Why don't we just unban every card and build better decks instead of crying about how powerful certain cards are, someone told me that's the grown up thing to do.
You should read the whole tread instead of just a few comments, just so you know exactly what people are talking about.
I did read the thread and your point. It was not exactly sarcasm. You were shot down by other users so you made a post by having "instead of crying about how powerful" and also ending it with "someone told me that's the grown up thing to do." which doesn't exactly ring of sarcasm and instead of something else.
Yes, Wizard tribal isn't exactly limiting when you have plenty of ETB creatures. Inalla however is like Minion Reflector but better as she doesn't care if the creature is a token and the copy-tax is only 1 instead of 2. Yet what pushes Inalla over the others is that she allows for combos while sitting safely in the command zone and being very non-interactable as there is nothing the opponent can do to Inalla herself.
Inalla, Archmage Ritualist does care if the creature were a token. Else you'd just pay X to make X copies of a wizard.
ALright my tiny bad, but that doesn't stop wanderwine prophets which keeps triggering Inalla.
The effect of the Emienence abilities for Cats/Dragons/Vampires are within the same power level, but the Wizard one is vastly more powerful than it has any right to be. Which is why Inalla isn't a fair commander for the format.
UR-Dragon is neat but not exactly a major game warper as its basically just a tribal discount of 1. Arahbo is cool but still is like only a giant growth for one creature and its only worrying interaction is with Lost Leonin. Edgar pushes that more with making vampires whenever you cast vampire spells, while he does get flak for his power his only real relevance was in 1v1.
Yes, Wizard tribal isn't exactly limiting when you have plenty of ETB creatures. Inalla however is like Minion Reflector but better as she doesn't care if the creature is a token and the copy-tax is only 1 instead of 2. Yet what pushes Inalla over the others is that she allows for combos while sitting safely in the command zone and being very non-interactable as there is nothing the opponent can do to Inalla herself.
Not even partners had that sort of annoyance of sitting safely in the command zone while still having such a big impact, like imagine if Vial Smasher the Fierce also had Eminence and it was just her triggered ability.
Like what would actually make Inalla fair is if the effects of her Eminence ability were swapped with activated ability. That way she is required to be on the battlefield if she wants to combo off. This would also slow her down considerably.
Like I had fun designing a RGU creature that wasn't tribal based. The eminence ability (when a player taps a land for mana, they had which can't be spent) is cute but in actuality is ineffective while the Sultan is not around "When mana is lost, Sultan does 2 damage to that player for each unspent mana lost."
I'm always hoping for the unbanning of Yawgmoth's Bargain. I know it's degenerate, but i just want to play it again...
Emminence should go. Getting advantages without ever casting your commander seems wrong.
I disagree. While Eminence could be broken and - it is strong - you do have to narrow your deck into a tribal strategy for it to be effective. Also... people use Generals that have nothing to do with what their actual decks do. Think about how many generals are used just so the player can slip an extra color in their deck for tutors and combos. That also seems wrong to me.
Eminence itself isn't horrible but Inalla is clearly not the same power level as the other Eminence creatures, basically over pushed.
I see what you mean. Power creep is rough on casual formats because the necessary restraint is derived from players, not the cards available. That being said, prizes are meant to be won, so I'd feel no shame about bringing nonblue storm.
I don't blame you for bringing such a deck.
Like for example you got Wanderwine Prophets. Cute card, saw play in merfolk-centric tribal decks mostly and that is still a rarity compared to what else gets played. So when Inalla, Archmage Ritualist walks in, now everyone is suddenly using the Wanderwine Prophets for infinite turns and damage. I mean nobody realistically thought something like Inalla would be a thing back when Prophets was brand new from Lorwyn in 2007 (11 years ago) to make it absurd.
I swear there must be some sort of dissonance between the folks who design certain legendary creatures and the commander community. Take Leovold, Emissary of Trest which in my opinion is one of the worst designed legends from a mechanical standpoint when regarding commander; a format which became a flagship at this point.
Why don't we just unban every card and build better decks instead of crying about how powerful certain cards are, someone told me that's the grown up thing to do.
As a Selvala player, I can attest to the power to which you refer, but I don't think Selly should eat a ban any moreso than Animar, Purph, Zur, Narset, OG Sigrada, Yisan (who is a better, faster selvala in some ways), or Pheldagriff. It's a 2/3 that dies to doom blade and if 3 players can't cough up an answer, that's on the table but certainly not the card.
