As for Narset and Sarkhan I don't see any difference between they're "random hookup" and a romantic relationship between Chandra and Gideon. Narset made Sarkhan feel peaceful in his otherwise ravaged mind. Chandra makes Gideon question his alliances and his beliefs. I think either of these relationships is fine but I don't think calling one a random hookup while thinking the other is fine is a good way to look at it. Personally I think Sarkhan deserves a nice lady to accompany him after all the crap he's been through. And if Chandra can get Gideon to lighten(heh) up a little then great. I do think it would be interesting if they explored planeswalkers relationships with each other more which it seems is what they will be doing in the future. I mean we know that Jace and Lilli were a thing once upon a time.
I suppose I should respond to this too.
The difference between Chandra and Gideon and Narset and Sarkhan is the sort of chemistry and tension that was present.
Narset and Sarkhan lacked pretty much all of that. They met and got along, but there wasn't really anything there that made sense as a relationship. Sarkhan went all agog and smitten with her, but it was very much a projection onto Narset instead of a mutually built relationship. To quote Barbara Streissand from a movie (I honestly don't remember which one) "You aren't in love with me, you're in love with the idea of me."
Gideon and Chandra, on the other hand, had an obvious tension and worked together well. The fact that they didn't want to admit it, and finally the pair confided in each other felt much more developed than the few days Sarkhan and Narset spent with each other even though it was probably roughly the same amount of time spent together. I mean, part of that might have genuinely been the difference between a foxhole romance and roadtrip buddy, but ultimately, there seemed to be genuine chemistry between Gideon and Chandra that was totally missing from Mister crazy pants and his bride to be.
Essentially, I just don't see how Sarkhan could actually be in a relationship because he IS crazy. And not functionally either, but completely outside society crazy.
Yeah, while I didn't get to read Godsend I'm pretty sure that Elspeth knew Daxos from a long time ago and her feelings for him developed long before the events of the Theros Block.
As much as I respect your position and authority as a storyline guru and lore keeper I disagree with you whole heartedly about seeing Narset/Sarkhan as a "hook up." From what I understand, Elspeth's feelings for Daxos were pretty clearly stated but it seemed like Narset and Sarkhan were just friends and personally really hope it stays that way.
Well, I'm overstating things, but that's partly because there are a lot of people who don't view it as a friendship, but just... differently romantic since Sarkhan is such a mess.
Elspeth encountered Daxos for something akin to 15 minutes right after his mom was stolen to the underworld. They treated the relationship rather more exaggerated as a starting point because of that. They did spend months together following Polukranos' defeat, but that doesn't mean they felt natural together. It was a VERY VERY forced relationship.
I'll be honest, I really wish they'd come back to that. I haven't been terribly happy with the random hookups we've been getting on our walkers as of late. (Narset/Sarkhan, Elspeth/Daxos)
Wow those people who called that Kytheon Iora was Gideon were right on the money.
... that was a thing? Geez.
I have complicated feelings about that then. Because it just kind of fuels the crazier speculations and that doesn't do some of us any favors.
Good on the people that worked that out though...
Incidentally, I am deeply amused by the fact that he comes from Akros and is probably going to end up getting dropped into Akrasa during his tenure on Bant.
Out of all of the Bantish nations, that one just feels most likely to me. Valeron already had Elspeth and Topa and Jhess just don't feel right to me. Could have ended up in Eos, but... I mean, come on, Akros and Akrasa is just too funny.
They've known for long enough that Gideon was Theran that they included a reference to him on the flavor text of Desperate Stand. In retrospect it makes plenty of sense, in terms of both his physical appearance and his sensibilities.
Actually, there's some distinction to be made with how Bant might have shaped him too since he's very much the kind to try to solo a raid/boss (forgive that pop-culture reference) to make sure that others aren't endangered.
Also yes, that Gideon on Bant pic is wicked cool. And apparently they've wanted to entangle him with Bant since... what was it, 2010? 2011? Of course they didn't get the details exactly right back then, but they've wanted to put him there for a while.
So at the end of the day, I'm not going to nod and stroke my chin, saying one or the other dragonlord isn't that oppressive. They set into motion these new Laws which people were forced to obey (or die, from what I understand). I think they should be repulsive.
