About Planeswalkers, I'm not sure how much play I will be able to do in September as I have some stuff coming up in the next 2 weekends (I only play Paper), so Arlinn might not be a smart buy. Now Samut, Voice of Dissent is not expensive (even cheaper than Arlinn), but do you think she makes the cut? Saw some lists with 1x maindeck, that's something I woudn't mind buying and test since it has more time in Standard.
Got the point in both Life Goes On vs Zombies and Harnessed Lightning vs monored, both makes sense, thanks for explaining.
About the Hazoret replacement, comparing to your list, this spot is curenly taken by Larger than life, and that's something I'm willing to replace for something else to see what happens, with so much removal and control, going a bit away from combo might help. There was this time where I played with 2 Lathnu Hellions maindeck because I was playing with 2 Rhonas (borrowed a second from a friend), I didn't go that well (found myself multiple times with Rhonas by himself on the battlefield and second one in hand, multiple pumps, etc). I guess I was very unlucky that day, maybe I could try 2 Lathnus main deck again as a replacement for Larger Than Life or glorybringers so I don't mess with energy and get some good value in mid-game.
I haven't really tried Samut since between her and Arlinn, Arlinn is the better choice. The only time I will be testing Samut out is when Arlinn rotates out unless there is a better walker when Ixalan is released.
As for Rhonas, the ideal partner for him is Bristling Hydra because of staying power. Outside Hydra, it's Glorybringer or a pumped Longtusk Cub.
Thanks Kehbehboi for providing the details about the deck & strategy, everything you said makes sense. I wish I had the Trackers, when I built the deck I was trying to keep it budget and ended up not getting them, since they are also rotation soon (same for Chandra - not going to rotate, but pretty expensive for me). The card draw is something the deck really lacks and I think we will have a good option for that when Ixalan is out with that new enchantment that gives draw when our creatures are targeted by opponents spells.
Besides not having these cards, the deck usually puts results and I've made top 4 in the PPTQ and 3rd place in a standard showdow one time. Yesterday was a below average for me going 2-2 (ended up 7th out of 14).
I have not yet played against the MonoRed, but since you talked about Life Goes On, I will give it a chance and try it out instead of adding more sweepers, probably also helps vs zombies? I didn't understand why you removed Harness Lightning vs MonoRed, would help to control early and reach mid-game, right?
Hazoret is not an option for me anymore since the price has skyrocket, so my plan now is to go for the second (maybe third) Glorybringer. I'm still missing the second Rhonas (was very lucky to open one), but I find myself being in lots of situations where Rhonas is alone in the battlefield, and that's when Lathno comes in and surprises the opponent. It doesn't work well with Hydra that's true, but fact is, usually Lathnu gets removed the next turn, so it basically hits 4 and feeds itself this one turn, together with Longtusk, they've been the MVP's vs control matches.
While I was researching on budget options for decks, Prowling Serpopard is the best replacement for Tireless Tracker for the same reason. If you don't have Chandra, then you can opt for Arlinn Kord since it is one of the cheapest planeswalkers in the market and can synergize well with Glorybringer and Bristling Hydra, also her ultimate looks so sweet.
As for Life Goes On, it works well against Mono Red but I don't know about Zombies. Zombies don't care about life gain since they can dish back what you've gained, so the more efficient strategy so far is to put in more efficient removals and fat blockers. As a side note, they are scared when there is Electrostatic Pummeler on the board. Most of my opponents suddenly switch from aggressive to defensive mode since Pummeler with 6 or more energy must be respected. So I usually bluff them with open mana for pump spells that do not exist in my hand.
As with the Harnessed Lightning, I don't know if it was just that situation or not but it only serves to remove creatures with toughness 4 or more. The only creature that fits that description is Hazoret and Aethersphere Harvester. Hazoret can't be killed with out current arsenal and Aethersphere Harvester can be removed by Abrade. So it would be just wise to spend one mana instead of two to remove their creatures with the burn spells I have and block with my creatures while saving my Abrade for Aethersphere Harvester.