Compare to Leovold, who actively stopped the game from being played at a uber-efficient cost with counter back-up or Rofellos, who was so blisteringly fast that he'd lap Selvala like Usain Bolt at a high school track event. Although certainly no slouch, Selvala just isn't oppressive, resilient, or fast enough to meet RC ban standards IMO.
Very true. If not the commanders, at least some tools should then. As while there is a potential for them to be used fairly, they keep being recurring problems.
Then again Commander has almost completely run from the RCs with the new cards and new interactions that keep happening. As I get what the original point was "guidelines rather than rules" but its more viewed and accepted as "rules rather than guidelines" especially at store locations where prizes are on the lines and they can't exactly afford to make houserules.
If there is a five color deck and it has multiple planeswalkers, it better have Taysir and Urza and Arzakon. Each is a named WUBRG planeswalker that has existed for around 20 years apiece.
I guess the one plus side is it would have made mana burn and mana burn-like effects more easily worded. What with something like: "Whenever a player’s unspent mana becomes lost, deal 1 damage to that player for each unspent mana lost."
Or even just using Wake of Destruction to hit the most common mana at the table like a forest or swamp. Sometimes all three of these in tandem when the planets align and somebody plays an Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth.
They could even do Arzakon. A 5-color planeswalker that was the antagonist of Shandalar. Which means we have Taysir, Arzakon, and Urza for five-color options. Like in order of most to least likely: Arzakon, Taysir, Urza.
Arzakon: Ran a 148 card deck, modernize that and its easily a commander sized deck. Didn't really have any pre-established powers or tricks besides convincing a bunch of mortal mages to grant him power so he could break the barrier on the plane of Shandalar.
Taysir: The only thing holding him back is that he is associated with Rabiah, but that hasn't stopped WOTC from referencing it with other products such as planechase. He is otherwise the same as Arzakon.
Urza: The reason he got an UN-version is because its pretty much impossible to really capture what Urza is like in a single card. Plus any nonsilver card of Urza will have a high probability of failing to meet expectations. The only safe bet is something Artifact related, as if we don't have enough of those already.
Here is a really easy solution for the original poster: Terra Eternal, Avacyn, Angel of Hope, Elspeth, Knight-Errant or other such effects. If you are dealing with MLD regularly, play these. As you would be adapting to the situation.
Also don't play Maelstrom Wanderer if there is MLD from regular opponents as you're setting yourself up for disappointment.
You might think people love group hug type effects, but in previous polls on the message board group hug decks were by far the most hated.
I play what makes me happy. Not what makes others happy. Because frankly people are impossible to please.
Yes, hi, I actually have mana do stuff on my subsequent turns when I MLD most of the time. What a shock, right?
What did the rest of the table deserve for when person combos off for infinite (Damage/draw/turns/etc)? What did the rest of the table do to deserve to get run down by a tribal/token swarm? What did the rest of the table do to deserve to fight against a deck that has "win the game" cards? What did the rest of the table do to deserve to fight a stax deck? Nothing. Its just a fact of magic the gathering in general.
Other ways to handle ramp decks? Well last I checked that means I have to run stax if I want a reliable option which is about as cruel as MLD and creates the same feeling of players wanting the game to end already. As other such things like tucking hasn't been that supported and red still doesn't have a reliable ways to lock lands down atm.
MLD is a tactical option just like hosers, hate, damage, discard, mill, bounce, sweepers, exile, counterspells, tucking, etc. Everything can be used in a bad or good tactical way based on the circumstance. An Armageddon is just as valuable as a counterspell when wanting to stop an anticipated threat, the method is merely different.
Its only a social taboo by people who have a thin skin. Such thin skins also see counterspells as a social taboo. Even remembered someone got very upset that just their artifacts and enchantments were getting blown up, not their lands, as they were a threat at the table. Treating things in MTG as social taboos is the most slippery slope thing to do.
Basically what I'm saying is:
Quote from Stephen Fry »
It's now very common to hear people say, "I'm rather offended by that." As if that gives them certain rights. It's actually nothing more... than a whine. "I find that offensive." It has no meaning; it has no purpose; it has no reason to be respected as a phrase. "I am offended by that." Well, so ******* what.
