Though I'm patient, so I'm willing to see a little more motive before jumping on the bandwagon yet.
If I must make an observation, Cythare is one aggressive cat. Rawr.
Teh JeY (look, spelled accurately! :p) does the same thing that EtR does in the next post. Expresses interest in the wagon, while also pointing out why they're waiting to go on. Fence-sit, see: prime example.
I'm not going to pile on with a vote at this point, but I would like to hear more from Swishh regarding his comment.
EtR]Hmmm. I didn't vote because I didn't think it was really worthy of a vote. I didn't see the action as scummy but was interested in his thoughts from the statement.
And furthermore, I don't see these 2 posts jiving here from EtR. From starting your response to Vox with "Hmmm", it stood out as you being careful, and then you go on to say you didn't think it was worthy of a vote.
But I see your statement about not wanting to pile on "at this point" to mean that you didn't vote only because it would be seen as piling on, not because you didn't think it was unwarranted.
whoa whoa whoa I didn't say he was scum. Unvote
Vote Rick Santorum
That was awful shifty mister.
If this whole swishh thing doesn't scream "I'm NEW and having fun!" then I just don't know what else to even say. Which frankly, is pretty much null for a player with no experience. Definitely cuts into the allegedly scummy nature of such a strangely motivated vote though.
Voting people because "they annoy you?" And even worse, as soon as you're called out, you vote the person who called you out on it. Scummy, scummy, scum.
Please explain why this is only a scum mind set option and not a town mind set option.
Looking for someone to bounce ideas off regarding Amistarian III, and ultimately review the setup once it's complete. If you're interested, please let me know via PM.
Still seeking.
Thanks!
DYH
If I didn't desperately want to play in it, I'd give it a go
You said I wanted him vigged. I said I don't want him vigged, but given the difficulty in finding his alignment via actions the best way to find it is to vig him.[/font]
Can't really be the best way to find his alignment if he's dead afterward...Even a guess based loosely on his actions would be a better way since it doesn't chance a misvig. So that logic doesn't play out very well.
I was following up on something that Ecophagy noted. I no longer thought Shark was scum, but I thought Eco's point that he would be pursued for the rest of the game was valid. In the absence of another strong candidate at the time, getting info was better than not getting any.
As I said to Eco back then, this is not a town mindset to "settle" for a bad lynch, especially since it has been proven many times, and in this game as well that a good case can gain traction plenty quick enough.
[font='Georgia']You really love to use meta. I don't really have a counter-argument besides that you're incorrect about how specific you are about my town meta v. my scum meta.[/font]
You just come across as annoyed in this post that Xyre is using meta. Which isn't a point in your favor since his meta analysis has been very successful to this point in the game, and I daresay townie Cythare wouldn't have had a problem with that.
D2, when Ecophagy asked for detrimental abilities to be used on him, I tried to engage him in a way that would bait the NK onto him.
N2, I targeted Ecophagy with Sanctuary Chant.[/font]
So, after Eco asked for detrimental abilities, you tried to bait one onto him, and then attempted to protect him from said detrimental ability? How does that make any sense?
Do you care about the order they were locked, or just what my current lock configuration is? And if the former, why?[/font]
I do care what order. Why do you care why I care?
Because I'm not sure how it's relevant, and it seemed vaguely akin to things that might care about lock color. Here you go:
N1: Lock 1 lock of each Silent Chant and Stifling Chant.
N2: Unlock Stifling Chant lock, then lock 1 lock of each Silent Chant and Stifling Chant.[/font]
You don't understand how it's relevant to get clarification on used abilities and their effects from the day's top scumspect?
Seems like a pretty good way to verify the truth of a claim.
And I'm sure you can see that, which makes me think you were hoping to avoid making a mistake in your story.
[font='Georgia']Alright, I'll get to my list between 8:00 and 11:00 AM EST tomorrow. Then put the remaining 4 votes on me, the town doc. Better?[/font]
Hey, you forgot to mention that you're the town doc.
And then, N2, targeting Eco, who specifically asked to be targeted by detrimental abilities, with an ability that would, theoretically, turn off the detrimental ability he was asking someone to hit him with. It just seems backwards. And you did this just because you thought scum might want to target him because of that odd request?
