I understand why Browbeat style cards are usually bad, but in this case, it's either 4 damage for R or a 4/3 for R. That is so ridiculously aggressively priced that getting whichever is worse of the two is still really, really good.
2) A player voting for himself/herself will be considered the day's lynch, and the game will immediately progress to night. This rule will be ignored for the first 100 posts.
I thought I would do an introduction post since I'm new here. Somethings you should know about me:
-On my forum, mafia is played in hyperdrive. Day phases are usually 24 hours long and people can post at night. It's a constant stream of people posting and arguing often in real-time.
-I don't lie. I often leave things out of my posts or say things in vague ways. However, if you can catch me in a direct statement, you can rely on it to be the truth. Due to this though, I will often say things that use syntax that sounds mafia-ish. (E.G. "The town is doing well today." Instead of "we are doing well today".)
Onto my actual first post:
How high powered is this game? Should we expect lots of kills/protects/investigates going on on day 1.
I would love it if a few of you could introduce yourselves as well so I could get a feel for the personalities I'm dealing with.
Prefacing scummy behavior and fishing, leading me to question this:
Personally I'm hoping he is just BSing (like Guard in Kitteh Trek and the LOLCats) and not that Zion actually put a PR into this game. PRs suck for both the player who has one (me in TF2 for example) and the rest of the players in the game (again look at TF2 for example)
CALLED THAT **** - goes to look at game - HE WAS TOWN AND LIED ABOUT HIS PR??? WTF?
Players joking or lying about their random votes being random is the classic way to catch scum early Day One. I know I've been guilty of it at least once.
I have literally never done this or seen it be used to catch someone. Not that it doesn't happen, but I don't put as much stock in it as you apparently do.
This morning, things are different as the units gather. To start with, The Cold Monarch, Taldarin, Protoss Dragoon, a member of the Town, was lying in front of the Command Center a sticky, blue, Protoss mess. The Mafia are getting much more brazen. Almost as if... but that's not possible... it's only been a few days since this fiasco started...
As a crowd gathers around the body, a group of six stands atop a nearby platform.
KittyCupCake, Alan Shezar, Terran Goliath, a member of the Mafia,
Iso, Samir Duran, Terran Ghost, Mafia Executioner,
Void, Gerard DuGalle, Terran Battleship, Mafia Godfather,
Brinatoo, Syndrea, Protoss Arbiter, a member of the Mafia,
Yanni, Rastadon/Imrian, Protoss Dark Archon, a member of the Mafia, and
GigaRage, Magellan, Terran Science Vessel, Town Cop Mind-Controlled by the Mafia during Day 3
Just as the sun breaks dawn over the horizon, a large red ball of energy manifests from Yanni. The ball flashes to zindabad, Warbringer, Protoss Reaver, a member of the Town Mind-Controlled by the Mafia during Day 5.
Iso steps forward and calls out to the crowd, "Mephit, Alexei Stukov, Terran Ghost, Saulus, come join us upon our pedestal."
Yanni's deep voice projects from the platform. "We control a majority of the living units. This station is ours now. You have lost this 'game,' as some would have it."
Archonoid, Tom Kazansky, Terran Wraith, a member of the Town, has been end-gamed and loses.
ganderin_dan, Edmund Duke, Terran Battleship, a member of the Town, has been end-gamed and loses.
ProphetKing, Arcturus Mengsk, Terran Battleship, a member of the Town, has been end-gamed and loses.
kill-joy, Gui Montag, Terran Firebat, a member of the Town, has been end-gamed and loses.
Prophylaxis, Zeratul, Protoss Zealot, a member of the Town, has been end-gamed and loses.
Artifice 101, Fenix, Protoss Dragoon, a member of the Town, has been end-gamed and loses.
Audinho, Andraxxus, Protoss Carrier, a member of the Town, has been end-gamed and loses.
Starcraft Mafia is now officially over with a Mafia win. Setup details and an apology to the Town for the scum-sidedness will be forthcoming.
