Guys..... Survival of the Fittest always has always done exactly what Protean Hulk can do and it does it better because if you draw any of the combo pieces with Protean Hulk you then have to like... play them or get them in somehow. Survival combo on the other hand usually costs around 6 mana (assuming you have no pieces and any creature) and then can be executed on turn 7. If you get any of the pieces to hand with survival combo it goes off for less mana and needs no other card to execute it for you where as Protean Hulk executes the same combos but needs a sac outlet plus seven mana. You could just as easily do a Tooth and Nail combo and in fact its probably easier to do than Hulk combo.
I really don't see why people are losing their *****. Guys..... its literally Survival combo and it costs essentially the same but is more corner case in executing it. Protean Hulk unban in no way equates to Gifts Ungiven. If you feel that card should be unbanned... congratulations, they are not the same card. One being unbanned puts no precedent on the other.
RC - thanks, I think this was a great move on both cards.
I ordered two foil copies before prices jumped
Entomb + Necromancy is instant win after sac at end of turn. Seems less costly than the survival setup. These are in tutor colors.
Flash + Hulk costs less than survival if you are using Volrath's Shapeshifter as the least costly way to combo off with survival.
Then there is Sneek Attack and Through the Breach which can be used as well. Again no sac outlet needed.
Goes off sooner than turn 7. Combos with a million different things. Just like gifts. Both cards are abnoxious.
Winding Constrictor and Kujar Seedsculptor did most of the work.
The Implements were very good as well.
Resourceful Return was just value.
Fourth Bridge Brawler 2-for-1's
Yahenni's Expertise was never cast.
Am I mistaken or do you always post a deck that is basically every 1, 2, and 3 drop in your pool, and then say you go 4-0 with it? I'm sure I'm exaggerating but I feel confident that you've posted similar decks for previous prereleases, to the point that I thought before, "wow this guy just builds a super low curve and then goes 4-0" and here it is again.
Is it really that easy to 4-0? I wonder how such decks would perform on Magic Online. Is it just that the player base at your local store is easy to beat? Or is the secret to winning just having an average casting cost of 2?
EDIT: I just checked Fedders post history and clearly it wasn't him, this is his first prerelease post as far as I can tell. Something about the Bill Murray avatar tickled my memory. I have to go search to see who I am thinking of.
No worries mate.
I've been crushed plenty of times. And I believe I got super lucky with my draws here.
Some amount 4cmc planewalkers (Nahiri, Gideon being my pick) appears mildly ok alongside a 1 or 2 of Baral's expertise. Testing should confirm if this is true
Stunning Growth is nuts. It's a better, one sided Planar Birth. I'll be running that a lot. Aside to Fedders, can we at least wait until the prerelease to start speculating about bans? Maybe let a couple people play at least one game with the card?
lol. Perhaps I jumped the gun on that speculation. It just seems like it would evolve to fit into the criteria that doesn't let us play with the card.
"Produces Too Much Mana Too Quickly. Commander is a format about epic plays but the turn 10 epic play happening on turn 3 is deflating. Limited acceleration is good but we don't want the format to turn into "who can go off earliest" so we rein in large quantities of early mana." - Sheldon
I doubt this will enable the turn 10 play on turn 3. But newer players will likely gravitate to this card while likely taking offense to land destruction strategies and combo, which warps the dominance of the not to be criticized ramp based strategy. Now every tri color green deck has three of the one mana cycle lands, 9 fetches, life from the loam, and stunning Growth. Now people can build thier 86 other card G/X/x.
But seriously, the set hasn't even been released yet. And I wanna play with this card. So stop with all that ban talk!
Deathtouch creatures + Viridian Longbow
Deathtouch creatures + Recursion if opponents want to attack into them for some reason Curfew + Mnemonic Wall/Archeaomancer to bounce all opponents creatures
Gain life then X everything to death with Crypt Rats and recursion or keeping Pestilence on the board
Value land creatures plus buyback spells for the long grindy game.