For example, my unlock involves Night targeting, and I either got roleblocked or my target got doc'd, because I didn't get my unlock.
What's up with this? Your Unlock is points based, right? And you totally did get the point, right?
Excellent catch. I didn't even remember him mentioning that.
Also worth noting how Cythare initially plays it off to you:
Quote from Cythare »
None of it does. I was being intentionally vague because I didn't know what had caused my ability to fail and didn't want to give away how my role actually worked.
The entire game is about trying to tell genuine from fake. Let's extrapolate: it's perfectly possible for all of my positions in the game so far to have come from a townie that has wrong reads. For example, what is about the fact that I voted not-Eron on Day 2 scummy? Why have you zeroed in on those posts, but in the few where I lay out my entire thought process, this is suddenly indeterminable.
You are correct: only townies (and neutrals) scumhunt. The Mafia have to appear to scumhunt. What in my posts (particularly the ones where I lay out my reasoning behind all my reads!) leads you to believe that I am doing the latter rather than the former.
Eco has the feel of someone who is caught, but not for what he sees as the correct or valid reasons. The indignation, urgency and emotional appeal over the work he put into his reads all seem to point to this tell.
Pedit: I'm not trying to rush days end. I want xyre to post, but I want to make sure we lynch scumCythare no matter what. Call it fearmongering but I really feel this l-2 threshold is more a ploy than anything. Not saying he is lying about the claim but more of lying about the immediacy of his lynch
What makes you think he's lying about the threshold?
--------------
That being said, I'd be voting Cythare right now if it wouldn't be the hammer.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showp...&postcount=714 pretty hardcore fencesit here, looks like Alpha wants to say "hey, it's a strong power and he will die toDay so why don't we let him live" but doesn't. Considering the flip and Alpha recent posts I'm safely putting him in my leaning scum pile.
That’s not close to what I was saying. I was in fact theorizing that even those who weren’t convinced of his guilt should consider whether it was reasonable to let somebody claiming that ability to live.
You even noted later that Asenion nonsensically wanted to try for a Axelrod lynch, which was ludicrous at the time, and now. I certainly never hinted at what you suggest.
Also, please elaborate on recent posts that you seem to find so reprehensible. If memory serves, you didn’t like me deriving a scum mindset from your wording. That’s all that comes to mind.
Quote from DRey »
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showp...&postcount=847 Now this is a scummy FOS. What I get from this is "Asen is scummy for MAJOR reasons... Hey look at Arn and KK! vote KK for no apparent reason". Pretty damning evidence here.
Well, hard to say “no apparent reason” as I was working on my Kosa case at the time. Think of what I was saying as a top suspects list, and you’ll start to get an idea of what I was posting. Quick hits on my thoughts, and didn’t want Asenion’s ridiculous suggestion from the day before go unnoticed, while at the same time I was following what I thought was a good lead on Kosa. In hindsight, EtR being scum makes those leads seem incorrect.
Easy mislynch. Implies that it was a case with much traction, and that there was significant suspicion from others at the time. Neither of which were true. More like an earnest but probably incorrect attempt at scumhunting. We can’t all be master analysts.
Quote from DRey »
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showp...postcount=1142 Here we see Alpha noticing something no one has noticed about Cy, something very relevant as scum is much more self-aware than town, however no pressure whatsoever, exactly like he did with Asen.
You’re using your own read of Cythare as scum to point out a lack of pressure by me. But I made points about several players that caught my attention in that post. That one was no more egregious than any other, and I had a working idea of who was mafia.
We have different feelings on the value and/or frequency of pressure. I’m not somebody who votes/changes their vote often. And my previous response applies here as well.
Quote from DRey »
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showp...postcount=1242 total difference from my read at that post, what I thought was "Ced is claiming to be a power role, I will not highlight this post nor ask any question for fear of outing a power role". Alpha fishes pretty hardcore here, worse still there's nothing to be gained from this for town, this is a total fishing question.