Hi guys, I'm going through a lot right now, but I'm down to this being my only active game at the moment. Please don't lynch me :|
I am about to pass out now and I literally have a full day tomorrow, so if I don't get back on before deadline, I'll be sure to post content right out of the gate in Day 2.
This is only the first half-ish of the game. I'm going to bed. I'll do the other half tomorrow, or Tuesday at the absolute latest if I don't feel like it after my math test tomorrow evening. Spoilered for clutter control.
I almost did, but the role choices I got are not exactly stellar.
Love the new avatar, fruity pebbles.
I think I agree with him, but I'm not sure if he's approaching it the way I am.
My bet is that out of three roles, the scum have at least one obviously scummy role to choose from that needs to be replaced with a more townie one and will have to lie about it. I think by pressing hard on the choices we can reveal more information than even from the choice the player made. It seems like it would be a really hard place to defend from as scum.
Also, there is (assuming 3 scum) the potential for 27 town roles we just chose from. The risk to flat replace a role with a townie one is very high, and I bet lies can be spotted in highly customized roles.
I started not liking Emo with this post. He soft-claims a weak PR, which is troublesome, and then goes onto speculate way too much.
As serious as any vote placed with weak behavioral tells can be, yes. I don't have anything else to work with, so the guy who (if I am correct) threatening to AZWOLG someone with no town consent gets the vote for now.
Shalako, if you daykill someone without the town's consent, I will do my utmost to see you lynched. Vigs who arbitrarily kill people are as bad as serial killers.
Shalako has been playing this way the last two games I was in with him.
Do we consider pondering mafia dasychat scummy? How about wondering if they could coordinate their role choices?
@All Without naming the parameters and without you suggesting any, would you want a soft claim of some sort?
I say yes.
After I've read this game for the second time, I'm moving Infinis up my scum list. I had him as middle of the road before, but this and some of his more recent posts are reading scummier to me now. Like, really? "Is discussing something scummy?" Who asks that? Scum ask that.
* Wuffles_II throws a suspicious glance at Infinis
What sort of soft claim?
1) Choices given
2) Name
3) Crypto - (apparently these have been judged against the spirit of the game now, thank the lord council almighty :p)
4) Something else?
If it is option 1 or 2 though, I am cautiously optimistic about this.
Cautiously optimistic for us to reveal two pieces of information that tell scum a lot about our role?
I will be seriously trying to policy lynch you today, because there is not a single bit of townie in the possible motivations behind azwolging someone like that. At best, you're a horrible player.
Good work giving the mafia a free -1 to LOL.
Even if he is mafia, you still fail at this game.
If you're trolling, it is working.
So, you know that pinkfloyd (me) is town. And possibly Shalako too. Which means you're scum.
Because I'm taking Wuffles out First Post of Day 2 obviously.
I'd rather lynch him today. As for you, I think you're most likely town if you can shoot again, but you really need to use it as a second lynch and not blow it because someone doesn't appease your every request.
In a *mini* sir, there are twelve players. Also, the town likely has a high percentage of power roles ALSO, so your second point is moot.
How normal games go:
Assuming there is one scum nightkill and one lynch per day, the town can do the following and NOT lose the game.
Day 1: Mislynch, 11 players, 3 scum.
Night: Nightkill town, 10 players, 3 scum.
Day 2: Mislynch, 9 players, 3 scum
Night: NK town, 8 players, 3 scum.
Day 3: Mislynch, 8 players, 3 scum.
Night: NK, 7 players, 3 scum.
Day 4: Lylo.
While if a random, arbitrary nightkill like Shalako has done occurs, then:
Day 1: Mislynch, daykill, 10 players, 75% chance of 3 scum left.
Night: DK, 9 players left, 3 scum.
Day 2: Mislynch, daykill, 8 players left, 66% chance of 3 scum left.
Night: DK, 7 players left, 3 scum.
Day 3: Lylo, daykill, STILL less than 50% chance of hitting scum.
Scum wins day 3.
Shalako's play will mean unless we are at the top of our game, that we are losing an entire night and day period. So unless he is killing with legitimate reason, there is simply no statistical reason for letting him live.
Plus, the way he's acted today tells me he's not going to apply any kind of objective or relevant criteria to who he takes out.
