I'm curious to know what this deck looks like after a decade. How many of your original elephants are still in the deck? How does this deck hang with all the power-creeped cards that have been released in the past 10 years?
I built a deck with The First Sliver at the helm, but I found him to not be an enjoyable general as cascade chains took too long to resolve. I've tweaked the deck very heavily to be more of a control deck that uses the 5C legends as finishers. How does it look? Terrible mana-base aside.
Mana severance would also be super busted. Lab Man + Gush + gitaxian probe + 96 islands is a 1/3 turn 3 win, 2/3 turn 4 win every time. Obviously assuming no Counterspell or removal.
Also busted, Sol Ring. Haven’t seen that mentioned yet.
On a fun note, master transmuter, through the breach and natural order
I've a slower cube. It's focused more around battlecruiser/EDH-ish with casting and wrecking people with large dragons. A good way to summarize it is I've put Worldspine Wurm into a deck without any ways to cheat it into play and cast it.
Since I don't support Mono-R aggro a whole lot, my red section struggled with a distinct identity. I tried a goblin subtheme but that didn't stick. I tried artifact synergies, but blue just did that better. However, I really like Chandra, so I've been putting a bunch of Chandras in my cube. So one of red's sub-themes was that while every other color is capped on planeswalkers at 3. Red gets basically as many playable Chandras as they print. Which until recently was basically Chandra, Torch of Defiance, Chandra, the Firebrand, and Chandra, Flamecaller. I'm also running Chandra Nalaar and Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh because even though my friends think they're complete trash. They're actually 23rd card playable in my cube. Anyway they just printed Chandra, Fire Artisan and Chandra, Awakened Inferno who are also super strong and I'm adding.
Here's my list. I think they're pretty similar, but the two most notable differences are the manabase (I decided to follow darren's suit and stick with a traditional, non-budget manabase) as well as cutting almost all the Champion dorks as well as Myr Galvanizer - I drew the Galvanizer in about half the games I played and he was incredibly mediocre every time, I'm not convinced he's worth running just for the combo alone.
I really think the Champion dorks are really strong. I just have way better luck with them it seems, see my above experience. Galvanizer is really bad outside that combo. I've almost never drawn him and the times that I have it usually rapidly lets me combo off. I'll put him higher on my watch list though, because he is really terrible in a vacuum.
Looking ahead, in addition to Risen Reef, I'm probably going to pick up Wirewood Symbiote and give it a try too (though I worry about having too many bouncers and not enough things to do with the bounce). Coat of Arms is an idea I hadn't considered (though it seems so obvious that I'm not sure why) so I might try and test that. I'm also going to try and explore the idea of running a lot of tribal-exclusionary wraths as a way of keeping up on board to buy time for my synergies to come together - I'm already running Crux of Fate and Widespread Brutality, and Wakening Sun's Avatar was a recent inclusion I'm eager to try out, but Rakdos, the Showstopper might find its way back in and Hythonia the Cruel might work OK as well (though I'm more dubious of that one).
Ironically, I had someone play Crux of Fate against me naming dragons. I think my meta-game is a bit less creature reliant, I'm pretty comfortable with the two wrath spells I'm running. Crux of Fate is great, but I have a ton of dragon cards already. :/
I've only played about 5 or 6 games so the sample size isn't large, but so far it's played about how I thought it would, I.E. with wild swings of variance. Of those games, the highest point was curving Manaweft Sliver + changelings into turn 4 Sliver Queen into turn 5 tutor for Hibernation Sliver which helped dodge a wrath that same turn cycle, turn 6 I replayed everything and then finally turn 7 I assembled Cloudshredder Sliver + Reaper King + Impostor of the Sixth Pride in play, which with the other two slivers is "Pay 2 life: Destroy target permanent". My opponents scooped to just that combo, and I even randomly drew into Tolsimir that turn but was a mana short of playing it alongside everything else. That's probably the closest thing to this deck's nut draw.
The lowest point was being stuck on 4 lands for most of another game, with a draw that had both Hibernation Sliver and Walker of Secret Ways but no ways to abuse them and only 1 changeling to go along with my various tribal lords. Ways to filter cards or hit land drops seem pretty important for making sure the deck can function into the late game. I wish I could play like 5 copies of Elder Pine of Jukai.
Two cards that seemed continuously impressive without ever being cast were Patriarch's Bidding and Living Death. Half the games I played I had one of these cards in hand and could play to the board knowing I could get everything back if a wrath hit (though I never actually cast them, either because I wasn't wrathed and won or because I died with my board in tact). Living Death being a pseudo-wrath that gets around indestructible is nice too.
Personally I'm thinking of cutting Sliver Overlord. I find casting it, paying 3 mana and then the casting cost of a sliver to be prohibitively slow. The only thing I ever really wanted to search for was Sliver Hivelord which I cut.
Patriarch's Bidding and Coat of Arms seem great, I'm just worried about the fact that they benefit everyone. I think other people might get more use out of casting them than I do. My metagame has a bunch of graveyard abuse decks and token swarms are always popular. This is the primary reason I hadn't added them myself.
I'm also planning on porting this over to mtgNexus in the near future.
Im not really a fan of going infinite, and tutors are also largely discouraged. Hence, I take a more draw cards approach.
