As a marketing person, I went into this really intrigued and excited. The new logo however is disappointing and a bit worrying.
The font of the old logos should have been kept. The age and style of the font reflected the brand itself: classic, timeless and iconic. It emphasized the long-lasting and unique position of Magic in the gaming industry, as well as the fundamental aspect of the game itself: always changing, but staying true to its foundations.
This is a game that has been around now close to 25 years - people have seen that font, those words, for over two decades. That font had a level of brand resonance and cultural weight that this new one simply can't match. You wouldn't see a font like the old one on many major new intellectual properties nowadays, and that's a GOOD THING for Magic because it highlights just how classic this game is. It won't put off new players, it will intrigue them. You'll notice a lot of classic, strong brands (like Coca Cola, Marvel, Ford, Disney) may change font colors but deliberately keep the same fonts for decades, as it communicates brand strength through a long history.
I'm surprised about the change; the new logo is too radical and weakens the brand image. When it comes to Magic, you can change the color of the logo, but changing the font itself is a step too far and undermines what makes this game so special.
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- damagecase
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Member for 16 years and 1 day
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Oct 9, 201724
chochky posted a message on New Magic Logo -- Effective starting in Dominaria 2018Posted in: The Rumor Mill -
Aug 1, 20171
Caranthir posted a message on 5 colour dragons , Selesnia Cats, Mardu Vampires, Grixis Wizards and new Red BalloonsPosted in: The Rumor MillQuote from danwall472 »Question: Is there a reason it seems most are speculating the vampire is Edgar Markov and not say, Runo Stromkirk? I mean Runo was the legendary swordsman and all...
Markov lineage vampires share the typical golden eyes Sorin has. Look at Sorin, look at Markov Blademaster, look at Markov Warlord.
This vampire has the same golden/black eyes.
Quote from ilovesaprolings »Quote from danwall472 »Question: Is there a reason it seems most are speculating the vampire is Edgar Markov and not say, Runo Stromkirk? I mean Runo was the legendary swordsman and all...
Idk, wasn't Runo and the Stromkirk related to the sea and the worshipping of abyssal monsters? Doesn't seem a good candidate for a mardu vampire
True, yet all Stromkirk vampires in the game are black and red. He can easily be just BR.
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Jul 7, 20171
prismatic elf posted a message on How much luck is involved in Magic?Posted in: Modern
I agree, I see it like this. You go to a 100 man tournament playing a control deck because aggro has been non existent in the meta, right call. Only 3 people show up playing aggro in that 100 man tournament, again verification you made the right call. Some how your first three Matchups are the Aggro players. I see this as unlucky not just a variance of chance. I guess a lot of this debate comes down to if you believe luck is something that can be measured or it is something more supernatural.Quote from damagecase »My two cents: First of all we need to define what "luck" is. For a quick and sloppy analysis we'll just associated it to randomness. Then good luck is having the randomness inexplicably tilt in your favor, bad luck is inexplicably against your interest. The randomness of a magic deck is significantly less than that of a deck of playing cards. So, even when putting two competing decks head to head, the amount randomness, purely in card draw would still be less than a deck of playing cards. Now there is another level of "luck" that is relevant and it comes in the form of meta gaming. Decks have good and bad matchups where a deck can be favored purely on design principle. Aggro is favored vs control but is not against tron type decks for example. Going into an unknown meta is a crap shoot. You can mitigate your chances by playing a tiered deck but ultimately until you familiarize yourself with the environment, it is significantly random.
Overall, I think people attribute way too much of the game to skill and ignore the luck aspect far too often because "being lucky" does very little to the ego...lol. Don't get me wrong: there is a significant amount of skill in the form of game intellect and moxie that the best players possess but ultimately a couple no land opening hands will end their day just as quickly as a novice. -
Feb 21, 2017
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Grand Prix Vancouver 2017 Q+A Finalist Jonathon Zaczek (Nikachu) #gpvanPosted in: Aggro & Tempo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPzcXT2lOK8 -
May 19, 2017
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Keramory posted a message on Commander Anthology: June 9thThe overwhelming hate is real.Posted in: The Rumor Mill
Personally I'm not getting the set, but I appreciate that it would be valuable for others. I feel like this would target two groups of people:
1. Newer players or players new to magic. Although none of the decks are insanely tuned, 5 decks for the price is a good deal. What a beautiful way to begin getting into commander with a nice list of options.
