
1 Curse of the Swine
1 Cyclonic Rift
1 Decree of Pain
1 Fated Retribution
1 Flowstone Slide
1 Fumigate
1 Hallowed Burial
1 Hour of Revelation
1 Hythonia the Cruel
1 In Garruk's Wake
1 Jiwari, the Earth Aflame
1 Jokulhaups
1 Kalemne's Captain
1 Kaya's Wrath
1 Magister of Worth
1 Merciless Eviction
1 Obliterate
1 Oblivion Stone
1 Pernicious Deed
1 Planar Cleansing
1 Rout
1 Silence the Believers
1 Starstorm
1 Street Spasm
1 Terminus
1 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
1 Wakening Sun's Avatar
1 Ancient Stone Idol
1 Atarka, World Render
1 Autochthon Wurm
1 Chromanticore
1 Colossus of Akros
1 Darksteel Colossus
1 Deceiver of Form
1 Desolation Twin
1 Elder Deep-Fiend
1 Figure of Destiny
1 Fleetfeather Cockatrice
1 Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
1 Hydra Omnivore
1 Impervious Greatwurm
1 Inkwell Leviathan
1 It That Betrays
1 Kalonian Behemoth
1 Krosan Cloudscraper
1 Lorthos, the Tidemaker
1 Plated Slagwurn
1 Scuttling Doom Engine
1 Shipbreaker Kraken
1 Sigarda, Host of Herons
1 Skarrg Goliath
1 Sphinx of Jwar Isle
1 Sphinx of the Final Word
1 Sphinx of the Steel Wind
1 Stonehoof Chieftain
1 Stormtide Leviathan
1 Surrak Dragonclaw
1 Transcendent Master
1 Utvara Hellkite
1 Void Winnower
1 Zetalpa, Primal Dawn
1 Army of the Damned
1 Crush of Wurms
1 Grave Titan
1 Josu Vess, Lich Knight
1 Splicer's Skill
Haste & Enablers - 16
1 Akroma, Angel of Wrath
1 Darigaaz Reincarnated
1 Decimator of the Provinces
1 Elemental Appeal
1 Emissary of Grudges
1 Gaea's Revenge
1 Hypersonic Dragon
1 Resounding Roar
1 Rhythm of the Wild
1 Samut, Voice of Dissent
1 Slayer's Stringhold
1 Temur Ascendancy
1 Thornling
1 Thraximundar
1 Warstorm Surge
1 Zurgo Helmsmasher
One-Hit KOs - 4
1 Akroma, Angel of Fury
1 Dark Depths
1 Dragon Hatchling
1 Phage the Untouchable
Burn - 22
1 Aladdin's Ring
1 Backlash
1 Baneful Omen
1 Bloodfire Colossus
1 Bogardan Hellkite
1 Bosh, Iron Golem
1 Fight with Fire
1 Grab the Reins
1 Inescapable Blaze
1 Inferno
1 Magmatic Force
1 Parallectric Feedback
1 Price of Knowledge
1 Prophetic Bolt
1 Refuse // Cooporate
1 Resounding Thunder
1 Riddle of Lightning
1 Ruric Thar, the Unbowed
1 Searing Wind
1 Siege-Gang Commander
1 Sorin's Vengeance
1 Stormbreath Dragon
1 Aeon Chronicler
1 Ancient Excavation
1 Arcanis the Omnipotent
1 Baleful Force
1 Beck // Call
1 Blighted Cataract
1 Bringer of the Blue Dawn
1 Chemister's Insight
1 Combustible Gearhulk
1 Commence the Endgame
1 Consecrated Sphinx
1 Deepfathom Skulker
1 Desolate Lighthouse
1 Dig Through Time
1 Endbringer
1 Etched Monstrosity
1 Etched Oracle
1 Everdream
1 Fact or Fiction
1 Fortune's Favor
1 Geier Reach Sanitarium
1 Heartwarming Redemption
1 Illusory Ambusher
1 Jace's Ingenuity
1 Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur
1 Mind's Eye
1 Mulldrifter
1 Mystic Confluence
1 Nezahal, Primal Tide
1 Niv-Mizzet, Parun
1 Notion Thief
1 Opportunity
1 Precognitive Perception
1 Promise of Power
1 Prying Eyes
1 Sphinx of Lost Truths
1 Sphinx of Uthuun
1 Steam Augury
1 Thoughtflare
1 Throne of the High City