If someone dies to a four card combo that takes multiple turns to assemble, can be easily disrupted by Doom Blade, in a deck that can't tutor for the pieces (outside of tutors that have summoning sickness or an 8 mana investment) then I don't the slightest bit of remorse.
Descendants' path is a ticking timebomb. As soon as you get one changeling, it can easily get you yet another.
Although a lot of cards are nice to combo with a changeling, such as Wirewood Savage or Loam Dweller, they have little to no impact on their own and they often sport a creature type that isnt easily intermingled.
Wirewood Savage draws cards? I feel like in a way that's significantly more consistent then Descendants' path. Descendants' path requires a changeling on board and then it has a 50% chance of drawing you a card every turn. I just have a hard time expecting that to be anywhere near good enough with no top deck manipulation.
From my experience, to make a changeling deck really formidable is that you want to consider the changeling as cheap 'clones'. That is, combine it with creatures that do something really serious with their own creature type. Just getting 1 changeling alongside then quickly becomes 'ok this is serious' into 'omg whats happening? 10 5/5s coming my way?!'
I feel like I have done this thing? My non-changelings are either ramp, card advantage, removal or a combo-piece (usually while ramping or providing card advantage). What would you define as "really serious" with their own creature type? The only things that turn changelings into 5/5s that I know of off hand are Coat of Arms and Crucible of Fire.
I finally put my deck together and played some games, and so far it's been a blast. Strangely I kept drawing the same half of the deck (I cast Knowledge Exploitation on turn 4 three games in a row) so I'm looking forward to playing with Higure and some of the other cards that have been talked about.
How has the deck been running for you. Could you post your list? I'm curious to know how similar it is to my own. Any particular standout cards? I've been running into a bunch of wrath spells and been getting blown out. Have you had this problem at all? This deck top-decks terribly and really wants to over-commit to the board for maximum value.
Kaalia, Zenith Seeker - A good, efficient flying body that has a decent chance of drawing 1 or 2 cards with the deck running 18+ changelings as well as some actual dragons, Kaalia might squeeze in for me. Might need some testing to see how reliable the draw is. If this ever draws 3 its insane.
I play Gishath, Sun's Avatar with ~25 dinosaurs. Gishath has missed for me a couple of times. It's enough of a feels bad there that I doubt I'll run Kaalia here. Bouncing her with Mirror Entity and Hibernation Sliver does seem cool though.
Omnath, Locus of the Roil - I'm more unsure about this one. It'll be an FTK a reasonable amount of the time which is alright, and slowly growing our changelings or itself into bigger threats is nice (especially for me since I'm running the full suite of fetches), but we don't run enough land ramp to reliably get to 8 lands and that's where most of the value of this thing lies. I was initially high on it, but thinking about it more has me less optimistic.
I usually only have 2-3 changelings on the battlefield max at anytime due to the amount of wrath spells I've been seeing. Him being a shock is super underwhelming. I'd consider him much more if I knew I could consistently hit 8 lands for him.
Other than those and Risen Reef (which is an auto-include), I'm not seeing anything else worth running.
Pretty much, which is fine because Risen Reef is boss.
Finally got myself a Morophon, the Boundless so I'm adding that and cutting Loam Dweller. The dweller just didn't do nearly enough. No idea what I'll cut for Risen Reef. I'll deal with that problem in a few weeks.
- He gets back a fair amount of changelings (most notably Mirror Entity). He's probably not good enough, but his synergy with Wirewood Symbiote and Hibernation Sliver does amuse me a fair amount.
Probably not worth it I'd guess. I'm running 10 humans plus 16 changeglings, so the odds of hitting are mediocre.
This guy would fight for the same slot that Tolsimir, Friend to Wolves is sitting in. Tolsimir has a way higher upside but also costs way more mana. Tolsimir is also tutorable with Skyshroud Poacher. I'll probably stick with Tolsimir for now, but I'll keep an eye on him. Tolsimir also unlocks "wolves" where as I already have "angels" unlocked.
First two games in with the deck and obviously there was some getting used to the cards Enough misplays for sure but it did let me get a feel for the deck and had me made some changes to my list.
Cards Out: Patron of the Vein - Highly costed and cutting the single double black card will help as well. Evolution Sage - With Patron gone I'm not going to keep it in just for the Vivids. Descendants' Path - Just fell short half of the time, so looking for a bigger impact.
Cards In: Felidar Guardian - Reset button for Arcane Adaptation, but can blink other stuff as well. Najeela, the Blade-Blossom - No dragons but the warrior tokens will quickly stack up if unchecked. Finale of Devastation - A tutor that can recur from the graveyard and comes with a built in pump effect.
I wonder how Najeela, is going to turn out for you. She seems pretty spicy, especially with all my drawtriggers. There's gotta be a really dump way to go infinite with her in this deck right?
Attack with all of them. Untap all your creatures. Tap changelings and Manaweft for WUBRG. Use floating mana to untap. Kill the table with Changeling Outcast? That's fantastic, I should pick a copy of her up. With 5 changelings you get infinite mana (but only during a combat step) and can draw your deck with Azami and such. Interesting interesting.
@ materpillar
Since you are looking for themed wraths, did you consider Whelming Wave?
I've considered it. I never really thought it'd be worth it. Bouncing creatures in EDH seems lack luster since there are such a massive multitude of ETB triggers that get played.
