I am inclined to still keep the pyrite for welder kill and also it is just easier to combo out. I am cutting the echoing truth, I am not sure what to add perhaps an AEther Spellbomb? I really like MD needle becasue it can be searched out with trinket mage. Also if people could elaborate on what to name with mage. For instance vs. Gifts, do I name Gifts or yawg will, tinker etc. Thanks for the help so far.
Do you feel that the 5 moxen that ae in the first list are really nesscary? I only run pearl and sapphire for proxy reasons, but also running full power did not really make sense to me. I have also been wondering about the 1 echoing truth I run in my build, is it really nesscary to have a bounce spell and the explosives. I found it helpful with mystical but I am not sure if it is a wasted slot. This is my first time playing with nameing cards (meddling mage, pithing needle) what do I name against the current top decks? On pyrite spellbomb I run it as a mercy kill and also so I don't have to spend 5 min. setting up and swinging with a bunch of creatures, it is just easier. It also keeps you from losing to random things like form of the dragon Once again here is my current list for refrence.
BomberMan:
4 Auriok Salvagers 4 Trinket Mage 4 Meddling Mage 1 Darksteel Colossus 1 Tinker 1 Mystical Tutor 4 Brainstorm 3 Thirst for Knowledge 1 Ancestral Recall 4 Mana Drain 4 Force of Will 1 Echoing Truth 1 Time Walk 1 Mox Pearl 1 Mox Sapphire 1 Sol Ring 1 Mana Crypt 1 Black Lotus 1 Lion’s Eye Diamond 1 Pyrite Spellbomb 1 Pithing Needle 1 Engineered Explosives 1 Phrexyain Furnace 2 AEther Spellbomb 4 Flooded Strand 4 Tundra 1 Volcanic Island 6 Island 1 Plains
Sideboard: 3 Serenity 3 STP 2 Seal of Cleansing 2 Vedalken Shackles 1 Old Man of the Sea 1 Decree of Justice 1 Exalted Angel 1 Chalice of the Void 1 Tormod’s Crypt
The list I play does not run LOA for proxy reasons, I also did not find to to be all that useful. The first list wins by drawing it's deck with the spellbombs then playing all your creatures and attacking. I chose not to run that in my list for reasons I stated above.
Bomberman recently placed 3rd and 8th at the Quebec Vintage Championships. This deck uses the Auriok Salvager+Black Lotus combo to create infinite mana.
3rd: Martin Bonneville Bomberman
4 Force of will 3 Brainstorm 3 Thirst for knowledge 4 Mana drain 1 Time walk 1 Fact or fiction 1 Ancestral recall 3 Aether vial 2 Phyrexian furnace 1 Engeneered explosive 2 Aether spellbomb 1 Pithing needle 4 Trinket mage 3 Medling mage 4 Auriokd salvagers
4 Flooded strand 4 Tundra 6 Island 1 Mox jet 1 Mox ruby 1 Mox Sapphire 1 Mox emerald 1 Mox pearl 1 Sol ring 1 Black lotus 1 Library of Alexandria 1 Polluted delta
SB : 4 Sword to plowshare 1 Chalice of the void 2 Disenchant 1 Tormod’s crypt 2 Exalted angel 3 Energy flux 2 Veldaken shackles
8th: Lany Chabot-Laroche Bomberman the original
3 Aether spelbomb 1 Ancestral recall 2 Aura of silence 4 Auriok salvager 1 Black lotus 4 Brainstorm 1 Engineered explosive 1 Fact or fiction 4 Flooded strands 4 Force of will
5 Island 1 Library of Alexandria 1 Lion eye diamond 4 Mana drain 4 Meddling mage 1 Mox pearl 1 Mox sapphire 3 Phyrexian furnace 3 Plains 1 Sol ring 1 Strip mine 2 Swords to plowshares 1 Time walk 3 Trinket mage 4 Tundra
SB : 2 Disenchant 2 Energy flux 2 Sword to plowshare 2 Exalted angel 2 Back to basic 3 Brain freeze 2 Veldaken shackles
Here is the list I am currently running.
