Wolf / Garruk tribal looks super fun. Also worth noting that Oath of Gideon lets you ultimate both the new Garruk and Garruk Wildspeaker immediately after casting them. Abzan tokens/Walkers could be a thing.
I haven't tried Nissa Who Shakes the World in modern, but I've played with her a bunch in standard and agree that she's better than she looks.
If Once upon a time could hit Utopia Sprawl it would revolutionize the ramp core for creature-heavy versions. I think it's still worth looking at; in hands without a t1 accelerator, but with Once Upon a Time you should have pretty good odds of finding one; 5 is really deep, and you know you don't have any in the first 7 you drew. If we could replace dorks with Once... it would let us run more threats, and paying 2 to dig for a wincon later is no big deal. Not hitting sprawl is a bummer, though.
If we're going to have cards laying out the evolution of a single character like this, I would have liked to see them linked mechanically...
Couldn't teenage Chandra have an ultimate that tutors grown-up Chandra and puts her in play, or some such?
Deep Forest Hermit + Cloudstone Curio + Cryptolith Rite + Fervor = all the squirrels. That's not good, of course, but it is hilarious.
@arrogantAxolotl, like you say, the beauty of Wolfbriar is that it scales. It's not the best option at exactly six, but it ranges from an embarrassing 4 drop to a game winner when you have all ramp and no other payoff. I do love Bellower as well, especially in lists with lots of tutors using creature silver bullets from the sideboard.
Re: Primalcrux... if you want this to work you really need to run ways to give it haste, and even then you're soft to decks with Path to Exile. I tried a bunch of ways to make it work, and its definitely crazy powerful and fun, but also suboptimal in modern. Casting Aspect of Hydra on that thing is one of my all-time favorite mtg memories, though.
@CurdBros, thanks for the kind words. Fully agree with your meta-analysis of how we make the deck tick. We have cards that ramp, and cards that win. I agree that overrun and combo are the premier ways to end the game.
There's room for more interactive, almost controlling builds, like your old Karn focused Walker build, or the mtggoldfish deck that was mostly built around the Primal Command/Eternal Witness loop, but in my experience that's a losing proposition in modern, at least in game 1. It seems impossible to have the right tools to slow down such a wide variety of fast goldfish-y decks. It was actually one of your comments about missing lethal overrun opportunities that led me down this path with the deck... I figured if we're building a winning board state by accident imagine what we could do on purpose
@ThorsHammer, I'd cut a couple of forests for two Birds of Paradise; having turn 1 ramp reliably is really important, and the deck plays much more consistently with 10 1-drop ramp spells. Its possible that 9 is the right number with the new mulligan rule, but I doubt it. Also, you should upgrade decimator to Craterhoof Behemoth as soon as your budget allows; it's both lower cmc and more bonkers. I'm not a huge fan of Harmoize; if it were my list I'd cut one and go up to the full set of Primal Command.
Edit to add one more quick note to the Primeval Titan discussion; Inkmoth Nexus is worth considering as a target that can give you lethal the next turn, if you grab it along with wolf run. I dont like having that many colorless sources, but it is another way to get the kill.
Great discussion all around. I think Garruk is better in traditional devotion than in Tooth and Nail.
Tooth and Nail is really racing to get to 9 mana, and while Garruk is a super powerful ramp spell he might be outclassed by Kiora just on the basis of his cmc.
In other devotion lists we're playing more utility creatures, and dont have the big "I win" button at 9. Having the overrun available often leads to wins out of nowhere, even if that's not the decks plan A.
My latest iteration of the deck is optimized to flood the board and then overrun with either Garruk or Craterhoof as quickly as possible, and Garruk is easily the best card in the deck. It takes some building around to really get the most from him, though. You want a lot of bodies, and you dont want defenders. I'm using full sets of BTE, Elvish Visionary, and Summoner's Pact, along with three Wolfbriar Elemental and a Hornet Queen (as a pact target) to ensure I have a wide board. It's not unusual to play Garruk, untap two lands, use the mana to deploy a few beaters, and then overrun for the win on my next turn.
In related news, my favorite 6-drop is Wolfbriar Elemental, kicked twice
That temur list sounds super fun. Probably too far down the rabbit hole, but my first thought was to include Trophy Mage or one of the Tezzerets to tutor up a singleton cloudstone curio.
The new hydra is bonkers with Kiora, that's for sure. With another Walker that grants haste (like 4cmc Domri, or Sarkhan Vol, it might be the best 5cmc finisher for a superfriends list.
The green Finale is certainly powerful and flexible, but my gut says it's too slow/expensive. If you need to ramp it costs at least 2 (No turn 1 Dryad Arbor, so it cant replace any of our 1 drop ramp cards like GSZ would).
As a finisher it's more expensive than either Tooth and Nail or Pact into Craterhoof, both of which end the game on the spot, and if you're finding a silver bullet paying two extra is pretty rough; 5 for a rec sage just doesn't seem good enough.
Rotator would be awesome in pact lists. Ive been running a single karametra's acolyte for situations where I have 4 mana and need to (essentially) pact for nykthos; this would be a big upgrade. Doesn't seem unreasonable from a power level standpoint, either.
I have never liked huntmaster. Arlin Kord is worth considering if you're in the market for a grindy 4-drop. At the very least you get a wolf token and she soaks up some damage/removal. Unchecked she'll take over the game with wolf - bolt - wolf.