I just saw this card in another thread. I wonder if it'd be good enough for me. I've had a little trouble with over-extending into a wrath spell, this might be an on theme draw spell. With only 16 changelings though, she'd probably miss a ton. Hrm. Maybe not.
It doesn't look like you really have any way to draw cards. If you get your graveyard exiled with only one or two cards in hand it seems like you'd run out of steam extremely fast. I feel like this deck would really enjoy having a Skullclamp and it would also help with this problem.
Maybe you don't sacrifice enough fodder, but I'm a huge fan of Pitiless Plunderer in sacrifice decks.
With all your land recursion Memorial to Folly could work as a bad Genesis. Also, with your dredge/land package Azusa, Lost but Seeking is a really good ramp creature. Especially with all your sacrifice lands.
This deck looks like it has a hard time actually getting people dead in an efficient amount of time. Might be worth slotting in Craterhoof Behemoth to end the game with Worm Harvest.
Got my preordered cards in today, so along with the updates to my other decks I went and built a version of this deck as well. Took some inspiration from the lists posted here with some minor changes based on which cards I had around.
The mana base is obviously makeshift as well, since am working with what I had laying around. Roughly based it on being fetchable through Krosan Verge and Skyshroud Claim since I lack actual fetches to fix colors.
The oddball is probably Evolution Sage but I enjoyed it with the Vivid lands in other decks, so a bit of a pet inclusion. It's also the reason why I do have Patron of the Vein still in this list.
Seems pretty close to my list. I'll be curious to know how it works out for you. Since you're running traditional wrath spells, I'd look into picking up a Sliver Hivelord eventually if you enjoy the deck enough. Loam Dweller is certainly the weakest card in the deck. I'd probably recommend you cut it for some flavor of draw spell (distant melody if you're staying on theme, FoF/Rhystic Study if you're not) since your deck has just a few less draw spells than mine.
I've never played with Descendants' Path and have a hard time evaluating it. If you cast it some could you tell me how well it pans out for you?
I'm weary of playing Arcane Adaptation since this deck has so many different creature types. Usually it'll only buff one creature card and if that card dies it'll kinda be useless. Unless you're naming dragon, but all that does is make it a mana rock which is fine I suppose.
Widespread Brutality has been a pretty underwhelming card for me so far. Although, to be fair it's super hard on my manabase which you probably won't struggle with. I'm just... REALLY limited on correctly themed wraths. I think Endemic Plague is much better.
I do mean CHAGELING tribal. Every creature in the deck is a changeling. With Morophon as commander, here are a few interesting cards I found. Any other ideas? The idea is to abuse effects that target a specific creature type and jam them all into one deck.
So, I've been running a changeling deck very consistently these past few months. A few notes:Morophon the Boundless isn't actually the best general for the changeling deck. The Ur-Dragon does the same thing, except he doesn't need to be on the battlefield. Reaper King is straight up way more powerful as an effect.
A deck with only changelings and no non-changeling creatures is going to be pretty weak. Half your deck is going to be grizzly bears with extremely minor upside. Top decking a changeling with no synergy cards suuuuuucks, just as long as you're aware.
There's a couple of lists bumping around in my thread, or if you don't feel like reading through that here's the list. Do note: it's more derpy combo oriented and less face beating with lords.
Oathkeeper, Takeno's Daisho is super cool but not strong enough for my purposes. However if your going to stick with only changelings and non-creature synergy cards it might be good enough. You'll probably also want Elvish Guidance.
-1 Chameleon Colossus
+1 Irregular Cohort
I never really wanted to search for the colossus. I've played one game and already been way happier with the cohort.
-1 Moonglove Changeling
+1 Venomous Changeling
Having natural deathtouch and a 1/3 body is way better. I originally thought that Venomous Changeling was only 2 mana, not 3.
-1 Wort, Boggart Auntie
+1 Graveshifter
Wort never got me back more than one creature, I was never happy with her. Graveshifter is going to be fantastic with Unholy Grotto (which I can't find anywhere)
-1 Woodland Changeling
+1 Universal Automaton
I thought about this for a long time, Woodland changeling's body is effectively non-existent. I decided I'd rather have Cairn Wanderer because it can be a 4/4 flying, lifelink, deathtouch, haste. All of which are relevant. I think Skeletal Changeling's regeneration is more relevant than +1/+1. I think an extra mana for flying is worth it on Avian Changeling. Mothdust Changeling's kinda flying is also better. Taurean Mauler actually affects the board outside of being a changeling. Amoeboid Changeling has a bunch of tiny synergies.
Having played with a fair amount of Changelings in a Tolsimir, Friend of Wolves deck, this deck idea is definitely intriguing to me. Especially since I wanted to change up from Tolsimir and other ‘small’ tokens decks. Initially I wanted to see about building a dragons deck with Ur-Dragon, but this looks like a fun alternative that I might piece together instead.
I'd recommend it. Part of what makes me so happy about this deck is how much feel people have watching me play it.
Some epic lords I want to suggest. I have my own deck that isn't with changelings, but it's using as many lords as I can (a maximum of one per creature type) and abusing that with Mirror Entity. Here're my suggestions:
Lullmage Mentor helps counter any annoying spell that might ruin your plans.
The Scarab God does wonders at the beginning of your upkeep with enough changelings in play.