He's as bad as a serial killer if he's town, and if he's scum or actually *is* a serial killer, then that's even worse for the town. If he keeps choosing his targets for himself, then he will likely lose the game for us.
Those statistics are so misleading. I'll give you that you're bad at math, but it's still scummy. And you clearly have implied here and elsewhere that you think he's town, even if you do include the "if he's scum" copout.
Infi, your "general interest" in soft claim from me was a NO.
I then went on to say "hoooowever, if it is 1) or 2) then a cautious yes."
also, can everyone please from now on assume that no matter what I say, my opinion on Shalako is "his actions make no sense whatsoever on a townie, so he's mafia or SK, as otherwise he is very very bad at this game, and no matter what, unless he lets the town control his ability, he is effectively an SK anyways, so he must die".
I noticed after that my last post was not quite definitive enough in explaining.
I believe he is scum with a powerfully-chosen ability, because if he's town, he's not playing like one. Therefore, he is scum.
re: softclaim: What else could we softclaim? You're saying NO WE SHOULDN'T SOFTCLAIM but if we're going to softclaim either of the two only possibilities (which both happen to give the scum information as to our roles), then it's fine. What?
re: Shalako: here you say he's scum, flat out
Okay, so I got 51% in 5th form maths. Stats is not my strong suit but if Shalako keeps playing that way, we're still more likely than not to lose.
Fearmongering. There's a disconnect between your saying that he's scum and all of these implications that he's town. If he's scum, then the daykill has been balanced and we're not more likely than not to lose because of it (assuming that Tanmod is worth a ****, which he is). We're only more likely than not to lose if he's an AWOLZGLHSDFLHing (whatever) town vig.
[URL="http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showpost.php?p=7890245&postcount=23"][URL="http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showpost.php?p=7892109&postcount=30"]Re Emo[/URL]: This is such a townie view point. I really don't like Arch's posts regarding this.
I'll agree that Arch's posts aren't amazing (they're not superbad either though), but I disagree that Emo's is a townie view point. For example, each scum could have had three choices. I find that just as likely if not more likely than that he's town who missed Tan's thing about how people can have different numbers of posts. I'll admit that this may be confirmation bias (I think I'm using that correctly) though.
oookay, after having read the rest of the posts since I went to sleep now
I have had a lot of time to think on this and despite, DESPITE, DESPITE Shalako's terrible play here, he probably is town.
I let my sheer gigantic throbbing...frustration rule me yesterday, and it clouded my read on shalako to an unacceptable extent. There is no better way to make me rage in mafia than a vig that can't keep it in his pants.
However, I am still really curious as to why Shalako's not bringing any hate down from any other players?
He never even provided any reasoning as to why he tried to murder PF.
Even if you don't think it was a scum play, at very least, it WAS terrible. Shalako should have saved the kill for a more appropriate time, and he should have let us use him as a second lynch.
If he keeps this up, and kills me tomorrow, that's fine, it at least confirms him as town or SK. Because no mod is stupid enough to give a mafioso multiple daykills.
Although I do remember a game where the mafia could EITHER daykill OR nightkill, so I will be seriously looking at Shalako come Day 2 if there was no nightkill, and I think you all should too.
Aside from that, though, I'm willing to let Shalako go for now, not because he's not terrible, but because he's probably not mafia. Nobody is ever going to convince me that azwolging vigs should be allowed to roam free though. I've lost two games at least where the townie vig took out multiple power roles and the mafia just ran rampant.
While I agree with your call here, I don't buy that you slept on it and reread and now think he's town. I think you've known he was town this whole time and had to adopt the he's scum PoV to explain your wanting to lynch him, and now you're trying to backtrack.
@ TFF - I see no harm in telling our names - it seals the mafia into any false claims which can be exploited by the town. How could something like that hurt the town? o.O?
QUIT SAYING YOU'RE AGAINST A SOFT CLAIM AND THEN SAYING KINDS OF SOFT CLAIMS YOU'RE OK WITH ARGLSDILHGSHL
I was obviously not joking about Daykilling him and the fact that he allowed me to shoot him instead of using it as a 2nd lynch(as I was planning to Cite: Next quoted post) was a waste of my power for today.
