Here is a no-banlist version I threw together, afterwards I realized that I overlooked Anguished Unmaking since the lists I was looking at were all from before the SOI release because of the Eye ban. Should I try to make room for a copy or two in the 75?
Hey guys, I've been on this deck since coming back to MtG after a 12+ year hiatus in December. I've followed the builds and discussion on this thread very closely, and figured now that I've learned a bit about the modern format, and piloting the deck, that I can add to the discussion. Firstly, I feel like the deck is extremely rewarding when you know what cards are in your opponents' deck and their game-plan. Since the deck is so controlly and reactive until you turn the corner, knowing what you're up against is more advantageous to this deck than many others in the format. I have done well at my LGS with this deck, quite often going 2 or 3 wins, and way more often than not my losses come from my lack of experience or knowledge when I play am opponent with a new deck. I agree with deaddrift that this is a strong control deck in modern right now, mainly because it beats other control decks like Jund and Nahiri, and thanks to main and sideboard life-gain can do pretty well against aggro as well. Tron is a nightmare, dear god.
Before I forget I want to mention that I've read a lot of talk about ditching Blight Herder for Eternal Scourge, while I think Scourge could deserve a spot in the list, I don't see running more than a 1-of, maybe two. There is a downside in that it can easily be removed by the opponent, and while lowering the curve would benefit the deck, Blight Herders are awesome and as long as I keep seeing as many as 2 people out of 8-10 running Ancestral Visions at my weekly tournaments I can't see myself removing them entirely. Trimming, sure, but they definitely belong in the deck. I'm also a much bigger fan of Westvale Abbey than most on the deck, which Herder Helps. 1 Eternal Scourge as a recurring presence on the board seems like it would be fine, but I think there's much more value to be had in Stranglers and Reshapers for that 3 drop spot. Speaking of Reshaper, I started playing with it a bit, trying a 3 Strangler/ 1 Reshaper split and now moving to an even 2/2 split, and that card has outperformed my expectations. Two games in a row the revealed card on Reshaper's death was a Strangler and I was able to process and kill a creature of the opponent's with its ETB trigger, talk about value. What I like about Strangler and Reshaper is in a bolt-heavy modern meta, these drops will get you value quickly, whereas Scourge would most likely come into play later (scourge T3, they kill before your T4, hopefully you've got TKS/Smasher/Herder in hand ready for T4).
I love Westvale Abbey in the deck. In my mana base I am either trading off a Shambling Vent or Ghost Quarter for Abbey and I think it's worth it in the relatively slow local meta I play in. This deck performs leaps better when you're getting TKS and Smasher out asap, so losing a tap-land and an self-destruct land for a late-game threat land is something I'm definitely alright with. Abbey's first ability is probably underrated, sure it's worse than Sea-Gate Wreckage if you're just looking at the first ability, but you can use Abbey when you have cards in your hand and that 1/1 can be a damn good chump blocker to buy turns while you topdeck as well. And getting to flip it is basically game-ending, and not necessarily in a win-more way. In a Jund matchup two weeks ago we each had 4-6 creatures on board and empty hands, he's got a 5+ something goyf and a beefed scooze to where I can't even swing with a Herder I've got out, I topdeck either another Herder or a Lingering Souls, flip Abbey, and they scoop when I do. I feel like I'm lucky in that usually we see 0-1 decks running some form of aggro, so I've got a few card decisions based on that. Other than the Abbey I've got a second Cavern of Souls (lots of blue players) and just this week I've decided to go from 3 to 2 Herders in favor of putting Batterskull back in. I ******* love Batterskull and I want it in the deck so much. It's an instant lifelink, 4/4 with vigilance creature at worst, it's an artifact that begs to be removed by your opponent that can also be saved by returning it to your hand, and moving it to a Smasher or Souls token is pretty OP. When I look at Herder and Batterskull as 5-drops, I would so much rather drop the Bskull much of the time, and while ramping a Herder is obviously good, getting the value of processing while ramping can be pretty tricky. I like Abbey and Batterskull both because of the ability to use mana late game on them if/when the draws aren't working in your favor.