You can drop Hazoret if you're on a tight budget. You can replace it with Lathnu Hellions if you like but play only two so that it won't fight with Bristling Hydra or Electrostatic Pummeler for energy but the second Rhonas is a must. Yeah he's expensive because it's seeing modern play but according to my friend's predictions, Rhonas might get a decrease in price because lately he's is seeing less modern play with all of the Path to Exiles in that format and he is only seeing limited play in standard. Let's just hope that the price does decrease.
So how are you able to beat UR Control without lathnu hellion and Prowling Serpopard? Could you go over about your sideboard plans and how the match usually goes?
I believe you need Sweltering suns for better matchup vs mono-red and zombies.
When I was making the deck, I was choosing between Tireless Tracker and Prowling Serpopard. Prowling Serpopard is good at negating counter spells and baiting removals aside from activating Rhonas but Tireless Tracker is good against a wider range of decks providing us with card draws and makes the deck last against grindy match ups. Against control, opponents usually grind the game with more removals, sweeps, Thing in the Ice and the optional Dragonmaster Outcast postboard. I want to put threats after removals and sweeps to pressure control opponents, and I can't do that if I don't have cards in my hand or if I draw lands in turns 5 onwards. I didn't put Lathnu Hellion in my sideboard since in postboard, my energy producers are reduced with -3 Voltaic Brawler, -1 Fling and -4 Electrostaic Pummeler for +3 Glorybringer, +3 Tireless Tracker and +2 Chandra. I want to reserve my energy for Bristling Hydra since it's the bane of control decks. Lathnu Hellion and Hydra would've fought each other for energy.
In my opinion, Prowling Serpopard and Lathnu Hellion would have worked before Hour of Devastation since we only have Essence Scatter, Censor, Sweltering Suns and Disallow to worry. Now, control decks have more toys with Hour of Devastation, Supreme Will and Nicol Bolas. This why postboard I opt to go aggro-midrange without losing card advantage and board pressure rather than retain the combo plan with Pummeler.
Against mono-red, I don't know if it is just me or something else but I don't know why they are scared when a Pummeler is out when the pressure is on us rather than them. As a combo deck, we are more weak against hyper-aggro decks like Zombies or Ramunap Red. Watching the Pro Tour, I noticed that their weakness is early to mid game board pressure and life gain. That is why I opted to go Life Goes On rather than Sweltering Suns or Radiant Flames because gaining 8 life hurts them so much after turns 3 or 4 and that there are fatties blocking them. After playtesting with a teammate using Ramunap Red with the Tom Ross list, I found that -3 Voltaic Brawler, -3 Harnessed Lightning and -1 Servant of the Conduit for +3 Magma Spray +2 Life Goes On and +2 Glorybringers with Rhonas and Hazoret checking the opposing Hazoret is the key.
This is the deck that I'm playing right now. After extensive playtesting with my friends, it can hold well against Ramunap Red/Rakdos Aggro, U/W Monument/God Pharaoh's Gift and U/R Control.
Hi, I recently decided to pick up RG Pummeler again after seeing the Amsterdam/Manila lists, but I still need a little help to tune the deck. This is what I'm playing currently:
What would you suggest against a meta like this: Temur Energy, Zombies, Control (Grixis, UR, 4-Color), Monument and some Metalwork Colossus. I've seen the "Midrange" Package with Trackers, but I don't have them and I don't know if it's too late to buy them rotating soon. Any help appreciated.
Remove one Forest and one Fling for two Abrades or remove another Harnessed Lightning for three Abrades. Trackers are good for grindy matchups but you can be all set up with just the Prowling Serpopards. Also replace the Sheltered Thickets. cycling is only good if you're planning to go long with games and with this kind of deck you want to go fast. Since you want to go fast, you can't have a land entering tapped because that will mess up your curve.
Remove the Harnessed Lightning from your SB. Replace it with Appetite for the Unnatural for Cast Out or Solemnity if you know someone is running them, or another Magma Spray.
Depends on what you are trying to do because there isn't just one "Stompy" deck. It's just a catch-all term for any mono green or mostly green fast aggro strategy. I personally feel like the deck does best without any of the cards you listed, and I have tried both.