BomberMan:
4 Auriok Salvagers 4 Trinket Mage 4 Meddling Mage 1 Darksteel Colossus 1 Tinker 1 Mystical Tutor 4 Brainstorm 3 Thirst for Knowledge 1 Ancestral Recall 4 Mana Drain 4 Force of Will 1 Echoing Truth 1 Time Walk 1 Mox Pearl 1 Mox Sapphire 1 Sol Ring 1 Mana Crypt 1 Black Lotus 1 Lion’s Eye Diamond 1 Pyrite Spellbomb 1 Pithing Needle 1 Engineered Explosives 1 Phrexyain Furnace 2 AEther Spellbomb 4 Flooded Strand 4 Tundra 1 Volcanic Island 6 Island 1 Plains
Sideboard: 3 Serenity 3 STP 2 Seal of Cleansing 2 Vedalken Shackles 1 Old Man of the Sea 1 Decree of Justice 1 Exalted Angel 1 Chalice of the Void 1 Tormod’s Crypt
Some brief card explanations:
LED: This is a card I keep cutting and putting back. It gives you another combo piece, and can be used with Brainstorm and a Spellbomb to give that white mana to cast salvagers. It has won me several games but I am not sure that it is worth it.
Pyrite Spellbomb: This card is the win condition for the deck, get infinite mana then do infinite damage to your opponent. It is technically not necessary for the deck, because you can just draw your deck play all you creatures, time walk and win, holding a handful of counterspells. I keep it in there as a mercy kill.
Volcanic Island: This card is in the deck so I can use Pyrite Spellbomb to take out welders and other small creatures. Running this may be a little to techy and impractical.
Old Man of the Sea: This probably should be a Vedalken Shackles however I only have 2 Shackles and he is signed.
I think this deck may have a chance of competing because it is not just a combo deck, it is a control aggro combo deck. Thoughts and suggestions welcome.
The transmute cards are okay however there is almost no reason to run them over grim tutor. While this do have another card built into them that card is often unplayable. This makes grim tutor better with it's ability to search out other cards, desire, tendrils etc. I think the transmute cards may see some play as an addtional tutor to grim but not much.
I liked the article and agree with must of what you said. I play Vintage and unfortunatly can not afford to pimp my cards, black bordered, foil etc. So intstead of spending the big bucks I use sharpies to pimp my cards. Take my Auriok Salvagers, first I colored the entire pic. black (except for the guy). I then drew a lotus in with silver and other colored sharpies making it looks like the salvager is throwing the lotus. Just an example for people on a budget who want to pimp. By the way when coloring in the backround I tape around the border of the picature so I have a nice smooth straight edge. Once again nice article.
First of all themanadrain is a wonerful site and the people there are very helpful and imformative, even with budget decks. There are many threads on R/G Beats there I suggust you check them out.
R/G beats can be viable in the correct metagame, a heavy workshop metagame. You should be running land grant over fetchlands land grant is strictly better than fetchlands if you are running root maze. Choke is a SB option I would consider because of its synergy with root maze. I am not sure about AEther Vial in the deck it seems to me you would be better off with null rod. I would also not run maindecked pillars they should however be in the sideboard. Monrgeul should be run over river boa, the island walk does not help you much, but mongreuls ability to pump is amazing.
This is a little off topic but I wonder what people think of metagamed Slighs ability to compete in Comptative Vintage?
I am trying to make Sligh good again so I thought I would try this approach to it.
Grim Lavamancer or Lava Dart:
At the moment I think Lavamancer would be better but I am having trouble finding enough cards in the graveyard. The reason I would run dart instead is because lavamancer does not have haste.
Hearth Kami:
I was running Jackal Pup but with all the Moxen it is not hard to cast this, it is great for killing my Opponents Chalice of the Void.
REB/Pyroblast:
These are to protect my spells from counter magic, and the large amount of blue in type one. I am running 2 of each now but would it be better to run 4 pyroblast so I can target non-blue creatures and gain control of them via fractured loyalty? I am not sure if that works however so if somebody knows I would appreciate an answer.
Genju of the Spires:
I run this over Mishra’s Factory because of all the off color moxen.
Price of Progress:
I considered Blood Moon but I found most decks could work around it. I was thinking of adding I 4th but I can’t find the space.
Ankh of Mishra/
Ankh is very good against fetchlands crucible of worlds and it is good with the wasteland strip mine I run.
