I'm not really sure what miscut cards are worth, but I know that foil delver is a pretty sought after card for legacy. If anyone could give me an idea of what this is worth, I'd be very grateful. The images of both sides are attached. Thanks!
There's a difference between a card that is an engine in a deck and a card that does cool stuff.
This is a good point, you can look at a bunch of cards in standard and say that it takes over the game when played, but that's not all that these engines do. They have synergy with a lot of cards in the deck. I like a lot of ideas, especially things like:
[CARD]puresteel paladin
mentor of the meek
primeval titan
Tezzeret, agent of bolas[/CARD]
Hey everyone, I'm trying to create a list of the engines in standard. In case you don't know what that means, an engine is a card that must be built around to achieve it's full potential, but is incredibly deadly when it is built correctly. For instance, a few off the top of my head would be:
Ok here's what ya do. Each turn, you want to focus on getting some sort of one-for-one. Hopefully you'll have a turn one wring flesh (which you should probably have two of mainboard) and a snapcaster to fill any hole in the curve you need. Then, I've found that the split of 3 consecrated sphinx and 2 wurmcoils main and 2 batterskull board is really effective, so finding one of those wurmcoil ends the game if you get it turn 6, and the second game you can board in two batterskulls and possibly some spellskites. So to sum up:
Curve out your control: focus on answering something a turn if possible. It's understandable to alchemy for a finisher if you need to.
Land a batterskull or wurmcoil on time.
If these two conditions are met, it's a really not that bad a matchup. If for some reason you are really worried about RDW, one of the best things about UB control is that it is easily customized. It's all about tuning the deck to beat what you believe you will play.
Just for the record, it finished 1-4th, since they haven't played the semis and finals yet.
Anyway, I like the list, but I don't like the hero of bladeholds very much. I think they don't help enough against aggro decks, and are easily dismembered by control decks, but I'll definitely have to check them out. I do love how he is a little more focused on control then a lot of the deck lists here. Geist has been pretty good for me today, since I just switched them out for invisible stalker.
Why? I don't see the big deal. It doesn't outright win games. It's just a nice utility card.
Snapcaster mage is an insane utility card though, one that can indirectly (or sometimes directly) win you the game. Returning a day of judgment won me two games at an fnm, and snapcasting a mana leak can keep your opponents win-cons off the board, which might have otherwise killed you.
Hi, just got back from my first innistrad fnm with mage-blade...(I think we need to come up with a cool name, because too many people asked me what deck I was playing, and I had to say caw-blade.) Anyway, there were 27 or so people, and I went 4-1 which got me 2nd place, which was a promising sign for this deck. Here's what I played just for reference, I analyzed it a bit a few pages back:
I threw together the sideboard 2 hours or so before the tournament, but it was pretty decent. My theory was that since I am running 4 copies of snapcaster mage, I could use spaces for sideboard hate cards that were instants or sorceries, and then snap them back for double the fun. This theory worked really well against a puresteel deck, which amazingly enough was the only time I saw a good deal of artifacts. Since sideboarding seems to be the topic of conversation, I'll comment on each of my choices.
Revoke Existence - This card is pretty good. I nabbed a couple of oblivion rings of oblivion rings today, which felt great, but didn't have a matchup with tempered steel that I was looking for. I had really high hopes for this card, but it doesn't appear that artifacts are going to be a big player in the upcoming season, so I definitely wouldn't use them as a four of in the sideboard. Probably a 3-2 split with the next card can cover a ton of decks.
Steel Sabotage - This card was awesome against puresteel! It's really flexible, which was great, since I used one to counter his first war and peace, and a second one to return his second was and peace to his hand (and block+kill the creature he thought was safe). The instant fits into the theme of my deck a little better than revoke existence does, but that won't be too common with other people's deck lists.
Timely Reinforcements - I don't know, but I lost a lot of faith in this card over the last month. That's why it didn't earn a mainboard position, but playing 4 in your 75 is going to be a good idea. You will see a lot of stromkirk nobles in the future, and you will want this against him.
Day of Judgment - Before rotation I played 2 mainboard and 1 sideboard, but playing 4 throughout both is absolutely neccessary now (unless you play that super aggressive one with lots of creatures...) What really worried me, is that I saw a lot of Thrun, the last troll, and this is are only defense against it. That, and of course it can totally win you the game against an overly aggressive opponent.
Negate/Dissipate - These are just for the control decks. They did there job well, the only thing I'd say is that snapping back a dissipate is really hard to do, since is takes 2UUU... I love this deck against control, since it's draw-go aggression is really hard for them to deal with. I've already seen a consistent theme of people having to dismember/go for the throat my spirit token, and that's exactly what I want to happen.
I'm definitely changing up the sideboard for the next time I play this. It'll probably include some number of geist of saint traft.
Anyway a really quick recap on how things went if anyone is interested. I know I sorta skim over these kinda things when other people do it, so I'll keep it short.