At least you note that it’s a different read. I didn’t feel I was fishing. I took it as him saying he could prove that he thought dC wouldn’t be the NK, as if though he had mentioned it before and could reference a prior post.
It was (and still is) an interaction that I can’t wrap my head around. But given my town read on Iso to that point, I would rather try to understand him than attack him for it.
So town points, but then not town points because I “prepare for a hop” onto you “the next day”. Sorry my good sir, that’s not a hop. It’s a start. For looking at someone the next day. Which, by your own admission, you now see exactly why I was so alarmed at your deflection:
Quote from DRey »
I decided to finish the reread before posting my notes, the funniest part is that I now can understand why people accused me of trying to deflect from Eron, back there I couldn't understand because I had no idea of the existence of the Eron wagon and how well the dynamic duo of Xyre-Axel had caught him.
All that being said, I spent the better part of yesterday trying to find your scum games and instances of you being lynched. And in all the cases I found, I saw no instances of DRey maintaining he was town, or even really being around when lynched.
The overall posting style really feels different here too. As scum, your sentences tend to be shorter, and betray much less of your own feelings. You also tend to be a good deal less emotional, and I think you’ve actually been pretty close to a town meta here.
Additionally, having read through that entire post while answering your criticisms of me, that analysis feels pretty hard to fake from a scum perspective. I think it’s probably time to swallow my pride and conclude that your premature /bah post was genuine.
Since our current deadline falls somewhat awkwardly within the festive period, I've decided to offer a one-time-only deadline extension of one week. The new deadline is set for Saturday, January 5th, 2013, at 9:30pm EST.
Thank you for this. I'm sure I'm not the only one who had a much-too-eventful holiday. Gonna need another day to get my thoughts in order. But I'm here.
Ok, I reread my PM, Zinda did in fact told me it came at the start of the day, I was the one that assumed it was at night because that's what Eron said and I would not expect a strange ability like this to be a day one. Anyway, my lynch is not even on the table atm, I don't mind about being lynched, but I do mind if my COUNTLESS HOURS OF REREAD are wasted with a quickhammer just because.
There's no excuse for you guys to hammer me before I finish my reread, we have 9 days and if I flip scum you just discard everything I say as WIFOM. I'm sure I'm not asking much and with so many good players I expect to be respected, because if I'm hammered before finishing my job I will be pissed.
Well, that just sealed it for me. That shouldn't even be a thought in your head if you were telling the truth.
DRey, I was rather hoping I wouldn't have to do this, but your total lack of cooperation has forced my hand. I need you to claim right now. Don't say "the case is bad" or "claims don't mean anything", just claim. If you do not verify the information I have on you, I will stop at nothing to see you die.
Sick in bed for the last day and a half. Eco post further cements the necessity of DRey claiming.
So let's get this over with, yes?
I also don't understand why are you voting me, can you please refresh my mind? Also please explain the bolded, what a strange sentence. From the looks of if you consider me a threat, one that must be dealt with, but if you truly believe I'm scum about to be lynched (and this game is a full reveal one remember) why do you want so much to extract my claim? Maybe you don't really believe I'm scum and just want to hear my claim for some other reason? Or maybe you just want an excuse (my claim) to pursuit another person toDay?
I told you yesterday that you merited attention today for calling the town starting a new wagon of ETR anti-town since it would split votes and lead to a no-lynch. Read like classic fearmongering as the consensus moved away from a mislynch, and I also disliked your declaration that Asian was scum not five minutes after joining the game.
Also, despite the random role distributions making false claims largely untenable (neutral notwithstanding), claims can help prevent mislynches like what seems to have happened with Asenion. Granted, there still exists the possiblity that another living scum tried to do the nightkill, but Asenion's claim coupled with Arnaria's test eliminated the notion that Asenion attempted a kill last night.
Quote from DRey »
Claims in this game are just a way for scum to hide, in a normal game sure, we don't want to risk exclusive or confirmable power role despite scummy behavior, but here, there are no such things, everything is game. How can you not understand this? By claiming we are just helping scum in two fronts.
a)Eventually letting they escape the hang by a strong falseclaim.
b)Revealing our powers for them to safely manuever at night.
