After a 5 year break, i'm resurrecting the cube once again! Just finished up rebalancing where i'd left off. I'll update the OP with the changes when i get back in the swing of things. [I'm going to maintain the cube on cubetutor for now.] We're supposed to play on Sunday.
-You won't be able to support the number of players that your cube was designed for.
Indeed, it would be useful more for days when there are less people around to play than the maximum. Or use formats like the Odyssey-block style, which wouldn't hurt cube size.
-You would have to adjust the amount of cards that interact with the cards in the probability enhanced sections (like fixing or artifact hate).
Good point! Each format would need a ratio breakdown, starting with 8/8 (or 16/16 to really refine). So for the heavy multicolor version, it could be broken down something like:
After a 2.5yr break due to Race for the Galaxy, my cube is back in action. Below are the first batch of changes - black is now up to date with what i have.
While thinking about pack construction, i was just struck with a new(?) idea. Consider, if you don't have exactly equal numbers of each color/multi/artifact/land in your cube, making packs out of "print runs" actually changes the distribution of your cube. E.g. my cube has 50 WUBRGL, 55 multi, 45 colorless. By constructing equal distribution packs, i make multicolor slightly less prevalent, and colorless slightly moreso, than if i made purely random packs.
Now we can take this one step further, and radically change the distribution in interesting ways. Ever wondered how your cube would play as artifact-heavy like Mirrodin block? As multicolor-heavy like Ravnica block? For the latter, make your pack composition half multicolor cards, and half from the rest! You could even do some Odyssey-block color-balance-by-pack shenanigans, though that's starting to get a bit complicated. Other strange possibilities include creature-only...
As an example for multicolor-heavy, for 2p Winchester (3x 14c packs each), each player's starting packs would end up with, on average, 21 multicolor cards, and 3 from each other pile of WUBRGCL (3x7=21).
Note that your cube will not be able to support as many players with some of these formats, since you'd effectively be cutting out ~half of the relative cube contents. Depending on what you do exactly.
Thoughts? If it hasn't been done, i'll definitely try it and report back.
Initially I would sort the colors/lands/artifact/multi and evenly distribute them in packs -- but I found that this made signaling WAY too easy and as a result people always ended up playing 'their' deck.
What was the exact seeding method that lead to this? I just read every post in every shuffling thread on this forum, and i definitely noticed many people who seed were using too-simple methods. It's very important to ensure that you can't 100% decipher your neighbor's pick color, which is why i use a streamlined version of metamind's seed method.
Why not just shuffle the 45 before you make packs? Distribution won't normalized within the pack but you'll rarely be far off from it. I do approve of seeding packs like that, but I don't think you need to play three card monte with it.
That sounds alright, but definitely a 2nd choice for me. It would be a bit too much like full random for my tastes. Also, i don't like that i'd have too much information about the distribution of my 2 future packs. E.g. when cracking pack 2, you know way too much about pack 3.
I know I'm late to the party, but what do you mean by this?
"Washing cards" is like what they do in a casino. Dumping everything in a big mess and mixing everything around. Like what you do with scrabble tokens at the start of a game.
As for the topic at hand, i think i've settled on this shuffling method (super simplified version of metamind's method):
1) Everyone shuffles the 8 separate piles for WUBRGMCL individually (all 8 are about equal for me).
2) Everyone makes packs by taking 2 cards from each pile (16 card packs).
3) Shuffle each pack and randomly remove 3 cards from each.
4) Shuffle all removed cards together.
5) Redistribute 2 cards from this pile to each pack.
This means you can have anywhere from 0-4 of any type per pack, but that they will mostly be pretty well distributed, like real packs.
Other benefits include far less shuffling than required to fully randomize a large deck; cube is always sorted by color for easy modification/verification.
It takes the same amount of time to shuffle. You're either shuffling the entire cube in different piles, or shuffling the entire cube in one pile. You still have to shuffle the entire cube.
Can a mathematician verify this? My gut says that randomizing e.g. 8 piles of 50 unique cards, vs randomizing 400 unique cards at once, does not require an equal amount of time/shuffling. It may even be an order of magnitude difference.
So i have a question(s): should Inkwell Leviathan even be in this cube? Is it mainly used as a Tinker (which i don't have) target? And/or only used in decks with turbo artifact mana like Mana Vault (which i don't have)? I have Tolarian Academy in the cube, tho i don't even know if that should be in there either given i'm missing several key mana artifacts...
My long-term goal is to downsize from 55 to 50 multi, and up artifacts from 45 to 50. I want to find 5 wedge cards to go with the 5 shards, and have 4 of each guild. In the meantime tho it has to be either 45 or 55 multi, and i'm happy with 55 since my collection is really low on strong artifacts.
drafting red/x aggro looks pretty difficult given the fact that there isn't a single mono-red one drop.