Going back to the deck performing leaps better when ramping, I too am pretty sold on Mind Stone as a 2-of. Deaddrifts post just above mine discusses all the reasons to use it, getting a 1-2 turn ramp on Smasher being the strongest reason to play it. Often times I get to play a relic off the 1 mana on T2 when I Mind Stone, and that is a pretty decent set-up turn for this deck. Honestly I would love a second Sorin, but I don't see what else can be taken out for it other than Mind Stone and I don't think that's worth it. Increasing the consistency of ramping TKS and Smasher will get you wins, and the cantrip and colorless source seal the deal that this card deserves a spot.
This list seems very tight right now, and I really struggle with deciding how I can trim even 1 card to get something in for play-testing. It's great to see others having success with the deck locally, it is super fun to play and my favorite line to hear from an opponent is "I hate reality Smasher". I am baffled that there hasn't been any results posted by the deck at a large-scale tournament because I don't see where this deck is weak where other control decks aren't. Maybe it's because there's no pro level players grinding with the deck to perform better with it? Maybe no one's playing it online to have modern league representation?
Now that I've finally made an account, I'll try to make some posts on play reports and such. I think personally I could use lots of info on siding IN/OUT and strategies/game-plans against certain decks, and I'll contribute what I can. It would also be sweet if we could get some discussion on higher level plays that might not come up often, but are useful to know. An example would be "when facing U/B mill, always wait to use Relic's exile all ability and keep it untapped while your opponent has the open mana for Cryptic Incursion to crack it in response and stop their potentially huge lifegain". I mean relic alone has soooo many ways to get more value than just "exile card(s)" and as someone who's trying to play catch-up having recently jumped into modern I am looking for any and all ways to improve my piloting of the deck.
So we've got a modern no-ban tournament coming up in 2 weeks, having done it once before back in February. The first time I took my modern B/W Processors list and simply put in 2 Sensei's Divining Tops and managed to get 4th out of 25 or so. Would you think it would be better to stick with the current creature base for the one in two weeks, or should I bring in the Oblivion Sower and Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger package since I'll have Eye of Ugin available to me? I love Sower and was one of the last to take it out of my deck-list one Eye got banned, but the current creature build is much faster and I'm pretty content with Smashers being the main end-game threat. Right now my plan is to go with my current list, -2 Mind Stone/+2 Sensei's, and trimming two other cards for 2 Stoneforge Mystic to tutor and play Batterskull early. Any advice on a no-ban version of the deck would be appreciated.
Sorry for the wall of text, and thanks for all the discussion.
EDIT: I knew I forgot about something. I think Warping Wail deserves some testing in the sideboard and I've been playing with it for a couple weeks. The card is so versatile and that fits the deck pretty well, there are so many creatures in modern that can be exiled with it (and on turn two for 2 mana, 1 being colorless, it enables processors), and it seriously catches people off-guard when you are countering sorceries as a B/W deck. They will not play around Warping Wail and that is to our advantage.
Before I forget I want to mention that I've read a lot of talk about ditching Blight Herder for Eternal Scourge, while I think Scourge could deserve a spot in the list, I don't see running more than a 1-of, maybe two. There is a downside in that it can easily be removed by the opponent, and while lowering the curve would benefit the deck, Blight Herders are awesome and as long as I keep seeing as many as 2 people out of 8-10 running Ancestral Visions at my weekly tournaments I can't see myself removing them entirely. Trimming, sure, but they definitely belong in the deck. I'm also a much bigger fan of Westvale Abbey than most on the deck, which Herder Helps. 1 Eternal Scourge as a recurring presence on the board seems like it would be fine, but I think there's much more value to be had in Stranglers and Reshapers for that 3 drop spot. Speaking of Reshaper, I started playing with it a bit, trying a 3 Strangler/ 1 Reshaper split and now moving to an even 2/2 split, and that card has outperformed my expectations. Two games in a row the revealed card on Reshaper's death was a Strangler and I was able to process and kill a creature of the opponent's with its ETB trigger, talk about value. What I like about Strangler and Reshaper is in a bolt-heavy modern meta, these drops will get you value quickly, whereas Scourge would most likely come into play later (scourge T3, they kill before your T4, hopefully you've got TKS/Smasher/Herder in hand ready for T4).