Again, there exists a neutral. And also, WoD falseclaimed part of his role (the abilities) and was lynched partly for that, and correctly.
Is anybody else having major connection issues? I'm getting a "site is down" message about every other time I try to browse to the forums :/
I have to test it a bit more when back from work, but I think it may have to do with connecting from a mobile browser?
At any rate, Asenion being confirmed as not using an ability last night certainly takes the heat off, and now it only makes sense to extract a claim from DRey.
I don't understand at all why some are suggesting that we stop all future claims, including from DRey before lynching him. That doesn't compute. I can see wanting to crack down on claims from players who aren't about to be lynched, but especially considering the impending holiday and deadline, we should know what we're dealing with re: DRey.
This will be good to get a resolution.
I'm all for Asenion trying to clear himself by targeting Xyre. Of course, we should hear from Xyre on the matter before anything goes down.
DRey is definitely a very good lead for today...when I re-read yesterday, he stuck out the most as the one who didn't want EtR lynched. By couching it in not wanting a no-lynch, it was subtle enough to not be obvious.
But I had reasons for not coming out the gate swinging at him out of last night.
It only makes sense at this point to get him to claim range, however. And I still may be able to shed some light afterwards.
What makes you say that the mafia need unlocks "pretty desperately"?
Simple math. Down 2 players in the first 2 days, at statistical improbability of winning, with the "evener" ability requiring 5 unlocks, plus whatever else they have personally. This all on top of there being less people to earn those unlocks.
Quote from Caex »
There's a bit of a misrep in here, in that I didn't actually ask for an unlock. I put my name up for consideration for an unlock. There are certainly other people who should be considered (Xyre, Axelrod, and Ecophagy first and foremost).
Just confused then, why you would put your name up there when you seem to think the others are obvious considerations. Why muddy the waters?
Certainly was at the time. Having trouble seeing him as scum with Eron being dead scum though.
Quote from Silver »
Anti-Eron
/swish
Quote from Silver »
Anti-DRey
I am not a big fan of DRey's play so far, correct.
Quote from Silver »
Pro-Shark
Yep, the wagon yesterday felt very pushed, EtR being a vocal member.
Quote from Silver »
Anti-Asian I
I have not been fully anti-AsianI, I buy his claim and supported him being on wagons, but he did offer the opinion that Shark should be lynched just because he shouldn't be trusted in the endgame, so he's worth keeping any eye on.
Quote from Silver »
and Anti-Iso.
My thoughts on Iso are also much more complicated than that. I've noted that WoD's interaction with him is a point for him, and also had a town read on him early in the game. But, again, I do read his hop off the Shark wagon as whiplash-inducing, and he can't give me a legitimate reason for doing so (at least, as he said, not one that I'd accept)
Quote from Silver »
That being said, he's been all over the place this game -- definitely more than Arnnaria has been (who admittedly hasn't been flip-flopping THAT much, just enough for me to notice).
AlphaI seems to have pointed out an awful lot of things without drawing conclusions, which is scummy.
You've never played with me, so I suppose that conclusion is not unusual. I do give a wide breadth of thoughts since my posting is less frequent than most. And I'm just not the most decisive person. But I do feel that I've been able to be helpful to this point, and I will continue to do so.
Quote from Silver »
As for the point addressed to me, I fail to see how that's goofy, and goofy itself is a strange word choice, because it is a derisive word. You don't call a peer's behavior goofy, you use it to describe clowns and adolescents, of which class of being I am neither, I can assure you!
I hope you don't take offense to my word choice, as I certainly didn't mean it to be derisive. It just didn't feel like a logical leap that made sense to me, but I could easily see that being a difference of opinion on how to evaluate play.
However, that still doesn't change my opinion on Asenion. I can reliably confirm that the NK failed last night. Whether it was my roleblock or something else, I cannot confirm.
You can? Please elaborate on how you can confirm that? Because while I think that's the most likely scenario, I can see other possibilities. For example, from the OP, the kill mechanic needs to be used in lieu of any other night actions from the scum using it. Perhaps whoever is left chose to use their native ability/abilities.