Lord of the Unreal is solid for giving your changelings hexproof. And if you make him into an illusion he protects himself.
Persistent Petitioners if you wanna have some alternate wincon. Not only that, but milling opponents can get creatures in there that can make Cairn Wanderer a have a ton of keyword abilities.
Lullmage Mentor is frankly not going to happen. Speaking from experience, it's immensely rare that I've managed to keep 7 changelings alive.
The Scarab God is very interesting. My first instinct was dismissing him as his synergies with Changelings is very minimal. However, his token creation would also allow me to re-trigger stuff with my dead changelings. I'll probably look into picking one up if I get the chance. He seems sweet.
Lord of the Unreal suffers from the fact that I'm mostly using my changelings to trigger ETB effects. Once the changelings are on the battlefield they don't do much.
Aboshan, Cephalid Emperor is a sweet older card. I don't think it'd have a largest enough effect to warrant. My changelings also want to tap to attack and for mana. This competes directly with those desires.
Persistent Petitioners. This one I need to think about for a little longer. I don't know if it'd have a large enough effect. However, it is hilarious enough that I need to process it some more. It'd be especially great with the Scarab God. Hmmm.
So while going through some cards I found one that will add another creature type to the ones you get to say! Meet Scarblade Elite! Sure it's a touch slow but it does kill things by hurling random changelings at them.
Dragonlover
Ooooh. Scarblade Elite is pretty sweet. Skyshroud Poacher can even find him. Unfortunately, this deck doesn't seem to struggle a ton against single creatures and I'm worried the elite would be too slow.
Ironically I just saw someone lose a game yesterday because they had cut Reliquary Tower from their deck. They'd forgotten and cracked an expedition map to go find it. Didn't have it, and had to discard their hand because of Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur. Thus death. In fact, I've seen Jin-Gitaxias so much recently I've considered adding Reliquary Tower back into my decks out of sheer annoyance. Admittedly, this is an extremely niche personal metagame situation.
Another strong point in favor of running Reliquary Tower is because if you do happen to randomly draw 18+ cards, the rest of the table doesn't have to wait for 5 minutes while you carefully decide what to discard at the end of your turn... which also happened to me yesterday.
I will not recommend cards from the new set since I am sure you are on top of that.
Wirewood symbiote is a fairly good protection card/etb reuser that happens to go infinite with mirror entity and priest of titania or elvish archdruid or Harabaz Druid or any other card that somehow can tap for 3 or more mana (2 mana and you can get infinitely many etb triggers - in either case you can reduce the mana generation requirement by 1 if your creatures does not die when activating mirror entity for 0 - e.g. because all creatures have boosted toughness)
elvish guidance is annother creature type matters accel spell.
That wirewood symbiote combo is exactly the flavor of stupid I’m looking for. I hadn’t even put that together the first time I considered the symbiote.
Elvish guidance won’t make the cut specifically because it isn’t a creature for my silly combos like that one.
Haakon is cool but I’m not going to dedicate slots to getting him in the graveyard.
As for mana, Birchlore Rangers does not feel right, but it exists.
Sarkhan, Fireblood can cast much of your deck.
Qasali Slingers is repeatable disenchant in your deck.
Hrm. I’ll need to think about Birchlore Rangers some more. It’s way less explosive but has almost-haste and actually fixes colors.
Qasali Slingers is fantastic! I’m getting one of those this weekend for sure.
I love changeling decks. Using Ur-dragon is ideal here because the cost reduction + drawing cards on creatures attacking is needed gas because changelings themselves are weak individually.
Ever find space for something like Kindred Discovery or Knight Exemplar? You have so many options, which is the nice thing about a deck like this. Is Scourge of Valkas hard to cast here? It may need some manabase adjustments but the potential is there.
These decks are never really too strong, but they're amusing to watch and can still pull off wins.
I thought about adding Knight Exemplar but usually no one bothers killing my changelings, they kill the synergy pieces. I’ve cut a bunch of lords that protected them because of this. I was also running Sliver Hivelord instead of Knight Exemplar as it does the same thing but also protects itself.
Scourge of Valkas suffers from not being as good as my other dragons and I’m really trying to limit the number of tribal synergies to 3. I give a pass for synergies that enable infinite combos (dragons, slivers and soon elves).
Kindred Discovery is probably good enough. When I first read it I didn’t realize it was on attack also and only thought it wasn’t ETB. I’ll have to consider some more. This list is getting tight. -.-
Ur-Dragon is way better than Morophon as a commander. Ur-Dragon does the same amount of cost reduction except while not on the battlefield. Ur-Dragon can also get me back into the game with lots of card draw. Morophon also makes the ur-dragon cost 5 less and is tutorable via moggcatcher.
This deck is looking for tribal specific ramp/mana fixings cards more than anything else (like Thunderherd Migration, Harabaz Druid) but I don't know if any more of them really exist. As it turns out having 10/35 lands only tapping for colorless (for non-changelings) makes casting things like Azami, Lady of Scrolls REALLY hard.
Also, I've found that I'm pretty weak towards non-creature threats like enchantments and artifacts as I only have twoways to destroy enchantments (both of which always instantly die to removal) and three (four?) to destroy artifacts.
Extremely obscure tribal cards are always welcome too.
