Hey guys, I know this is the Modern section, but these are the best tezzeret minds around and I would be very surprised if some of you are not also planning on jamming tezz in standard. Does anyone have a list they would be willing to share, or would anyone be up for collaborating on a primer with me?
For the people on Whir of invention, a couple other cute interactions include using it as a ramp spell with Darksteel Citadel and as a removal spell via artifact creatures with deathtouch, like Tidehollow Strix
Whir of invention it is not a good card and it is not the kind of deck se want to play. Tezz should be a tap-out / lock down deck that kills the opponent via thopters or tezzeret. That's my point of view. I want tezzerator to be a control deck
Could you explain why it is not a good card instead of just saying it isn't a good card? I strongly disagree with you. Just because you are playing a tutor doesn't change what type of deck tezzerator is.
I strongly believe that Whir of Invention and Reverse Engineer are very, very good cards and I wanted to utilize them to their fullest extent without breaking down too much of makes the deck tick already. I want to play as many as 4 Pentad Prism but found it difficult to cut any more cards. Pentad Prism allows us to cast Whir Of Invention for X=3 with greater consistency on turn 3. This also allows for Reverse Engineer on turn 3 with only two lands in play. It is even +1 mana for improvise cards the turn you play it. We can consistently find our Thopter/Sword and Ensnaring Bridge. We can respond to a Liliana of the Veil by casting Whir of Invention for a Pithing Needle. We can respond to Abrupt Decay/Maelstrom Pulse with a Spellskite or Welding Jar. We can lock out entire decks as early as turn 4 by tutoring Ensnaring Bridge, Witchbane Orb, Grafdiggers Cage, Ethersworn Cantonist, etc.
As someone else already mentioned we can force decks to respect or fear our combo like twin did. Play an artifact on 1, combo piece on 2, and threaten to Whir of Invention for the the other piece on their end step and combo out on your turn 4!
Falling behind? Draw 3 cards for UU. Need to kill that Glister Elf without paying 4 life and kill the Inkmoth Nexus? Push it off a cliff.
I am excited to play Modern because I feel like I may have the best deck when I walk into the room now and I'll get to have fun doing it. I'll share my testing with you all and let you know how I do as far as results. I could be wrong about these new cards, but I really don't think I am. Good Luck and Happy Brewing!
So I have been brainstorming artifacts that are good enough to play that can also helps us quickly enable improvise. Here is what I come up with so far:
Essentially any playable artifact that doesn't already produce mana by tapping. I am most excited to experiment with Pentad Prism since it can add 2 of the already difficult to achieve triple blue and tap for improvise. It is twice as good as wall of roots is for chord decks. With 3 lands and this on turn 2 you can Whir of Invention for an Ensnaring Bridge on turn 3. With a turn 1 artifact you can tutor a 4 cmc card into play on turn 3. That is busted. It is twice as good as wall of roots is for chord decks. Feels pretty powerful. I've begun working on a list with 4x Whir of Invention. I am confident this is the best card we will get out of kaladesh block. I will post my experimental list soon since I don't think anymore useful spoilers will be coming our way.
So i'm just gonna drop this here and walk away... Seems like if Inventors' Fair wasn't enough, all your dreams just came true.
seems pretty high costing even with the improvise ability. uuu is going to be pretty hard to cast. its a lot of hassle to fetch a bridge/silver bullet. i'd rather play trinket mage.
That is just wrong, this card is ridiculously powerful. I will be playing 4x and building around it.
I personally don't feel either of them are that good. 3 mana is a tough spot. I can see 1 of each at most. Other than bridge what else is trophy getting you realistically? Trinket has way more hits and overall usefulness. Don't get me wrong, games are decided by a bridge or not. I still couldn't justify more than 1 of either though. Extreme builds may want 2 trophy depending on the meta.
The real truth here is that the games are decided by a turn 3 bridge. A turn 4 bridge after a trophy mage isn't going to cut it.