Chalice of the Void:
I play this over null rod because null rod costs 2 and I can still play moxen as long as I play them before playing Chalice for 0.
The Sideboard needs work, I am not sure if I should run the tormod’s crypt or phrexyian furnace. They are for the Gifts matchup and I am not sure which to run, because of the chalices I run.
Here is a B/U control ist I have been working on with a friend, and was wondering what people thought of it. It is still in the testing stage, and I am willing to change everything:
B/U Control:
4 underground sea
4 polluted delta
4 brainstorm
4 mana drain
1 demonic tutor
1 vampric tutor
1 mystical tutor
1 mind twist
3 Duress
4 force of will
4 cranial extraction
3 planar void
3 braingeyser
3 swamp
7 island
3 stifle
3 null rod
2 morphling
4 wasteland
1 strip mine
Suggestions welcome. Do you think this deck could be a semi-competetive
deck in type 1? Sideboard suggestions welcome.
BomberMan:
4 Auriok Salvagers
4 Trinket Mage
4 Meddling Mage
1 Darksteel Colossus
1 Tinker
1 Mystical Tutor
4 Brainstorm
3 Thirst for Knowledge
1 Ancestral Recall
4 Mana Drain
4 Force of Will
1 Echoing Truth
1 Time Walk
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Black Lotus
1 Lion’s Eye Diamond
1 Pyrite Spellbomb
1 Pithing Needle
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Phrexyain Furnace
2 AEther Spellbomb
4 Flooded Strand
4 Tundra
1 Volcanic Island
6 Island
1 Plains
Sideboard:
3 Serenity
3 STP
2 Seal of Cleansing
2 Vedalken Shackles
1 Old Man of the Sea
1 Decree of Justice
1 Exalted Angel
1 Chalice of the Void
1 Tormod’s Crypt
3rd: Martin Bonneville
Bomberman
4 Force of will
3 Brainstorm
3 Thirst for knowledge
4 Mana drain
1 Time walk
1 Fact or fiction
1 Ancestral recall
3 Aether vial
2 Phyrexian furnace
1 Engeneered explosive
2 Aether spellbomb
1 Pithing needle
4 Trinket mage
3 Medling mage
4 Auriokd salvagers
4 Flooded strand
4 Tundra
6 Island
1 Mox jet
1 Mox ruby
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox emerald
1 Mox pearl
1 Sol ring
1 Black lotus
1 Library of Alexandria
1 Polluted delta
SB :
4 Sword to plowshare
1 Chalice of the void
2 Disenchant
1 Tormod’s crypt
2 Exalted angel
3 Energy flux
2 Veldaken shackles
8th: Lany Chabot-Laroche
Bomberman the original
3 Aether spelbomb
1 Ancestral recall
2 Aura of silence
4 Auriok salvager
1 Black lotus
4 Brainstorm
1 Engineered explosive
1 Fact or fiction
4 Flooded strands
4 Force of will
5 Island
1 Library of Alexandria
1 Lion eye diamond
4 Mana drain
4 Meddling mage
1 Mox pearl
1 Mox sapphire
3 Phyrexian furnace
3 Plains
1 Sol ring
1 Strip mine
2 Swords to plowshares
1 Time walk
3 Trinket mage
4 Tundra
SB :
2 Disenchant
2 Energy flux
2 Sword to plowshare
2 Exalted angel
2 Back to basic
3 Brain freeze
2 Veldaken shackles
Here is the list I am currently running.
BomberMan:
4 Auriok Salvagers
4 Trinket Mage
4 Meddling Mage
1 Darksteel Colossus
1 Tinker
1 Mystical Tutor
4 Brainstorm
3 Thirst for Knowledge
1 Ancestral Recall
4 Mana Drain
4 Force of Will
1 Echoing Truth
1 Time Walk
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Black Lotus
1 Lion’s Eye Diamond
1 Pyrite Spellbomb
1 Pithing Needle
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Phrexyain Furnace
2 AEther Spellbomb
4 Flooded Strand
4 Tundra
1 Volcanic Island
6 Island
1 Plains
Sideboard:
3 Serenity
3 STP
2 Seal of Cleansing
2 Vedalken Shackles
1 Old Man of the Sea
1 Decree of Justice
1 Exalted Angel
1 Chalice of the Void
1 Tormod’s Crypt
Some brief card explanations:
LED: This is a card I keep cutting and putting back. It gives you another combo piece, and can be used with Brainstorm and a Spellbomb to give that white mana to cast salvagers. It has won me several games but I am not sure that it is worth it.