So I just saw The First Sliver and realized I really wanted a sliver EDH deck as Slivers was the first deck I built. I've got a ton of nostalgia for them and a ton of them lying around. Here's just what I scrapped together recently.
I'm pretty aware some of the sliver choices are sub-optimal and the mana base is baaaad. My goal is to make a deck that is tries to take out the table via combat damage, so not a hyper competitive combo monstrosity. I also want to run Primal Surge as a way to more efficiently make this happen, so that and Patriarch's Bidding are the only non-permanents I plan on running.
I'm just worried about running out of gas (although The First Sliver being my general should help out there), and not really having much removal at all. I was wondering if you had any recommendations in those areas?
I'm curious to know what this deck looks like after a decade. How many of your original elephants are still in the deck? How does this deck hang with all the power-creeped cards that have been released in the past 10 years?
I'd like to add Spiteful Sliver and Blasphemous act as a finisher or maybe slot in pestilence or pyrohemia since they synergize so well with the hivelord.
I'd also like to add Psionic Sliver/quilled sliver they're great with the deathtouch slivers and the hivelord.
1 Sliver Hivelord
Creature
1 Heart Sliver
1 Winged Sliver
1 Hunter Sliver
1 Quick Sliver
1 Gemhide Sliver
1 Harmonic Sliver
1 Manaweft Sliver
1 Diffusion Sliver
1 Venom Sliver
1 Crystalline Sliver
1 Hibernation Sliver
1 Root Sliver
1 dormant sliver
1 Shifting Sliver
1 Basal Sliver
1 Necrotic Sliver
1 Homing Sliver
1 Bonescythe Sliver
1 Lavabelly Sliver
1 Essence Sliver
1 Toxin Sliver
1 Constricting Sliver
1 Notion Thief
1 Sliver Queen
1 Sliver Overlord
1 Sliver Legion
1 The First Sliver
Enchantment
1 Worship
1 Rhystic Study
1 Spreading Plague
1 Privileged Position
1 Wild Pair
1 Asceticism
1 Call to the Kindred
1 Bounty of the Luxa
1 Wilderness Reclamation
1 Karplusan Forest
1 City of Brass
1 Llanowar Wastes
1 Battlefield Forge
1 Graven Cairns
1 Terramorphic Expanse
1 Vivid Crag
1 Vivid Creek
1 Vivid Grove
1 Vivid Marsh
1 Mystic Gate
1 Arcane Sanctum
1 Crumbling Necropolis
1 Jungle Shrine
1 Raging Ravine
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Vivid Meadow
1 Kessig Wolf Run
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Mystic Monastery
1 Opulent Palace
1 Frontier Bivouac
1 Savage Lands
1 Cascading Cataracts
1 Unclaimed Territory
1 Steam Vents
1 Blood Crypt
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Godless Shrine
1 Plains
1 Island
2 Forest
1 Mountain
1 Swamp
1 Sol Ring
1 Mind Stone
1 Obelisk of Alara
1 Darksteel Ingot
1 Swiftfoot Boots
1 Coalition Relic
1 Talisman of Curiosity
1 Talisman of Resilience
Instant
1 Counterspell
1 Mortify
1 Voidslime
1 Sudden Death
1 Sudden Spoiling
1 Negate
1 Terminate
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 Return to Dust
1 Arcane Denial
1 Chemister's Insight
1 Disdainful Stroke
1 Return of the Wildspeaker
Sorcery
1 Day of Judgment
1 Recurring Insight
1 Vandalblast
1 Compulsive Research
1 Fumigate
1 Dusk // Dawn
Planeswalker
1 Ashiok, Dream Render
Mana severance would also be super busted. Lab Man + Gush + gitaxian probe + 96 islands is a 1/3 turn 3 win, 2/3 turn 4 win every time. Obviously assuming no Counterspell or removal.
Also busted, Sol Ring. Haven’t seen that mentioned yet.
On a fun note, master transmuter, through the breach and natural order
Since I don't support Mono-R aggro a whole lot, my red section struggled with a distinct identity. I tried a goblin subtheme but that didn't stick. I tried artifact synergies, but blue just did that better. However, I really like Chandra, so I've been putting a bunch of Chandras in my cube. So one of red's sub-themes was that while every other color is capped on planeswalkers at 3. Red gets basically as many playable Chandras as they print. Which until recently was basically Chandra, Torch of Defiance, Chandra, the Firebrand, and Chandra, Flamecaller. I'm also running Chandra Nalaar and Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh because even though my friends think they're complete trash. They're actually 23rd card playable in my cube. Anyway they just printed Chandra, Fire Artisan and Chandra, Awakened Inferno who are also super strong and I'm adding.
Since they just printed Chandra, Acolyte of Flame and Chandra's Regulator I was thinking of "officially" supporting "Chandra Tribal" as a one of Red's color identities. Is there any other good synergy cards like these I should consider adding? I'll probably get Oath of Chandra, Chandra's Phoenix, and Chandra's Triumph. Anything else I should consider?
Have one champion (say Titan) in hand and one changeling championing (say hero) the Wirewood Symbiote. Cast the Changeling Titan, champion the Changeling Hero. Use Wirewood Symbiote to bounce the Changeling Titan and untap Priest of Titania, the Changeling Hero returns and champions the Wirewood Symbiote. You've returned to the start of the loop. My friend drew into it while storming through his deck with Unesh, Criosphinx Sovereign and Morophon, the Boundless.
