It's really a shame that more people on this board did not share in other's excitement for what is quite literally the most exciting thing to happen to cube since Lorwyn.
I have been cubing for 24 of the last 36 hours. What a friggin' blast. Sure, it doesn't beat out getting the weekly group together to play games, but it was a fantastic experience all around. Concerns about the cube's power level were entirely unfounded, IMO. Users who played prior to the launch and during the launch, you'll have to chime in on this one, but my experience showed that this list was plenty powerful. I know my initial drafts on Tapped Out were pretty weak, but in practice, this was a much different beast. I am very thankful they decided to use a 720 card cube. I don't believe it would work out otherwise.
I was able to draft literally every archetype imaginable including Storm / Dream Halls combo (see picture below for decklist). In case you're wondering, I went 3-0 in my queue with the Storm deck after winning my final game on a mull to four.
Hopefully those of you who hadn't had MODO experience that played enjoyed your time. For those of you that didn't get your share in, I am sure it'll be back with a face lift.
I'm in the middle of my first draft now. Just won round 1. I'm Rg & green was super-open the whole draft. Red was not so much but I still got some sweet spells. I wish I had more time to play this weekend but I think this is the only draft I'll be doing. Lousy having the draft on Easter weekend when I have other obligations.
I would recommend that they add more mana fixing as well as try to beef up aggro. Admittedly those are tougher to do in a 720 card Cube.
I really dislike Hexproof as a mechanic. Not being able to directly interact with an opponent's creature (while they are able to interact) is quite frustrating.
That being said I'm pretty excited for most of the new cards. I wonder how many Angels will be in the new set? Maybe they will have some sweet EtB abilities which is why the new Angel has the "no angel" clause.
For us exiling has been more relevant than any other extra on red X spells.
The biggest value of exiling is not strongly related to reanimation spells. It's nice to know that the creature you kill will not come back to bug you later, but exiling one creature doesn't turn your opponent's reanimation spells into dead cards. It's hitting creatures with persist, undying, 'leave the battlefield' triggers and in-built reanimation where exiling hurts the most. I've exiled many a kamigawa dragon, where a destroy effect would have lost me the game. Exiling Kitchen Finks where your opponent was likely counting on the extra body and the life is less spectacular, but still quite strong. Kill Bloodghast or Vengevine once and for all. And Innistrad block has given us undying, making exile even more relevant.
This is a very persuasive argument. We're looking to cut Comet Storm for being too mana intensive & I think this case for RSZ will move it to the testing zone.
All they have to do is send out an email to the same recipients with an update. This whole debacle has showed me that I shouldn't put much money into virtual cards since they can be taken from me at any time without notice.
I got that same E-mail on the beta phishing thing. I wonder if it does have something to do with that? I'm E-mailing WOTC right now. Please post if you get an update & I will do the same.
EDIT: BTW, how sloppy is it that Wizards sends out an E-mail with all of our E-mail addresses listed individually? That E-mail address that I have is now compromised. They need to get this resolved fast & apologize for their egregious error.
I'm having this same problem! I was even on MTGO earlier today & everything was fine. I tried system restore back to last night & the first few steps from their troubleshooting thread & it's still not working.
Keep me posted on if yours is working. BTW, I'm also in the MTGO Beta & that connection is also not working.
There's nothing on my PC which should prevent me from connecting.
Welcome. There are lots of "new to Cube" threads out there. Check the sticky at the top of the main page for some info. You can look around people's lists for some ideas on what to do. Lanxal is one of many people here who has a Pauper Cube. I have a 500-card Cube in my signature but starting at 360 is totally fine (and probably easier).
Are there any local stores that sell old cards? Maybe go to them asking for old commons & see if they can give you a deal on the "bulk" cards. If I had to start over I would go to my local store to get some bulk cards & then order the rest on a website like Starcity. You're paying extra online but having all the cards sent to you without digging through a bunch of boxes is quite valuable in itself.
Are you planning to get foils down the road? How much do you want to spend now & later? Who will be playing the Cube? All questions that will determine the direction you should go.
Why run Boreal Druid? Just to power the handful of okay snow cards? The only really good one of the bunch is Chilling Shade, and only then if you're playing all snow basics. I guess the centaur is also pretty good.
Elves of Deep Shadow provides fixing for BG (usually a good combination considering the existence of pestilence, crypt rats and Justice) in a format where there's very little fixing before you get into really terrible stuff (if you go whole hog there's karoos, signets, alara fetches, obelisks and then ...?)