Yeah i feel like red might be the color that needs the most work, i'll have to look into that, thanks. Basically my fave magic colors are blue>black>>>red>>>white>green. So i knew while building the cube that subconsiously i would work hardest on blue and black, and kind of ignore green and white. So to counterbalance that i mainly kept my wantlist to green and white. But fast forward 2 years later, the middle-man red probly is the worse for that system.
I am actually really happy to have Carven Caryatid back in my cube again. It is always a 2:1 and if a red deck tries to stop it usually a 3:1 trade, that buys you a lot of time.
Carven Caryatid is actually just a placeholder until i get Wall of Blossoms. I hadn't considered using both, but it makes sense as they are quite different.
I'll update the OP with the changes when i get back in the swing of things.[I'm going to maintain the cube on cubetutor for now.] We're supposed to play on Sunday.Green:
+Natural Order, -Stonewood Invocation,
+Tarmogoyf, -Beastbreaker of Bala Ged,
+Strangleroot Geist, -Garruk's Companion,
+Basking Rootwalla, -Twinblade Slasher,
+Farseek, -Growth Spasm,
+Arbor Elf, -Kodama of the North Tree,
+Avacyn's Pilgrim, -Briarhorn,
+Bramblecrush, -Creeping Mold,
+Noxious Revival, -Squirrel Nest,
+Nantuko Vigilante, -Mold Shambler,
+Devoted Druid, -Hurricane,
Multicolor:
+Tattermunge Maniac, -Boggart Ram-Gang,
+Turn/Burn, -Nucklavee,
+Rakdos Shred-Freak, -Void,
+Beetleform Mage, -Lorescale Coatl,
+Viashino Firstblade, -Bull Cerodon,
+Wojek Halberdiers, -Duergar Hedge-Mage,
+New Prahv Guildmage, -Teferi's Moat,
Colorless:
+Talisman of Progress, -Azorius Signet,
+Talisman of Dominance, -Dimir Signet,
+Talisman of Indulgence, -Rakdos Signet,
+Talisman of Impulse, -Gruul Signet,
+Talisman of Unity, -Selesnya Signet,
+Palladium Myr, -Prismatic Lens,
+Pithing Needle, -Empyrial Plate,
+Shrine of Burning Rage, -Ensnaring Bridge,
Land:
+Volcanic Island, -Ice Floe,
+Ghitu Encampment, -Urza's Factory;
+Arc Trail, -Rorix Bladewing,
+Ash Zealot, -Sulfur Elemental,
+Brimstone Volley, -Sudden Shock,
+Faithless Looting, -Petravark,
+Mogg Fanatic, -Dwarven Blastminer,
+Mogg War Marshal, -Taurean Mauler,
+Reckless Charge, -Flame Slash,
+Searing Blaze, -Flame Javelin,
+Stone Rain, -Blood Knight,
+Stormblood Berserker, -Viashino Slaughtermaster,
+Whipflare, -Caldera Hellion.
+Accorder Paladin, -White Knight,
+Balance, -Momentary Blink,
+Fiend Hunter, -Prison Term,
+Leonin Relic-Warder, -Silver Knight,
+Lingering Souls, -Pianna, Nomad Captain,
+Porcelain Legionnaire, -Celestial Crusader,
+Lone Missionary, -Galepowder Mage,
+Gideon's Lawkeeper, -Scepter of Dominance,
+Azure Mage, -Wind Zendikon,
+Clone, -Rishadan Airship,
+Compulsive Research, -Jace's Ingenuity,
+Deprive, -Power Sink,
+Exclude, -Evacuation,
+Meloku the Clouded Mirror, -Arcanis, the Omnipotent,
+Pestermite, -Thieving Magpie,
+Preordain, -Thought Courier,
+Repulse, -Ninja of the Deep Hours,
+Trinket Mage, -Stroke of Genius,
+Despise, -Visara the Dreadful,
+Fleshbag Marauder, -Skeletal Vampire,
+Gatekeeper of Malakir, -Last Gasp,
+Magus of the Abyss, -Infest,
+Phyrexian Rager, -Necrotic Ooze.
Indeed, it would be useful more for days when there are less people around to play than the maximum. Or use formats like the Odyssey-block style, which wouldn't hurt cube size.