2. People who treat it like a board game. I have over 15 decks, but they're all tuned and edited from the precons if they weren't built from scratch. For people like me, a set of precons is a nice fun break of a more casual setting. I have friends who have all the precons that are not touched and they're super fun.
Again I'm not getting it because I don't have that kind of money to spend for something I'd bring out once in a blue moon (in regards to 2). But I think it still has value for the two reasons I listed -
May 5, 2017
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axman posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, metagame, and more! (3/13 update)Posted in: Modern ArchivesQuote from Lantern »Quote from axman »Quote from Lantern »Quote from Tanukimo »Quote from acc95 »Apparently, Lantern has changed both the data source and the tiering cutoffs. Now it seems +1% decks are Tier 2 and +3% decks are Tier 1, roughyl. No official layout and/or explanation of changes by any mod so far.
Thank you. It would be nice if the staff were more transparent about it.
I am. Did you message me? Ive also been commenting on all the deck threads that asked about it.
I'm not a god, I'm not telepathic. I'm a Television Studio Producer. I work about 75 hours a week, and do this on the side. No one is paying me. And my main Mod, who I trained and have been working with for literally years is leaving me. Next time anyone requests me to magically fix everything, they can just quote this.
No offence. I've been modding this sub for literally a decade at this point, and its mostly people telling me how things are wrong. Sometimes I get thanked, most times I dont. I'm training 2 new mods now, so Maybe I can be free enough to actually do more work in the tiering.
I'll be as clear as day here... and again. Yall can quote me on this if anyone asks again, it would save me the leg work of people thinking Im shafting them.
THERE IS NO GOOD DATA FOR ME TO DRAW ON. Point blank. I can use MTG goldfish, but their data is incomplete and they only hold a month of data on file, and when they update they dump 3 weeks of data and start fresh every month. Thats pretty bad for a non rotating slow to change format.
I can use top 8, like I'm doing right now, that does 2 months of data, but has random data holes and weighs everything pretty equally. So theres problems there too.
I can use modern nexus... when they remember to update. They are always late, and depending on them lately has been like throwing a paper plane and hoping it comes back sometime. (If you are reading this modern nexus, sorry. I was extremely pleased by the site, but every update has been weeks late for about a half a year now.)
I can use mainphase's data. Even messaged them (because people assume I havent been trying to fix this problem) asking about the data and more information. Im waiting on replies.
To be clear. You are asking me to be on top of an issue that has no good answers while I also have to feed my family AND train 2 new mods and clean up a forum missing the best partner I ever had.
I'm not going to ask for sympathy over here, or call out selfishness, but I will ask for understanding and patience. Come on. Cut some slack.
Do you adjust for MTGO figures? The challenge is MTGO does not have top 8. As a result if you try to apply a top 8 methodology to both MTGO and paper magic equally... it's going to skew results.
For example, in Legacy D&T sees little to no play on MTGO due to the cost. As a result if you were to look at the top 8 statistics including MTGO it looks like D&T is only 3-5% of the meta (when in fact, it is far more popular in paper). When you look at paper only events, the meta of D&T raises to 7%. Which is a substantial increase.
Realistically, I know some people want tiering to be based off skill and skill alone, but we haven't had access to win rates in forever, and most tiering systems, if not all of them, still have some fraction of popularity bais too. A good example is pokemon. Pokemon tiering does go off win rates... but the exact tiering they use in smogon still has people voting for the pokemon to be promoted or demoted based on wins they need to supply test evidence with. No one really loves chancy but wont deny how good of a wall it is, but gengar is currently rank A, even though its been nerfed to hell because people still like gengar.