Wolfbriar is _great_ in the deck, but it's more of a scalable top end that can be cast for four in a pinch... Fills a different role, imo.
I've found Oath of Nissa to be pretty awkward in a list with that many tutors... feels really bad to dig past a pact when you're desperate for a payoff card. Has it been working ok for you guys?
In my experience if you want to win with primalcrux (and really, who doesnt?), you need haste enablers. Letting it sit for a whole turn where they can untap and remove it is just too long.
The cool thing about the archetype is that once you're spending dozens of mama to win you have a ton of options.
My current build came about because of how often I was winning with some random creatures + Garruk overrun; I decided to see what happened when I optimized for that plan.
Right, if they have a big death's shadow I just want to burn 'em out of the game. They do so much damage to themselves I want to finish the job directly. I'd seriously consider Lava Axe. I don't know if it's a good plan, but I do know it's a fun plan.
Deathtouch blockers might help; they are usually winning with disruption plus one or two beefy under costed beaters. We need something that doesn't die to Tarfire... I guess Narnam Renegade could work in lists that consistently hit revolt.
If Once upon a time could hit Utopia Sprawl it would revolutionize the ramp core for creature-heavy versions. I think it's still worth looking at; in hands without a t1 accelerator, but with Once Upon a Time you should have pretty good odds of finding one; 5 is really deep, and you know you don't have any in the first 7 you drew. If we could replace dorks with Once... it would let us run more threats, and paying 2 to dig for a wincon later is no big deal. Not hitting sprawl is a bummer, though.
Couldn't teenage Chandra have an ultimate that tutors grown-up Chandra and puts her in play, or some such?
@arrogantAxolotl, like you say, the beauty of Wolfbriar is that it scales. It's not the best option at exactly six, but it ranges from an embarrassing 4 drop to a game winner when you have all ramp and no other payoff. I do love Bellower as well, especially in lists with lots of tutors using creature silver bullets from the sideboard.
Re: Primalcrux... if you want this to work you really need to run ways to give it haste, and even then you're soft to decks with Path to Exile. I tried a bunch of ways to make it work, and its definitely crazy powerful and fun, but also suboptimal in modern. Casting Aspect of Hydra on that thing is one of my all-time favorite mtg memories, though.
@CurdBros, thanks for the kind words. Fully agree with your meta-analysis of how we make the deck tick. We have cards that ramp, and cards that win. I agree that overrun and combo are the premier ways to end the game.
There's room for more interactive, almost controlling builds, like your old Karn focused Walker build, or the mtggoldfish deck that was mostly built around the Primal Command/Eternal Witness loop, but in my experience that's a losing proposition in modern, at least in game 1. It seems impossible to have the right tools to slow down such a wide variety of fast goldfish-y decks. It was actually one of your comments about missing lethal overrun opportunities that led me down this path with the deck... I figured if we're building a winning board state by accident imagine what we could do on purpose
@ThorsHammer, I'd cut a couple of forests for two Birds of Paradise; having turn 1 ramp reliably is really important, and the deck plays much more consistently with 10 1-drop ramp spells. Its possible that 9 is the right number with the new mulligan rule, but I doubt it. Also, you should upgrade decimator to Craterhoof Behemoth as soon as your budget allows; it's both lower cmc and more bonkers. I'm not a huge fan of Harmoize; if it were my list I'd cut one and go up to the full set of Primal Command.
Edit to add one more quick note to the Primeval Titan discussion; Inkmoth Nexus is worth considering as a target that can give you lethal the next turn, if you grab it along with wolf run. I dont like having that many colorless sources, but it is another way to get the kill.
Tooth and Nail is really racing to get to 9 mana, and while Garruk is a super powerful ramp spell he might be outclassed by Kiora just on the basis of his cmc.
In other devotion lists we're playing more utility creatures, and dont have the big "I win" button at 9. Having the overrun available often leads to wins out of nowhere, even if that's not the decks plan A.
My latest iteration of the deck is optimized to flood the board and then overrun with either Garruk or Craterhoof as quickly as possible, and Garruk is easily the best card in the deck. It takes some building around to really get the most from him, though. You want a lot of bodies, and you dont want defenders. I'm using full sets of BTE, Elvish Visionary, and Summoner's Pact, along with three Wolfbriar Elemental and a Hornet Queen (as a pact target) to ensure I have a wide board. It's not unusual to play Garruk, untap two lands, use the mana to deploy a few beaters, and then overrun for the win on my next turn.
In related news, my favorite 6-drop is Wolfbriar Elemental, kicked twice
That temur list sounds super fun. Probably too far down the rabbit hole, but my first thought was to include Trophy Mage or one of the Tezzerets to tutor up a singleton cloudstone curio.
As a finisher it's more expensive than either Tooth and Nail or Pact into Craterhoof, both of which end the game on the spot, and if you're finding a silver bullet paying two extra is pretty rough; 5 for a rec sage just doesn't seem good enough.
Wolfbriar is _great_ in the deck, but it's more of a scalable top end that can be cast for four in a pinch... Fills a different role, imo.
The cool thing about the archetype is that once you're spending dozens of mama to win you have a ton of options.
My current build came about because of how often I was winning with some random creatures + Garruk overrun; I decided to see what happened when I optimized for that plan.
Deathtouch blockers might help; they are usually winning with disruption plus one or two beefy under costed beaters. We need something that doesn't die to Tarfire... I guess Narnam Renegade could work in lists that consistently hit revolt.