What? If you were planning on using it as a second lynch if he did claim, then what you did was straight-up fishing. Sure, if he claimed bulletproof, you probably wouldn't have tried to shoot him. But you didn't know he was going to be bulletproof when you asked him to claim. So you never had an intention of using it as a 2nd lynch.
NO YOU LITTLE SMUG EXPLICATIVE, I AM NOT SCUM AND I AM NOT GIVING UP, IT IS JUST INCREDIBLY FRUSTRATING TO ME THAT AE WALTZES IN HERE WITH A CASE THAT IS SHALAKO LEVELS OF TERRIBLE AND NOT ONE BUT TWO PEOPLE HAVE EXPRESSED THAT THEY AGREE WITH IT. ARE YOU SO BLIND THAT YOU CAN NOT SEE THAT HIS CASE IS NOTHING BUT "THIS IS TOTALLY WHY SIR MU DID THIS, P.S. HE'S SCUM". HOLY -HELL- I CAN ONLY ASSUME THAT, IF YOU AND INFINIS ARE TOWN, YOU BOTH HAD A GUT READ OF SCUM ON ME FOR SOME GOD-AWFUL NON REASON AND ARE JUST USING AE'S CASE TO JUSTIFY IT TO YOURSELVES.
I really wish it was possible for me to express my anger without using allcaps and pseudo-swears.
I also agreed with the case at this point. You are either bad flailing town or scum, but since you're an un-CC'd Cop, you're probably bad flailing town.
EWP: Oh. I know what you're talking about. Sir Mu refused to claim in the mass claim, not when at L-2 in that game; and he explicitly was willing to claim if a majority requested that he do so. I was talking about refusal to claim as a lynch suspect, not in the context of mass claims.
Are you intentionally ignoring a fairly long history of people not claiming for one reason or another? You're acting like no townie has never not claimed, and if I was Sir Mu I probably wouldn't claim then either.
I mean, you ran in and put him to L-1 only to say no townie would refuse to claim and you never saw Sir Mu not claim despite Sir Mu not claiming. Does "I've never seen Sir Mu not claim at L-2 hold water to you? It shouldn't.
Hyperbole much? I didn't say "no townie has ever not claimed". I said a townie not claiming when under the lynch gun is a pointless waste. You seem to be trying for an all-or-nothing defense - that just because some townies have done X, X can't be scummy. But that's silly; this is not a game of 100% probabilities.
I think that Emo looks scummy as hell through this exchange. Sir Mu's not claiming in Hetalia is very different from his not claiming here.
Told you so. Let's move on to the obviously scummy people from his wagon.You are correct, I misread how much importance you put on that and your slipping memory already had my hackles raised.
I find the "told you so" here to be very... scummy.
BTW, wuffles, the correct answer was, "I'm upset at Mu for acting so scummy that he was forced to claim, outing our cop D1." Your answer of, "I'm upset his role prevented a mislynch," isn't really a townie motivation for anger here.
WwaB has done nothing today. Wants to lynch PF based on role. Has said nothing about PF in game. Has a town read on Infinis and toastboy. Really?
With so little posts you get a town read on them? Maybe its legit, maybe those posts are content full and take stances on the days top discussions. I will have to look into that also. I feel Wolf is trying to stay under the radar.
Some of the recently spoiled cards are just ridiculous in power level. The red one-drop in particular is just... why?
I wonder if it's going to be Jace 4.0 or one of the existing 3 incarnations...
And seconded on the gas prices. I don't think it's ever been above $4 here (although it's close now).
EDIT: I'm blind, it's 282 feet and 85.5 meters. Lol.
I've got to be somewhere and won't be back until late tonight, so it might not be until tomorrow before I have a chance to get caught up and post.
Gratz! And I assume that you mean that your girlfriend/wife is pregnant? 'Cuz I thought you were a guy lol
Interesting rule is interesting.
Prefacing scummy behavior and fishing, leading me to question this:
Cyan's usually pretty spot-on with his reads, but I don't really agree with this.
