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  • posted a message on [Primer] G/W Auras (Bogle)
    Best would be Burn, Dredge, Hollow One if anyone plays that, UR Phoenix if you dodge or kill Thing in the Ice, Titanshift and Jeskai if anyone plays those, I'm sure I'm forgetting a few.

    Worst would be Infect, Amulet, Company decks, discard decks if you don't get Leyline or have to mulligan to non functional hands, UR Phoenix if their Thing lives. I'm probably forgetting some here too.


    You forgot Tron... that, for me, is terrible, the worst match. When Karn Liberated or Ugin finally come to the battlefield... you probably will lose the game :\
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on [Primer] G/W Auras (Bogle)
    The actual meta is full of Surgical Extraction.. even Tron is using it nowadays. We really need to destroy artifacts and enchantments... and, at the same time, protect our most valuable permanents from destruction: auras. These cards can do both.

    Deglamer and Unravel the Aether are different cards with the same effect. It's useful to use one on the 2nd game.. and the other on the 3rd game, for example. Having 2 copies of each gives us flexibility.

    It's nice, but I don't think it's a good idea to have 4 cards with this same effect. It's too much.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on [Primer] G/W Auras (Bogle)
    I totally agree... Thing in the Ice is the creature to be beaten in the Phoenix deck and, for me, it's much more important in the deck than Phoenix itself. When you add Thing in the Oce + Arclight Phoenix this deck is simply turned into a bomb. The deck is not really a creature deck, it's a combo one.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on [Primer] G/W Auras (Bogle)
    Update about Vessel of Nascency in main deck.

    First of all, I played with 3 mains, although I really think the ideal is 2 main. I just needed it to appear more frequently for the test, so I decided to play with 3 main for now.

    Well, this card is really great. Once it interacts with Ethereal Armor, many times I just waited till the end of my opponent's turn to sacrifice it. In other games, in the other hand, when I just really needed a creature or a land, i just sacrificed Vessel of Nascency as soon as possible. In many matches, it gave me more efficiency than Kor Spiritdancer. Once Spiritdancer, before being destroyed by Bolt or Fatal Push, needs 2 mana to cast and 1 more mana to cast another aura just to trigger the ability that grants us a draw, Vessel of Nascency sometimes gives us much more advantage, making it possible to choose one among the four cards of the top.

    While playing against The Rock, for example, my opponent preferred to target Vessel of Nascency with his Abrupt Decay than any other aura I have... because in the last game it was the Vessel that made possible for me to reveal 4 cards and put Rest in Peace (that was the 4th in order) in my hand in the end of his third turn and cast it during my fourth turn.

    While playing against Liliana of the Veil, firstly the combo fetch + Dryad Arbor saved me.. but I knew that I needed one more body, because my only creature was a 7/7 Bogle and in 2 turns Liliana's ability would make me sacrifice it. I waited for the draw step for 2 turns... no creature. After the draw in the last turn, I sacrificed Vessel of Nascency and found, among the four cards, one Gladecover Scout that saved me.

    Against Hardened Scales, once, It helped me to reveal and put in my hand a Seal of Primordium, that was really useful at that right moment.

    So, these were just some of the many times when the card really showed it's value to me. For me, from now on, it's a must in this deck. It gives me timing, consistency, interaction with my own cards, fast access to sideboard cards, and options... oh, man, you know how hard we need options while playing Bogles. Considering the sideboard, our deck is almost 100% creatures, enchantments/auras, artifacts and lands... Vessel lets us put in our hand almost every one of these cards (Path to Exile - that is an instant - is the common exception).

    This is the list I'm using right now. Really happy with it. I tried other lists, but this is the one that gets more wins against the top tiers. No, I don't play Leyline of Sanctity. I know it's a good card but it rarely appears in my first hand.

    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on [Primer] G/W Auras (Bogle)
    My friends, what do you think about Vessel of Nascency?

    During my tests, It is being proven to be really, really useful as a good cantrip. This card accelerates our game plan in a way totally different from Open the Armory. These two cards do not occupate the same space and function inside Bogles.

    Game 1: let it resting on the battlefield waiting for the right moment... meanwhile it helps to buff Ethereal Armor. Ok, the "hard cast" cost is 1GG in one only turn, but you can pay it in two different turns and activate the ability as instant in the end of opponent's turn. Vessel can bring, during moments of necessity, creatures, artifacts, and even lands.. these pieces sometimes are really important to win the game, even more important than the auras.