Match one - BR vamps
He wasn't really too experience, he played diabolic tutor as a 2-3 of in the main. He did, however, start both games off with a stromkirk noble, which is pretty scary... I beat his face in with a consecrated sphinx with a feast and famine both games.
1-0
Match two - Venser Control
He kept getting gideon out, and my invisible stalkers with swords on them couldn't get their triggers, so I lost game one. Game two I beat down with 2-3 inkmoths a turn, and he had no answers. Game three was just everything in my deck coming together. Gideons, snapcasters, sphinxes and spirits all got in on the actions. It was a thing to behold.
2-0
Match three - GR aggro
This is a pretty scary deck, but he got mana screwed and I made the risky decision to dismember his birds of paradise, which payed off. Second game he went turn one birds-turn two dungrove-turn three thrun. I can't imagine a scary opening for me. I was at three mana since he went first, so no day. luckily he got greedy and tapped out inferno titan, and I hit him with the board wipe the next turn.
3-0
Match four - GW aggro
This is another thrun-dungrove driven deck that has a bit of o-ring back up with garruk primal hunter too. It's quite solid, and kessig wolf run can be powered up by a birds of paradise, which is really cool. I made a pretty bad play mistake in game 2, but probably wouldn't have won anyway. These green decks are really scary for us... that's what a few sideboard spots should go to.
3-1
Game five- puresteel
This is a great matchup for us. I just destroyed puresteels with o-rings and dismember, and dropped a turn five gideon with counter backup next turn that sealed both games. Can't stress it enough, but this is an easy win.
4-1
Overall good start. I just need to start thinking of ways to get around those pesky hexproof green guys. A final notes is that when playing control Moorland Haunt really comes in handy. I had ones game before the tournament where I must've ceated 6-7 tokens.
I was referring to your UBW list gocubsgo. Have you been able to test that yet?
You still have 2 Stalkers in your UW list (2-3 I forget) Have you considered any other 2 drop?
Oh sorry! The esper list is great!!! When it gets the right lands... unfortunately, I haven't been able to find a stable mana base, but it can definitely do some powerful stuff. I'm basically using the black for some spot removal, a little discard, and grave titan. What I've found is that despise doesn't hit what you want it to most of the time, leaving their birthing pod, tempered steel, or sword of feast and famine sitting in their hand. The spot removal is nice, but the go for the throat is extremely condition with all the artifacts running around. Most of the time, I end up winning with cards that are available to UW anyway, and that combined with the faulty mana base turned me away from esper. However, geist of saint traft works really well with spot removal, and is a huge upgrade from invisible stalker. I think that this deck has the most raw power, but it will also take the most tuning. We might need to play 27 lands to get it consistent, or vastly lower the amount of colorless lands we are playing. This means cutting inkmoths, which I never like to do.
I have thought about cutting stalker, but I just can't find a replacement for him. I've look to geist of saint traft (which is probably the direction I'm going to be heading but can't get 2 by friday...) and it's been ok. It's weird to say this, but 3 mana is a big investment for us, and it is much harder to clear the way in UW then it is in esper. The other problem I have is his lack of defense, but stalker fails in this category too. He can win you the game without equipment, which is great, and stomps control.
On a sidenote UW Aggro Control is used to running 26 lands. I think that was ok for 2 reasons. First, we had Manlands. Second, Squadron Hawks ensured that we would always have creatures, if we drew just 1. Since we no longer have those tools, I am leaning towards cutting 2 lands in favor of some more bodies. Some opinions?
I've tested the UW version a lot over the past few days, and it's tested really well. There are a few decks that just stand almost no chance against it (puresteel especially...), then there are a few decks that are favorable to even. I haven't found any decks that can are really a bad match up, but if there is any deck you would like me to test against you can just tell me, and I'll grab a friend to help me test. Here are a few conclusions that I have drawn from it:
1. I don't like Invisible Stalker. It's just useless without a sword, all you can really do is chump block or get one damage a turn through. I know a ton of people are really excited about this guy, but we have enough sword-bearers to work with, and shouldn't go all in on this "cheap guy, equip, profit" strategy. I try to run creatures that can help me out in the majority of situations. He just hasn't impressed me during testing.
2. I love the instant/flash theme of this deck! Playing cards like snapcaster mage and midnight haunting let us leave up mana for a counterspell, and can ambush several of your opponent's favorite creatures. It also helps because on turn four, we can grab a creature, let's say midnight haunting, block with a token and cast/equip a sword next turn. All this can be done while keeping mana leak viable every turn of the game. Of course, if you are playing on your own turn, you are probably crippling them, since you're casting Oblivion Ring, Day of judgment, Gideon Jura, or Consecrated Sphnx. The instant speed creatures are the reason I have a singleton dissipate, and I'm thinking of adding another...