Hierarch/Mystic - What are you trying to ramp into? This deck wants to play a lot of 1 and 2 drops, so you don't really need ramp, and having ramp lowers your threat density.
CoCo - It can be hard to get to 4 mana before it matters, and again you are sacrificing something for CoCo, and you have to run more creatures. Running CoCo just doesn't leave enough room for impact spells like Vines of Vastwood, Rancor, Aspect of Hydra, etc.
I think the deck you are talking about with ramp and CoCo is more of a mid-range deck called Mono Green Devotion. Nothing wrong with that deck, but it's not "Stompy" per se.
thanks for the info. if that's the case then my deck is good to go . one last thing guys what should my sb plan be if the meta is affinity, DnT and Death's Shadow? This is the whole deck with temporary sb plan.
i'm planning to do an G/R monsters or G/R pummeler deck with a transformative sideboard. How does Majestic Myriarch and Ambuscade fare with either decks?
very informative sideboarding guide, which is what i need. with B/G and Temur Energy the dominant decks in the LGS< i'll be MBing some cards to deal with them more effectively game 1.
so... me not including Whirler Virtuoso was not really a mistake after all.
i think Strasky went overboard with the dorks, though. maybe split Channeler Initiate and Longtusk Cub will suffice. if the deck doesn't have Thopter tokens to dump the -1/-1 counters from the Initiate into, it could be a bad topteck mid game.
a teammate of mine runs temur energy. he sideboards 2 for zombies match ups together with removals. forget initiate go cub all the way or split it up with two cubs-two rhonas.
i could and i also have 4 Harnessed Lightning mainboard. but post board i wanna make sure i can kill those opposing Longtusk Cubs and Glorybringers. they seem to be the high priority targets for removal.
depends on who's on the play and on the draw. if you're on the play, go tempo. a creature or two, servant excluded and preferably a longtusk cub, then just protect them and clear the opponents creatures. if the opponent gets a hydra, hopefully that cub is big or check it with your own hydra. save your harnessed lightnings for glorybringers. on the draw, go midrange, remove creatures, chump block with rogue refiners. save your bombs unless needed. when the opponent has 2 or 3 cards then put them up. kozilek's return-elder deep fiend-kozilek's return usually does the trick or a controlled sweep with radiant flames.
alright. thanks! i am not on the EDF package, though, but maybe with more removal when on the draw i can manage.
i could and i also have 4 Harnessed Lightning mainboard. but post board i wanna make sure i can kill those opposing Longtusk Cubs and Glorybringers. they seem to be the high priority targets for removal.
depends on who's on the play and on the draw. if you're on the play, go tempo. a creature or two, servant excluded and preferably a longtusk cub, then just protect them and clear the opponents creatures. if the opponent gets a hydra, hopefully that cub is big or check it with your own hydra. save your harnessed lightnings for glorybringers. on the draw, go midrange, remove creatures, chump block with rogue refiners. save your bombs unless needed. when the opponent has 2 or 3 cards then put them up. kozilek's return-elder deep fiend-kozilek's return usually does the trick or a controlled sweep with radiant flames.
75 as it stands. Will be making more updates w/ more games this weekend.
how is khenra and rishkar doing? i'm still skeptical about those two.
tried a G/R deck last FNM with the Charioteer (no Rishkar, though). went 2-2. losses were to Temur marvel.
with the Charioteer in play, Lathnu Hellion and Bristling Hydra became more effective. but it's not quite as impressive as i hoped. if it's the only creature on the board (or with dorks and/or 2/2 Longtusk Cubs) it's rather underwhelming.
so i am undecided on whether or not it's good to include them. seems to work fine for Lugger, though, so it has potential.
i'll switch to Temur Energy with Elder Deep Friend for next FNM. i went 3-1-1 at an FNM before with that. loss and draw were to Temur Marvel.
i am so glad Marvel's gone. good riddance.
hear hear. since the banning, my LGS had no Marvel players, the FNM i had was pretty much a wild west senario where everyone were playing different decks. there was new perspectives, U/R control. U/B control, Tower variants, U/R Drakes, U/W control, Grixis Summonings and Jund Madness/BR Hazoret Key. i went back to the deck that started it all, with R/G Pummeler and went 4-0. i might change decks to Jund Energy aggro if the shift is into B/G and vehicles.
https://kibykibs.wixsite.com/savageknuckleblade/single-post/2017/08/04/The-Jank-ness-Standard-Thundercats-Deck-Tech-in-MtG
Tell me what you think?