    Game 2 and 3: It REALLY, REALLY helps to "fetch" our sideboard cards. Our side is basically enchantments, creatures and artifacts. So, during many games, Vessel was really important to "draw" that Stony Silence, Rest in Peace or Seal of Primordium turns earlier than expected. This helps us a LOT to win the game.

    At least for now, it's helping a lot to give much more consistency to the deck. I will keep testing.

    Last but not least... what do you think about Favor of the Overbeing?

    1G to cast. Worst scenario: it gives only +2/+2 to Kor Spiritdancer because of her ability. Good scenario: +1/+1 & vigilance to Gladecover Scout. Best scenario +2/+2 & vigilance & flying to Slippery Bogle.

    100% of our creatures are benefited in a way. 33,3% get the best scenario. 33,3% get the good scenario. 33,3% get the worst scenario.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on [Primer] G/W Auras (Bogle)
    What do you guys think about a 2 CMC white enchantment that would let us swap auras between creatures? Once Serra, the planeswalker, was spoiled... What about something like Serra's Sanctum?
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on [Primer] G/W Auras (Bogle)
    Bogles probably won't benefit of the reprint of cards that are not legal in modern yet... old cards may turn this deck into an unstoppable machine or even make other decks unstoppable, breaking the format. Any new addition to Bogle's aura/enchantment armory has to be almost quite designed to specifically boost this deck (but not too much). The card can't be strictly/generally too powerful and can't be too weak or limited in a way that it's useless to us. It has to be powerful and limited in a way that it's real power shines only inside this deck so that the card won't break the format. Strong... but stronger inside bogles. Generally limited to cast or activate it's ability... but not too limited inside bogles. Not useful inside many decks... but really useful inside bogles. That's exactly what Daybreak Coronet is: powerful, but limited in a way that will be useful only inside of a deck that plays many auras... it shines only inside bogles, where it's limitation (to be attached only to a creature that already has an aura attached) is forgivable and "superfluous".

    After all, it's not easy to create a strong aura that satisfy our refined taste and is still possible to be played in bogles. If any new strong aura has one bit of CMC beyond what is strictly necessary.. it is useless. If it has no boost effect.. it's (almost) useless. If it doesn't add any keyword ability... it's useless. If it is not green or white.. it's (almost) useless. If it adds just the same as the other auras we wave, it's useless. If it's just a bit slow or limited to cast or keep on the battlefield... it's useless.

    You see? It's difficult to create a card that helps bogles and, at the same time, won't destroy Modern, legacy or commander. Tutor, in my opinion, probably will not see the modern fresh air... because it would certainly overboost any affinity deck (or artifact based deck).

    So, let's hope they are looking to Bogles with some wide smile in their faces and gently help us in any way. Maybe a new creature? Maybe one more 1 CMC hexproof creature?
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on [Primer] G/W Auras (Bogle)
    Quote from MatsT »
    Quote from Pedro Rocha »
    I'm playing Bogles a lot... but it seems so fragile in so many matches for me. Sometimes it seems to need more evasion... sometimes it seems to need more power... sometimes it seems to need more protection... sometimes it seems to need more consistency... sometimes it seems to need more interaction... and in the end there are not enough auras to fill all these blank spaces. Don't get me wrong, I love the deck, but it can be frustrating here and there.

    1) What about Sigarda's Aid? I know Bogles doesn't really need instant speed, but I think this could really make the combat more aggressive once the opponent doesn't know what we are about to cast to make our creatures even more monstrous. Sigarda's Aid would even make Helm of the Gods viable.

    2) Is there any powerful list of Bogles that plays Arcanum Wings combo? Aura Swap ability + some powerful but high CMC auras (Spectra Ward, Eldrazi Conscription, etc) seems tempting.

    3) What about Umbra Mystic? It’s ability grants totem armor to all our auras! For 2W, It’s presence on the field is great.
    The problem with most of the things you suggest, is that it completely ruins what little consistency the deck has. You talk about wanting more consistency but that would not be the effect of the cards you suggest.

