Ah, yes, PoC will surely hang their hat on this achievement, being represented on a single card, without any context, in a TCG designed for tweens. Present them their participation trophy and call it a day, #winning.
It boggles my mind that people are so stuck on this. Her skin color literally doesn’t matter. They could have made her green with purple spots and it wouldn’t have made a difference. Her skin color is not relevant to her character or story arc. For the love of god people just let it go.
Yup. And it's pretty disheartening to come to this site which for years has been a great forum to discuss Magic spoilers and to be presented with some bigot's unwanted hot takes about how diversity is bad and its ruining muh Magic the Gathering. There are countless places where you can go and be racist on the internet but this isn't one of them.
It’s also pretty disheartening to associate some of those comments with someone being a racist. If anything, that’s more annoying than the hot takes. Oh, you don’t see how this can be possible because source material? Racist. Don’t understand the role of the character? Racist. I love it. All of you guys high-fiving and doing victory laps for calling somebody racist, on the internet. Good for you.
For instance-
I think or at least hope WOTC sees discussions like this and realizes exactly why a character and card like this are needed.
I don’t see why they are needed. This makes it sound forced, and inevitably leads to “token” status. @highholder makes a valid point, though you can not determine ethnicity through suits of armor. It is a perfectly reasonable to ask how this character came to be in this setting.
Then there are those using the “‘cuz fantasy” to explain it away. Well, to me, fantasy is used to sever ties with reality. Injecting realism via PC “checkboxes” crushes that in totality. I’m not saying they shouldn’t do this, but as mentioned above, you end up creating “token” characters just to please the masses. That’s not creativity, that’s being lazy.
My complaint here is that an average budget green/blue ramp deck can typically outperform an optimal non-green non-combo deck. This is mainly due to greens tutor ability to cheat lands in to play, and the sheer volume of ramp tutors available making for obnoxious consistancy.
Whoa, no stepping out just yet there bud. Why are we choosing UG?
I know why. It’s because that is the best color for card advantage. You’re getting buried in CA, so you associate that with a player having more lands than you. You aren’t losing to Ramp, you’re losing to decks that out-tempo you.
You won’t accept this response, but this is really what you have a problem with. This has nothing to do with Rampant Growth lol.
This will be the sixth board wipe in 2020 Standard, and it has advantages over the other five. Citywide Bust only hits big creatures and Ritual of Soot only hits small creatures. Kaya's Wrath and Time Wipe are multicolored. Planar Cleansing costs more and kills planeswalkers as well, which is awkward in many control decks. This does have a big downside, if I am understanding adventures correctly, that it is only counted as a sorcery on the stack, and therefore can't be found by Augur of Bolas or Narset. I am not a good control player, so I don't know how to balance these, but it certainly seems like it is in the conversation.
Can I just add some clarity here.
I am not saying this is a bad board wipe. I’ve gone so far as to say it’s par for the course in nuStandard. However, that does not make this a card worth a Mythic slot.
The card isn’t the problem, the rarity is. You just listed ‘wipes that are all comparable, either costing less with restrictions or costing more but killing more. This falls into the same category. It’s also not leaving behind a body, it’s leaving behind an expensive, vanilla, creature spell. So one side of the spell is certainly a rare-worthy card. The other half is most certainly not. For a card like this, I’d expect some form of synergy between the 2 abilities. There really isn’t any here, which is why I am incredibly puzzled by the rarity.
This card is mythic for literally the same reason that wakening sun's avatar was mythic.
Any creature with a board wipe tacked on is mythic nowadays.
But this isn’t tacked on. It’s 13 mana, albeit spread across a few turns, for a “wrath tacked on”.
I understand that standard wrath’s are now 5-CMC, but, most have upsides, not downsides. Regardless of how many giants exist, you’re still potentially missing something with the wrath. The creature is too vanilla.
It’s just not Mythic worthy. Maybe if the Adventure was 6cmc at instant speed with the same vanilla body attached, but as is, just don’t like it at all.
It reminds me a lot of Part the Waterveil, actually, in terms of what you're getting for the cost. I think the major issue with it isn't its design so much as the fact that it's a white card in a top-down, low powered set leading into a potentially slower meta. In the abstract, wiping the board and then getting a big body a turn or two later - from the same card - is actually solid value. The ultimate question isn't "is this a good card?" so much as "is there a place for this?", but the general proportions of it certainly do seem mythic, to me at least.
This is the last bit I’m going to give on this. I’ve said my piece, ‘it’s what it ‘tis. For 8-Mana, you’re left with a hasty, albeit smaller body. They are effectively the same thing.
You may want to have the creature later, and that’s fine. But, that doesn’t change the fact that this effect has been done before at rare, and a few instances at that. And, the effect at Mythic has been done before and pushed a bit harder.
This card is mythic for literally the same reason that wakening sun's avatar was mythic.
Any creature with a board wipe tacked on is mythic nowadays.
But this isn’t tacked on. It’s 13 mana, albeit spread across a few turns, for a “wrath tacked on”.
I understand that standard wrath’s are now 5-CMC, but, most have upsides, not downsides. Regardless of how many giants exist, you’re still potentially missing something with the wrath. The creature is too vanilla.
It’s just not Mythic worthy. Maybe if the Adventure was 6cmc at instant speed with the same vanilla body attached, but as is, just don’t like it at all.
This is still an overcosted wrath withbuilt in drawback, stapled to an overcosted beater with no evasion.
If this was a true Day of Judgement and the creature had something a bit more relevant in terms of pressure/survivability, sure, but as is, this isn’t a very good mythic.
For reference, we have Bonecrusher Giant, which seems more deserving of a mythic spot than this.