Good point! Each format would need a ratio breakdown, starting with 8/8 (or 16/16 to really refine). So for the heavy multicolor version, it could be broken down something like:
- 3/8 WUBRG
- 3/8 Multicolor
- 1/8 Colorless
- 1/8 Land
or
- 5/16 WUBRG
- 8/16 Multicolor
- 1/16 Colorless
- 2/16 Land
+Blind Creeper, -Vigor Mortis,
+Dauthi Horror, -Knight of Stromgald,
+Dauthi Marauder, -Arrogant Bloodlord,
+Fume Spitter, -Stromgald Crusader,
+Last Gasp, -Sudden Death,
+Necrotic Ooze, -Diabolic Tutor,
+Reanimate, -Doomed Necromancer,
+Reassembling Skeleton, -Yawgmoth's Bargain,
+Skinrender, -Cruel Edict,
+Smallpox, -Sign in Blood,
+Tragic Slip, -Terror,
+Vampire Interloper, -Black Knight,
+Mindshrieker, -Spreading Seas;
Now we can take this one step further, and radically change the distribution in interesting ways. Ever wondered how your cube would play as artifact-heavy like Mirrodin block? As multicolor-heavy like Ravnica block? For the latter, make your pack composition half multicolor cards, and half from the rest! You could even do some Odyssey-block color-balance-by-pack shenanigans, though that's starting to get a bit complicated. Other strange possibilities include creature-only...
As an example for multicolor-heavy, for 2p Winchester (3x 14c packs each), each player's starting packs would end up with, on average, 21 multicolor cards, and 3 from each other pile of WUBRGCL (3x7=21).
Note that your cube will not be able to support as many players with some of these formats, since you'd effectively be cutting out ~half of the relative cube contents. Depending on what you do exactly.
Thoughts? If it hasn't been done, i'll definitely try it and report back.
What was the exact seeding method that lead to this? I just read every post in every shuffling thread on this forum, and i definitely noticed many people who seed were using too-simple methods. It's very important to ensure that you can't 100% decipher your neighbor's pick color, which is why i use a streamlined version of metamind's seed method.
That sounds alright, but definitely a 2nd choice for me. It would be a bit too much like full random for my tastes. Also, i don't like that i'd have too much information about the distribution of my 2 future packs. E.g. when cracking pack 2, you know way too much about pack 3.
"Washing cards" is like what they do in a casino. Dumping everything in a big mess and mixing everything around. Like what you do with scrabble tokens at the start of a game.
As for the topic at hand, i think i've settled on this shuffling method (super simplified version of metamind's method):
1) Everyone shuffles the 8 separate piles for WUBRGMCL individually (all 8 are about equal for me).
2) Everyone makes packs by taking 2 cards from each pile (16 card packs).
3) Shuffle each pack and randomly remove 3 cards from each.
4) Shuffle all removed cards together.
5) Redistribute 2 cards from this pile to each pack.
This means you can have anywhere from 0-4 of any type per pack, but that they will mostly be pretty well distributed, like real packs.
Other benefits include far less shuffling than required to fully randomize a large deck; cube is always sorted by color for easy modification/verification.
Can a mathematician verify this? My gut says that randomizing e.g. 8 piles of 50 unique cards, vs randomizing 400 unique cards at once, does not require an equal amount of time/shuffling. It may even be an order of magnitude difference.
Thanks.
+Paladin en-Vec, -Kor Firewalker,
+Yosei, the Morning Star, -Ghostly Prison,
+Kokusho, the Evening Star, -Evil Presence,
+Mindslaver, -Relic of Progenitus,
+Sword of Vengeance, -Fellwar Stone;
So i have a question(s): should Inkwell Leviathan even be in this cube? Is it mainly used as a Tinker (which i don't have) target? And/or only used in decks with turbo artifact mana like Mana Vault (which i don't have)? I have Tolarian Academy in the cube, tho i don't even know if that should be in there either given i'm missing several key mana artifacts...
Well it is a budget cube, i don't think i have [m]any cards that are too weak but i'm open to anything you see that doesn't fit.
My long-term goal is to downsize from 55 to 50 multi, and up artifacts from 45 to 50. I want to find 5 wedge cards to go with the 5 shards, and have 4 of each guild. In the meantime tho it has to be either 45 or 55 multi, and i'm happy with 55 since my collection is really low on strong artifacts.
Yeah i feel like red might be the color that needs the most work, i'll have to look into that, thanks. Basically my fave magic colors are blue>black>>>red>>>white>green. So i knew while building the cube that subconsiously i would work hardest on blue and black, and kind of ignore green and white. So to counterbalance that i mainly kept my wantlist to green and white. But fast forward 2 years later, the middle-man red probly is the worse for that system.
Carven Caryatid is actually just a placeholder until i get Wall of Blossoms. I hadn't considered using both, but it makes sense as they are quite different.
+Sacred Mesa, -Twilight Shepherd,
+Draining Whelk, -Call to Mind,
+Skeletal Vampire, -Horobi, Death's Wail,
+Viashino Slaughtermaster, -Flameblast Dragon,
+Carven Caryatid, -Masked Admirers,
+Terastodon, -One Dozen Eyes,
+Teferi's Moat, -Swans of Bryn Argoll,
+Simic Sky Swallower, -Temporal Spring,
+Nucklavee, -Suffocating Blast,
+Bull Cerodon, -Cerodon Yearling,
+Esper Charm, -Tower Gargoyle,
+Prismatic Lens, -Voltaic Key;