So I have been trying to make a reject rare cube but I wanted to make the draft seem like your drafting a made out of rare cards only. The way I'm working on it now I've decided to proportionally increase the numbers of "common" rates to 12 uncommon rares to 6 & rare rares to 3 with Mythics only included with 1 copie each. Does this make sense? Is there an easier way to figure this out? Does it sound fun? I'd love help or feedback.
These are some great combos! Thanks for the suggestions so far. I've added all of them to the cube except Chance Encounter (I still added Frenetic Efreet) because it doesn't do anything by itself. It's still a cool combo though. I didn't realize they reversed the errata to make it work again. If anyone can still think of any combos I'd love to hear more.
I've been working on a reject rare cube for awhile and I want to include unique themes and combos you wouldn't find in a normal cube. The cards have to be rares or mythics that aren't good on their own and wouldn't be included in a normal cube. Un-cards are allowed as long as they can be played on Cockatrice without difficulty. Themes I'm using include Mercenaries as a tribe, vampires as a tribe (to support Baron Sengir), lots of undercosted creatures with big drawbacks, iconic cards that used to be good but aren't anymore (like Ernham Djinn or Balduvian Horde) and trying to make Quest for Ula's Temple possible. The kind of combos I'm looking for include things like Bazaar Trader& Bronze Bombshell or Underworld Dreams & Mindmoil. Basically any janky but fun interactions. Any help would be great!
So DementedKirby and I have been working on a new online only format based on standalone sets and unique promos. We still have to iron out kinks but the general idea is that these sets and promo cards have never been legal outside of Vintage/Legacy (or legal for constructed at all) and that it would be interesting to see what this card pool was capable of without all the block sets and core sets. So far it's led to a really interesting format. In order for a set to qualify as a "standalone" for the purpose of this format it has to either have introduced original cards that did not appear in standard/extended although we also decided to include the first Planechase set and Archenemy despite them being reprint only. We felt that it didn't make a whole lot of sense to include Planechase 2012 but not the first Planechase or Archenemy. We also decided that adding all of the wizards supplements like Duel Decks and Battle Royale would over complicate things without adding much to the format. We've also decided to legalize a number of Unglued/Unhinged cards and are hoping we can get someone with some judging experience on board to help with rulings and errata when needed. The format has both a banned and restricted list. The only banned cards are either silver bordered cards that don't work conventionally enough for us to include them (mostly cards that require physical actions or depend on random factors like flavor text and artist). Currently the cardpool consists of the following sets: Arabian Nights, Antiquities, Legends, The Dark, Fallen Empires, Astral (from the microprose computer game),Homelands, Portal, Portal: Second Age, Portal: Three Kingdoms, Starter 1999, Starter 2000, Commander, Planechase, Archenemy, Planechase 2012, and Commander 2013.
The following promo cards are legal as well: Mana Crypt, Sewers of Estark, Arena, Giant Badger, Nalathini Dragon, Gleemox (MTGO promo), Gifts Given, Naughty/Nice, Fruitcake Elemental, 1996 World Champion, Shichifukujin Dragon, and the Japanese Dreamcast cards. Some of these are not available on most Cards.xml files so we're working on a supplement to add those to the cockatrice database.
The following cards are being considered for restriction (most of them won't be restricted to start with. We're trying to decide on what the best decisions would be any input would be great.):
Blacker Lotus
Brainstorm
Dark Ritual
Gleemox
Gleemax
Enter the Dungeon
Library of Alexandria
Imperial Seal
Mana Crypt
Mana Drain
Mise
Mishra's Workshop
Shahrazad
Shardless Agent
Skullclamp
Sol Ring
Strip Mine
True-Name Nemesis
Acid Rain
Bazaar of Bagdhad
Bloodbraid Elf
Boiling Seas
Double Take
Eternal Witness
Eureka
Flashfires
Gifts Given
Grim Tutor
Johnny Combo Player
Lodestone Golem
Power Artifact
Merchant Scroll
Mine Mine Mine!