The fact that this gains life is what pushes it to the rarity it is IMO.
Granted, it’s also an all upside 3 power black creature, so it is already a bit undercosted body as is. Being able to “trade” with a trampling behemoth, most likely a finisher, is super powerful.
If you ban one type of tutor like demonic tutor then you warp what the color choices people use in edh away from black. Technically rampant growth is a tutor, that also puts a permenant strait in to play. Is that ban worthy? It doesn't seem far to ban demonic tutor variants without also hitting all of the green land-ramp and creature spells, the white equipment and enchantment tutors, the blue spell tutors, and the joke of red tutors in gamble and sarkhan's triumph.
My issue with people bringing up this topic is usually similar to my issue with people wanting to ban fast mana. If you take away all the fast mana-rocks then competitive decks are going to be all semi-green to use all the 1cmc mana dorks and land-ramp. It would be terrible for the entire format from casual to competitive.
Neither of these points are really true. How often are you grabbing a land with Demonic Tutor? Unless you are grabbing Urborg/Coffers, likely never. Green ramp spells have minimal impact on the game, at least in comparison to other tutors. You aren’t tutoring up a game winning/saving answer with Rampant Growth.
Enter tapped isn't an issue, consider Llanowar Reborn does something similar without chance to untap. Like many other cards in the set, they are aiming to bolster mono-color decks, which I approve.
This^ is such a good card, todays card really isn’t. That “kicker” requirement is steep. I really don’t see why it couldn’t have been given the Adamant mechanic. It’s really expensive as is and I think that punishes it enough to warrant the additional effect.
It’s splashy, don’t get me wrong, but I think I’ll always wish to see another card when I draw it outside of very few decks.
It’s also pretty disheartening to associate some of those comments with someone being a racist. If anything, that’s more annoying than the hot takes. Oh, you don’t see how this can be possible because source material? Racist. Don’t understand the role of the character? Racist. I love it. All of you guys high-fiving and doing victory laps for calling somebody racist, on the internet. Good for you.
For instance-
I don’t see why they are needed. This makes it sound forced, and inevitably leads to “token” status. @highholder makes a valid point, though you can not determine ethnicity through suits of armor. It is a perfectly reasonable to ask how this character came to be in this setting.
Then there are those using the “‘cuz fantasy” to explain it away. Well, to me, fantasy is used to sever ties with reality. Injecting realism via PC “checkboxes” crushes that in totality. I’m not saying they shouldn’t do this, but as mentioned above, you end up creating “token” characters just to please the masses. That’s not creativity, that’s being lazy.
<snip>
Except for drawing Evolving Wilds late game?
Whoa, no stepping out just yet there bud. Why are we choosing UG?
I know why. It’s because that is the best color for card advantage. You’re getting buried in CA, so you associate that with a player having more lands than you. You aren’t losing to Ramp, you’re losing to decks that out-tempo you.
You won’t accept this response, but this is really what you have a problem with. This has nothing to do with Rampant Growth lol.
Can I just add some clarity here.
I am not saying this is a bad board wipe. I’ve gone so far as to say it’s par for the course in nuStandard. However, that does not make this a card worth a Mythic slot.
The card isn’t the problem, the rarity is. You just listed ‘wipes that are all comparable, either costing less with restrictions or costing more but killing more. This falls into the same category. It’s also not leaving behind a body, it’s leaving behind an expensive, vanilla, creature spell. So one side of the spell is certainly a rare-worthy card. The other half is most certainly not. For a card like this, I’d expect some form of synergy between the 2 abilities. There really isn’t any here, which is why I am incredibly puzzled by the rarity.
This is the last bit I’m going to give on this. I’ve said my piece, ‘it’s what it ‘tis. For 8-Mana, you’re left with a hasty, albeit smaller body. They are effectively the same thing.
You may want to have the creature later, and that’s fine. But, that doesn’t change the fact that this effect has been done before at rare, and a few instances at that. And, the effect at Mythic has been done before and pushed a bit harder.
But this isn’t tacked on. It’s 13 mana, albeit spread across a few turns, for a “wrath tacked on”.
I understand that standard wrath’s are now 5-CMC, but, most have upsides, not downsides. Regardless of how many giants exist, you’re still potentially missing something with the wrath. The creature is too vanilla.
It’s just not Mythic worthy. Maybe if the Adventure was 6cmc at instant speed with the same vanilla body attached, but as is, just don’t like it at all.
This is still an overcosted wrath withbuilt in drawback, stapled to an overcosted beater with no evasion.
If this was a true Day of Judgement and the creature had something a bit more relevant in terms of pressure/survivability, sure, but as is, this isn’t a very good mythic.
For reference, we have Bonecrusher Giant, which seems more deserving of a mythic spot than this.
Granted, it’s also an all upside 3 power black creature, so it is already a bit undercosted body as is. Being able to “trade” with a trampling behemoth, most likely a finisher, is super powerful.
I really like the design of this card.
Neither of these points are really true. How often are you grabbing a land with Demonic Tutor? Unless you are grabbing Urborg/Coffers, likely never. Green ramp spells have minimal impact on the game, at least in comparison to other tutors. You aren’t tutoring up a game winning/saving answer with Rampant Growth.
But it has to be untapped to be a Llanowar Reborn.
This^ is such a good card, todays card really isn’t. That “kicker” requirement is steep. I really don’t see why it couldn’t have been given the Adamant mechanic. It’s really expensive as is and I think that punishes it enough to warrant the additional effect.
It’s splashy, don’t get me wrong, but I think I’ll always wish to see another card when I draw it outside of very few decks.