I guess I've always been chased off by the 1 life per activation cost. Now that I think about it I think it would be a better inclusion than Boreal Druid despite the life loss. I'll look for another cut instead of the Druid because I like all the mana elves. With Deep Shadow it will be easier to run Gx splash black decks. Splashes occur pretty often in the Commons Cube.
What do people think about the number of 1 mana accellerators (mana elves) in cube? Seeing as there are only three of them Lanxal's cube and they all went very quickly in the rotodraft, I can see green becoming a more solid colour if 4 or even 5 mana elves are run.
Hey since you mostly do two-player draft formats I am going to X-post from a previous thread on three of our favourite two-man drafts. The Sawlerman draft is what we do about 75% of the time because its the most fun and skill intensive.
Sawlerman Draft
The name of this format is a bit of a play on words (my last name being Sawler) and since we have been playing this format, we barely ever Winston anymore. To start the cube is completely randomized and then we determine who picks first. There are eight rounds to drafting.
Round 1: In the first round six cards are revealed in the middle.
Player A has the option of taking one of the revealed cards and adding it to his pool or taking a card at random from the remainder of the cube. If a revealed card is taken, then it is replaced with another card from the cube so there are always six cards showing.
Player B then repeats Player A's option of either taking a card from the middle, or taking one at random.
It is now Player A's turn. He has the same two options as before except now there is a third option. He can choose to swap one of the cards he has already drafted *this round* with one card in the middle AND take one card at random from the rest of the cube. This ensures that every turn, that player's pool increases by one.
The round continues until each player has five cards in their pool that they drafted that round. Once Player B gets his last card, all the remaining revealed cards are swept away and can no longer get drafted.
Round 2: Six new cards are revealed and now it is Player B's turn to choose first. The exact same rules are followed as in round one, with Player A getting the last pick in Round 2.
**Note: You cannot swap a card from your pool which you drafted in a previous round with a revealed card. Only cards drafted in Round 2 may be swapped for a revealed card in Round 2.**
After 8 rounds, each player should have 40 cards in their total pool to build a deck with.
This format is fun because the decks are generally more powerful and cohesive than a standard Winston or Winchester draft. It also leads to some sweet moments like when you take a mediocre card in the middle only to flip up a Sol Ring or Umezawa's Jitte for your opponent.
It also allows you to screw over your opponent if you have the last pick in the round. Say you are drafting R/G aggro and Jace, The Mind Sculptor gets revealed. On the final pick of the round that player could swap Jace for a card in the middle without their opponent getting priority to draft it.
Try it! Its a nice variant on a draft format I read somewhere and we do this about 75% of the time when two of us draft the cube.
Revolver Ocelot
This two-player draft format begins with 6 packs of 19 cards. We will call the piles 1 through 6. The piles are arranged in a circle (looks like bullets in a six-shooter) and both players are drafting simultaneously.
Player A will start with pile 1, while Player B will start with pile 4. Each player looks at the top five cards of the pile and choose one for their deck. They replace the remaining four cards on top and then shifts that pile one space clockwise.
Now Player A will look at pile 2, while Player B will look at pile 5. Same thing happens - they look at the top five cards and choose one card.
The piles continue to rotate until each pile only has five cards remaining. At this point, the drafter will look at the remaining five cards, select one, and then set the final four cards aside face-down, and these cards cannot be drafted.
At the end of this rapid-fire draft, each player should have drafted 45 cards to build a deck from.
I like this format a lot because its quicker than a Winston draft, and each player is actively doing something, instead of waiting for their opponent to make their choice. As well it is nice because signals are very obvious once you get about 10-12 picks in. Each time the pack goes around the table you will have the chance to see between 1-2 new cards, allowing for a good chance to table something you want in the top five cards you looked at.
Con: This is sometimes easy to mess up since both drafters are going quickly. Even so, its a very fun format, and somewhat unique.
Booster Tutor
This draft easily yields the most bonkers decks in my cube history. This draft utilizes the entire cube and is suitable for any number of drafters, for a cube of any size.
Let's look at a cube of 720 cards with two drafters.
At the end of the draft each player should have 36 cards to build a deck from. Each player will select only one card from each pack created so the number of cards per pack will equal (Cube Size)/36. In the case of 720: 720/36 = 20. So 36 packs of 20 are created. This can be extrapolated to cubes of any size, with the pack size being larger or smaller.