Natural Order
Organ Harvest
Once More With Feeling
Sylvan Library
Strategy, Schmategy
Windfall
Since we're still not decided on which Un-cards to include I won't include the entire list but as you can see above there are several we're decided on. Here's a partial list of cards we're legalizing that aren't currently up for restriction:
Jack-in-the-Mox
Double Play
Double Dip
Double Cross
Double Deal
Goblin Bookie
Timmy, Power Gamer
Goblin Tutor
World Bottling Kit
Greater Morphling
Goblin Tutor
Mana Screw
Magical Hacker
Blast From the Past
Who/What/Where/When/Why
Rocket Powered Turbo Slug
Mana Screw
Would you play this format? Why or why not? Any feedback is appreciated! I will add a few sample decklists later.
Oh man a combo deck with High Tide and Hidden Strings would be awesome! I think Vault and diminsihing returns both could be too good but I'm on the fence about it. They seem like the perfect kind of card for this exercise as they are powerful but rarely played elsewhere. I still would like to see it happen. If they reprinted some of the counter magic we've listed above it could help it not become a problem.
I would like to add the hidden cards from Urza Block: Hidden Ancients,Hidden Gibbons, Hidden Herd ,Hidden Guerillas, hidden spider, and hidden stag. I would like to see Kor Haven too.
Nice picks! I'd go with Bubbling Muck over High Tide though. High Tide has had it's time to shine in Legacy before but bubbling muck has always been outclassed by Dark Ritual in black. I think Bubbling Muck could be good enough for modern and would be a cool addition. It's not as good as High Tide or Dark Ritual either so it looks safe. I think Culling the Week would be cool too. It's a powerful card that was never strong enough in Vintage/Legacy only seeing some fringe play in a couple decks. I would also like to see Oppression. As far as a couple more risky cards I think Diminishing Returns and Lim-Dul's Vault would be interesting. Personally I think modern would be able to handle those cards and these cards are another instance of being rarely played fringe in Vintage and Legacy. There's a few more of course. Maybe I'll post them later.
Well I didn't want to include stuff that has already seen heavy Vintage/Legacy play like Daze, Force of Will, Wasteland, Dark Ritual, or Misdirection with the exceptions to that being Baleful Strix, Strategic Planning and Grim Tutor (the latter two of which haven't seen widespread play in years). I do agree that adding the complete list of cards over a short period of time would be a bad idea too. I tried to focus on stuff that might be too good for contemporary standard but not good enough for the other eternal formats. If I had to cut the list down to like 10 cards they would probably be: Counterspell, Dust Bowl, Pillage, Grim Tutor, Foil, Rhystic Study, the Masques depletion counter lands, Abolish, Gerrard's Verdict, and Cave-In. I think those would all get some play without being too efficient for the format and oppressive like Wasteland or Force of Will would be.
Multiple Sol Rings would be an issue too. You could conceivably open with multiple Sol Rings and be way ahead off 1 land. It was one of the earliest cards restricted in Vintage for good reason. It's an absurd card.
My apologies if this belongs in baseless speculation. Please move it if so. Some of my thinking may be off as I don't have a whole lot of knowledge about the Modern format but it interests me and I would like to play it more often. Anyway I was thinking of cards that could be interesting reprints. Some of these cards saw lots of tournament play but most weren't given much of a chance. I hate seeing interesting potentially playable cards sit in format limbo because they're not standard legal but also too fringe or not good enough for Vintage and Legacy. Also I'm not saying that all these cards WOULD be good in Modern,just that they could be interesting additions. Basically if I could make a Modern legal Chronicals this would be it. Here's my list:
The original fetchlands- Obviously
Counterspell- I understand how this could be considered too efficient for Standard but for Modern? I'm not sure. It could help balance the format and maybe shrink the ban list? Also they brought back Lightning Bolt and Duress so maybe it's time for counterspell to come back too. Pillage - See above
Crystal Vein- An optional mana boost at the cost of sacrificing a land. It could power out spells a little early but isn't overly powerful. It's similar to the depletion counter lands from Mercadian Masques speaking of...