I think Battlefield Scrounger is a top 20 card in this format
Entomb + Necromancy is instant win after sac at end of turn. Seems less costly than the survival setup. These are in tutor colors.
Flash + Hulk costs less than survival if you are using Volrath's Shapeshifter as the least costly way to combo off with survival.
Then there is Sneek Attack and Through the Breach which can be used as well. Again no sac outlet needed.
Goes off sooner than turn 7. Combos with a million different things. Just like gifts. Both cards are abnoxious.
Still trying to piece together the mana base and need a little help there.
4 Renegade Map
4 Unbridled Growth
4 Oath of Nissa
Superfriends (9)
1 Ob Nixilis Reignited
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
1 Nahiri, the Harbinger
1 Arlinn Kord
1 Tamiyo, Field Researcher
1 Dovin Baan
1 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
1 Nissa, Voice of Zendikar
Removal(9)
3 Fatal Push
3 Radiant Flames
2 Declaration in Stone
1 Quarantine Field
1 Noxious Gearhulk
1 Linvala, the Preserver
2 Deadeye Harpooner
Value(3)
1 Oath of Gideon
1 Oath of Jace
1 Oath of Liliana
Land(23)
4 Spire of Industry
4 Evolving Wilds
5 Forest
2 Swamp
2 Plains
2 Mountain
1 Island
1 Foreboding Ruins
1 Fortified Village
1 Game Trail
1 Radiant Flames
1 Fatal Push
1 Authority of the Consuls
1 To the Slaughter
1 Aligned Hedron Network
1 Release the Gremlins
1 Ruinous Path
1 Quicksmith Rebel
1 Oath of Liliana
2 Negate
2 Unlicensed Disintegration
2 Fumigate
No worries mate.
I've been crushed plenty of times. And I believe I got super lucky with my draws here.
4 Felidar Guardian
3 Torrential Gearhulk
Instant 13
3 Anticipate
3 Harness Lighting
2 Glimmer of Genius
2 Shock
2 Disallow
1 Negate
Planeswalker 6
4 Saheeli Rai
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
1 Nahiri, the Harbinger
Sorcery 4
3 Radiant Flames
1 Fumigate
3 Renegade Map
1 Implement of Combustion
1 Pacification Array
Land 25
4 Port Town
3 Aether Hub
3 Inspiring Vantage
1 Spirebluff Canal
5 Island
4 Plains
1 Mountain
4 Wandering Fumarole
1 Stasis Snare
1 Fragmentize
1 Blessed Alliance
1 Linvala, the Preserver
1 Release the Gremlins
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Spell Queller
2 Fairgrounds Warden
2 Negate
2 Dispell
Shock should be valued over Harnessed Lightning if this combo becomes Tier 1.
Playing 1 or 2 Implement of Combustion isn't a huge cost to ping opposing S.Rai's for 1.
Renegade used with Implement of Combustion or Pacification Array could allow for Spire of Industry for the manabase
Putting a few Spell Queller and Fairgrounds Wardens in the SB might be useful.
Some amount 4cmc planewalkers (Nahiri, Gideon being my pick) appears mildly ok alongside a 1 or 2 of Baral's expertise. Testing should confirm if this is true
4 FG
4 SR
3 T.G. Hulk
Seems pretty good.
Winding Constrictor and Kujar Seedsculptor did most of the work.
The Implements were very good as well.
Resourceful Return was just value.
Fourth Bridge Brawler 2-for-1's
Yahenni's Expertise was never cast.
Kill a creature
Kill a creature
tick up to temporarily ramp
Kill a creature
for 2UB
Depending on the final cardpool, this thing could be very T2 playable.
ITT, people underestimating the potential to kill multiple creatures with this.
tarfire is red, but it might be better than disfigure
lol. Perhaps I jumped the gun on that speculation. It just seems like it would evolve to fit into the criteria that doesn't let us play with the card.