In response to your land question, I tend to stick near the higher end of the curve (I played 27 in caw-blade 2.0). I completely agree with your theory of man lands and squadron hawks, so I could probably go from 26 to 25. For me, running 24 is getting a bit risky, since you now only have a 63% chance of hitting a turn four land drop (Day of Judgment), 47% of hitting a turn five (Gideon Jura), and only 32% of hitting turn 6 (Consecrated Sphinx) compared to 72, 57, and 42 of a 26 land deck. My lists tend to lean on the upper part of the curve a little more (slightly more control than aggro) but if you are playing a more aggressive version, than cutting to 24 lands won't give you much of a problem.
I believe that it's going to be major player in the upcoming standard, whatever form it might take. I'm mainly going to focus on the UW version, but I know that there are many other viable options. Most of the slack (RIP squadron hawk) is picked up by the inclusion of one card from innistrad...
Snapcaster Mage!
Everybody realizes the power of this card when used with sword of feast and famine, since it provides insane value. I've been toying around with many different shells for a blade deck, but this guy always seems to be finding it's way in. Let's quickly delve into what seems to be the core of these kind of decks:
4 Mana Leak - This is fairly obvious... There just aren't enough decent counterspells to argue against playing four.
3 Dismember - This is mainly for the UW decks (even though they aren't bad as a singleton in UB or esper...) and are a huge tempo boost. They get you out of mainy sticky situations, but the life-loss is too big to run four.
2-3 Day of Judgment - Sure, we are supposed to be an aggro-control deck, but day can just be too crippling to leave out. It's won me too many games to count, but can be kind of awkward when you get too many.
2 Consecrated Sphinx - I can understand why you would run a 1-1 split between this and grave titan if you have black, but I love this card. It demands an immediate answer (i.e doom blade) or else the game will get quickly out of hand. It is large enough to stop aggro decks, and can finish off control decks that can't answer it.
2-3 Gideon Jura - He does everything. He buys you time against fast decks, if he doesn't just finish them off single-handedly. Against control, he can destroy their finishers, and then swing all by himself. He's definitely a keeper.
2-3 Oblivion Ring - It can answer almost anything on the opponent's side of the table, but must be cast during the main phase and can screw with your tempo a little bit. Since the format appears to be slowing down a bit, this card is almost an auto-include, but it runs the gambit as to how many copies are main-decked.
2-3 Sword of Feast and Famine - I heard that this card is pretty good. In fact it's what fuels our deck. I'm leaning towards running three right now, since losing squadron hawks and celestial collonnade reduces our aggressiveness a bit. I'm sorry, but a 2/1 without a sword won't get us there. I would definitely run more if you are looking at Invisible Stalker, since he is useless without it.
Ok so that's what I view as the core, but I know that there are several different ways to go with this deck. I've been toying around with a few decklists, and I wanted to share them with you to give you a starting point if you are looking to play a blade deck.
So the main liberties I took with this list is with the smaller, sword bearing creatures. I've played around with Invisible Stalker a lot, and I just can't get into this card. It is a solid sword carrier, but other than that, it just doesn't follow the theme of getting value from each card. I know that many people are excited by this card, so there's probably more than what I've been seeing lately. Midnight Haunting on the other hand, has really impressed me. I haven't heard too many positive responses on the topic of this guy, but it reminds me of squadron hawk just a little bit (please don't destroy me for saying that!). I make this point because it can be used as clutch blockers that you aren't afraid to lose, and being at instant speed leaves you free to main phase mana leak, or kill a puresteel paladin that wouldn't have otherwise attacked. It can be flashed in at the end of the fourth turn to follow up with a turn five sword an equip, which is devastating. Also, it's a great target to return with snapcaster mage, since you get three instant speed creatures that can block and swing or swing the next turn.
This bears close resemblance to the UW version, but with the inclusion of instant speed removal and two discard spells. Oh yeah, and one grave titan... I decided to go the geist of saint traft route, since all the removal can effectively clear a path for an otherwise fragile 2/2. Six damage for three mana is incredibly alluring for an aggro-control deck, add hexproof to it and you are ensuring that it will be played. I would consider him as almost a strick upgrade to Invisible Stalker. There is obvious synergy here for Snapcaster Mage with options to return targeted removal, mass removal, target discard, and counterspells. The only reason that I wouldn't run the esper version would be the faulty mana base, and the fact that I can't run too many inkmoth nexus without feeling guilty.
Well that's it for now! I'll try and come up with a solid UB list, and friday marks the first time I can officially start tuning for the decks that are appearing, and then I can start to finalize a sideboard. Right now, I'd just grab several of those conditional cards, such as steel sabotage and revoke existence. I'm looking forward to
So I was looking through the standard decks, and I noticed that blade decks weren't really getting much attention. I believe that it's going to be major player in the upcoming standard, whatever form it might take. I'm mainly going to focus on the UW version, but I know that there are many other viable options. Most of the slack (RIP squadron hawk) is picked up by the inclusion of one card from innistrad...