Our tiering still represents popularity AND wins:
- Tier 1- A deck you WILL see in day 2 GP like touriments
- Tier 2- A deck you have a fair chance at seeing in a day 2 GP
- Proven- Decks that either were good in the past and people still might run, or decks that are rising in popularity. Its unlikely you will see them, but you should know what they are to be prepared.
Zoo is a great deck, but the decks it beats, delver and control arent popular right now, thus it is a bad deck... Popularity and success are intermixed there.
Quote from Aazadan »Quote from Lantern »
THERE IS NO GOOD DATA FOR ME TO DRAW ON. Point blank. I can use MTG goldfish, but their data is incomplete and they only hold a month of data on file, and when they update they dump 3 weeks of data and start fresh every month. Thats pretty bad for a non rotating slow to change format.
Would it be possible for mtgs to build it's own data pool over time? For example storing others data and using it to build trends after a few months?
Sure it could be. But we run into the same problem as last time. People dont want to spend time to do it and give it up. Im not trying to reinvent my data source every half year
Quote from ktkenshinx »Quote from idSurge »First: Lantern, you are beholden to nobody. I (and others) asked for criteria just so we could make sense of what was done, but in the end this is a hobby for all or most of us.
Second: We need to try to establish what tiers are. You can see over the last several pages some discussion around this.
Are they representation?
Are they power?
Are they performance and results?
Or is it a combination? I dont think we can base it on power, as thats difficult to judge. Nor can we base it on representation, because not everyone is going to flip to Jund, from some Jank, just because they are told Jund is tier 1.
The most fair metric, will be results.
If we had a way to track data for Top 8's and 5-0's, that would be ideal to see general trends, but even those numbers as HolyDiva outlined could EASILY be skewed by a few grinders in the case of MTGO.
People need to stop being completely infatuated with tiers, and I know I do it too, but decks that are not Tier 1 can have play, even if not popular.
Quote from egoblinsw »
This. I play goblins in legacy, and in terms of MWP it's very very good. But because representation is low, it rarely breaks T8. Low representation decks underperform in results based metrics.
There is no good dataset for MWPs. Data either comes from single players (small N, player skill can matter more than deck performance, high matchup variance, etc.) or from single events (similar issues as above, notably with sample and match variance). This would have been feasible in the days of MTGO replays and scraping software, but it isn't now.
I really don't get why people are trying to reinvent the wheel given Modern's current information sources. The prevalence-based tiering system was largely accurate and largely liked, and that has been true for years. If we had access to stuff like MWPs or matchup-specific data then great, I'm sure many would happily use it. Same if we had Day 1 to Day 2 to Top 8 conversion rates. But we don't have any of that information, especially not on a consistent basis. Because of that, prevalence-based metrics are the next best thing. Those metrics also aren't inaccurate. Even when we did get conversion rate data and MWP information, it rarely changed the top-tier picture too much, and few sleepers like Amulet Bloom and Lantern were missed.
It's a bummer that Modern Nexus is behind with consistent metagame updates. Mainphase's updates are frequent but they have small Ns and questionable (maybe even arbitrary) cutoffs. Hopefully the format can get the best of both those worlds soon, or someone steps up to fill in those gaps.
I keep nexus open on my tabs. I refresh it once a day to see if it has updated. Were 3 days late at this point, and everytime its late I have to change my "when does the forum refresh" date. It sucks. I wish it was better. I like the site.
I think that is part of the confusion, is the new tier system is alot more lax.
I feel like the old tiering system was as follows (feel free to disagree)
Tier 1- A deck you WILL see at the top tables. As well as day 2 representation 99% of the time.
Tier 2- A deck you have a fair chance at seeing in a day 2 GP and occasional top table appearances.
Proven- Decks that either were good in the past and people still might run, or decks that are rising in popularity. Its unlikely you will see them, but you should know what they are to be prepared
I feel like the new tier system is missing the "top tables" element. But due to the lack of data, there may not be anyway around that.