I really think the Champion dorks are really strong. I just have way better luck with them it seems, see my above experience. Galvanizer is really bad outside that combo. I've almost never drawn him and the times that I have it usually rapidly lets me combo off. I'll put him higher on my watch list though, because he is really terrible in a vacuum.
Ironically, I had someone play Crux of Fate against me naming dragons. I think my meta-game is a bit less creature reliant, I'm pretty comfortable with the two wrath spells I'm running. Crux of Fate is great, but I have a ton of dragon cards already. :/
How has Wakening Sun's Avatar been for you? 8 mana is a lot.
Personally I'm thinking of cutting Sliver Overlord. I find casting it, paying 3 mana and then the casting cost of a sliver to be prohibitively slow. The only thing I ever really wanted to search for was Sliver Hivelord which I cut.
Patriarch's Bidding and Coat of Arms seem great, I'm just worried about the fact that they benefit everyone. I think other people might get more use out of casting them than I do. My metagame has a bunch of graveyard abuse decks and token swarms are always popular. This is the primary reason I hadn't added them myself.
I'm also planning on porting this over to mtgNexus in the near future.
If someone dies to a four card combo that takes multiple turns to assemble, can be easily disrupted by Doom Blade, in a deck that can't tutor for the pieces (outside of tutors that have summoning sickness or an 8 mana investment) then I don't the slightest bit of remorse.
Wirewood Savage draws cards? I feel like in a way that's significantly more consistent then Descendants' path. Descendants' path requires a changeling on board and then it has a 50% chance of drawing you a card every turn. I just have a hard time expecting that to be anywhere near good enough with no top deck manipulation.
I feel like I have done this thing? My non-changelings are either ramp, card advantage, removal or a combo-piece (usually while ramping or providing card advantage). What would you define as "really serious" with their own creature type? The only things that turn changelings into 5/5s that I know of off hand are Coat of Arms and Crucible of Fire.
How has the deck been running for you. Could you post your list? I'm curious to know how similar it is to my own. Any particular standout cards? I've been running into a bunch of wrath spells and been getting blown out. Have you had this problem at all? This deck top-decks terribly and really wants to over-commit to the board for maximum value.
I play Gishath, Sun's Avatar with ~25 dinosaurs. Gishath has missed for me a couple of times. It's enough of a feels bad there that I doubt I'll run Kaalia here. Bouncing her with Mirror Entity and Hibernation Sliver does seem cool though.
I usually only have 2-3 changelings on the battlefield max at anytime due to the amount of wrath spells I've been seeing. Him being a shock is super underwhelming. I'd consider him much more if I knew I could consistently hit 8 lands for him.
Pretty much, which is fine because Risen Reef is boss.
Finally got myself a Morophon, the Boundless so I'm adding that and cutting Loam Dweller. The dweller just didn't do nearly enough. No idea what I'll cut for Risen Reef. I'll deal with that problem in a few weeks.
Probably not worth it I'd guess. I'm running 10 humans plus 16 changeglings, so the odds of hitting are mediocre.
This guy would fight for the same slot that Tolsimir, Friend to Wolves is sitting in. Tolsimir has a way higher upside but also costs way more mana. Tolsimir is also tutorable with Skyshroud Poacher. I'll probably stick with Tolsimir for now, but I'll keep an eye on him. Tolsimir also unlocks "wolves" where as I already have "angels" unlocked.
I wonder how Najeela, is going to turn out for you. She seems pretty spicy, especially with all my draw triggers. There's gotta be a really dump way to go infinite with her in this deck right?
[edit]Manaweft Sliver + Najeela, the Blade-Blossom + 4 changelings is infinite attack steps I believe?
Attack with all of them. Untap all your creatures. Tap changelings and Manaweft for WUBRG. Use floating mana to untap. Kill the table with Changeling Outcast? That's fantastic, I should pick a copy of her up. With 5 changelings you get infinite mana (but only during a combat step) and can draw your deck with Azami and such. Interesting interesting.
I've considered it. I never really thought it'd be worth it. Bouncing creatures in EDH seems lack luster since there are such a massive multitude of ETB triggers that get played.
I just saw this card in another thread. I wonder if it'd be good enough for me. I've had a little trouble with over-extending into a wrath spell, this might be an on theme draw spell. With only 16 changelings though, she'd probably miss a ton. Hrm. Maybe not.
Maybe you don't sacrifice enough fodder, but I'm a huge fan of Pitiless Plunderer in sacrifice decks.
I personally like Big Game Hunter more than Bone Shredder. Plus it's fantastic with Survival of the Fittest.
With all your land recursion Memorial to Folly could work as a bad Genesis. Also, with your dredge/land package Azusa, Lost but Seeking is a really good ramp creature. Especially with all your sacrifice lands.
This deck looks like it has a hard time actually getting people dead in an efficient amount of time. Might be worth slotting in Craterhoof Behemoth to end the game with Worm Harvest.
I want it NOW! NOW I SAY!
Seems pretty close to my list. I'll be curious to know how it works out for you. Since you're running traditional wrath spells, I'd look into picking up a Sliver Hivelord eventually if you enjoy the deck enough. Loam Dweller is certainly the weakest card in the deck. I'd probably recommend you cut it for some flavor of draw spell (distant melody if you're staying on theme, FoF/Rhystic Study if you're not) since your deck has just a few less draw spells than mine.