Everybody realizes the power of this card when used with sword of feast and famine, since it provides insane value. I've been toying around with many different shells for a blade deck, but this guy always seems to be finding it's way in. Let's quickly delve into what seems to be the core of these kind of decks:
4 Mana Leak - This is fairly obvious... There just aren't enough decent counterspells to argue against playing four.
3 Dismember - This is mainly for the UW decks (even though they aren't bad as a singleton in UB or esper...) and are a huge tempo boost. They get you out of mainy sticky situations, but the life-loss is too big to run four.
2-3 Day of Judgment - Sure, we are supposed to be an aggro-control deck, but day can just be too crippling to leave out. It's won me too many games to count, but can be kind of awkward when you get too many.
2 Consecrated Sphinx - I can understand why you would run a 1-1 split between this and grave titan if you have black, but I love this card. It demands an immediate answer (i.e doom blade) or else the game will get quickly out of hand. It is large enough to stop aggro decks, and can finish off control decks that can't answer it.
2-3 Gideon Jura - He does everything. He buys you time against fast decks, if he doesn't just finish them off single-handedly. Against control, he can destroy their finishers, and then swing all by himself. He's definitely a keeper.
2-3 Oblivion Ring - It can answer almost anything on the opponent's side of the table, but must be cast during the main phase and can screw with your tempo a little bit. Since the format appears to be slowing down a bit, this card is almost an auto-include, but it runs the gambit as to how many copies are main-decked.
2-3 Sword of Feast and Famine - I heard that this card is pretty good. In fact it's what fuels our deck. I'm leaning towards running three right now, since losing squadron hawks and celestial collonnade reduces our aggressiveness a bit. I'm sorry, but a 2/1 without a sword won't get us there. I would definitely run more if you are looking at Invisible Stalker, since he is useless without it.
Ok so that's what I view as the core, but I know that there are several different ways to go with this deck. I've been toying around with a few decklists, and I wanted to share them with you to give you a starting point if you are looking to play a blade deck.
So the main liberties I took with this list is with the smaller, sword bearing creatures. I've played around with Invisible Stalker a lot, and I just can't get into this card. It is a solid sword carrier, but other than that, it just doesn't follow the theme of getting value from each card. I know that many people are excited by this card, so there's probably more than what I've been seeing lately. Midnight Haunting on the other hand, has really impressed me. I haven't heard too many positive responses on the topic of this guy, but it reminds me of squadron hawk just a little bit (please don't destroy me for saying that!). I make this point because it can be used as clutch blockers that you aren't afraid to lose, and being at instant speed leaves you free to main phase mana leak, or kill a puresteel paladin that wouldn't have otherwise attacked. It can be flashed in at the end of the fourth turn to follow up with a turn five sword an equip, which is devastating. Also, it's a great target to return with snapcaster mage, since you get three instant speed creatures that can block and swing or swing the next turn.
This bears close resemblance to the UW version, but with the inclusion of instant speed removal and two discard spells. Oh yeah, and one grave titan... I decided to go the geist of saint traft route, since all the removal can effectively clear a path for an otherwise fragile 2/2. Six damage for three mana is incredibly alluring for an aggro-control deck, add hexproof to it and you are ensuring that it will be played. I would consider him as almost a strick upgrade to Invisible Stalker. There is obvious synergy here for Snapcaster Mage with options to return targeted removal, mass removal, target discard, and counterspells. The only reason that I wouldn't run the esper version would be the faulty mana base, and the fact that I can't run too many inkmoth nexus without feeling guilty.
Well that's it for now! I'll try and come up with a solid UB list, and friday marks the first time I can officially start tuning for the decks that are appearing, and then I can start to finalize a sideboard. Right now, I'd just grab several of those conditional cards, such as steel sabotage and revoke existence. I'm looking forward to hearing your opinions!
sure he's nice, but who in their right mind is going to walk into 4 open mana assuming they are safe? the counterspell use of this card is going to be much less than most people think. he's best when you are using cheap draw spells, like think twice/ponder/visions. but he's no god in standard like some people think he is going to be. he's just card advantage for a big price. and even then, why do I want a card that reads: 2/1 creature that draws a card when it enters the battlefield for 3 mana? not sure if this is the best use of deck slots to me.
Ok when it gets to the point that my opponent doesn't want to cast anything when I have open mana, then I, as the control player, am winning. The point is that you can nab an early drop with a mana leak, then grab a midranged card too. Then you have finisher mana, and you are set. Not to mention you can destroy creatures too, and it has insane late game value. If you've ever played control, and shuffled your graveyard into your library after a game, then you know what I mean...
I'm gonna go ahead and be different, and say that it will not drop. It might take an initial hit, but this is a planeswalker designed for competitive play. All the pros have said that this is one of the strongest cards in the set (with snapcaster being the only rival) and it could simply explode out of the gate. I wouldn't bet on this, but I don't think 30 bucks is too much to ask for this.
Here's my deck, I just finished my testing against the puresteel deck, and this baby was amazing! The record was 8-2, and the two loses were only due to bad mana. I wouldn't get too excited yet, because puresteel lays over and dies when you remove it's namesake, but I'll keep you updated if it keeps doing well.