What would have been the functional difference between saying you didn't want to vote to unlock your abilities, or saying you didn't have a vote, and your abilities would unlock over time?
None. You shouldn't have needed to make up an excuse for something that self-explanatory.
Not a complete noob, just a bad townie. I've played enough to know what is going on and know the basic terminology etc.
If you know it's being a bad townie to lie, and you came into the game planning to do that anyway...why would you do that? That would mean it was a goal of yours to exhibit bad town play.
Claim has nothing to do with alignment and I would have no reason to lie about it. The OP and my role both describe that players only get to use one ability per Day/Night cycle regardless of whether it's a Day or Night ability.
You didn't address what I mentioned before. You seemingly could have used an ability last night AND today since these are different day/night cycles. Is this wrong?
EBWOP: I'll toss my name into the hat of "roles that would be useful to have unlocked", considering I have a locked protective ability.
A small note, but I don't love Caex asking for an unlock. Axel fingering him a bit, plus the fact that the mafia need unlocks pretty desperately (their own abilities/Mow Down) make me wary.
---------------
I've been having some additional thoughts on Asenion; looking over the OP.
Axel makes a good point that Asenion's reaction to all of this hasn't been from a typical scum mindset, though that could have something to do with his inexperience. However, it could certainly make sense from a neutral standpoint.
Add in the fact that he was so defensive when Arnaria said he could be the neutral trying to unlock his "Invoke Cehenna" ability, and the fact that the ability does require unlocks...and this theory has some real merit.
Particularly see how he mentions:
Quote from Asenion »
Wouldn't that be just a little bit too convenient? And do you really think I could pull that off starting from the first post? At this point you are just mud slinging, and the only reason I can think of to mud sling at a newb is because they are easy prey.
considering we now know that he entered the game with the mindset of lying and it certainly seems like he is slyly patting his own back here for his sneaky work.
Yeah...I'm going to go ahead and call your bluff that you have no idea what RobRoy's getting at. Am I correct?
Teh JeY (look, spelled accurately! :p) does the same thing that EtR does in the next post. Expresses interest in the wagon, while also pointing out why they're waiting to go on. Fence-sit, see: prime example.
And furthermore, I don't see these 2 posts jiving here from EtR. From starting your response to Vox with "Hmmm", it stood out as you being careful, and then you go on to say you didn't think it was worthy of a vote.
But I see your statement about not wanting to pile on "at this point" to mean that you didn't vote only because it would be seen as piling on, not because you didn't think it was unwarranted.
If this whole swishh thing doesn't scream "I'm NEW and having fun!" then I just don't know what else to even say. Which frankly, is pretty much null for a player with no experience. Definitely cuts into the allegedly scummy nature of such a strangely motivated vote though.
So, enlighten me, what made you suddenly lose your patience you touted. What "motive" did you see? Surely not just the "twitchy" read?
Unvote; Vote Teh JeY
2nd'd.
Nice try, but he brought up valid questions. Not responding to them once again is not helping your case.
Welcome, Cy!
Vote MandersHex. Long time no see!
Well, I could use a game!
/in
Not in any games.
Favorite historical figure would be Roberto Clemente, may he rest in peace.
If I didn't desperately want to play in it, I'd give it a go
Somebody take this man up on his offer!
Can't really be the best way to find his alignment if he's dead afterward...Even a guess based loosely on his actions would be a better way since it doesn't chance a misvig. So that logic doesn't play out very well.
What is his scum meta, as you haven't mentioned that, and what makes his current play different?
As I said to Eco back then, this is not a town mindset to "settle" for a bad lynch, especially since it has been proven many times, and in this game as well that a good case can gain traction plenty quick enough.
You just come across as annoyed in this post that Xyre is using meta. Which isn't a point in your favor since his meta analysis has been very successful to this point in the game, and I daresay townie Cythare wouldn't have had a problem with that.
So, after Eco asked for detrimental abilities, you tried to bait one onto him, and then attempted to protect him from said detrimental ability? How does that make any sense?
What was the thinking, pray tell?