Phyrexian Tower- Never saw much high level competetive play but combos well with recursive creatures or 0 cost creatures and could open doors for deck development. Sterling Grove- Not sure if this would be overpowered but it'd be cool to see it back. Dust Bowl- Hasn't seen a lot of play and has mostly been overshadowed by Rishadan Port. It's not overpowered but it's great for slower control decks
Foil- A fair pitch counter that's not nearly as good as FOW but also not as narrow Pact of Negation, Mindbreak Trap, or Disrupting Shoal. It's basically an upgrade to Shoal which sees little play. I'd like to see this get a chance and I think it would see moderate play.
Abolish- Sees some play in Vintage and Legacy but I could see it being widely played in modern without being overly dominant.
Delraich- Demon at Death's Gate and Salvage Titan don't see much play but Delraich is a little more efficient and easier to set up because it doesn't require life loss or artifacts to pay its alternate CC.
Grim Tutor- not nearly as good as it was without Dark Ritual and,honestly,I'd also like to see a price drop.
Rhystic Study- Broken in group games and EDH but in high level constructed formats it hasn't been played much. I could see it finding a home in modern fo sure. Seedtime- A potentially very powerful sideboard card that has seen very limited play in other formats.
Primal Order- There are few Homelands cards that the ensuing years have been kind to. This is one of them. With the amount of nonbasics in Modern this could be a decent sideboard or even maindeck card if 2GG isn't too high a casting cost. Broken Visage- Another decent Homelands card that usually acts as a 3 for 1 for 4B. Not bad.
Drudge Spell- Another maligned Homelands card that could see play somewhere. It only costs BB and can quickly crank out regenerating skeleton tokens. Bitterblossom is obviously better but this doesn't require lifeloss and isn't a triggered ability.
Aether Storm-Fairly unique effect at a reasonable casting cost. Could be good in control decks as an early game stall and act as late game disruption after you have a finisher out.
Diabolic Intent- Possibly too powerful and I think it would definitely see play in Modern while in Vintage and legacy it is a fringe card at best.
UndermineAbsorb- Two personal favorites of mine. They might not be strong enough anymore though.
Prophetic Bolt- A cool card with an interesting combination of effects. I think it would be played somewhere. Diabolic Visions- A great library manipulator if given the chance but it also doesn't look overpowered being that it costs UB is a sorcery and doesn't allow you to Scry or shuffle away chaff.
Omen- Ponder-lite. The extra mana cost makes it less likely to be a problem while still enabling combo decks
Vindicate- I'm surprised this hasn't been reprinted already. I think it will be in the near future.
Gerrard's Verdict- A fan favorite that isn't overpowered but is very efficient and fits in really well with the existing modern legal BW cards.
Read the Runes- Can lead to blowouts in the right deck with cards like Hatching Plans but is also risky. It could lead to a new combo deck but it's also possibly overpowered and could be too good.
Global Ruin- Another card that hates on nonbasics and destroys extra copies of basic lands too. It has to be built around but it's good without being as strong as Armageddon.
Enlistment Officer and Grave Defiler- Other tribes got similar cards in Lorwyn-Shadowmoor block and elves, merfolk, and goblins already have strong tribes. I think with the Soldiers and Zombies that are already modern legal there's enough potential for these to make Soldier decks and Zombie decks more playable.
Recoil- Good card that I think will get reprinted for modern sooner or later
Tangle- A great defensive card that doesn't look OP and I'm sure it would be played.
Cauldron Dance- Through the Breach and Shallow Grave combined with a cost of 4BR. This card has tons of potential and could be too good. I think it would be playable for sure.