I'm curious to hear opinions of divine reckoning, because it contributes to the mid-range nature of bant pod, while also keeping a pod change in tact. Then our one creature will grow, and there's will just seem obsolete.
This is a good point, you can look at a bunch of cards in standard and say that it takes over the game when played, but that's not all that these engines do. They have synergy with a lot of cards in the deck. I like a lot of ideas, especially things like:
[CARD]puresteel paladin
mentor of the meek
primeval titan
Tezzeret, agent of bolas[/CARD]
Please just shout out any cards you think fit this category, because it may help us find a powerful deck to build.
Curve out your control: focus on answering something a turn if possible. It's understandable to alchemy for a finisher if you need to.
Land a batterskull or wurmcoil on time.
If these two conditions are met, it's a really not that bad a matchup. If for some reason you are really worried about RDW, one of the best things about UB control is that it is easily customized. It's all about tuning the deck to beat what you believe you will play.
Just for the record, it finished 1-4th, since they haven't played the semis and finals yet.
Anyway, I like the list, but I don't like the hero of bladeholds very much. I think they don't help enough against aggro decks, and are easily dismembered by control decks, but I'll definitely have to check them out. I do love how he is a little more focused on control then a lot of the deck lists here. Geist has been pretty good for me today, since I just switched them out for invisible stalker.
Snapcaster mage is an insane utility card though, one that can indirectly (or sometimes directly) win you the game. Returning a day of judgment won me two games at an fnm, and snapcasting a mana leak can keep your opponents win-cons off the board, which might have otherwise killed you.
4x Glacial Fortress
4x Inkmoth Nexus
6x Island
2x Moorland Haunt
6x Plains
4x Seachrome Coast
1x Dissipate
4x Forbidden Alchemy
4x Mana Leak
3x Midnight Haunting
3x Oblivion Ring
2x Invisible Stalker
4x Snapcaster Mage
2x Day of Judgment
3x Sword of Feast and Famine
3x Gideon Jura
4 Revoke Existence
4 Timely Reinforcements
2 Day of judgment
2 Steel Sabotage
2 Negate
1 Dissipate
I threw together the sideboard 2 hours or so before the tournament, but it was pretty decent. My theory was that since I am running 4 copies of snapcaster mage, I could use spaces for sideboard hate cards that were instants or sorceries, and then snap them back for double the fun. This theory worked really well against a puresteel deck, which amazingly enough was the only time I saw a good deal of artifacts. Since sideboarding seems to be the topic of conversation, I'll comment on each of my choices.
Revoke Existence - This card is pretty good. I nabbed a couple of oblivion rings of oblivion rings today, which felt great, but didn't have a matchup with tempered steel that I was looking for. I had really high hopes for this card, but it doesn't appear that artifacts are going to be a big player in the upcoming season, so I definitely wouldn't use them as a four of in the sideboard. Probably a 3-2 split with the next card can cover a ton of decks.
Steel Sabotage - This card was awesome against puresteel! It's really flexible, which was great, since I used one to counter his first war and peace, and a second one to return his second was and peace to his hand (and block+kill the creature he thought was safe). The instant fits into the theme of my deck a little better than revoke existence does, but that won't be too common with other people's deck lists.
Timely Reinforcements - I don't know, but I lost a lot of faith in this card over the last month. That's why it didn't earn a mainboard position, but playing 4 in your 75 is going to be a good idea. You will see a lot of stromkirk nobles in the future, and you will want this against him.
Day of Judgment - Before rotation I played 2 mainboard and 1 sideboard, but playing 4 throughout both is absolutely neccessary now (unless you play that super aggressive one with lots of creatures...) What really worried me, is that I saw a lot of Thrun, the last troll, and this is are only defense against it. That, and of course it can totally win you the game against an overly aggressive opponent.
Negate/Dissipate - These are just for the control decks. They did there job well, the only thing I'd say is that snapping back a dissipate is really hard to do, since is takes 2UUU... I love this deck against control, since it's draw-go aggression is really hard for them to deal with. I've already seen a consistent theme of people having to dismember/go for the throat my spirit token, and that's exactly what I want to happen.
I'm definitely changing up the sideboard for the next time I play this. It'll probably include some number of geist of saint traft.
Anyway a really quick recap on how things went if anyone is interested. I know I sorta skim over these kinda things when other people do it, so I'll keep it short.
Match one - BR vamps
He wasn't really too experience, he played diabolic tutor as a 2-3 of in the main. He did, however, start both games off with a stromkirk noble, which is pretty scary... I beat his face in with a consecrated sphinx with a feast and famine both games.
1-0
Match two - Venser Control
He kept getting gideon out, and my invisible stalkers with swords on them couldn't get their triggers, so I lost game one. Game two I beat down with 2-3 inkmoths a turn, and he had no answers. Game three was just everything in my deck coming together. Gideons, snapcasters, sphinxes and spirits all got in on the actions. It was a thing to behold.