You don't understand how it's relevant to get clarification on used abilities and their effects from the day's top scumspect?
Seems like a pretty good way to verify the truth of a claim.
And I'm sure you can see that, which makes me think you were hoping to avoid making a mistake in your story.
Hey, you forgot to mention that you're the town doc.
You know, definitely of the town persuasion.
Just thought you'd want to fix the oversight.
THANK YOU! It is nonsensical.
Excellent catch. I didn't even remember him mentioning that.
Also worth noting how Cythare initially plays it off to you:
as being vague. Not fully a lie, you know.
But NOW, it was a lie:
In bits and pieces, really. And though I responded to the salient ones here: http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=9515574&postcount=2170
He did not see fit to reply.
Eco has the feel of someone who is caught, but not for what he sees as the correct or valid reasons. The indignation, urgency and emotional appeal over the work he put into his reads all seem to point to this tell.
What makes you think he's lying about the threshold?
--------------
That being said, I'd be voting Cythare right now if it wouldn't be the hammer.
That’s not close to what I was saying. I was in fact theorizing that even those who weren’t convinced of his guilt should consider whether it was reasonable to let somebody claiming that ability to live.
You even noted later that Asenion nonsensically wanted to try for a Axelrod lynch, which was ludicrous at the time, and now. I certainly never hinted at what you suggest.
Also, please elaborate on recent posts that you seem to find so reprehensible. If memory serves, you didn’t like me deriving a scum mindset from your wording. That’s all that comes to mind.
Well, hard to say “no apparent reason” as I was working on my Kosa case at the time. Think of what I was saying as a top suspects list, and you’ll start to get an idea of what I was posting. Quick hits on my thoughts, and didn’t want Asenion’s ridiculous suggestion from the day before go unnoticed, while at the same time I was following what I thought was a good lead on Kosa. In hindsight, EtR being scum makes those leads seem incorrect.
20/20, and all that jazz.
Easy mislynch. Implies that it was a case with much traction, and that there was significant suspicion from others at the time. Neither of which were true. More like an earnest but probably incorrect attempt at scumhunting. We can’t all be master analysts.
You’re using your own read of Cythare as scum to point out a lack of pressure by me. But I made points about several players that caught my attention in that post. That one was no more egregious than any other, and I had a working idea of who was mafia.
We have different feelings on the value and/or frequency of pressure. I’m not somebody who votes/changes their vote often. And my previous response applies here as well.
At least you note that it’s a different read. I didn’t feel I was fishing. I took it as him saying he could prove that he thought dC wouldn’t be the NK, as if though he had mentioned it before and could reference a prior post.
It was (and still is) an interaction that I can’t wrap my head around. But given my town read on Iso to that point, I would rather try to understand him than attack him for it.
So town points, but then not town points because I “prepare for a hop” onto you “the next day”. Sorry my good sir, that’s not a hop. It’s a start. For looking at someone the next day. Which, by your own admission, you now see exactly why I was so alarmed at your deflection:
All that being said, I spent the better part of yesterday trying to find your scum games and instances of you being lynched. And in all the cases I found, I saw no instances of DRey maintaining he was town, or even really being around when lynched.
The overall posting style really feels different here too. As scum, your sentences tend to be shorter, and betray much less of your own feelings. You also tend to be a good deal less emotional, and I think you’ve actually been pretty close to a town meta here.
Additionally, having read through that entire post while answering your criticisms of me, that analysis feels pretty hard to fake from a scum perspective. I think it’s probably time to swallow my pride and conclude that your premature /bah post was genuine.
Unvote
Thank you for this. I'm sure I'm not the only one who had a much-too-eventful holiday. Gonna need another day to get my thoughts in order. But I'm here.
Well, that just sealed it for me. That shouldn't even be a thought in your head if you were telling the truth.
Sick in bed for the last day and a half. Eco post further cements the necessity of DRey claiming.
So let's get this over with, yes?
I told you yesterday that you merited attention today for calling the town starting a new wagon of ETR anti-town since it would split votes and lead to a no-lynch. Read like classic fearmongering as the consensus moved away from a mislynch, and I also disliked your declaration that Asian was scum not five minutes after joining the game.