Coalition Honor GuardCoalition Flag- Basically these give all your other creatures hexproof and Honor Guard's 4 toughness puts it out of bolt range.
Nightscape Master- Really it could be all of the Masters from this cycle but Nightscape is the best one. He can bounce or shock repeatadly which are good abilities to have. He may be overcosted these days though.
Vine Dryad- The best green pitch card. Besides often being free it has flash and makes a great surprise blocker. Sometimes it can be nice just to have a free 1/3 forestwalker.
Ancestral Mask- Since Theros is really pushing the Auru theme and the number of decent Auras and cards that have positive interactions with auras has grown I think this could be an interesting reprint.
Flame Rift- A good burn spell by itself it also works great with bloodthirst and the new Rakdos.
I don't know if anyone has brought up Contract From Below before but it's such a powerful card that it makes me sad not to include it. I've been following baseball a lot lately and when players who reject qualifying offers by one team are signed by another team then the former team gets their draft pick. I was thinking something like this could be applied to cube w Contract.
If you draft Contract from Below you get to ignore the ante effect but skip your next pick. I've never done it in practice but was wondering what other peoples' perspectives on this issue are.
Reject rare draft always looked fun to me and I thought mixing it in with Cubing could lead to a fun cheap cube. The idea would be that all cards would have to have been printed at least once at either rare, mythic, or uncommon 1 (in an old set). I also include the Harper Prism book promos and Nalathini Dragon as potential rares. The cards must have at least a use/reason to play so no Wood Elementals or Pale Moons. The cards should also not be good enough to be included in a large regular cube. Cards should cost $1 or less with few exceptions (sometimes there's an older cool crap rare like Serendib Djinn that costs a bit more but could be fun or interesting). An upside is that you get play with cards that you may never play with otherwise and even garbage rares can be fun. It puts them to good use. Thoughts?
The following promo cards are legal as well: Mana Crypt, Sewers of Estark, Arena, Giant Badger, Nalathini Dragon, Gleemox (MTGO promo), Gifts Given, Naughty/Nice, Fruitcake Elemental, 1996 World Champion, Shichifukujin Dragon, and the Japanese Dreamcast cards. Some of these are not available on most Cards.xml files so we're working on a supplement to add those to the cockatrice database.
The following cards are being considered for restriction (most of them won't be restricted to start with. We're trying to decide on what the best decisions would be any input would be great.):
Blacker Lotus
Brainstorm
Dark Ritual
Gleemox
Gleemax
Enter the Dungeon
Library of Alexandria
Imperial Seal
Mana Crypt
Mana Drain
Mise
Mishra's Workshop
Shahrazad
Shardless Agent
Skullclamp
Sol Ring
Strip Mine
True-Name Nemesis
Acid Rain
Bazaar of Bagdhad
Bloodbraid Elf
Boiling Seas
Double Take
Eternal Witness
Eureka
Flashfires
Gifts Given
Grim Tutor
Johnny Combo Player
Lodestone Golem
Power Artifact
Merchant Scroll
Mine Mine Mine!
Natural Order
Organ Harvest
Once More With Feeling
Sylvan Library
Strategy, Schmategy
Windfall
Since we're still not decided on which Un-cards to include I won't include the entire list but as you can see above there are several we're decided on. Here's a partial list of cards we're legalizing that aren't currently up for restriction:
Jack-in-the-Mox
Double Play
Double Dip
Double Cross
Double Deal
Goblin Bookie
Timmy, Power Gamer
Goblin Tutor
World Bottling Kit
Greater Morphling
Goblin Tutor
Mana Screw
Magical Hacker
Blast From the Past
Who/What/Where/When/Why
Rocket Powered Turbo Slug
Mana Screw
Would you play this format? Why or why not? Any feedback is appreciated! I will add a few sample decklists later.