I love Westvale Abbey in the deck. In my mana base I am either trading off a Shambling Vent or Ghost Quarter for Abbey and I think it's worth it in the relatively slow local meta I play in. This deck performs leaps better when you're getting TKS and Smasher out asap, so losing a tap-land and an self-destruct land for a late-game threat land is something I'm definitely alright with. Abbey's first ability is probably underrated, sure it's worse than Sea-Gate Wreckage if you're just looking at the first ability, but you can use Abbey when you have cards in your hand and that 1/1 can be a damn good chump blocker to buy turns while you topdeck as well. And getting to flip it is basically game-ending, and not necessarily in a win-more way. In a Jund matchup two weeks ago we each had 4-6 creatures on board and empty hands, he's got a 5+ something goyf and a beefed scooze to where I can't even swing with a Herder I've got out, I topdeck either another Herder or a Lingering Souls, flip Abbey, and they scoop when I do. I feel like I'm lucky in that usually we see 0-1 decks running some form of aggro, so I've got a few card decisions based on that. Other than the Abbey I've got a second Cavern of Souls (lots of blue players) and just this week I've decided to go from 3 to 2 Herders in favor of putting Batterskull back in. I ******* love Batterskull and I want it in the deck so much. It's an instant lifelink, 4/4 with vigilance creature at worst, it's an artifact that begs to be removed by your opponent that can also be saved by returning it to your hand, and moving it to a Smasher or Souls token is pretty OP. When I look at Herder and Batterskull as 5-drops, I would so much rather drop the Bskull much of the time, and while ramping a Herder is obviously good, getting the value of processing while ramping can be pretty tricky. I like Abbey and Batterskull both because of the ability to use mana late game on them if/when the draws aren't working in your favor.
Going back to the deck performing leaps better when ramping, I too am pretty sold on Mind Stone as a 2-of. Deaddrifts post just above mine discusses all the reasons to use it, getting a 1-2 turn ramp on Smasher being the strongest reason to play it. Often times I get to play a relic off the 1 mana on T2 when I Mind Stone, and that is a pretty decent set-up turn for this deck. Honestly I would love a second Sorin, but I don't see what else can be taken out for it other than Mind Stone and I don't think that's worth it. Increasing the consistency of ramping TKS and Smasher will get you wins, and the cantrip and colorless source seal the deal that this card deserves a spot.
This list seems very tight right now, and I really struggle with deciding how I can trim even 1 card to get something in for play-testing. It's great to see others having success with the deck locally, it is super fun to play and my favorite line to hear from an opponent is "I hate reality Smasher". I am baffled that there hasn't been any results posted by the deck at a large-scale tournament because I don't see where this deck is weak where other control decks aren't. Maybe it's because there's no pro level players grinding with the deck to perform better with it? Maybe no one's playing it online to have modern league representation?
Now that I've finally made an account, I'll try to make some posts on play reports and such. I think personally I could use lots of info on siding IN/OUT and strategies/game-plans against certain decks, and I'll contribute what I can. It would also be sweet if we could get some discussion on higher level plays that might not come up often, but are useful to know. An example would be "when facing U/B mill, always wait to use Relic's exile all ability and keep it untapped while your opponent has the open mana for Cryptic Incursion to crack it in response and stop their potentially huge lifegain". I mean relic alone has soooo many ways to get more value than just "exile card(s)" and as someone who's trying to play catch-up having recently jumped into modern I am looking for any and all ways to improve my piloting of the deck.
So we've got a modern no-ban tournament coming up in 2 weeks, having done it once before back in February. The first time I took my modern B/W Processors list and simply put in 2 Sensei's Divining Tops and managed to get 4th out of 25 or so. Would you think it would be better to stick with the current creature base for the one in two weeks, or should I bring in the Oblivion Sower and Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger package since I'll have Eye of Ugin available to me? I love Sower and was one of the last to take it out of my deck-list one Eye got banned, but the current creature build is much faster and I'm pretty content with Smashers being the main end-game threat. Right now my plan is to go with my current list, -2 Mind Stone/+2 Sensei's, and trimming two other cards for 2 Stoneforge Mystic to tutor and play Batterskull early. Any advice on a no-ban version of the deck would be appreciated.
Sorry for the wall of text, and thanks for all the discussion.
EDIT: I knew I forgot about something. I think Warping Wail deserves some testing in the sideboard and I've been playing with it for a couple weeks. The card is so versatile and that fits the deck pretty well, there are so many creatures in modern that can be exiled with it (and on turn two for 2 mana, 1 being colorless, it enables processors), and it seriously catches people off-guard when you are countering sorceries as a B/W deck. They will not play around Warping Wail and that is to our advantage.