    To get back to the basics, most "fair" decks are generally trying to draw a good mixture of lands and spells. If you draw too many spells, you won't have lands to cast them. If you draw too few spells, your opponent can trade 1-for-1 and outvalue you. Bogles takes this to the next level by requiring three separate components to function. Lands, creatures and auras. If you draw too few of one of these components, it's hard to win, and the opponent can focus his answers on the type you are lacking.

    Cards like Sigarda's Aid and Helm of the Gods don't fill any of these three roles. They introduce a 4th role, cards that are only good if you already drew the other 3 types. Playing cards like that over additional creatures and/or auras will make the deck more inconsistent and vulnerable to answers. It's much easier to starve the deck from Auras if you replaced a bunch of them with utility cards like this. This is the reason why cards like Spirit Link and Keen Sense have always been kind of questionable.

    Regarding the Arcanum Wings combo, it's simply too inconsistent. Both Arcanum Wings and Eldrazi Conscription are almost dead if you don't draw both, we have no good way of finding them, and even if you do they're still easily answerable. Against any deck that can't answer the combo, playing Rancor+Daybreak Coronet is likely good enough too. 3 mana is by no means a certain thing with this deck, frequently we have to operate on two lands which doesn't work with the combo.

    Regarding cards like Umbra Mystic and Nomad Mythmaker, they're way too easy to answer and do nothing when answered. A general rule in modern is that any creature that gains neither value nor tempo against a removal spell is unplayable. In Bogles cards like that are particularly terrible because they turn on the otherwise dead removal spells. Even for cards that do provide tempo or value, 3 mana is still almost always too much for this deck and 4 mana for things like Wrath of God is simply unthinkable.


    Yeah, you're right. I agree with almost everything you said... but I have some arguments in favor of 3x Sigarda's Aid in this deck. Considering it is in the field, we gain three important stuff that, without it, we don't have: (1) unpredictability; (2) efficiency when playing defensive, and (3) even more efficiency when playing offensive.

    1 - Sigardas's Aid CMC is 1. This means this enchantment won't mess our curve and can be played in the same turn as almost any other aura in the deck. Can be played on turn 2 with ethereal armor and count as one more enchantment.

    2 - Cause we can wait till after blockers are declared to play our auras, the coefficient of "mana cost to cast x utility of spell" goes above the ceiling.

    3 - Once playing auras as instants we now have interaction with our opponent. We have a way to respond spells and abilities played in our opponent's turn.

    4 - The combat step isn't as predictable as before. For bogles, the combat step is always predictable. The opponent knows everything we have: our creatures tapped, the creatures untapped, who is attacking, who will be possibly blocking next turn, the auras attached to them, their power and toughness, and know he can expect the only probably one instant we may have (path to exile). Our actual way to play is totally vulnerable and predictable. Even when we have advantage and play offensive we are still vulnerable to tons of instants. Deflecting Palm, for example, loses great part of its efficiency to ruin us: once our opponent have to choose the source as it resolves, if we play our first aura and he responds it, we can attach our next aura to another creature or even make some other emergency moves to avoid losing the game (like "pathing" our own creature with that untapped plains we left open to play our next aura).

    5 - With totem armor and our other auras, we gain access to many new situations where we, the bogle player, now have advantage. Have you ever attacked with a 0/2 Kor Spiritdancer? If yes, have you ever played an aura instant speed to make a creature bigger and protect it? I did. While testing Nomad Mythmaker I had the chance to attack with a massive bogle and a 0/2 Spiritdancer... and guess what: my opponent threw all his creatures to block and kill my 17/17 trampling bogle and played a bolt to kill Spiritdancer. I responded the bolt with Nomad Mythmaker's ability, attached a rancor to Spiritdancer, saved her from the bolt, draw a card, assigned 4 damage to my opponent (the Spiritdancer became 4/4) and won the game that turn. Playing our auras as instants targeting Kor Spiritdancer can not only protect it, but can lead us to win the game by causing massive unexpected damage to the player.

    6 - Spells that destroy permanents, like the famous overplayed duo Abrupt Decay & Assassin's Trophy, are not that scary anymore cause they can't be used to respond destroying auras that are still on the stack. If you know how to manage the stack properly and when to cast the auras instant speed, you'll be always able to bait that Decay and avoid the destruction of your Daybreak Coronet. The auras can be played even in response to Decay (to add one more aura before the resolution of Decay and avoid having just Coronet and the aura targeted by Decay attached to our creature) or after it resolved.