I've never played with Descendants' Path and have a hard time evaluating it. If you cast it some could you tell me how well it pans out for you?
I'm weary of playing Arcane Adaptation since this deck has so many different creature types. Usually it'll only buff one creature card and if that card dies it'll kinda be useless. Unless you're naming dragon, but all that does is make it a mana rock which is fine I suppose.
Widespread Brutality has been a pretty underwhelming card for me so far. Although, to be fair it's super hard on my manabase which you probably won't struggle with. I'm just... REALLY limited on correctly themed wraths. I think Endemic Plague is much better.
So, I've been running a changeling deck very consistently these past few months. A few notes:Morophon the Boundless isn't actually the best general for the changeling deck. The Ur-Dragon does the same thing, except he doesn't need to be on the battlefield. Reaper King is straight up way more powerful as an effect.
A deck with only changelings and no non-changeling creatures is going to be pretty weak. Half your deck is going to be grizzly bears with extremely minor upside. Top decking a changeling with no synergy cards suuuuuucks, just as long as you're aware.
The cards that over perform in my changeling deck are Sachi, Daughter of Seshiro, Cryptic Gateway, Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow, Dragon's Hoard, and Spit Flame. I would also recommend the full Lorwyn block land cycle (Murmuring Bosk, Wanderwine Hub, etc).
There's a couple of lists bumping around in my thread, or if you don't feel like reading through that here's the list. Do note: it's more derpy combo oriented and less face beating with lords.
Oathkeeper, Takeno's Daisho is super cool but not strong enough for my purposes. However if your going to stick with only changelings and non-creature synergy cards it might be good enough. You'll probably also want Elvish Guidance.
-1 Artificial Evolution
I never actually cast Artifical Evolution. It was also brought to my attention that Wirewood Symbiote + Mirror Entity + Priest of Titania = infinite green mana. Walker of Secret Ways always over-performs for me and this also does a fine imitation of her. Plus the symbiote will be fantastic with Graveshifter
-1 Chameleon Colossus
+1 Irregular Cohort
I never really wanted to search for the colossus. I've played one game and already been way happier with the cohort.
-1 Moonglove Changeling
+1 Venomous Changeling
Having natural deathtouch and a 1/3 body is way better. I originally thought that Venomous Changeling was only 2 mana, not 3.
-1 Fire-Belly Changeling
+1 Impostor of the Sixth Pride
Imposter is always a 3/1 and the Fire-belly needs to be pumped. More on specific changeling cuts later.
-1 Ghostly Changeling
+1 Changeling Outcast
I never pumped the moonglove in any game. 1-mana reduction and unblockable is great.
-1 Wort, Boggart Auntie
+1 Graveshifter
Wort never got me back more than one creature, I was never happy with her. Graveshifter is going to be fantastic with Unholy Grotto (which I can't find anywhere)
-1 Woodland Changeling
+1 Universal Automaton
I thought about this for a long time, Woodland changeling's body is effectively non-existent. I decided I'd rather have Cairn Wanderer because it can be a 4/4 flying, lifelink, deathtouch, haste. All of which are relevant. I think Skeletal Changeling's regeneration is more relevant than +1/+1. I think an extra mana for flying is worth it on Avian Changeling. Mothdust Changeling's kinda flying is also better. Taurean Mauler actually affects the board outside of being a changeling. Amoeboid Changeling has a bunch of tiny synergies.
Shapesharer, mirror entity, Changeling Titan (and the rest of the cycle) are just miles away from being cut.
Morophon, the Boundless is going in whenever I pick one up. I just haven't yet. Not really sure what I'll cut.
I'd recommend it. Part of what makes me so happy about this deck is how much feel people have watching me play it.
Lullmage Mentor is frankly not going to happen. Speaking from experience, it's immensely rare that I've managed to keep 7 changelings alive.
The Scarab God is very interesting. My first instinct was dismissing him as his synergies with Changelings is very minimal. However, his token creation would also allow me to re-trigger stuff with my dead changelings. I'll probably look into picking one up if I get the chance. He seems sweet.
Lord of the Unreal suffers from the fact that I'm mostly using my changelings to trigger ETB effects. Once the changelings are on the battlefield they don't do much.
Aboshan, Cephalid Emperor is a sweet older card. I don't think it'd have a largest enough effect to warrant. My changelings also want to tap to attack and for mana. This competes directly with those desires.
Persistent Petitioners. This one I need to think about for a little longer. I don't know if it'd have a large enough effect. However, it is hilarious enough that I need to process it some more. It'd be especially great with the Scarab God. Hmmm.
Ooooh. Scarblade Elite is pretty sweet. Skyshroud Poacher can even find him. Unfortunately, this deck doesn't seem to struggle a ton against single creatures and I'm worried the elite would be too slow.
Another strong point in favor of running Reliquary Tower is because if you do happen to randomly draw 18+ cards, the rest of the table doesn't have to wait for 5 minutes while you carefully decide what to discard at the end of your turn... which also happened to me yesterday.
That wirewood symbiote combo is exactly the flavor of stupid I’m looking for. I hadn’t even put that together the first time I considered the symbiote.