Armageddon is a good idea. It doesn't see play elsewhere and probably wouldn't be dominant I'd like to see it back. I'd even be happy enough with Catastrophe or Global Ruin.I don't think Erhnam would be playable. They reprinted it in Judgement and it didn't see much play then so with all the power creep between now and then it probably wouldn't do much. Sad because it's an icon and was such a powerhouse back in the day. A few more cards I thought of are Serendib Efreet, Captain Sisay,Flusterstorm,Pack Hunt, Desolation Angel, Portent, Cabal Coffers, Oppression, and, Lin Sivvi, Defiant Hero, Bearscape.
I would like to add the hidden cards from Urza Block: Hidden Ancients,Hidden Gibbons, Hidden Herd ,Hidden Guerillas, hidden spider, and hidden stag. I would like to see Kor Haven too.
The original fetchlands- Obviously
Counterspell- I understand how this could be considered too efficient for Standard but for Modern? I'm not sure. It could help balance the format and maybe shrink the ban list? Also they brought back Lightning Bolt and Duress so maybe it's time for counterspell to come back too.
Pillage - See above
Crystal Vein- An optional mana boost at the cost of sacrificing a land. It could power out spells a little early but isn't overly powerful. It's similar to the depletion counter lands from Mercadian Masques speaking of...
Peat Bog Sandstone NeedleSaprazzan Skerry Remote FarmHickory Woodlot- Fair and balanced Sol Lands that provide colored mana and can accelerate spells that have a higher color weight.
Phyrexian Tower- Never saw much high level competetive play but combos well with recursive creatures or 0 cost creatures and could open doors for deck development.
Sterling Grove- Not sure if this would be overpowered but it'd be cool to see it back.
Dust Bowl- Hasn't seen a lot of play and has mostly been overshadowed by Rishadan Port. It's not overpowered but it's great for slower control decks
Foil- A fair pitch counter that's not nearly as good as FOW but also not as narrow Pact of Negation, Mindbreak Trap, or Disrupting Shoal. It's basically an upgrade to Shoal which sees little play. I'd like to see this get a chance and I think it would see moderate play.
Abolish- Sees some play in Vintage and Legacy but I could see it being widely played in modern without being overly dominant.
Delraich- Demon at Death's Gate and Salvage Titan don't see much play but Delraich is a little more efficient and easier to set up because it doesn't require life loss or artifacts to pay its alternate CC.
Grim Tutor- not nearly as good as it was without Dark Ritual and,honestly,I'd also like to see a price drop.
Rhystic Study- Broken in group games and EDH but in high level constructed formats it hasn't been played much. I could see it finding a home in modern fo sure.
Seedtime- A potentially very powerful sideboard card that has seen very limited play in other formats.
Primal Order- There are few Homelands cards that the ensuing years have been kind to. This is one of them. With the amount of nonbasics in Modern this could be a decent sideboard or even maindeck card if 2GG isn't too high a casting cost.
Broken Visage- Another decent Homelands card that usually acts as a 3 for 1 for 4B. Not bad.
Drudge Spell- Another maligned Homelands card that could see play somewhere. It only costs BB and can quickly crank out regenerating skeleton tokens. Bitterblossom is obviously better but this doesn't require lifeloss and isn't a triggered ability.
Aether Storm-Fairly unique effect at a reasonable casting cost. Could be good in control decks as an early game stall and act as late game disruption after you have a finisher out.
Diabolic Intent- Possibly too powerful and I think it would definitely see play in Modern while in Vintage and legacy it is a fringe card at best.
Undermine Absorb- Two personal favorites of mine. They might not be strong enough anymore though.
Prophetic Bolt- A cool card with an interesting combination of effects. I think it would be played somewhere.
Diabolic Visions- A great library manipulator if given the chance but it also doesn't look overpowered being that it costs UB is a sorcery and doesn't allow you to Scry or shuffle away chaff.
Omen- Ponder-lite. The extra mana cost makes it less likely to be a problem while still enabling combo decks
Disrupt- Great one mana cantrip counterspell.