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May 4, 20178
ktkenshinx posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, metagame, and more! (3/13 update)Posted in: Modern ArchivesQuote from LeoLeft »I think this new tiering system better reflects the uncertainty we have of all decks true positioning in the meta. This will displease those who want a clear picture of the best of the best for better spiking purposes, I believe that the way Wizards obscures data prevents us from having the resources to give iron clad tiers the way people want.
How did Sheridan manage to do this before? I believe he used more strict cut-offs and created his own weighted system of balancing online to paper data, but with so much other data being withheld (true winrates and online metashares) this was essentially the most statistically sound and objective way of creating the illusion of solid clear cut tiers. Trying to do too much with too little.
It's been pointed out a few times but I still find it funny that Divas wake up call about mtgo dailies (she herself contributed 2% to UR aggro) went largely unnoticed.
The meta information is flawed, the emperor has no clothes.
And yet, the tiering system frequently predicted the top decks at all major events, as well as the MTGO regulars. People love to believe the metagame has secret Tier 3 decks that are actually Tier 1. They love to believe they can unlock some elusive metagame system that reveals a new picture of Modern's best deck. Sadly, in almost all cases, what you saw was what you got and the top tier decks really were exactly what they seemed to be. This is true now and it was true three years ago. -
May 1, 20171
Wraithpk posted a message on Temporary 4/24/17 banlist discussion threadPosted in: Modern ArchivesQuote from damagecase »Good to see this. Meta looks healthy and is ripe for an unban. Does it need it? No. But this is the perfect environment to set loose a card or two and see what shakes out. If it goes bad, hey we know where the offender is. I sometimes wish there was a month or two month hold on new cards entering the format.Even a couple of weeks that would allow for some testing and for the meta to get nailed down upon the new cards coming in. I know that's asking too much, but I think it would help the format overall. Besides, most new cards take a while to filter into modern, unless they are slam dunks, of course.
Yeah, I had the idea a while back for them to have trial periods for unbans and print gold bordered versions of cards on trial that are tournament legal during the trial period and make them directly purchasable through WotC for like a dollar a piece. That would give them some time to evaluate cards before actually unbanning them, and hopefully reduce the price spikes around unbans. -
Apr 20, 20171
Xaricore posted a message on Grixis DelverPosted in: Aggro & TempoQuote from damagecase »I'm a novice to this deck so I was just kinda spitballing. I mean while dropping either Tas or Angler, you lose all those cards in your yard. A good portion of which are viable SCM targets. With CS and as Marcwizard pointed out, bedlam reveler, those sorceries and instants stay available. Of course angler and Tas make use of cracked fetches which CS does not. Thanks for the info.
I agree, Tasigur, the Golden Fang and Gurmag Angler can eat up some cards in our graveyard that can be useful but that is one of the reasons why we are a "delver" deck. Don't get me wrong, Cryptic Serpent can be very useful in wanting to keep all the cards we want in our graveyard for potential use later on. Delving cards quickly to get our main threats on the field is quite useful in the end instead of waiting for Cryptic Serpent to be cast for UU. Both do have their up sides and down sides. Needless the say, it is a bit early to say what Cryptic Serpent can do this deck. -
Apr 17, 20174
spawnofhastur posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, metagame, and more! (3/13 update)I think you're not classifying the decks right.Posted in: Modern Archives
Death's Shadow Jund is much closer to a midrange deck than an aggro one. Grixis Shadow is closer to tempo or midrange depending on the list than aggro.
That would make midrange much more well represented than you are trying to claim. - To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
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I take issue with this, which is weird because we are usually on the same page. 5%? Every single card you draw is random right? And every game, provided you have been already lucky with your meta, will come down to drawing the right card at the right time while your opponent draws the wrong card at the right time? I'd say the relevance of chance in a game of magic has to be significantly higher than 5%.
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Overall, I think people attribute way too much of the game to skill and ignore the luck aspect far too often because "being lucky" does very little to the ego...lol. Don't get me wrong: there is a significant amount of skill in the form of game intellect and moxie that the best players possess but ultimately a couple no land opening hands will end their day just as quickly as a novice.
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