The new tezz is actually going to be quite good in standard, but is worse than AOB. But what did we expect, AOB is one of the top 3 best planeswalkers ever printed. If modern slows down a little I could see this getting played in modern in different builds, almost exclusively for the removal on a stick with the ability to be a win condition. The deck would have to move away from bridge and into a more tapout UB control deck. Ill probably try it out some, unlikely to be any better than AOB.
I don't have a whole lot to contribute as of now, I have been busy with non-magic related stuff. Depressing I realize. However I did get in a bunch of testing with a Tezzeret list running Ghost Quarter/Crucible/Surgical and I was unfortunately very disappointed. It felt like it did nothing most of the time and I will no longer be running it.
This sounds like a great meta for a chalice build, but those builds have faded away as of recently. Anyone here have a successful CoV build for CthuluHoops?
If we are going to GQ plan i like playing all 4 main with the crucible and starting the build from that point, prioritizing the mana base. 14 should be right for blue and black sources.
Essentially we have to give up the second fair and the academy ruins/Creeping Tar pit slot and increase our land count to 24 to make this happen. I don't hate this given that we might ghost quarter aggressively and can bounce them off Darksteel Citadel.
I just picked up a crucible so i will give this a try and let you know how it works out, Likely 1 surgical main and 2 more in the sideboard.
If anyone else wants to try something similar and report back that would be excellent!
I agree with most if what you said. Even tier 1 decks don't have enough data behind them correctly calculate win rates. This is why I have created the spreadsheet. Hopefully we can get at least more opinions to get closer to an accurate conclusion.
Multiplying by 2 is correct when determining the +/- split. I have changed it on the spreadsheet for easier understanding.
I have not played thousands of games with this list, but I have played with the arch type enough to understand what helps where and make a reasonable guess.
Please contribute to the spreadsheet with your opinions and data to help us all get a more accurate picture.
-That is actually correct. If it goes from 60/40 to 55/45. A 20 percent split to a 10 percent split. However I see your point and Ill change it for easier use.
-I didn't think to do per a deck, I do like that idea. It helps you realize if you need to play relic or chalice or something of that nature to sure up a matchup. I'll try to jam that in.
-I excluded tier 2 decks because they change quite often. All of tier 2 makes up another 25% of the metagame and there are currently 11 decks in tier 2. We could incorporate it. Most might not have relevant match up data against a chunk of the tier 2 decks as well.
Hi everyone. Given recent discussion about win rates before and after sideboarding. I made this Super Fancy Spreadsheet on google sheets to allows us to collaborate on decklists and get a better understanding of how we are actually positioned in the metagame. Please contribute! It benefits not only you but all of us! I have already entered my own and Radoufs (but if you could provide a link to a decklist that would be most excellent) to give everyone an idea how it works. Thanks in advance!
@Timba Did you even read it? It goes into detail to show you how I get 1.37%. My increased or decreased win ratio multiplied by each decks meta share. The matchup number come from my personal experience of playing many, many games with the deck. This is as close to accurate we are going to get without playing hundreds of games of skilled pilots against each other for each match. If you disagree with my numbers, please provide your reasoning and your numbers.
Or even better it can get lotus bloom or mox opal
Could you explain why it is not a good card instead of just saying it isn't a good card? I strongly disagree with you. Just because you are playing a tutor doesn't change what type of deck tezzerator is.