Doesn't contain prior secret lairs.
Seems like a fail in marketing.
Like here is what I mean with Inalla: http://commandertheory.com/post/164306346497/i-agree-with-you-the-ability-is-inherently-broken
The effect of the Emienence abilities for Cats/Dragons/Vampires are within the same power level, but the Wizard one is vastly more powerful than it has any right to be. Which is why Inalla isn't a fair commander for the format.
Yes, Wizard tribal isn't exactly limiting when you have plenty of ETB creatures. Inalla however is like Minion Reflector but better as she doesn't care if the creature is a token and the copy-tax is only 1 instead of 2. Yet what pushes Inalla over the others is that she allows for combos while sitting safely in the command zone and being very non-interactable as there is nothing the opponent can do to Inalla herself.
Not even partners had that sort of annoyance of sitting safely in the command zone while still having such a big impact, like imagine if Vial Smasher the Fierce also had Eminence and it was just her triggered ability.
Like what would actually make Inalla fair is if the effects of her Eminence ability were swapped with activated ability. That way she is required to be on the battlefield if she wants to combo off. This would also slow her down considerably.
Like I had fun designing a RGU creature that wasn't tribal based. The eminence ability (when a player taps a land for mana, they had
Like for example you got Wanderwine Prophets. Cute card, saw play in merfolk-centric tribal decks mostly and that is still a rarity compared to what else gets played. So when Inalla, Archmage Ritualist walks in, now everyone is suddenly using the Wanderwine Prophets for infinite turns and damage. I mean nobody realistically thought something like Inalla would be a thing back when Prophets was brand new from Lorwyn in 2007 (11 years ago) to make it absurd.
I swear there must be some sort of dissonance between the folks who design certain legendary creatures and the commander community. Take Leovold, Emissary of Trest which in my opinion is one of the worst designed legends from a mechanical standpoint when regarding commander; a format which became a flagship at this point.
- Rofellos, Llanowar Emissary
- Leovold , Emissary of Trest
- Coalition Victory
- Biorhythm
You want those unbanned?Then again Commander has almost completely run from the RCs with the new cards and new interactions that keep happening. As I get what the original point was "guidelines rather than rules" but its more viewed and accepted as "rules rather than guidelines" especially at store locations where prizes are on the lines and they can't exactly afford to make houserules.
Arzakon: Ran a 148 card deck, modernize that and its easily a commander sized deck. Didn't really have any pre-established powers or tricks besides convincing a bunch of mortal mages to grant him power so he could break the barrier on the plane of Shandalar.
Taysir: The only thing holding him back is that he is associated with Rabiah, but that hasn't stopped WOTC from referencing it with other products such as planechase. He is otherwise the same as Arzakon.
Urza: The reason he got an UN-version is because its pretty much impossible to really capture what Urza is like in a single card. Plus any nonsilver card of Urza will have a high probability of failing to meet expectations. The only safe bet is something Artifact related, as if we don't have enough of those already.
Also don't play Maelstrom Wanderer if there is MLD from regular opponents as you're setting yourself up for disappointment.
I play what makes me happy. Not what makes others happy. Because frankly people are impossible to please.
What did the rest of the table deserve for when person combos off for infinite (Damage/draw/turns/etc)? What did the rest of the table do to deserve to get run down by a tribal/token swarm? What did the rest of the table do to deserve to fight against a deck that has "win the game" cards? What did the rest of the table do to deserve to fight a stax deck? Nothing. Its just a fact of magic the gathering in general.
Other ways to handle ramp decks? Well last I checked that means I have to run stax if I want a reliable option which is about as cruel as MLD and creates the same feeling of players wanting the game to end already. As other such things like tucking hasn't been that supported and red still doesn't have a reliable ways to lock lands down atm.
MLD is a tactical option just like hosers, hate, damage, discard, mill, bounce, sweepers, exile, counterspells, tucking, etc. Everything can be used in a bad or good tactical way based on the circumstance. An Armageddon is just as valuable as a counterspell when wanting to stop an anticipated threat, the method is merely different.
Its only a social taboo by people who have a thin skin. Such thin skins also see counterspells as a social taboo. Even remembered someone got very upset that just their artifacts and enchantments were getting blown up, not their lands, as they were a threat at the table. Treating things in MTG as social taboos is the most slippery slope thing to do.
Basically what I'm saying is: