The [energy] does nothing by itself, and relies on you playing a subpar [creature or spell] that is a somewhat more powerful effect then what the effect should cost should you reach [energy value x]. If your argument is that [energy] is non-interactive, then consider the fact that [energy] does literally nothing without casting cards that are interactive because the cards casted can be countered, killed if they are creatures, etc.
My ultimate point is playing with energy deserves to be complained about and 'until the end of the game' is just like energy, or delerium with no GY hate, just like Emrakul, and infinite kitties, and smuggly wuggly, and Gideon.
It IS freaking obnoxious and Standard events aren't firing all over the place so no one gets to play any cards because players are tired of it.
When Standard is fixed and we all get to play every FNM then you get back to me.
How cute, you copied everything I said but inserted the energy mechanic instead of city blessing. Ill play along with your blatant trolling that I am certainly going to report you for, so to start with - do you even play Standard? Or MtG? THEY ARE TWO COMPLETELY DIFFERENT MECHANICS. They are functionally different, they have different pacing, require two different kinds of interaction to work together, and are just 100% not the same at all. Why do I even bother with this with you kids. Ugh.
Typical finding anything and everything grasping for straws MtGS complaining when something new is spoiled. The emblem does nothing by itself, and relies on you playing a subpar edict effect that is a somewhat more powerful effect then what the effect should cost should you reach Ascend. If your argument is that City's Blessing is non-interactive, then consider the fact that the blessing does literally nothing without casting cards that are interactive because the cards casted can be countered, killed if they are creatures, etc.
My ultimate point is stop complaining to complain as per usual. It is freaking obnoxious. Play the cards first then get back to me.
I think they’re running out of design space in this game...
Why do you say that? How would you design a mechanic? Way to add something to the discussion, really helps everyone out. Super positive contribution to just say "they're running out of design space". Ugh.
For like the 927372893847 time in every spoiler season, play with the actual cards before you kids start your complaints.
You could ignore the tutoring altogether and run it with Boris Devilboon and discard outlets.
If you're not doing that, you don't really need too many demons for this to be decent value. It would certainly be a lot better if it tutored on ETB though.
And that's how you brew right.
I agree. This is how Commander is done right. Using unplayed jank to make something flavorful and functionally awesome. Love this synergy with Boris Devilboon.
I suppose that can be considered uncreative using nothing but other planeswalker abilities, but again, how else would they design the card to meet the insane power level expectations that Urza has that would work even in jokey silver bordered games. Like what do you want, +50 loyalty win the game shred up your opponents cards, eat your opponent's lunch and steal their girlfriend? A real Urza card is impossible to please everyone power level wise and flavor wise, so this is a good middle ground even if it is a little uncreative. I still think it is cool to have every Planeswalker ability as it is over the top powerful, funny, and fits with Urza's character. I feel like most of you are just complaining to complain cuz that is the typical MtGS thing to do. There is rarely any genuine criticism here, just on the contrary to be on the contrary cuz internet.
Honestly i just wanted new abilities, i don't care if they are "powerful enough". Right now you can basically take 20 planeswalker, shuffle them and use them instead of the site. That's Urza.
BORING.
It's also boring that they didn't even try to "fix" some abilities to fit Urza's personality. He put octopus and dragon tokens into play. He becomes a dragon. Why? Why not constructs and golems or whatever, more fitting to Urza's personality and background?
Sure, but would you have been honestly satisfied with whatever new abilities they would have given Urza as a planeswalker card? It probably would have been too overpowered or underpowered to someone like yourself with extremely high expectations. It is virtually impossible to design an Urza card that fits flavor and power level wise.
Is this a joke post? I genuinely can't tell if you are trolling, but I will play anyways. First off, they DID give Urza 30+ abilities. Also they won't change the card just because people complain. Lastly, how else would you design the card? You can't fit everything onto one card with what you are asking for here. Are you complaining just to complain because internet?
I think people are disappointed because it's nothing new. Ot's just a collage of already existing abilities. When the site was online i tried a -6, excited to see which kind of effect i would have got:
"Create three 1/1 black Assassin creature tokens with Whenever this creature deals combat damage to a player, that player loses the game."