Each drafter will take one pack, look at its contents and select one card. Drafters will then exchange packs, look at the remaining cards, and select one. The rest of the cards are set aside face-down. This means in a 720 cube: Drafter A will look at 20 cards, choose one and then receive a pack with 19 cards and choose one. After these two cards are chosen, the packs are set aside and the process is repeated with two new packs.
Drafting continues until all packs are gone and each player has 36 cards.
This is good because the pick quality is always very high and the decks have stellar cohesion. This method probably works best with an unpowered cube, but I haven't played a powered cube like this before.
This draft allows each player to draft exactly the archetype they wish to draft, however signalling is nearly impossible, since the cards will always be so good when passed.
This can be done with more players following the exact same method, except the packs are passed around more like a booster draft. Just as above, each player may only select one cards from every pack created.
Definitely some interesting modes there. I think the first one is my favorite of the three. I've experimented with variants that are similar to it. One of the most common ones is where each player does X exchanges with the middle pile. I never liked the "popular" variant because I would get to a point where I was happy with my pile & didn't want to do anymore. One time we tried it where you could just stop the exchanging at any time & move to a new set of cards. It worked out okay. I would like to try it again sometime to try & flesh it out.
The last one you list would have some pretty insane decks. With my 500 card Cube the average pack size would be 13 8/9 cards. That's pretty much like having 36 first-pick cards in your pool. Wow. If we're looking for a change of pace maybe we can try this variant. It seems a lot simpler than a Rotisserie format. Mono red FTW?
In my experience I don't like Winston/Winchester very much in the big Cube. It works pretty well with the Commons Cube where you just take cards in a color but the last few times we've done Winston drafts it's almost felt like a 45-card sealed (which is pretty lame).
Thanks for the suggestions & I will definitely try your namesake format this weekend.
The only downside of Cube drafting is that every other format sucks in comparison
I got started by viewing eidolon's Cube comparison thread at http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=271371 I looked at the most popular cards & built my Cube from there. The Cube is completely customizable so do whatever you want with it.
Shameless bump to add 2-player draft formats to my Cube post. I've also posted them below. If you're ever "stuck" with only 2 players then I highly recommend the "Whammy." It makes the draft much more interesting than any other 2-player draft format I've done. Feel free to post feedback on these formats as well as my recent changes to the Cube. I only play 2-player drafts so changes have been made to the Cube with that in mind (sorry reanimator strategies & Tinker).
The "Whammy"
This is by far the most popular format in my playgroup
Shuffle up the entire Cube & distribute three stacks of 36 cards. One stack is for each player and one is the community pile. Roll a die & the winner gets to choose whether they want to go first or second.
Player A draws four cards from his stack while player B flips one card face-up from the community pile. Player A chooses one of these five cards. He then passes the remaining cards face-up to player B while flipping another card face-up from the community pile. Player B chooses two of these cards. Player B passes the remaining cards back to player A. Player A puts the remaining cards in his hand & secretly chooses one. Player A then puts any leftover cards in his discard pile.
Now the players switch roles with player B drawing four cards from his pile while player A flips one card face-up from the community pile. The players alternate who goes first until all three piles are empty.
The “Whammy” is what this draft is called because each player gets one “whammy” per draft. This means that anytime it is the player's turn they are able to “whammy” one card that has been turned face-up from the community pile. A card that receives the “whammy” is exiled from the draft & cannot be chosen by any player. This can only be done during the player's turn (at sorcery speed) & only once per draft. It can only be applied to the cards turned face-up from the community pile & NOT cards from the player's stack.
The “bonus card” is the final card taken in the draft. After all piles are empty each player picks up their discard pile & takes one card to add to their draft pool. Any cards exiled from the “Whammy” cannot be chosen as the bonus card.
Build 40 card decks from the 37 cards chosen & play!
This is just like regular sealed except you build two decks from your sealed pool. A 75-card sealed pool has worked well with our playgroup. Each player builds two completely separate decks with separate sideboards from their sealed pool. No cards can overlap between the two decks & sideboards. Each player chooses the deck they think is worse & those decks play a match first. Then each player plays a match using the deck they view as the better one. If the matches are split then each player battles using the deck that lost.
I'm in the middle of my first draft now. Just won round 1. I'm Rg & green was super-open the whole draft. Red was not so much but I still got some sweet spells. I wish I had more time to play this weekend but I think this is the only draft I'll be doing. Lousy having the draft on Easter weekend when I have other obligations.
I would recommend that they add more mana fixing as well as try to beef up aggro. Admittedly those are tougher to do in a 720 card Cube.