Elvish guidance won’t make the cut specifically because it isn’t a creature for my silly combos like that one.
Haakon is cool but I’m not going to dedicate slots to getting him in the graveyard.
Hrm. I’ll need to think about Birchlore Rangers some more. It’s way less explosive but has almost-haste and actually fixes colors.
Qasali Slingers is fantastic! I’m getting one of those this weekend for sure.
I thought about adding Knight Exemplar but usually no one bothers killing my changelings, they kill the synergy pieces. I’ve cut a bunch of lords that protected them because of this. I was also running Sliver Hivelord instead of Knight Exemplar as it does the same thing but also protects itself.
Scourge of Valkas suffers from not being as good as my other dragons and I’m really trying to limit the number of tribal synergies to 3. I give a pass for synergies that enable infinite combos (dragons, slivers and soon elves).
Kindred Discovery is probably good enough. When I first read it I didn’t realize it was on attack also and only thought it wasn’t ETB. I’ll have to consider some more. This list is getting tight. -.-
Ur-Dragon is way better than Morophon as a commander. Ur-Dragon does the same amount of cost reduction except while not on the battlefield. Ur-Dragon can also get me back into the game with lots of card draw. Morophon also makes the ur-dragon cost 5 less and is tutorable via moggcatcher.
This deck is looking for tribal specific ramp/mana fixings cards more than anything else (like Thunderherd Migration, Harabaz Druid) but I don't know if any more of them really exist. As it turns out having 10/35 lands only tapping for colorless (for non-changelings) makes casting things like Azami, Lady of Scrolls REALLY hard.
Also, I've found that I'm pretty weak towards non-creature threats like enchantments and artifacts as I only have two ways to destroy enchantments (both of which always instantly die to removal) and three (four?) to destroy artifacts.
Extremely obscure tribal cards are always welcome too.
I'm pretty aware some of the sliver choices are sub-optimal and the mana base is baaaad. My goal is to make a deck that is tries to take out the table via combat damage, so not a hyper competitive combo monstrosity. I also want to run Primal Surge as a way to more efficiently make this happen, so that and Patriarch's Bidding are the only non-permanents I plan on running.
I'm just worried about running out of gas (although The First Sliver being my general should help out there), and not really having much removal at all. I was wondering if you had any recommendations in those areas?
Decklist
1 Striking Sliver
1 Crypt Sliver
1 Crystalline Sliver
1 Darkheart Sliver
1 Diffusion Sliver
1 Gemhide Sliver
1 Heart Sliver
1 Hunter Sliver
1 Manaweft Sliver
1 Muscle Sliver
1 Predatory Sliver
1 Quick Sliver
1 Sinew Sliver
1 Spinneret Sliver
1 Two-Headed Sliver
1 Venom Sliver
1 Winged Sliver
1 Basal Sliver
1 Blur Sliver
1 Harmonic Sliver
1 Homing Sliver
1 Necrotic Sliver
1 Bonescythe Sliver
1 Bonesplitter Sliver
1 Dormant Sliver
1 Essence Sliver
1 Root Sliver
1 Shifting Sliver
1 Telekinetic Sliver
1 Toxin Sliver
1 Watcher Sliver
1 Might Sliver
1 Pulmonic Sliver
1 Sliver Hivelord
1 Sliver Legion
1 Sliver Overlord
1 Ward Sliver
1 Constricting Sliver
1 Megantic Sliver
1 Oversold Cemetery
1 Stony Silence
1 Courser of Kruphix
1 Mayael's Aria
1 Rhystic Study
1 Bounty of the Luxa
1 Asceticism
1 Privileged Position
1 Mana Reflection
1 Martyr's Bond
1 Wild Pair
Artifact (11)
1 Sol Ring
1 Mind Stone
1 Coalition Relic
1 Darksteel Ingot
1 Urza's Incubator
1 Birthing Pod
1 Door of Destinies
1 Seer's Sundial
1 Coat of Arms
1 Mind's Eye
1 Obelisk of Alara
Sorcery (2)
1 Patriarch's Bidding
1 Primal Surge
Land (36)
1 Alchemist's Refuge
1 Arcane Sanctum
1 Battlefield Forge
1 Blood Crypt
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Cascading Cataracts
1 Celestial Colonnade
1 City of Brass
1 Crumbling Necropolis
2 Forest
1 Frontier Bivouac
1 Godless Shrine
1 Graven Cairns
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Island
1 Jungle Shrine
1 Karplusan Forest
1 Kessig Wolf Run
1 Llanowar Wastes
1 Mountain
1 Mystic Gate
1 Mystic Monastery
1 Opulent Palace
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Plains
1 Raging Ravine
1 Savage Lands
1 Steam Vents
1 Swamp
1 Terramorphic Expanse
1 Vivid Crag
1 Vivid Creek
1 Vivid Grove
1 Vivid Marsh
1 Vivid Meadow
I'll probably try to acquire and find a place for the following slivers. Belligerent Sliver, Brood Sliver, Galerider Sliver, Magma Sliver, Opaline Sliver, Psionic Sliver, Synapse Sliver.
From the newest set I'll probably throw in Cloudshredder Sliver, Hollowhead Sliver, Lavabelly Sliver, Spiteful Sliver and Tempered Sliver depending on how quickly I acquire them and what I feel like cutting.