... that's Vraska. That's not new, not exciting and not urza
I suppose that can be considered uncreative using nothing but other planeswalker abilities, but again, how else would they design the card to meet the insane power level expectations that Urza has that would work even in jokey silver bordered games. Like what do you want, +50 loyalty win the game shred up your opponents cards, eat your opponent's lunch and steal their girlfriend? A real Urza card is impossible to please everyone power level wise and flavor wise, so this is a good middle ground even if it is a little uncreative. I still think it is cool to have every Planeswalker ability as it is over the top powerful, funny, and fits with Urza's character. I feel like most of you are just complaining to complain cuz that is the typical MtGS thing to do. There is rarely any genuine criticism here, just on the contrary to be on the contrary cuz internet.
WHAT!? This is it? Random effects from other planeswalker cards!?
Am I the only one who's gravely disappointed by this? Maybe I was being naïve, but I was honestly hoping they'd give Urza 30+ abilities that fit the character's flavor and power set.
Up to date, almost all existing planeswalker cards had abilities that were in line with the character, their role in the story and their magic specialization. There were only a few exceptions and those were mostly poorly received. (Yes, I'm looking at you, Liliana of the Dark Realms.) This cards had great potential, but as it is, it REALLY DOESN'T DO URZA ANY JUSTICE AT ALL!!!
I'll *head to* Blogatog (pun intended) and tell MaRo how betrayed the Vorthos in me feels. If you feel the same way, let your voice be heard too! Maybe if enough players express their disapproval of how poorly this cards reflects Urza's personality and skills, the website will receive an update. That's the good thing about it: the abilities can be changed at a moment's notice.
Is this a joke post? I genuinely can't tell if you are trolling, but I will play anyways. First off, they DID give Urza 30+ abilities. Also they won't change the card just because people complain. Lastly, how else would you design the card? You can't fit everything onto one card with what you are asking for here. Are you complaining just to complain because internet?
Still going to use my old-bordered foil-basics from 7th, invasion and that era. Much brighter, traditional and colorful than this force of will rip-off.
Good god you realize how hipstery you come off? I know that the kneejerk reaction to a basic land that is potentially $75-$100 is to go with the older stuff, but these are really quite nice. The price isn't worth that for these lands, but they are still cool.
I don't get it. If you're not in love with something that a lot of people like, you're not allowed to express it because that makes you a hipster? Aten't people entitled to their opinions without being subjected to name calling?
I'm not too high on these either, personally. I guess I should keep my mouth shut about it. Though I prefer the Bradley cycle from BFZ, which must be the most pedestrian basics out there these days, so good luck tagging me too a hipster. I don't know, I just don't think these look enough like magic cards.
I call out hipster because it is obvious his response is a auto knee jerk to be on the contrary sake to be an cool guy mcfly individual post, rather than have anything constructive to say about the lands. If you genuinely don't like them, that's fine but it is really apparent when someone is disliking something just to try and be different.
Still going to use my old-bordered foil-basics from 7th, invasion and that era. Much brighter, traditional and colorful than this force of will rip-off.
Good god you realize how hipstery you come off? I know that the kneejerk reaction to a basic land that is potentially $75-$100 is to go with the older stuff, but these are really quite nice. The price isn't worth that for these lands, but they are still cool.
This is better than the Unglued full art basics because of the sleek bordering on the bottom, and how there is no border on the sides. Wonder how much these will be per land though. I am guessing $10.