"Produces Too Much Mana Too Quickly. Commander is a format about epic plays but the turn 10 epic play happening on turn 3 is deflating. Limited acceleration is good but we don't want the format to turn into "who can go off earliest" so we rein in large quantities of early mana." - Sheldon
I doubt this will enable the turn 10 play on turn 3. But newer players will likely gravitate to this card while likely taking offense to land destruction strategies and combo, which warps the dominance of the not to be criticized ramp based strategy. Now every tri color green deck has three of the one mana cycle lands, 9 fetches, life from the loam, and stunning Growth. Now people can build thier 86 other card G/X/x.
But seriously, the set hasn't even been released yet. And I wanna play with this card. So stop with all that ban talk!
Stunning Growth looks like prime ban material. It can't be reanimated or bribery'd. But this looks like the kind of card that gets banned.
I love it.
1 Ana Battlemage
1 Sakura-Tribe Elder
1 Deadly Recluse
1 Elvish Visonary
1 Sylvan Ranger
1 Gatecreeper Vine
1 Ambush Viper
1 Thornweald Archer
1 Coiling Oracle
1 Tidehallow Strix
1 Sylovok Replica
1 Trinket Mage
1 Civic Wayfinder
1 Borderland Ranger
1 Wood Elves
1 Farhaven Elf
1 Fierce Empath
1 Oran-Rief Recluse
1 Stinkweed Imp
1 Crypt Rats
1 Phyrexian Rager
1 Yavimaya Elder
1 Cadaver Imp
1 Gravedigger
1 Heartstabber Mosquito
1 Mold Shambler
1 Ondu Giant
1 Kozilek's Predator
1 Eyeless Watcher
1 Archaeomancer
1 Mnemonic Wall
1 Mulldrifter
1 Tajuru Pathwarden
1 Wickerbough Elder
1 Battlefield Scrounger
1 Oakgnarl Warrior
1 Ruin Processor
1 Ulamog's Crusher
1 Preordain
1 Innocent Blood
1 Bone Splinters
1 Disturbed Burial
1 Consume Spirit
1 Ashes to Ashes
1 Evincar's Justice
Instant 16
1 Mind Games
1 Curfew
1 Into the Roil
1 Shred Memory
1 Sprout Storm
1 Deprive
1 Counterspell
1 Muddle the Mixture
1 Death Denied
1 Rend Flesh
1 Murder
1 Keep Watch
1 Snakeform
1 Soul Manipulation
1 Capsize
1 Mystical Teachings
Enchantment 2
1 Pestilence
1 Rhystic Study
Artifact 3
1 Sylvok Lifestaff
1 Viridian Longbow
1 Leonin Bola
Land 35
1 Command Tower
1 Evolving Wilds
1 Terramorphic Expanse
1 Rupture Spire
1 Transguild Promenade
1 Shimmering Grotto
1 Unknown Shores
1 Bant Panorama
1 Esper Panorama
1 Jund Panorama
1 Grixis Panorama
1 Jungle Hollow
1 Dismal Backwater
1 Thornwood Falls
1 Golgari Guildgate
1 Dimir Guildgate
1 Simic Guildgate
1 Halimar Depths
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Mortuary Mire
6 Forest
5 Swamp
3 Island
1 Blighted Woodland
Looking for suggestions on what to cut.
Here's what the deck does.
Deathtouch creatures + Viridian Longbow
Deathtouch creatures + Recursion if opponents want to attack into them for some reason
Curfew + Mnemonic Wall/Archeaomancer to bounce all opponents creatures
Gain life then X everything to death with Crypt Rats and recursion or keeping Pestilence on the board
Value land creatures plus buyback spells for the long grindy game.
I think Battlefield Scrounger is a top 20 card in this format
The card beats newer players into a pulp. Which I believe RC frowns upon. Not as great against veterans with answers, but still great.
How is he able to turn three languish with that BR list?