    7 - Liliana of the Veil's edict ability? Ok, we play Cartouche of Solidarity in response to it. Fetch + Dryad arbor will save us next time, saving resources.

    These are just some of the tons of advantage that we acquire while playing our great auras as instants. If you are an experient player and knows how to manage the stack properly, oh man you'll see how amazing Bogles will be while playing auras in response. As a long time infect player, I can tell you that isn't easy to manage the stack... it takes great effort and time to know the rules properly, but the reward comes fast.

    That old "Bogles doesn't care about interaction" line isn't right. Every deck needs the maximum of interaction as possible. Bogles ins't different. Bogles, after all, demands desperately for flexibility and unpredictability. Being predictable is terrible... and boring.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on [Primer] G/W Auras (Bogle)
    I'm playing Bogles a lot... but it seems so fragile in so many matches for me. Sometimes it seems to need more evasion... sometimes it seems to need more power... sometimes it seems to need more protection... sometimes it seems to need more consistency... sometimes it seems to need more interaction... and in the end there are not enough auras to fill all these blank spaces. Don't get me wrong, I love the deck, but it can be frustrating here and there.

    1) What about Sigarda's Aid? I know Bogles doesn't really need instant speed, but I think this could really make the combat more aggressive once the opponent doesn't know what we are about to cast to make our creatures even more monstrous. Sigarda's Aid would even make Helm of the Gods viable.

    2) Is there any powerful list of Bogles that plays Arcanum Wings combo? Aura Swap ability + some powerful but high CMC auras (Spectra Ward, Eldrazi Conscription, etc) seems tempting.

    3) What about Umbra Mystic? It’s ability grants totem armor to all our auras! For 2W, It’s presence on the field is great.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on [Primer] G/W Auras (Bogle)
    Once we have access to totem armor, why not to use Wrath of God to clean the field and swing for the maximum damage?

    I know it isn't the best card draw on the first 3 or 4 turns... but, after these turns, a mass board cleaning that (almost) doesn't affect our big creature will provide us a high probability to win the game.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on [Primer] G/W Auras (Bogle)
    Hi, folks!

    I’m a new bogles pilot. I’m still testing tons of cards.. but I keep wondering why Nomad Mythmaker isn’t seen in any bogles list. Do you think it isn’t good? I look to this card and think it’s amazing!
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Prison Term, Targets & Protection
    Thanks, my friend. That's exactly what I was thinking... but the target stuff was kind of confusing me.
    Posted in: Magic Rulings
  • posted a message on Prison Term, Targets & Protection
    Hi, folks.

    Let's say I have Prison Term on the field attached to a creature. My opponent, in his turn, plays Black Knight, a creature that has protection from white. In this scenario, because of Prison Term's second ability, may I attach Prison Term to the knight?

    I know that Prison Term's second ability doesn't target... but, as an aura, as long as Prison Term is on the field it has to have a target, a card to be attached to. Once the ability doesn't target, Prison Term can be attached, for example, to a creature that has hexproof.

    My doubt is... although the card's second ability doesn't target, as an aura it has to have a target and it is white... so, can it be attached to a creature with protection from white or protection from enchantments?

    Thanks, my friends!
    Posted in: Magic Rulings
  • posted a message on Fetch a land to play an instant?
    Perfect explanation! Thanks a lot for all your effort to detail every step of the game.

    Thank you, guys. This forum always helps me a lot!
    Posted in: Magic Rulings
  • posted a message on Fetch a land to play an instant?
    Oh my god... thank you guys for all this knowledge!

    So let's bring another situation that involves landfall just to clarify everything.

    It's my opponent's turn and I have no lands untapped. I have just a Misty Rainforest available. My opponent attacks with a random 4/4 creature. I have a 1/1 creature untapped and declare it as blocker. So, after my opponent pass priority (without playing any spells) to me, I crack my Misty Rainforest and pass priority. My opponent pass in succession. The fetch resolves and I place a forest on the battlefield. Once it resolved, my opponent (the active player) gets priority again and pass. Now I can use this new and untapped one forest to add {G} to the pool and cast Groundswell to add +4/+4 (because the landfall triggered once the land entered the battlefield under my control this turn) to my creature... which will become 5/5 and block to kill the attacking creature.

    If I understood everything above, this situation is ok and legal under the rules, right?
    Posted in: Magic Rulings
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