2-0
Match three - GR aggro
This is a pretty scary deck, but he got mana screwed and I made the risky decision to dismember his birds of paradise, which payed off. Second game he went turn one birds-turn two dungrove-turn three thrun. I can't imagine a scary opening for me. I was at three mana since he went first, so no day. luckily he got greedy and tapped out inferno titan, and I hit him with the board wipe the next turn.
3-0
Match four - GW aggro
This is another thrun-dungrove driven deck that has a bit of o-ring back up with garruk primal hunter too. It's quite solid, and kessig wolf run can be powered up by a birds of paradise, which is really cool. I made a pretty bad play mistake in game 2, but probably wouldn't have won anyway. These green decks are really scary for us... that's what a few sideboard spots should go to.
3-1
Game five- puresteel
This is a great matchup for us. I just destroyed puresteels with o-rings and dismember, and dropped a turn five gideon with counter backup next turn that sealed both games. Can't stress it enough, but this is an easy win.
4-1
Overall good start. I just need to start thinking of ways to get around those pesky hexproof green guys. A final notes is that when playing control Moorland Haunt really comes in handy. I had ones game before the tournament where I must've ceated 6-7 tokens.
Oh sorry! The esper list is great!!! When it gets the right lands... unfortunately, I haven't been able to find a stable mana base, but it can definitely do some powerful stuff. I'm basically using the black for some spot removal, a little discard, and grave titan. What I've found is that despise doesn't hit what you want it to most of the time, leaving their birthing pod, tempered steel, or sword of feast and famine sitting in their hand. The spot removal is nice, but the go for the throat is extremely condition with all the artifacts running around. Most of the time, I end up winning with cards that are available to UW anyway, and that combined with the faulty mana base turned me away from esper. However, geist of saint traft works really well with spot removal, and is a huge upgrade from invisible stalker. I think that this deck has the most raw power, but it will also take the most tuning. We might need to play 27 lands to get it consistent, or vastly lower the amount of colorless lands we are playing. This means cutting inkmoths, which I never like to do.
I have thought about cutting stalker, but I just can't find a replacement for him. I've look to geist of saint traft (which is probably the direction I'm going to be heading but can't get 2 by friday...) and it's been ok. It's weird to say this, but 3 mana is a big investment for us, and it is much harder to clear the way in UW then it is in esper. The other problem I have is his lack of defense, but stalker fails in this category too. He can win you the game without equipment, which is great, and stomps control.
I've tested the UW version a lot over the past few days, and it's tested really well. There are a few decks that just stand almost no chance against it (puresteel especially...), then there are a few decks that are favorable to even. I haven't found any decks that can are really a bad match up, but if there is any deck you would like me to test against you can just tell me, and I'll grab a friend to help me test. Here are a few conclusions that I have drawn from it:
1. I don't like Invisible Stalker. It's just useless without a sword, all you can really do is chump block or get one damage a turn through. I know a ton of people are really excited about this guy, but we have enough sword-bearers to work with, and shouldn't go all in on this "cheap guy, equip, profit" strategy. I try to run creatures that can help me out in the majority of situations. He just hasn't impressed me during testing.
2. I love the instant/flash theme of this deck! Playing cards like snapcaster mage and midnight haunting let us leave up mana for a counterspell, and can ambush several of your opponent's favorite creatures. It also helps because on turn four, we can grab a creature, let's say midnight haunting, block with a token and cast/equip a sword next turn. All this can be done while keeping mana leak viable every turn of the game. Of course, if you are playing on your own turn, you are probably crippling them, since you're casting Oblivion Ring, Day of judgment, Gideon Jura, or Consecrated Sphnx. The instant speed creatures are the reason I have a singleton dissipate, and I'm thinking of adding another...
3. Play forbidden alchemy instead of Think Twice.
In response to your land question, I tend to stick near the higher end of the curve (I played 27 in caw-blade 2.0). I completely agree with your theory of man lands and squadron hawks, so I could probably go from 26 to 25. For me, running 24 is getting a bit risky, since you now only have a 63% chance of hitting a turn four land drop (Day of Judgment), 47% of hitting a turn five (Gideon Jura), and only 32% of hitting turn 6 (Consecrated Sphinx) compared to 72, 57, and 42 of a 26 land deck. My lists tend to lean on the upper part of the curve a little more (slightly more control than aggro) but if you are playing a more aggressive version, than cutting to 24 lands won't give you much of a problem.
Snapcaster Mage!
Everybody realizes the power of this card when used with sword of feast and famine, since it provides insane value. I've been toying around with many different shells for a blade deck, but this guy always seems to be finding it's way in. Let's quickly delve into what seems to be the core of these kind of decks:
4 Mana Leak - This is fairly obvious... There just aren't enough decent counterspells to argue against playing four.
3 Dismember - This is mainly for the UW decks (even though they aren't bad as a singleton in UB or esper...) and are a huge tempo boost. They get you out of mainy sticky situations, but the life-loss is too big to run four.