I haven't really tried Samut since between her and Arlinn, Arlinn is the better choice. The only time I will be testing Samut out is when Arlinn rotates out unless there is a better walker when Ixalan is released.
As for Rhonas, the ideal partner for him is Bristling Hydra because of staying power. Outside Hydra, it's Glorybringer or a pumped Longtusk Cub.
While I was researching on budget options for decks, Prowling Serpopard is the best replacement for Tireless Tracker for the same reason. If you don't have Chandra, then you can opt for Arlinn Kord since it is one of the cheapest planeswalkers in the market and can synergize well with Glorybringer and Bristling Hydra, also her ultimate looks so sweet.
As for Life Goes On, it works well against Mono Red but I don't know about Zombies. Zombies don't care about life gain since they can dish back what you've gained, so the more efficient strategy so far is to put in more efficient removals and fat blockers. As a side note, they are scared when there is Electrostatic Pummeler on the board. Most of my opponents suddenly switch from aggressive to defensive mode since Pummeler with 6 or more energy must be respected. So I usually bluff them with open mana for pump spells that do not exist in my hand.
As with the Harnessed Lightning, I don't know if it was just that situation or not but it only serves to remove creatures with toughness 4 or more. The only creature that fits that description is Hazoret and Aethersphere Harvester. Hazoret can't be killed with out current arsenal and Aethersphere Harvester can be removed by Abrade. So it would be just wise to spend one mana instead of two to remove their creatures with the burn spells I have and block with my creatures while saving my Abrade for Aethersphere Harvester.
You can drop Hazoret if you're on a tight budget. You can replace it with Lathnu Hellions if you like but play only two so that it won't fight with Bristling Hydra or Electrostatic Pummeler for energy but the second Rhonas is a must. Yeah he's expensive because it's seeing modern play but according to my friend's predictions, Rhonas might get a decrease in price because lately he's is seeing less modern play with all of the Path to Exiles in that format and he is only seeing limited play in standard. Let's just hope that the price does decrease.
When I was making the deck, I was choosing between Tireless Tracker and Prowling Serpopard. Prowling Serpopard is good at negating counter spells and baiting removals aside from activating Rhonas but Tireless Tracker is good against a wider range of decks providing us with card draws and makes the deck last against grindy match ups. Against control, opponents usually grind the game with more removals, sweeps, Thing in the Ice and the optional Dragonmaster Outcast postboard. I want to put threats after removals and sweeps to pressure control opponents, and I can't do that if I don't have cards in my hand or if I draw lands in turns 5 onwards. I didn't put Lathnu Hellion in my sideboard since in postboard, my energy producers are reduced with -3 Voltaic Brawler, -1 Fling and -4 Electrostaic Pummeler for +3 Glorybringer, +3 Tireless Tracker and +2 Chandra. I want to reserve my energy for Bristling Hydra since it's the bane of control decks. Lathnu Hellion and Hydra would've fought each other for energy.
In my opinion, Prowling Serpopard and Lathnu Hellion would have worked before Hour of Devastation since we only have Essence Scatter, Censor, Sweltering Suns and Disallow to worry. Now, control decks have more toys with Hour of Devastation, Supreme Will and Nicol Bolas. This why postboard I opt to go aggro-midrange without losing card advantage and board pressure rather than retain the combo plan with Pummeler.