// 11 Instant
1 Stifle
1 Trickbind
1 Hatred
1 Time Stop
1 Tainted Strike
1 Final Fortune
1 Reins of Power
1 Soul's Fire
1 Summary Dismissal
1 Glorious End
1 Disallow
// 36 Land
3 Island
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Snow-Covered Swamp
1 Snow-Covered Mountain
1 Snow-Covered Island
1 Hall of the Bandit Lord
1 Steam Vents
1 Rogue's Passage
3 Mountain
3 Swamp
1 Watery Grave
1 Blood Crypt
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Shizo, Death's Storehouse
1 Smoldering Marsh
1 Homeward Path
1 Sunken Hollow
1 Volcanic Island
1 Underground Sea
1 Badlands
1 Izzet Boilerworks
1 Dimir Aqueduct
1 Rakdos Carnarium
1 Cascade Bluffs
1 Sunken Ruins
1 Graven Cairns
1 Geier Reach Sanitarium
1 Cathedral of War
1 Canyon Slough
1 Fetid Pools
// 1 Planeswalker
1 Dack Fayden
// 6 Sorcery
1 Living Death
1 Blasphemous Act
1 Faithless Looting
1 Mystic Retrieval
1 Scrap Mastery
1 Ever After
// 2 Sideboard
// 1 Creature
SB: 1 Lord of Tresserhorn
// 1 Land
SB: 1 Lost Vale
// 1 Tokens
// 1 Emblem
1 Dack Fayden (emblem)
Here is my list in case you would like some ideas. It is focused on winning out of nowhere, from a sudden infinite combo, Phage win, or a one shot Lord of Tresserhorn. Every card works with each other so no tutors are necessary. I have every possible way in the game to counter a triggered ability, except for Voidslime and Humility since those are outside of Grixis colors. I think taking out your ETB triggers will help you the most.
To help you out a bit with what to cut for The Immortal Sun, I'd cut Liliana's Mastery. The Immortal Sun only costs 1 more mana, it's easier to cast because it's all generic mana, and has more boons. It pumps all your creatures regardless if they're zombies or not, it reduces the costs of all your spells by 1, you get to draw an additional card, and has the bonus of hosing planeswalkers. By contrast Liliana's Mastery gives you two 2/2 black zombie creature tokens when it enters the battlefield (technically they're gonna be 3/3) and that's basically it. If you're already running Liliana's Mastery, what's 1 more in order to have the same boon and then some?
As for what to silver-bordered cards to include that stay on theme, you can add the following:
Over My Dead Bodies works for this deck because if you're sacrificing creatures, they're gonna be in the graveyard. However, with them in the graveyard, this enchantment still lets you attack them. Any creatures that deal combat damage to each other will be exiled, which is a bonus against other reanimator decks.
Time Out is another good removal spell because it puts the nonland permanent into the deck anywhere between the 2nd and 7th place.
I disagree with Immortal Sun over Liliana's Mastery. Liliana's Mastery creating two zombie tokens is huge in Lord of Tresserhorn. The two tokens can have multiple synergies with many other very relevant zombie matters cards like multiplying them with Endless Ranks of the Dead for starters, and by creating two zombie tokens Liliana's Mastery acts as an enabler to sacrifice two creatures AND it puts Lord of Tressehorn in a two hit kill range. Immortal Sun does not enable you to cast Lord of Tresserhorn and is really goodstuff filler that does not fully synergize with the rest of the deck.
As far as silver bordered cards, the best ones are probably the ones you mentioned. No uncard sticks out to me as being worthy of being in your deck.
Also I would like to point out how many ETB triggers you have, and with Torpor Orb that is an ultimate nombo. May I suggest a fully dedicated anti ETB deck with death triggers or leaves the battlefield triggers instead? Think creatures like Nevermaker (brutal if copied and sacrificed). Running Stifle, Trickbind etc. makes your deck way more able to interact with your Commander and being able to stop more non-interactive strategies such as Kiki-Jiki infinites etc. Having Torpor Orb with your own ETB creatures is just feel bads.
Since those decks have access to white, you have two stellar options for single target removal instead...that exile at a cheaper cost and instant speed.
Repercussion shenanigans? It’s not a good card.
This kind of thought is what Stifles creativity and makes Commander stagnant. By your logic here, why play anything else other than Path to Exile or Swords to Plowshares? Let's make every deck exactly the same. When I see a card like this, I see a lot of potential other than a card like Swords to Plowshares that plays the game for you. Pay one white to exile, real challenging. Takes alot of deck design and decision making out of the game and makes your personal touches on your deck blandy bland bland. I feel like alot of people are missing the point of Commander when they look at everything in the strictly better sense. If everyone did strictly better, every deck would be exactly the same. No thanks.