2-3 Day of Judgment - Sure, we are supposed to be an aggro-control deck, but day can just be too crippling to leave out. It's won me too many games to count, but can be kind of awkward when you get too many.
2 Consecrated Sphinx - I can understand why you would run a 1-1 split between this and grave titan if you have black, but I love this card. It demands an immediate answer (i.e doom blade) or else the game will get quickly out of hand. It is large enough to stop aggro decks, and can finish off control decks that can't answer it.
2-3 Gideon Jura - He does everything. He buys you time against fast decks, if he doesn't just finish them off single-handedly. Against control, he can destroy their finishers, and then swing all by himself. He's definitely a keeper.
2-3 Oblivion Ring - It can answer almost anything on the opponent's side of the table, but must be cast during the main phase and can screw with your tempo a little bit. Since the format appears to be slowing down a bit, this card is almost an auto-include, but it runs the gambit as to how many copies are main-decked.
2-3 Sword of Feast and Famine - I heard that this card is pretty good. In fact it's what fuels our deck. I'm leaning towards running three right now, since losing squadron hawks and celestial collonnade reduces our aggressiveness a bit. I'm sorry, but a 2/1 without a sword won't get us there. I would definitely run more if you are looking at Invisible Stalker, since he is useless without it.
Ok so that's what I view as the core, but I know that there are several different ways to go with this deck. I've been toying around with a few decklists, and I wanted to share them with you to give you a starting point if you are looking to play a blade deck.
4x Glacial Fortress
4x Inkmoth Nexus
6x Island
2x Moorland Haunt
6x Plains
4x Seachrome Coast
1x Dissipate
4x Forbidden Alchemy
4x Mana Leak
3x Midnight Haunting
3x Oblivion Ring
2x Invisible Stalker
4x Snapcaster Mage
2x Day of Judgment
3x Sword of Feast and Famine
3x Gideon Jura
So the main liberties I took with this list is with the smaller, sword bearing creatures. I've played around with Invisible Stalker a lot, and I just can't get into this card. It is a solid sword carrier, but other than that, it just doesn't follow the theme of getting value from each card. I know that many people are excited by this card, so there's probably more than what I've been seeing lately. Midnight Haunting on the other hand, has really impressed me. I haven't heard too many positive responses on the topic of this guy, but it reminds me of squadron hawk just a little bit (please don't destroy me for saying that!). I make this point because it can be used as clutch blockers that you aren't afraid to lose, and being at instant speed leaves you free to main phase mana leak, or kill a puresteel paladin that wouldn't have otherwise attacked. It can be flashed in at the end of the fourth turn to follow up with a turn five sword an equip, which is devastating. Also, it's a great target to return with snapcaster mage, since you get three instant speed creatures that can block and swing or swing the next turn.
4x Darkslick Shores
2x Drowned Catacomb
3x Glacial Fortress
2x Inkmoth Nexus
3x Island
3x Isolated Chapel
1x Plains
4x Seachrome Coast
4x Swamp
1x Dissipate
3x Doom Blade
4x Forbidden Alchemy
1x Go for the Throat
4x Mana Leak
3x Oblivion Ring
3x Sword of Feast and Famine
3x Geist of Saint Traft
1x Grave Titan
4x Snapcaster Mage
2x Day of Judgment
2x Despise
2x Gideon Jura
This bears close resemblance to the UW version, but with the inclusion of instant speed removal and two discard spells. Oh yeah, and one grave titan... I decided to go the geist of saint traft route, since all the removal can effectively clear a path for an otherwise fragile 2/2. Six damage for three mana is incredibly alluring for an aggro-control deck, add hexproof to it and you are ensuring that it will be played. I would consider him as almost a strick upgrade to Invisible Stalker. There is obvious synergy here for Snapcaster Mage with options to return targeted removal, mass removal, target discard, and counterspells. The only reason that I wouldn't run the esper version would be the faulty mana base, and the fact that I can't run too many inkmoth nexus without feeling guilty.
Well that's it for now! I'll try and come up with a solid UB list, and friday marks the first time I can officially start tuning for the decks that are appearing, and then I can start to finalize a sideboard. Right now, I'd just grab several of those conditional cards, such as steel sabotage and revoke existence. I'm looking forward to
Snapcaster Mage!
Everybody realizes the power of this card when used with sword of feast and famine, since it provides insane value. I've been toying around with many different shells for a blade deck, but this guy always seems to be finding it's way in. Let's quickly delve into what seems to be the core of these kind of decks:
4 Mana Leak - This is fairly obvious... There just aren't enough decent counterspells to argue against playing four.
3 Dismember - This is mainly for the UW decks (even though they aren't bad as a singleton in UB or esper...) and are a huge tempo boost. They get you out of mainy sticky situations, but the life-loss is too big to run four.