1 Tidings
1 Tower of Fortunes
1 Twisted Justice
1 Urza's Blueprints
1 Whispers of the Muse
Discard - 7
1 Ana Battlemage
1 Ghost-Lit Stalker
1 Hypnox
1 Myojin of Night's Reach
1 Resounding Scream
1 Silent Specter
1 Sire of Insanity
Charms - 8
1 Bant Charm (+Removal, Counter)
1 Crosis's Charm (+Removal)
1 Dromar's Charm (+Counter)
1 Esper Charm (+Draw, Discard)
1 Kolaghan's Command (+Graveyard, Removal)
1 Rakdos Charm (+Graveyard, Removal)
1 Sultai Charm (+Removal, Draw)
1 Treva's Charm (+Removal, Draw)
1 Body Double
1 Clever Impersonator
1 Dack's Duplicate
1 Dimir Doppelganger
1 Mirage Mirror
Copy/Steal/Redirect - 22
1 Blatant Thievery
1 Chromeshell Crab
1 Clocknapper
1 Dominate
1 Dominus of Fealty
1 Dualcaster Mage
1 Emrakul, the Promised End
1 Expropriate
1 Keiga, the Tide Star
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
1 Mass Manipulation
1 Memnarch
1 Mirror March
1 Mirrorpool
1 Perplexing Chimera
1 Reverberate
1 Rite of Replication
1 Slave of Bolas
1 Swerve
1 Wild Ricochet
1 Willbender
1 Word of Seizing
Flash Enablers/Time Cheat - 14
1 Alchemist's Refuge
1 Cloudthresher
1 Leyline of Anticipation
1 Lurking Predators
1 Mayael the Anima
1 Metathran Aerostat
1 Mind's Dilation
1 Prophet of Kruphix
1 Quicksilver Amulet
1 Raff Capashen, Ship's Mage
1 Restoration Angel
1 Root Elemental
1 Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir
1 Vedalken Orrery
Graveyard - 20
1 Angel of Serenity
1 Artisan of Kozilek
1 Betrayal of Flesh
1 Chainer, Dementia Master
1 Creakwood Ghoul
1 Debtors' Knell
1 Eternal Witness
1 Fated Return
1 Garna, the Bloodflame
1 Gravewaker
1 Grim Harvest
1 Mimic Vat
1 Miraculous Recovery
1 Moldgraf Monstrosity
1 Nim Deathmantle
1 Regenesis
1 Rise of the Dark Realms
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Sedris, the Traitor King
1 Sepulchral Primordial
1 Angel of Grace
1 Archangel Avacyn
1 Avacyn, Angel of Hope
1 Azorius Guildmage
1 Blazing Archon
1 Boseiju, Who Shelters All
1 Crowd Favorites
1 Deathless Angel
1 Kytheon's Irregulars
1 Maze of Ith
1 Mystifying Maze
1 New Prahv Guildmage
1 Nullstone Gargoyle
1 Soul of New Phyrexia
1 Teferi's Protection
Lifegain/Prevention - 25
1 Avacyn, Guardian Angel
1 Beacon of Immortality
1 Captain's Maneuver
1 Celestial Force
1 Channel Harm
1 Combat Medic
1 Comeuppance
1 Deflecting Palm
1 Divine Deflection
1 Dragonlord Dromoka
1 Empyrial Archangel
1 Firemane Angel
1 Glarecaster
1 Granny's Payback
1 Heroes Remembered
1 Kokusho, the Evening Star
1 Kor Haven
1 Pelakka Wurm
1 Prahv, Spires of Order
1 Razia, Boros Archangel
1 Selfless Squire
1 Shield of the Ages
1 Sunscorch Regent
1 Tower of Eons
1 Vengeful Archon
Combo/Misc - 5
1 Deadeye Navigator
1 Mindslaver
1 Necrotic Ooze
1 Sudden Spoiling
1 Thicket Elemental
Both Tev's and Kirblinx's stacks have provided a huge inspiration for this stack and my philosophy in building, as well as catching me up on the past ten years of Type 4 goodies. While Tev's stack has unfortunately not been updated in several years, Kirblinx continues to update his CubeTutor information.