Although this won't completely solve the problem with Commanders that have effects while they sit in the Command Zone, I can't stress enough to put every single Stifle "counter triggered ability" card printed, and be able to recur them. Nearly every broken thing that happens in Commander is a triggered ability, or at least a activated ability. Stifle, Trickbind, Time Stop, Glorious End, Voidslime, Disallow, Nimble Obstructionist, Summary Dismissal...I think that is absolutely every single card that can counter a triggered ability. All of those will help you be interactive with seemigly non-interactive commanders.
This is nothing but positives for Commander. It solidifies that Commander is a casual format, not competitive. It will be great to see more laughs and outrageous plays instead of the super serious atmosphere in a lot of games I walk into. Un-cards are for in person games, not online, which is great too because Commander online is virtually unplayable because of how fast it turns into a pure only play to win fest due to the social aspect being totally taken out. I hope after some cards that could be black bordered are tested there will be an official list of what works reasonable and functionally in Commander.
How cute, you copied everything I said but inserted the energy mechanic instead of city blessing. Ill play along with your blatant trolling that I am certainly going to report you for, so to start with - do you even play Standard? Or MtG? THEY ARE TWO COMPLETELY DIFFERENT MECHANICS. They are functionally different, they have different pacing, require two different kinds of interaction to work together, and are just 100% not the same at all. Why do I even bother with this with you kids. Ugh.
My ultimate point is stop complaining to complain as per usual. It is freaking obnoxious. Play the cards first then get back to me.
Why do you say that? How would you design a mechanic? Way to add something to the discussion, really helps everyone out. Super positive contribution to just say "they're running out of design space". Ugh.
For like the 927372893847 time in every spoiler season, play with the actual cards before you kids start your complaints.
I agree. This is how Commander is done right. Using unplayed jank to make something flavorful and functionally awesome. Love this synergy with Boris Devilboon.
Sure, but would you have been honestly satisfied with whatever new abilities they would have given Urza as a planeswalker card? It probably would have been too overpowered or underpowered to someone like yourself with extremely high expectations. It is virtually impossible to design an Urza card that fits flavor and power level wise.
I suppose that can be considered uncreative using nothing but other planeswalker abilities, but again, how else would they design the card to meet the insane power level expectations that Urza has that would work even in jokey silver bordered games. Like what do you want, +50 loyalty win the game shred up your opponents cards, eat your opponent's lunch and steal their girlfriend? A real Urza card is impossible to please everyone power level wise and flavor wise, so this is a good middle ground even if it is a little uncreative. I still think it is cool to have every Planeswalker ability as it is over the top powerful, funny, and fits with Urza's character. I feel like most of you are just complaining to complain cuz that is the typical MtGS thing to do. There is rarely any genuine criticism here, just on the contrary to be on the contrary cuz internet.
Is this a joke post? I genuinely can't tell if you are trolling, but I will play anyways. First off, they DID give Urza 30+ abilities. Also they won't change the card just because people complain. Lastly, how else would you design the card? You can't fit everything onto one card with what you are asking for here. Are you complaining just to complain because internet?
I call out hipster because it is obvious his response is a auto knee jerk to be on the contrary sake to be an cool guy mcfly individual post, rather than have anything constructive to say about the lands. If you genuinely don't like them, that's fine but it is really apparent when someone is disliking something just to try and be different.
Good god you realize how hipstery you come off? I know that the kneejerk reaction to a basic land that is potentially $75-$100 is to go with the older stuff, but these are really quite nice. The price isn't worth that for these lands, but they are still cool.