Against mono-red, I don't know if it is just me or something else but I don't know why they are scared when a Pummeler is out when the pressure is on us rather than them. As a combo deck, we are more weak against hyper-aggro decks like Zombies or Ramunap Red. Watching the Pro Tour, I noticed that their weakness is early to mid game board pressure and life gain. That is why I opted to go Life Goes On rather than Sweltering Suns or Radiant Flames because gaining 8 life hurts them so much after turns 3 or 4 and that there are fatties blocking them. After playtesting with a teammate using Ramunap Red with the Tom Ross list, I found that -3 Voltaic Brawler, -3 Harnessed Lightning and -1 Servant of the Conduit for +3 Magma Spray +2 Life Goes On and +2 Glorybringers with Rhonas and Hazoret checking the opposing Hazoret is the key.
4 Servant of the Conduit
3 Longtusk Cub
3 Voltaic Brawler
4 Electrostatic Pummeler
2 Rhonas the Indomitable
4 Bristling Hydra
2 Hazoret the Fervent
Noncreature Spells
4 Attune with Aether
4 Blossoming Defense
4 Invigorating Rampage
3 Harnessed Lightning
2 Abrade
1 Fling
4 Aether Hub
4 Game Trail
2 Cinder Glade
1 Hashep Oasis
6 Forest
3 Mountain
2 Life Goes On
2 Heroic Intervention
2 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
3 Magma Spray
3 Tireless Tracker
3 Glorybringer
I'm still finding a way to beat Zombies and Ramp without grinding too much. Any suggestions?
Remove one Forest and one Fling for two Abrades or remove another Harnessed Lightning for three Abrades. Trackers are good for grindy matchups but you can be all set up with just the Prowling Serpopards. Also replace the Sheltered Thickets. cycling is only good if you're planning to go long with games and with this kind of deck you want to go fast. Since you want to go fast, you can't have a land entering tapped because that will mess up your curve.
Remove the Harnessed Lightning from your SB. Replace it with Appetite for the Unnatural for Cast Out or Solemnity if you know someone is running them, or another Magma Spray.
thanks for the info. if that's the case then my deck is good to go
4 Experiment One
4 Dryad Militant
4 Strangleroot Geist
4 Avatar of the Resolute
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Leatherback Baloth
4 Dungrove Elder
4 Rancor
4 Vines of Vastwood
3 Aspect of the Hydra
4 Dismember
Lands
3 Treetop Village
16 Forests
1 Relic of Progenitus
2 Lifecrafter's Bestiary
2 Nature's Claim
2 Feed the Clan
2 Beast Within
2 Creeping Corrosion
2 Obstinate Baloth
2 Thrun the Last Troll
this is a nice deck but IMO i think i would cut two harnessed lightnings with two abrades for those vehicles and monuments. what's the SB like?
a teammate of mine runs temur energy. he sideboards 2 for zombies match ups together with removals. forget initiate go cub all the way or split it up with two cubs-two rhonas.
for all those playing temur energy, this might help
https://www.channelfireball.com/articles/a-guide-to-temur-energy-for-the-new-standard/
as for R/G pummeler, this is really useful. i'm also running the same list and it works wonders.
http://www.mtgmintcard.com/articles/writers/soh-weng-heng/sideboard-guide-for-red-green-pummeler
depends on who's on the play and on the draw. if you're on the play, go tempo. a creature or two, servant excluded and preferably a longtusk cub, then just protect them and clear the opponents creatures. if the opponent gets a hydra, hopefully that cub is big or check it with your own hydra. save your harnessed lightnings for glorybringers. on the draw, go midrange, remove creatures, chump block with rogue refiners. save your bombs unless needed. when the opponent has 2 or 3 cards then put them up. kozilek's return-elder deep fiend-kozilek's return usually does the trick or a controlled sweep with radiant flames.
hear hear. since the banning, my LGS had no Marvel players, the FNM i had was pretty much a wild west senario where everyone were playing different decks. there was new perspectives, U/R control. U/B control, Tower variants, U/R Drakes, U/W control, Grixis Summonings and Jund Madness/BR Hazoret Key. i went back to the deck that started it all, with R/G Pummeler and went 4-0. i might change decks to Jund Energy aggro if the shift is into B/G and vehicles.
how is khenra and rishkar doing? i'm still skeptical about those two.