Nice mudslinging. He wasn't wagon jumping so much as he was voting for his scumread.
CALLED THAT **** - goes to look at game - HE WAS TOWN AND LIED ABOUT HIS PR??? WTF?
I have literally never done this or seen it be used to catch someone. Not that it doesn't happen, but I don't put as much stock in it as you apparently do.
As a crowd gathers around the body, a group of six stands atop a nearby platform.
KittyCupCake, Alan Shezar, Terran Goliath, a member of the Mafia,
Iso, Samir Duran, Terran Ghost, Mafia Executioner,
Void, Gerard DuGalle, Terran Battleship, Mafia Godfather,
Brinatoo, Syndrea, Protoss Arbiter, a member of the Mafia,
Yanni, Rastadon/Imrian, Protoss Dark Archon, a member of the Mafia, and
GigaRage, Magellan, Terran Science Vessel, Town Cop Mind-Controlled by the Mafia during Day 3
Just as the sun breaks dawn over the horizon, a large red ball of energy manifests from Yanni. The ball flashes to zindabad, Warbringer, Protoss Reaver, a member of the Town Mind-Controlled by the Mafia during Day 5.
Iso steps forward and calls out to the crowd, "Mephit, Alexei Stukov, Terran Ghost, Saulus, come join us upon our pedestal."
Yanni's deep voice projects from the platform. "We control a majority of the living units. This station is ours now. You have lost this 'game,' as some would have it."
Archonoid, Tom Kazansky, Terran Wraith, a member of the Town, has been end-gamed and loses.
ganderin_dan, Edmund Duke, Terran Battleship, a member of the Town, has been end-gamed and loses.
ProphetKing, Arcturus Mengsk, Terran Battleship, a member of the Town, has been end-gamed and loses.
kill-joy, Gui Montag, Terran Firebat, a member of the Town, has been end-gamed and loses.
Prophylaxis, Zeratul, Protoss Zealot, a member of the Town, has been end-gamed and loses.
Artifice 101, Fenix, Protoss Dragoon, a member of the Town, has been end-gamed and loses.
Audinho, Andraxxus, Protoss Carrier, a member of the Town, has been end-gamed and loses.
Starcraft Mafia is now officially over with a Mafia win. Setup details and an apology to the Town for the scum-sidedness will be forthcoming.
kill-joy: 0
Void: 0
Yanni: 0
Archonoid: 0
zindabad: 1 (Void)
Iso: 0
Artifice 101: 0
Brinatoo: 0
GigaRage: 0
Prophylaxis: 0
ganderin_dan: 0
creampuffeater: 9 (Iso, Prophylaxis, GigaRage, TheFooFish, Audinho, kill-joy, Brinatoo, The Cold Monarch, Archonoid)
Audinho: 0
Mephit: 0
ProphetKing: 0
TheFooFish: 0
The Cold Monarch: 0
No Lynch: 0
Not Voting: 7 (Yanni, zindabad, Artifice 101, ganderin_dan, creampuffeater, Mephit, ProphetKing)
With 17 alive, it is 9 to lynch or 9 to no lynch.
creampuffeater has been lynched. He was Sarah Kerrigan, Terran Ghost, Judas.
It is now Night 4. Night actions are due by Saturday at Noon CST.
Mephit has been prodded.
Votecount 4.2
kill-joy: 0
Void: 0
Yanni: 0
Archonoid: 0
zindabad: 1 (Void)
Iso: 0
Artifice 101: 0
Brinatoo: 0
GigaRage: 0
Prophylaxis: 0
ganderin_dan: 0
creampuffeater: 8 (Iso, Prophylaxis, GigaRage, TheFooFish, Audinho, kill-joy, Brinatoo, The Cold Monarch)
Audinho: 0
Mephit: 0
ProphetKing: 0
TheFooFish: 0
The Cold Monarch: 0
No Lynch: 0
Not Voting: 8 (Yanni, Archonoid, zindabad, Artifice 101, ganderin_dan, creampuffeater, Mephit, ProphetKing)
With 17 alive, it is 9 to lynch or 9 to no lynch.