That being said I'm pretty excited for most of the new cards. I wonder how many Angels will be in the new set? Maybe they will have some sweet EtB abilities which is why the new Angel has the "no angel" clause.
This is a very persuasive argument. We're looking to cut Comet Storm for being too mana intensive & I think this case for RSZ will move it to the testing zone.
EDIT: BTW, how sloppy is it that Wizards sends out an E-mail with all of our E-mail addresses listed individually? That E-mail address that I have is now compromised. They need to get this resolved fast & apologize for their egregious error.
Keep me posted on if yours is working. BTW, I'm also in the MTGO Beta & that connection is also not working.
There's nothing on my PC which should prevent me from connecting.
Are there any local stores that sell old cards? Maybe go to them asking for old commons & see if they can give you a deal on the "bulk" cards. If I had to start over I would go to my local store to get some bulk cards & then order the rest on a website like Starcity. You're paying extra online but having all the cards sent to you without digging through a bunch of boxes is quite valuable in itself.
Are you planning to get foils down the road? How much do you want to spend now & later? Who will be playing the Cube? All questions that will determine the direction you should go.
Good luck!
I guess I've always been chased off by the 1 life per activation cost. Now that I think about it I think it would be a better inclusion than Boreal Druid despite the life loss. I'll look for another cut instead of the Druid because I like all the mana elves. With Deep Shadow it will be easier to run Gx splash black decks. Splashes occur pretty often in the Commons Cube.
It's always good to re-evaluate things, eh?
At 500 I run all of these & no Elves of Deep Shadow. Consistency is really key which is why I like having all of them.
Definitely some interesting modes there. I think the first one is my favorite of the three. I've experimented with variants that are similar to it. One of the most common ones is where each player does X exchanges with the middle pile. I never liked the "popular" variant because I would get to a point where I was happy with my pile & didn't want to do anymore. One time we tried it where you could just stop the exchanging at any time & move to a new set of cards. It worked out okay. I would like to try it again sometime to try & flesh it out.
The last one you list would have some pretty insane decks. With my 500 card Cube the average pack size would be 13 8/9 cards. That's pretty much like having 36 first-pick cards in your pool. Wow. If we're looking for a change of pace maybe we can try this variant. It seems a lot simpler than a Rotisserie format. Mono red FTW?
In my experience I don't like Winston/Winchester very much in the big Cube. It works pretty well with the Commons Cube where you just take cards in a color but the last few times we've done Winston drafts it's almost felt like a 45-card sealed (which is pretty lame).
Thanks for the suggestions & I will definitely try your namesake format this weekend.
I got started by viewing eidolon's Cube comparison thread at http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=271371 I looked at the most popular cards & built my Cube from there. The Cube is completely customizable so do whatever you want with it.
Good luck!
The "Whammy"
This is by far the most popular format in my playgroup
Shuffle up the entire Cube & distribute three stacks of 36 cards. One stack is for each player and one is the community pile. Roll a die & the winner gets to choose whether they want to go first or second.
Player A draws four cards from his stack while player B flips one card face-up from the community pile. Player A chooses one of these five cards. He then passes the remaining cards face-up to player B while flipping another card face-up from the community pile. Player B chooses two of these cards. Player B passes the remaining cards back to player A. Player A puts the remaining cards in his hand & secretly chooses one. Player A then puts any leftover cards in his discard pile.
Now the players switch roles with player B drawing four cards from his pile while player A flips one card face-up from the community pile. The players alternate who goes first until all three piles are empty.
The “Whammy” is what this draft is called because each player gets one “whammy” per draft. This means that anytime it is the player's turn they are able to “whammy” one card that has been turned face-up from the community pile. A card that receives the “whammy” is exiled from the draft & cannot be chosen by any player. This can only be done during the player's turn (at sorcery speed) & only once per draft. It can only be applied to the cards turned face-up from the community pile & NOT cards from the player's stack.
The “bonus card” is the final card taken in the draft. After all piles are empty each player picks up their discard pile & takes one card to add to their draft pool. Any cards exiled from the “Whammy” cannot be chosen as the bonus card.
Build 40 card decks from the 37 cards chosen & play!
This is just like regular sealed except you build two decks from your sealed pool. A 75-card sealed pool has worked well with our playgroup. Each player builds two completely separate decks with separate sideboards from their sealed pool. No cards can overlap between the two decks & sideboards. Each player chooses the deck they think is worse & those decks play a match first. Then each player plays a match using the deck they view as the better one. If the matches are split then each player battles using the deck that lost.