I think that might come down to expectations informing how we look at the dragonlords vs how we interpret them from other sources.
I mean, really, none of them are demanding virgin sacrifices, and in the past we've seen far far less reasonable dragonlords that basically all acted like Silumgar. (The Primeval Empire, for example)
Now, I'm not defending them or refuting your point, but I think it might be an issue of perspective and past experience shaping how we regard their actions in comparison to others.
I like to think most planes are balanced within reason. But I think it's silly to assume an even split between the colors on every world.
Following a certain logic, most worlds that we are familiar with should skew blue because of the amount of water vs land.
That's kind of why this is a frustrating conversation to have, because there are so many ways to interpret the conversation that basically any lead can be taken to justify a stance. That's why I think it is just simpler to make the statement that worlds don't naturally skew towards a color without extreme circumstances present, such as the Sundering or an artificial start.
And I still maintain that Ravnica would skew white since the major forces that maintain it (barring the Izzet) are white. Boros, Azorius, Orzhov, Selesnya, and Izzet are primarily responsible for maintaining the society that shapes the world.
Partly, I'll admit, I just don't want to deal with everyone trying to decide what color some world is every time we see a new one.
Frankly, people being bad at planar understanding isn't a reason to overstate something. Chastise those who do it incorrectly.
I think you underestimate how many people look at something like the Soul cycle and draw false conclusions and then propagate them. Heck, this entire discussion is a branch of the entire Ravnica is blue because... that we were dealing with earlier.
complete with tragic backstory (dead girlfriend, even) driving him towards redemption. *yawn*
I suspect it was probably his mentor rather than a paramour.
Though it's now really suspect how much they're even going to pay attention to Laura's backstory for him, that backstory did include a mentor.
I meant that Mirrodin originally had a sun for each color except green.
Argentum didn't have any moons to begin with. Each of the moons sprang out of the core when it destabilized. Green was just the last one to happen (and from what we gather, it was overdue because of Memnarch)
Given how often Magic goes to artificial or altered planes is seems like a mistake to exclude them when discussing whether or not a plane can have a bias toward one color or another.
Since the shards of Alara shows that its possible for colors to severely suppressed so it hardly seems unreasonable that much smaller biases may exist on other planes.
I find artificial data points skew the results and lead to biased conclusions about how the nature of the multiverse is supposed to function.
Partly, I'll admit, I just don't want to deal with everyone trying to decide what color some world is every time we see a new one.
No world, from a flavor standpoint, leans towards any one color.
Bant? Jund? Esper? Naya? Grixis?
Alara.
The shards aren't natural and were insustainable, hence why the conflux happened in the first place.
Mirrodin had giant flaming balls of mana orbiting around it to attest to just how ungreen it was.
That isn't ungreen. It's not normal to us, but that doesn't make it ungreen. By the same measure, Pyrulea is a dyson sphere with its sun in the middle. That doesn't mean it isn't natural for that plane.
As an aside, Mirrodin is a weird artificial world. It was built in a planar void that already existed, and that is why it appears to be stable.
Serra's Realm leaned white.
Also artificial and sought correction. When it couldn't be sustained, it collapsed.
It's true that no known plane is exclusively one color or totally lacks any colors but lots of planes lean one direction or the other.
Basically only artificial worlds inherently lean towards one color.
I am really confused with the end of the story,
as I understand, Ojutai forbid anyone about the knowledge of the Khan and Clan
but then after Narset intentionally break the rule
Ojutai just release Narset ? that's all ?
on the past Ojutai killed Shu Yun and the entire Bloodfire monk because of it, and now he just tell Narset to look for more knowledge ???
that's not making sense at all
In fairness, he killed the ghostfire warriors, probably, because they'd all killed a dragon.
And in some way, you have to look at the difference between the Jeskai and the Ojutai brood. The Jeskai were enemies. Narset was a member of his brood.
Someone else pointed out, as well, that by encouraging her to leave, he effectively removes the threat she poses anyways.
The difference between Chandra and Gideon and Narset and Sarkhan is the sort of chemistry and tension that was present.