Also, despite the random role distributions making false claims largely untenable (neutral notwithstanding), claims can help prevent mislynches like what seems to have happened with Asenion. Granted, there still exists the possiblity that another living scum tried to do the nightkill, but Asenion's claim coupled with Arnaria's test eliminated the notion that Asenion attempted a kill last night.
Again, there exists a neutral. And also, WoD falseclaimed part of his role (the abilities) and was lynched partly for that, and correctly.
So it matters.
I have to test it a bit more when back from work, but I think it may have to do with connecting from a mobile browser?
At any rate, Asenion being confirmed as not using an ability last night certainly takes the heat off, and now it only makes sense to extract a claim from DRey.
I don't understand at all why some are suggesting that we stop all future claims, including from DRey before lynching him. That doesn't compute. I can see wanting to crack down on claims from players who aren't about to be lynched, but especially considering the impending holiday and deadline, we should know what we're dealing with re: DRey.
I'm all for Asenion trying to clear himself by targeting Xyre. Of course, we should hear from Xyre on the matter before anything goes down.
But I had reasons for not coming out the gate swinging at him out of last night.
It only makes sense at this point to get him to claim range, however. And I still may be able to shed some light afterwards.
Unvote, Vote DRey
Simple math. Down 2 players in the first 2 days, at statistical improbability of winning, with the "evener" ability requiring 5 unlocks, plus whatever else they have personally. This all on top of there being less people to earn those unlocks.
Just confused then, why you would put your name up there when you seem to think the others are obvious considerations. Why muddy the waters?
Does that include today?
Certainly was at the time. Having trouble seeing him as scum with Eron being dead scum though.
/swish
I am not a big fan of DRey's play so far, correct.
Yep, the wagon yesterday felt very pushed, EtR being a vocal member.
I have not been fully anti-AsianI, I buy his claim and supported him being on wagons, but he did offer the opinion that Shark should be lynched just because he shouldn't be trusted in the endgame, so he's worth keeping any eye on.
My thoughts on Iso are also much more complicated than that. I've noted that WoD's interaction with him is a point for him, and also had a town read on him early in the game. But, again, I do read his hop off the Shark wagon as whiplash-inducing, and he can't give me a legitimate reason for doing so (at least, as he said, not one that I'd accept)
You've never played with me, so I suppose that conclusion is not unusual. I do give a wide breadth of thoughts since my posting is less frequent than most. And I'm just not the most decisive person. But I do feel that I've been able to be helpful to this point, and I will continue to do so.
I hope you don't take offense to my word choice, as I certainly didn't mean it to be derisive. It just didn't feel like a logical leap that made sense to me, but I could easily see that being a difference of opinion on how to evaluate play.
You can? Please elaborate on how you can confirm that? Because while I think that's the most likely scenario, I can see other possibilities. For example, from the OP, the kill mechanic needs to be used in lieu of any other night actions from the scum using it. Perhaps whoever is left chose to use their native ability/abilities.
I'm not familiar...why is this wrong?
If you know it's being a bad townie to lie, and you came into the game planning to do that anyway...why would you do that? That would mean it was a goal of yours to exhibit bad town play.
You didn't address what I mentioned before. You seemingly could have used an ability last night AND today since these are different day/night cycles. Is this wrong?
A small note, but I don't love Caex asking for an unlock. Axel fingering him a bit, plus the fact that the mafia need unlocks pretty desperately (their own abilities/Mow Down) make me wary.
---------------
I've been having some additional thoughts on Asenion; looking over the OP.
Axel makes a good point that Asenion's reaction to all of this hasn't been from a typical scum mindset, though that could have something to do with his inexperience. However, it could certainly make sense from a neutral standpoint.
Add in the fact that he was so defensive when Arnaria said he could be the neutral trying to unlock his "Invoke Cehenna" ability, and the fact that the ability does require unlocks...and this theory has some real merit.
Particularly see how he mentions:
considering we now know that he entered the game with the mindset of lying and it certainly seems like he is slyly patting his own back here for his sneaky work.