Pyrite Spellbomb: This card is the win condition for the deck, get infinite mana then do infinite damage to your opponent. It is technically not necessary for the deck, because you can just draw your deck play all you creatures, time walk and win, holding a handful of counterspells. I keep it in there as a mercy kill.
Volcanic Island: This card is in the deck so I can use Pyrite Spellbomb to take out welders and other small creatures. Running this may be a little to techy and impractical.
Old Man of the Sea: This probably should be a Vedalken Shackles however I only have 2 Shackles and he is signed.
I think this deck may have a chance of competing because it is not just a combo deck, it is a control aggro combo deck. Thoughts and suggestions welcome.
R/G beats can be viable in the correct metagame, a heavy workshop metagame. You should be running land grant over fetchlands land grant is strictly better than fetchlands if you are running root maze. Choke is a SB option I would consider because of its synergy with root maze. I am not sure about AEther Vial in the deck it seems to me you would be better off with null rod. I would also not run maindecked pillars they should however be in the sideboard. Monrgeul should be run over river boa, the island walk does not help you much, but mongreuls ability to pump is amazing.
This is a little off topic but I wonder what people think of metagamed Slighs ability to compete in Comptative Vintage?
4 goblin vandal
3 grim lavamancer/lava dart
4 Hearth Kami
4 lightning bolt
3 shrapnel blast
3 ankh of mishra
4 pyrostatic pillar
2 pyroblast
2 REB
3 Genju of the Spires
3 Price of Progress
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Wasteland
1 Strip Mine
1 mox ruby
1 mox jet
1 mox sapphire
1 mox emerald
1 mox pearl
11 mountain
1 Black Lotus
2 Fractured Loyalty
3 blood moon
3 Pyrokinesis
3 Rack and Ruin
4 Tormod’s Crypt
I am trying to make Sligh good again so I thought I would try this approach to it.
Grim Lavamancer or Lava Dart:
At the moment I think Lavamancer would be better but I am having trouble finding enough cards in the graveyard. The reason I would run dart instead is because lavamancer does not have haste.
Hearth Kami:
I was running Jackal Pup but with all the Moxen it is not hard to cast this, it is great for killing my Opponents Chalice of the Void.
REB/Pyroblast:
These are to protect my spells from counter magic, and the large amount of blue in type one. I am running 2 of each now but would it be better to run 4 pyroblast so I can target non-blue creatures and gain control of them via fractured loyalty? I am not sure if that works however so if somebody knows I would appreciate an answer.
Genju of the Spires:
I run this over Mishra’s Factory because of all the off color moxen.
Price of Progress:
I considered Blood Moon but I found most decks could work around it. I was thinking of adding I 4th but I can’t find the space.
Ankh of Mishra/
Ankh is very good against fetchlands crucible of worlds and it is good with the wasteland strip mine I run.
Chalice of the Void:
I play this over null rod because null rod costs 2 and I can still play moxen as long as I play them before playing Chalice for 0.
The Sideboard needs work, I am not sure if I should run the tormod’s crypt or phrexyian furnace. They are for the Gifts matchup and I am not sure which to run, because of the chalices I run.
B/U Control:
4 underground sea
4 polluted delta
4 brainstorm
4 mana drain
1 demonic tutor
1 vampric tutor
1 mystical tutor
1 mind twist
3 Duress
4 force of will
4 cranial extraction
3 planar void
3 braingeyser
3 swamp
7 island
3 stifle
3 null rod
2 morphling
4 wasteland
1 strip mine
Suggestions welcome. Do you think this deck could be a semi-competetive
deck in type 1? Sideboard suggestions welcome.
ANY instant... not exactly supporting the arcane theme.
The Shadow-Watcher looks OK, but not good in EXT, t1 or Legacy.
I like the Kannishi, really fun. A little like a bad Mother of Runes.
Can it get pro artifacts?