I am about to pass out now and I literally have a full day tomorrow, so if I don't get back on before deadline, I'll be sure to post content right out of the gate in Day 2.
Why didn't you?
I don't know what to think about this. Is he feigning ignorance? Scum typically (read: always) get to see each others' role PMs...
I started not liking Emo with this post. He soft-claims a weak PR, which is troublesome, and then goes onto speculate way too much.
Excuse me?
Why haven't you followed through on this?
After I've read this game for the second time, I'm moving Infinis up my scum list. I had him as middle of the road before, but this and some of his more recent posts are reading scummier to me now. Like, really? "Is discussing something scummy?" Who asks that? Scum ask that.
Cautiously optimistic for us to reveal two pieces of information that tell scum a lot about our role?
So, you know that pinkfloyd (me) is town. And possibly Shalako too. Which means you're scum.
Wasn't he mafia in that game? So you're saying that you want to lynch town?
I'd rather lynch him today. As for you, I think you're most likely town if you can shoot again, but you really need to use it as a second lynch and not blow it because someone doesn't appease your every request.
Those statistics are so misleading. I'll give you that you're bad at math, but it's still scummy. And you clearly have implied here and elsewhere that you think he's town, even if you do include the "if he's scum" copout.
re: softclaim: What else could we softclaim? You're saying NO WE SHOULDN'T SOFTCLAIM but if we're going to softclaim either of the two only possibilities (which both happen to give the scum information as to our roles), then it's fine. What?
re: Shalako: here you say he's scum, flat out
Fearmongering. There's a disconnect between your saying that he's scum and all of these implications that he's town. If he's scum, then the daykill has been balanced and we're not more likely than not to lose because of it (assuming that Tanmod is worth a ****, which he is). We're only more likely than not to lose if he's an AWOLZGLHSDFLHing (whatever) town vig.
I lol'd.
I'll agree that Arch's posts aren't amazing (they're not superbad either though), but I disagree that Emo's is a townie view point. For example, each scum could have had three choices. I find that just as likely if not more likely than that he's town who missed Tan's thing about how people can have different numbers of posts. I'll admit that this may be confirmation bias (I think I'm using that correctly) though.
How is that a terrible use of fishing? Shalako flat out told PF to claim or die? What is that if not fishing?
While I agree with your call here, I don't buy that you slept on it and reread and now think he's town. I think you've known he was town this whole time and had to adopt the he's scum PoV to explain your wanting to lynch him, and now you're trying to backtrack.
QUIT SAYING YOU'RE AGAINST A SOFT CLAIM AND THEN SAYING KINDS OF SOFT CLAIMS YOU'RE OK WITH ARGLSDILHGSHL
What? If you were planning on using it as a second lynch if he did claim, then what you did was straight-up fishing. Sure, if he claimed bulletproof, you probably wouldn't have tried to shoot him. But you didn't know he was going to be bulletproof when you asked him to claim. So you never had an intention of using it as a 2nd lynch.
That's the only thing you want to comment on?
I also agreed with the case at this point. You are either bad flailing town or scum, but since you're an un-CC'd Cop, you're probably bad flailing town.
I love how you refrain from saying whether he's town or scum.
I think that Emo looks scummy as hell through this exchange. Sir Mu's not claiming in Hetalia is very different from his not claiming here.
Actually, it could be, because magnetic north is not located at the north pole.
I find the "told you so" here to be very... scummy.
Quoted for freaking truth.
Agreed.
Seppel - Mojo, Protoss Scout, a member of the Town, has been killed during the night.
Day 4 has begun.
Votecount 4.1
kill-joy: 0
Void: 0
Yanni: 0
Archonoid: 0
zindabad: 0
Iso: 0
Artifice 101: 0
Brinatoo: 0
GigaRage: 0
Prophylaxis: 0
ganderin_dan: 0
creampuffeater: 0
Audinho: 0
Mephit: 0
ProphetKing: 0
TheFooFish: 0
The Cold Monarch: 0
No Lynch: 0
With 17 alive, it is 9 to lynch or 9 to no lynch.