1 Academy Ruins
4 Darkslick Shores
1 Darksteel Citadel
2 Flooded Strand
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Industrial Tower
2 Inventors' Fair
3 Island
4 Polluted Delta
1 Swamp
3 Watery Grave
Artifacts:
1 Batterskull
2 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Executioner's Capsule
2 Mox Opal
3 Pentad Prism
1 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Pithing Needle
2 Relic of Progenitus
1 Spellskite
3 Sword of the Meek
4 Thopter Foundry
1 Welding Jar
4 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
4 Whir of Invention
3 Reverse Engineer
4 Fatal Push
2 Collective Brutality
2 Damnation
2 Engineered Explosives
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Flaying Tendrils
1 Go for the Throat
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Pithing Needle
1 Spellskite
1 Witchbane Orb
1 Wurmcoil Engine
I strongly believe that Whir of Invention and Reverse Engineer are very, very good cards and I wanted to utilize them to their fullest extent without breaking down too much of makes the deck tick already. I want to play as many as 4 Pentad Prism but found it difficult to cut any more cards. Pentad Prism allows us to cast Whir Of Invention for X=3 with greater consistency on turn 3. This also allows for Reverse Engineer on turn 3 with only two lands in play. It is even +1 mana for improvise cards the turn you play it. We can consistently find our Thopter/Sword and Ensnaring Bridge. We can respond to a Liliana of the Veil by casting Whir of Invention for a Pithing Needle. We can respond to Abrupt Decay/Maelstrom Pulse with a Spellskite or Welding Jar. We can lock out entire decks as early as turn 4 by tutoring Ensnaring Bridge, Witchbane Orb, Grafdiggers Cage, Ethersworn Cantonist, etc.
As someone else already mentioned we can force decks to respect or fear our combo like twin did. Play an artifact on 1, combo piece on 2, and threaten to Whir of Invention for the the other piece on their end step and combo out on your turn 4!
Falling behind? Draw 3 cards for UU. Need to kill that Glister Elf without paying 4 life and kill the Inkmoth Nexus? Push it off a cliff.
I am excited to play Modern because I feel like I may have the best deck when I walk into the room now and I'll get to have fun doing it. I'll share my testing with you all and let you know how I do as far as results. I could be wrong about these new cards, but I really don't think I am. Good Luck and Happy Brewing!
Essentially any playable artifact that doesn't already produce mana by tapping. I am most excited to experiment with Pentad Prism since it can add 2 of the already difficult to achieve triple blue and tap for improvise. It is twice as good as wall of roots is for chord decks. With 3 lands and this on turn 2 you can Whir of Invention for an Ensnaring Bridge on turn 3. With a turn 1 artifact you can tutor a 4 cmc card into play on turn 3. That is busted. It is twice as good as wall of roots is for chord decks. Feels pretty powerful. I've begun working on a list with 4x Whir of Invention. I am confident this is the best card we will get out of kaladesh block. I will post my experimental list soon since I don't think anymore useful spoilers will be coming our way.
That is just wrong, this card is ridiculously powerful. I will be playing 4x and building around it.
The real truth here is that the games are decided by a turn 3 bridge. A turn 4 bridge after a trophy mage isn't going to cut it.
- 4 Ghost Quarter
- 4 Darksteel Citadel
- 4 Polluted Delta
- 1 Swamp
- 2 Island
- 2 Scalding Tarn
- 3 Watery Grave
- 3 Darkslick shores
- 1 Inventor's Fair
Essentially we have to give up the second fair and the academy ruins/Creeping Tar pit slot and increase our land count to 24 to make this happen. I don't hate this given that we might ghost quarter aggressively and can bounce them off Darksteel Citadel.I just picked up a crucible so i will give this a try and let you know how it works out, Likely 1 surgical main and 2 more in the sideboard.
If anyone else wants to try something similar and report back that would be excellent!
Multiplying by 2 is correct when determining the +/- split. I have changed it on the spreadsheet for easier understanding.
I have not played thousands of games with this list, but I have played with the arch type enough to understand what helps where and make a reasonable guess.
Please contribute to the spreadsheet with your opinions and data to help us all get a more accurate picture.
-I didn't think to do per a deck, I do like that idea. It helps you realize if you need to play relic or chalice or something of that nature to sure up a matchup. I'll try to jam that in.
-I excluded tier 2 decks because they change quite often. All of tier 2 makes up another 25% of the metagame and there are currently 11 decks in tier 2. We could incorporate it. Most might not have relevant match up data against a chunk of the tier 2 decks as well.