Wrecking Ball > Lapse of Certainty
Wretched Confluence > Splicer's Skill
Forbidden Alchemy > Everdream
Anguished Unmaking > Archmage's Charm
Silvos, Rogue Elemental > Dragon Hatchling
Nissa's Revelation > Slave of Bolas
Breya, Etherium Shaper > Lesser Masticore
Scatter to the Winds > Draining Whelk
Lay Bare > Voidmage Prodigy
Devious Cover-Up > Dismal Failure
Bone to Ash > Punish Ignorance
Scatter Arc > Countersquall
Exclude > Undermine
Disdainful Stroke > Void Shatter
Ethersworn Adjudicator > Plaguebearer
Tidespout Tyrant > Harbinger of the Hunt
Thousand Winds > Hythonia the Cruel
Beast Within > Kalemne's Captain
Butcher of Malakir > Jiwari, the Earth Aflame
Capsize > Arashi, the Sky Asunder
Overwhelming Splendor > Capital Punishment
Custodi Lich > Cruel Ultimatum
Soulscour > Bearer of the Heavens
Gaze of Granite > Sudden Death
Angrath's Marauders > Fight with Fire
Baneslayer Angel > Magmatic Force
Lyra Dawnbringer > Colossus of Akros
Anya, Merciless Angel > Akroma, Angel of Fury
Ethereal Absolution > Price of Knowledge
Vitu-Ghazi, the City-Tree > Crush of Wurms
Charnelhoard Wurm > Throne of the High City
Demonlord Belzenlok > Baleful Force
Shorecrasher Elemental > Tower of Fortunes
Aven Fateshaper > Aeon Chronicler
Skeletal Scrying > Promise of Power
Magus of the Future > Beck // Call
Viscera Dragger > Etched Oracle
Careful Consideration > Heartwarming Redemption
Oketra's Attendant > Sphinx of Lost Truths
Heroic Intervention > Ghost-Lit Stalker
Honored Hydra > Root Elemental
Spiritmonger > Cloudthresher
Cauldron Dance > Restoration Angel
Ethereal Ambush > Miraculous Recovery
Puppeteer Clique > Gravewaker
Den Protector > Grim Harvest
Reviving Vapors > Beacon of Immortality
Insurrection > Granny's Payback
Haazda Shield Mate > Combat Medic
Thalia, Heretic Cathar > Avacyn, Guardian Angel
Consecrate // Consume > Vengeful Archon
Teysa, Envoy of Ghosts > Empyrial Archangel
Seeds of Renewal > Blazing Archon
Linvala, the Preserver > Sunscorch Regent
I have a cube for 8 people max, and the a diverse commander choice really helps with seeing the same cards. It's fun seeing the same cards being used in different ways for different deck strategies.
Are you gonna post your cube changes? I'd love to see where you end up.
Huh, I hadn't thought about that. I wonder if that could feed into a more aggressive bleeder strategy. Is the guildmage really that good? It seems like it would take quite a bit of mana just to start the bleeding. I may have enough incidental lifegain in the cube to support it without pouring resources into the guildmage. This might be my inexperience with the card talking though.
