MTG Salvation

That's why I asked. It's a neat effect, but setting up for the ultimate seems difficult if not, possibly, not worth the effort.

What was he using to target, out of curiosity?

In a group that plays broken artifact ramp he's solid. He is fragile like all Planeswalkers so I don't know why anyone would build around him specifically. Early game steal rocks and loot can make him worth a card and late game steal something ridiculous
As I alluded, he is meta-dependant: if people have great/ridiculous artifacts go to town.

The deck is land light and needs more lands. Luckily, you will also need more plains. Up the amount to 9 plains and cut four non-lands. Five plains will make double white difficult and 20 lands is very low with Brisela and Ugin. A resource on probabilities: https://www.channelfireball.com/articles/an-introduction-to-the-hypergeometric-distribution-for-magic-players/

Edit: and it looks like you already "slipped in" Ugin as it is a 61 card deck. Stick to 60 so you increase your probability of drawing your best cards.

Yeah, that's why I really enjoy my C/Ube. The power is flatter and it there are lots of opportunities for skill edges.

Motivator is interesting. I have thought about building it, but only if I add the hilariously stupid Goblin Assassin. I would also probably tool around with artifact lands and Welder. [Edit: and Goblin Grenade]

So Matron and Ringleader make something like Faithless Looting unnecessary?

Anyway, fun is obviously subjective, but is the red or blue deck more fun?

So, if I understand right, and amazing start might be the first player Thoughtseizes the second players combo piece, the second player FOWs the third players attempt to go off, the fourth player fizzles, but has the Pyroblast to stop the Swan Song of the fifth player who goes off and is countered by sixth players FOW and then the sixth player has Chain of vapor to stop player one? That kind of thing? I am not saying in reality they would all have their combos or all have interaction. I am just trying to wrap my head around disruption being spread around a table and not missing. It is really easy if you want to to create efficient and busted combo packages for multiplayer decks and each additional player seems (seems, I am not saying I know) to make it more likely that somebody can't stop one of the later players attempts.

What I have seen is half a table of people with deep collections and experience and half a table without. The first half, who is not even attempting to play really nastily, basically gets to ignore the other half because it is literally two different levels of magic.

In no way am I saying that the way most people seem to play is better and it is not any different in result - a win is a win is a win - but playing for 15 - 10 turns lets people feel (most likely this is illusory) that they got to play and interact. In fact, to bring this full circle, playing inefficient decks with long games are more a coin-flip because it comes down to player whims and politics and card sequencing. I just don't know anymore!

This looks fun. Have you considered a Goblin build?

I've admitted my comment was overboard so I will move on and ask one question here and one on you Gifts thread.

Question: So, say it is a highly powered multiplayer free-for-all environment with 6+ players playing 4-ofs, not EDH, Vintage banned list, and everyone is playing combo for the sake of the question and it is a known meta. What are the interaction spells? Force of Will, Swords, Standstill? I actually have never played in a meta where everyone had access and proclivity to play that way. I have had dis-balanced ones.

Quote from Prid3 »

Quote from Tamrian »

I've always assumed that one of the reasons people dislike combo so much is that permission, discard, and cheap spot removal lack viability in multiplayer and it only gets worse if multiple players are running exceptionally fast combos. Anyone want to play flip the coin to determine the winner?

Which is an argument typically made by people who don't play in those types of spheres or who are unwilling to build/modify their decks to adjust. As someone who routine plays broken formats such as cEDH I can promise you that games are anything but a coinflip. Player skill comes through on a consistent basis and you're heavily rewarded for your experience and decision-making (which includes deck building). It's no different that the people who think that Vintage is a turn 1 format or Legacy is a turn 1 format etc etc. No one who plays these formats on a frequent basis believes in these ridiculous claims because they're completed unfounded concerns. Most games are extremely interactive and a good chunk of your wins/losses are due to decisions that you made (for better or for worse).

It isn't comparable to either of those formats (which I play, so I do understand the correlation you are attempting to create). 1 vs. 1 with things like Thoughseize and Force of Will is different. I don't care if you agree. I have very little interest in your typical incessant need to be correct. My comment was a general one and I stand by it.

Edit: However, I admit my poor phrasing and snarky joke. "Coin-flip" is hyperbolic and dismissive and is literally used by those that do not understand eternal formats. So, word choice and tone, my bad.

I've always assumed that one of the reasons people dislike combo so much is that permission, discard, and cheap spot removal lack viability in multiplayer and it only gets worse if multiple players are running exceptionally fast combos. Anyone want to play flip the coin to determine the winner?

I would look to cut the filler (the two pyromancers and guttersnipe). I would defiantly consider splashingfor Horizon Scholar since you have the proper land and disciple. 16 lands seems greedy; you have some great cards so you aren't afraid of the long game and Bamefire and spit flame + dragon aren't complaing if you are making your land drops. What are you losing to? Also, not running skyscanner in a deck with your bomby cards seems wrong. It helps make land drops and find them. Finally, how's recollect been?

I think you accidentally posted incorrectly. You may want to delete and repost.

Well, it is faster, in a better color (at least in terms of sitting on disruption), and has the all important text: "draw a card." I would say significantly better and the piper is considered playable.

Does this move her up in your rankings? After all, she has no special building constraints besides good creatures, which in modern Magic is kind of where we are at.

Quote from Prid3 »

Quote from Xyx »

Your Arcane Artisan review suggests that you need library manipulation but she requires zero setup.

"[T]his card is still reasonable even if you're just using it as a generic draw engine..."

It's fine, perfectly playable, but it's not busted unless you're pairing it with Brainstorms.

Xyx's point is that Brainstorm is unneeded because you discard from your hand after drawing. She obviously becomes better if you draw more so that you assure a creature in your hand, but it doesn't have to be the card you draw. She's busted.