// 10 Artifact
1 Torpor Orb
1 Anvil of Bogardan
1 Chromatic Lantern
1 Vedalken Orrery
1 Mindlock Orb
1 Sundial of the Infinite
1 Altar of Dementia
1 Phyrexian Altar
1 Dowsing Dagger
1 Skullclamp
// 30 Creature
1 Volrath's Shapeshifter
1 Mikaeus, the Unhallowed
1 Phage the Untouchable
1 Filth
1 Havengul Lich
1 Necrotic Ooze
1 Grimgrin, Corpse-Born
1 Deathbringer Thoctar
1 Wonder
1 Thraximundar
1 Gravecrawler
1 Notion Thief
1 Undead Alchemist
1 Dralnu, Lich Lord
1 Death Baron
1 Fatestitcher
1 Nekusar, the Mindrazer
1 Ghoulcaller Gisa
1 Corpse Augur
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
1 Diregraf Colossus
1 Magus of the Wheel
1 Haunted Dead
1 Nevermaker
1 Anger
1 Feldon of the Third Path
1 Nimble Obstructionist
1 Vindictive Lich
1 Glen Elendra Archmage
1 The Locust God
// 5 Enchantment
1 Elemental Mastery
1 Endless Whispers
1 Rooftop Storm
1 Goblin Bombardment
1 Phyrexian Reclamation
// 11 Instant
1 Stifle
1 Trickbind
1 Hatred
1 Time Stop
1 Tainted Strike
1 Final Fortune
1 Reins of Power
1 Soul's Fire
1 Summary Dismissal
1 Glorious End
1 Disallow
// 36 Land
3 Island
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Snow-Covered Swamp
1 Snow-Covered Mountain
1 Snow-Covered Island
1 Hall of the Bandit Lord
1 Steam Vents
1 Rogue's Passage
3 Mountain
3 Swamp
1 Watery Grave
1 Blood Crypt
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Shizo, Death's Storehouse
1 Smoldering Marsh
1 Homeward Path
1 Sunken Hollow
1 Volcanic Island
1 Underground Sea
1 Badlands
1 Izzet Boilerworks
1 Dimir Aqueduct
1 Rakdos Carnarium
1 Cascade Bluffs
1 Sunken Ruins
1 Graven Cairns
1 Geier Reach Sanitarium
1 Cathedral of War
1 Canyon Slough
1 Fetid Pools
// 1 Planeswalker
1 Dack Fayden
// 6 Sorcery
1 Living Death
1 Blasphemous Act
1 Faithless Looting
1 Mystic Retrieval
1 Scrap Mastery
1 Ever After
// 2 Sideboard
// 1 Creature
SB: 1 Lord of Tresserhorn
// 1 Land
SB: 1 Lost Vale
// 1 Tokens
// 1 Emblem
1 Dack Fayden (emblem)
Here is my list in case you would like some ideas. It is focused on winning out of nowhere, from a sudden infinite combo, Phage win, or a one shot Lord of Tresserhorn. Every card works with each other so no tutors are necessary. I have every possible way in the game to counter a triggered ability, except for Voidslime and Humility since those are outside of Grixis colors. I think taking out your ETB triggers will help you the most.
I disagree with Immortal Sun over Liliana's Mastery. Liliana's Mastery creating two zombie tokens is huge in Lord of Tresserhorn. The two tokens can have multiple synergies with many other very relevant zombie matters cards like multiplying them with Endless Ranks of the Dead for starters, and by creating two zombie tokens Liliana's Mastery acts as an enabler to sacrifice two creatures AND it puts Lord of Tressehorn in a two hit kill range. Immortal Sun does not enable you to cast Lord of Tresserhorn and is really goodstuff filler that does not fully synergize with the rest of the deck.
As far as silver bordered cards, the best ones are probably the ones you mentioned. No uncard sticks out to me as being worthy of being in your deck.
Also I would like to point out how many ETB triggers you have, and with Torpor Orb that is an ultimate nombo. May I suggest a fully dedicated anti ETB deck with death triggers or leaves the battlefield triggers instead? Think creatures like Nevermaker (brutal if copied and sacrificed). Running Stifle, Trickbind etc. makes your deck way more able to interact with your Commander and being able to stop more non-interactive strategies such as Kiki-Jiki infinites etc. Having Torpor Orb with your own ETB creatures is just feel bads.
This kind of thought is what Stifles creativity and makes Commander stagnant. By your logic here, why play anything else other than Path to Exile or Swords to Plowshares? Let's make every deck exactly the same. When I see a card like this, I see a lot of potential other than a card like Swords to Plowshares that plays the game for you. Pay one white to exile, real challenging. Takes alot of deck design and decision making out of the game and makes your personal touches on your deck blandy bland bland. I feel like alot of people are missing the point of Commander when they look at everything in the strictly better sense. If everyone did strictly better, every deck would be exactly the same. No thanks.