Narset and Sarkhan lacked pretty much all of that. They met and got along, but there wasn't really anything there that made sense as a relationship. Sarkhan went all agog and smitten with her, but it was very much a projection onto Narset instead of a mutually built relationship. To quote Barbara Streissand from a movie (I honestly don't remember which one) "You aren't in love with me, you're in love with the idea of me."
Gideon and Chandra, on the other hand, had an obvious tension and worked together well. The fact that they didn't want to admit it, and finally the pair confided in each other felt much more developed than the few days Sarkhan and Narset spent with each other even though it was probably roughly the same amount of time spent together. I mean, part of that might have genuinely been the difference between a foxhole romance and roadtrip buddy, but ultimately, there seemed to be genuine chemistry between Gideon and Chandra that was totally missing from Mister crazy pants and his bride to be.
Essentially, I just don't see how Sarkhan could actually be in a relationship because he IS crazy. And not functionally either, but completely outside society crazy.
Well, I'm overstating things, but that's partly because there are a lot of people who don't view it as a friendship, but just... differently romantic since Sarkhan is such a mess.
Elspeth encountered Daxos for something akin to 15 minutes right after his mom was stolen to the underworld. They treated the relationship rather more exaggerated as a starting point because of that. They did spend months together following Polukranos' defeat, but that doesn't mean they felt natural together. It was a VERY VERY forced relationship.
... that was a thing? Geez.
I have complicated feelings about that then. Because it just kind of fuels the crazier speculations and that doesn't do some of us any favors.
Good on the people that worked that out though...
Out of all of the Bantish nations, that one just feels most likely to me. Valeron already had Elspeth and Topa and Jhess just don't feel right to me. Could have ended up in Eos, but... I mean, come on, Akros and Akrasa is just too funny.
Actually, there's some distinction to be made with how Bant might have shaped him too since he's very much the kind to try to solo a raid/boss (forgive that pop-culture reference) to make sure that others aren't endangered.
Also yes, that Gideon on Bant pic is wicked cool. And apparently they've wanted to entangle him with Bant since... what was it, 2010? 2011? Of course they didn't get the details exactly right back then, but they've wanted to put him there for a while.
I mean, really, none of them are demanding virgin sacrifices, and in the past we've seen far far less reasonable dragonlords that basically all acted like Silumgar. (The Primeval Empire, for example)
Now, I'm not defending them or refuting your point, but I think it might be an issue of perspective and past experience shaping how we regard their actions in comparison to others.
Following a certain logic, most worlds that we are familiar with should skew blue because of the amount of water vs land.
That's kind of why this is a frustrating conversation to have, because there are so many ways to interpret the conversation that basically any lead can be taken to justify a stance. That's why I think it is just simpler to make the statement that worlds don't naturally skew towards a color without extreme circumstances present, such as the Sundering or an artificial start.
And I still maintain that Ravnica would skew white since the major forces that maintain it (barring the Izzet) are white. Boros, Azorius, Orzhov, Selesnya, and Izzet are primarily responsible for maintaining the society that shapes the world.
I suspect it was probably his mentor rather than a paramour.
Though it's now really suspect how much they're even going to pay attention to Laura's backstory for him, that backstory did include a mentor.
I find artificial data points skew the results and lead to biased conclusions about how the nature of the multiverse is supposed to function.
Partly, I'll admit, I just don't want to deal with everyone trying to decide what color some world is every time we see a new one.
The shards aren't natural and were insustainable, hence why the conflux happened in the first place.
That isn't ungreen. It's not normal to us, but that doesn't make it ungreen. By the same measure, Pyrulea is a dyson sphere with its sun in the middle. That doesn't mean it isn't natural for that plane.
As an aside, Mirrodin is a weird artificial world. It was built in a planar void that already existed, and that is why it appears to be stable.
Also artificial and sought correction. When it couldn't be sustained, it collapsed.
Basically only artificial worlds inherently lean towards one color.
In fairness, he killed the ghostfire warriors, probably, because they'd all killed a dragon.
And in some way, you have to look at the difference between the Jeskai and the Ojutai brood. The Jeskai were enemies. Narset was a member of his brood.
Someone else pointed out, as well, that by encouraging her to leave, he effectively removes the threat she poses anyways.