Vindicate- I'm surprised this hasn't been reprinted already. I think it will be in the near future.
Gerrard's Verdict- A fan favorite that isn't overpowered but is very efficient and fits in really well with the existing modern legal BW cards.
Read the Runes- Can lead to blowouts in the right deck with cards like Hatching Plans but is also risky. It could lead to a new combo deck but it's also possibly overpowered and could be too good.
Global Ruin- Another card that hates on nonbasics and destroys extra copies of basic lands too. It has to be built around but it's good without being as strong as Armageddon.
Enlistment Officer and Grave Defiler- Other tribes got similar cards in Lorwyn-Shadowmoor block and elves, merfolk, and goblins already have strong tribes. I think with the Soldiers and Zombies that are already modern legal there's enough potential for these to make Soldier decks and Zombie decks more playable.
Saprazzan Legate Deepwood Legate Cho-Arim Legate Kyren LegateRushwood Legate- Sideboard cards that are aggressive rather than disruptive but a free 1/3 flying merfolk or Shade that pumps for B seem worth it. The others aren't as exciting.
Recoil- Good card that I think will get reprinted for modern sooner or later
Tangle- A great defensive card that doesn't look OP and I'm sure it would be played.
Cauldron Dance- Through the Breach and Shallow Grave combined with a cost of 4BR. This card has tons of potential and could be too good. I think it would be playable for sure.
Coalition Honor Guard Coalition Flag- Basically these give all your other creatures hexproof and Honor Guard's 4 toughness puts it out of bolt range.
Divert- Would be a great answer to Abrupt Decay
Nightscape Master- Really it could be all of the Masters from this cycle but Nightscape is the best one. He can bounce or shock repeatadly which are good abilities to have. He may be overcosted these days though.
Vine Dryad- The best green pitch card. Besides often being free it has flash and makes a great surprise blocker. Sometimes it can be nice just to have a free 1/3 forestwalker.
Ancestral Mask- Since Theros is really pushing the Auru theme and the number of decent Auras and cards that have positive interactions with auras has grown I think this could be an interesting reprint.
Flame Rift- A good burn spell by itself it also works great with bloodthirst and the new Rakdos.
Skyshroud Poacher Moggcatcher Seahunter
Cornered Market
War Tax
Dawnstrider
Pack Hunt
Reverant Silence
Cave-In
Mageta the Lion
Avatar of Fury
Thresher Beast
Snake Pit
Ramosian Seargent
Serendib Efreet
Sea Drake
Rishadan Cutpurse Rishadan Brigand
Reverant Mantra
Stampede Driver
Glittering Lion
Viceling Rackling
Skyshroud Sentinel
OutbreakFlameshotSnag
Jeweled Amulet
Glowrider
Dawn Elemental
Forgotten Ancient
False Cure
Silver Knight
Oversold Cemetary
Edgewalker
Phyrexian Processor
Chains of Plasma- Personal bias here because I loved Swans and I don't think it would be overpowered in this environment.
Oblation
Planar Guide
Undead Gladiator
Decree of Silence
Mana Echoes
Cruel Bargain
Personal Tutor
Sylvan Tutor
Mercenary Knight
Final Fortune
Rancid Earth
Endless Cockroaches
Flux
Ashes to Ashes Dust to Dust
Baleful Strix
Strategic Planning
Restore
Reincarnation
Cloud of Faeries
Phyrexian Delver
Arcane Denial
Serene Master
Shattergang Brothers
Kongming Sleeping Dragon
Angel of Finality
Ruination
Sudden Demise
Buried Alive
Chaos Warp
Also the dreams cycle from Torment would be interesting.
Well, I'll post some more with explanations later.
Thoughts?
If you draft Contract from Below you get to ignore the ante effect but skip your next pick. I've never done it in practice but was wondering what other peoples' perspectives on this issue are.
Duplicate SCD threads merged.
—Lanxal
Yeah, that would be cool! Thanks!