I'm going to be revamping and updating my cube when commander 2018 releases, so expect a lot more questions from me in the coming month or so!
Thanks for the feedback! Token seems like a great bet, as does any strategy that doesn't have to focus on a single opponent. I have a feeling aggro will center around BR and RW, though RW centers more about equipment for its own tokens. Vial Smasher the Fierce seems the best for this kind of thing, though tokens feed well into the sacrifice theme, and I know others who have had success with Olivia, Mobilized for War.
Probably can get some milage out of Warstorm Surge, Vicious Shadows, and Pandemonium, though the latter might backfire slightly.
I've been working on revamping the cube in general, but midrange and control continue dominate. I know the format gears itself towards longer games anyways, but have you all had any success with supporting other, more aggressive strategies?
What's Exciting:
Lyra Dawnbringer - I don't have a Baneslayer Angel, but if I did, it would be an easy swap. Everyone loves angels, and Lyra's a great one.
Multani, Yavimaya's Avatar - Big green beaters with landfall potential make me and Omnath excited.
Blackblade Reforged - Maybe it's too expensive to equip, but it's a huge boost on a cheap to cast equipment, and the more flavor the better.
Karn, Scion of Urza - Karn's a card advantage engine and artifact support that doesn't require too much set up. Might replace Coercive Portal, but voting is a lot of fun.
Muldrotha, the Gravetide - I love graveyards, Muldrotha loves graveyards. Now the hard part is to find the switch.
What's Possible:
Demonlord Belzenlok - Painful black card draw on a body is nice, and the guarantee of business spells is promising. It might be too generic, however.
Josu Vess, Lich Knight - That kicker is sweet and super fun, but the normal body is just so...boring. Wish I had an interest in knight tribal.
Jaya Ballard - Triple red is tough to swallow, but her ultimate is great and rummaging ability is a nice alternative to her first ability.
Squee, the Immortal - Is a cube without a Squee really worth it? A nice recursive option to have, though it might not have enough payoff.
Teferi, Hero of Dominaria - Definitely a powerful card, but it might be too generic for a multicolored card, especially competing with Venser, the Sojourner.
Grand Warlord Radha - A dedicated ramp general that feeds off creatures, so maybe it will work better than Wort, the Raidmother?
Shalai, Voice of Plenty - Not sure if she is worth it, as hexproof is annoying to play with, but the counter ability is exciting.
Jhoira, Weatherlight Captain - Very cool psudo-artifact general that looks amazing, but might be too bland. Still, Izzet artifact commander!
Speaking of tribes, has anyone tried out tribal themes in their cubes? After the Commander 2017 decks left me with a bunch of powerful tribal nonsense, I've been wanting to try them out. Past attempts have been a weak, but I want to know if you all have had success.
I like Dowsing Dagger far more than Treasure Map, which is too slow for me to get excited about. The dagger is easy enough to flip while providing a big boost especially when you can flip it early. It might not be as consistent as I'd like, but it's exciting enough to test.
Agreed on all counts - Monarch is a fun mechanic that encourages a bit more aggression, which is something that has influenced some of my recent design choices. Skyline Despot is especially good, not only because it can protect you if you become the monarch, but it elevates the Monarch sub game into a cool thematic archenemy battle, with one side amassing dragons and lording over the rest of the table.
CB, was it you who had suggested starting the game with the Monarch token in the middle of the game for first blood? It's something I want to try soon and see how it plays.
Don't forget, EDH decks are never static. I find it's better to just throw in cards you want to play with, even if you're unsure of how they'll work or if they're 'optimal'. The experience of testing and playing is one of the most rewarding parts of EDH, and if you keep a mental (or physical) list of the testing cards, you'll know what to look for when you play.
As for you deck, the whole Blood Artist, Reveillark, Karmic Guide combo/style of play works quite well with smaller creatures and recursion. I'm building a similar style deck with Alesha, and all three of those cards work wonders on their own.