2-3 Day of Judgment - Sure, we are supposed to be an aggro-control deck, but day can just be too crippling to leave out. It's won me too many games to count, but can be kind of awkward when you get too many.
2 Consecrated Sphinx - I can understand why you would run a 1-1 split between this and grave titan if you have black, but I love this card. It demands an immediate answer (i.e doom blade) or else the game will get quickly out of hand. It is large enough to stop aggro decks, and can finish off control decks that can't answer it.
2-3 Gideon Jura - He does everything. He buys you time against fast decks, if he doesn't just finish them off single-handedly. Against control, he can destroy their finishers, and then swing all by himself. He's definitely a keeper.
2-3 Oblivion Ring - It can answer almost anything on the opponent's side of the table, but must be cast during the main phase and can screw with your tempo a little bit. Since the format appears to be slowing down a bit, this card is almost an auto-include, but it runs the gambit as to how many copies are main-decked.
2-3 Sword of Feast and Famine - I heard that this card is pretty good. In fact it's what fuels our deck. I'm leaning towards running three right now, since losing squadron hawks and celestial collonnade reduces our aggressiveness a bit. I'm sorry, but a 2/1 without a sword won't get us there. I would definitely run more if you are looking at Invisible Stalker, since he is useless without it.
Ok so that's what I view as the core, but I know that there are several different ways to go with this deck. I've been toying around with a few decklists, and I wanted to share them with you to give you a starting point if you are looking to play a blade deck.
4x Glacial Fortress
4x Inkmoth Nexus
6x Island
2x Moorland Haunt
6x Plains
4x Seachrome Coast
1x Dissipate
4x Forbidden Alchemy
4x Mana Leak
3x Midnight Haunting
3x Oblivion Ring
2x Invisible Stalker
4x Snapcaster Mage
2x Day of Judgment
3x Sword of Feast and Famine
3x Gideon Jura
So the main liberties I took with this list is with the smaller, sword bearing creatures. I've played around with Invisible Stalker a lot, and I just can't get into this card. It is a solid sword carrier, but other than that, it just doesn't follow the theme of getting value from each card. I know that many people are excited by this card, so there's probably more than what I've been seeing lately. Midnight Haunting on the other hand, has really impressed me. I haven't heard too many positive responses on the topic of this guy, but it reminds me of squadron hawk just a little bit (please don't destroy me for saying that!). I make this point because it can be used as clutch blockers that you aren't afraid to lose, and being at instant speed leaves you free to main phase mana leak, or kill a puresteel paladin that wouldn't have otherwise attacked. It can be flashed in at the end of the fourth turn to follow up with a turn five sword an equip, which is devastating. Also, it's a great target to return with snapcaster mage, since you get three instant speed creatures that can block and swing or swing the next turn.
4x Darkslick Shores
2x Drowned Catacomb
3x Glacial Fortress
2x Inkmoth Nexus
3x Island
3x Isolated Chapel
1x Plains
4x Seachrome Coast
4x Swamp
1x Dissipate
3x Doom Blade
4x Forbidden Alchemy
1x Go for the Throat
4x Mana Leak
3x Oblivion Ring
3x Sword of Feast and Famine
3x Geist of Saint Traft
1x Grave Titan
4x Snapcaster Mage
2x Day of Judgment
2x Despise
2x Gideon Jura
This bears close resemblance to the UW version, but with the inclusion of instant speed removal and two discard spells. Oh yeah, and one grave titan... I decided to go the geist of saint traft route, since all the removal can effectively clear a path for an otherwise fragile 2/2. Six damage for three mana is incredibly alluring for an aggro-control deck, add hexproof to it and you are ensuring that it will be played. I would consider him as almost a strick upgrade to Invisible Stalker. There is obvious synergy here for Snapcaster Mage with options to return targeted removal, mass removal, target discard, and counterspells. The only reason that I wouldn't run the esper version would be the faulty mana base, and the fact that I can't run too many inkmoth nexus without feeling guilty.
Well that's it for now! I'll try and come up with a solid UB list, and friday marks the first time I can officially start tuning for the decks that are appearing, and then I can start to finalize a sideboard. Right now, I'd just grab several of those conditional cards, such as steel sabotage and revoke existence. I'm looking forward to hearing your opinions!
Ok when it gets to the point that my opponent doesn't want to cast anything when I have open mana, then I, as the control player, am winning. The point is that you can nab an early drop with a mana leak, then grab a midranged card too. Then you have finisher mana, and you are set. Not to mention you can destroy creatures too, and it has insane late game value. If you've ever played control, and shuffled your graveyard into your library after a game, then you know what I mean...
4x Darkslick Shores
3x Day of Judgment
3x Despise
1x Dismember
2x Dissipate
3x Doom Blade
3x Drowned Catacomb
3x Gideon Jura
3x Glacial Fortress
1x Go for the Throat
2x Grave Titan
6x Island
2x Isolated Chapel
4x Mana Leak
3x Oblivion Ring
3x Plains
3x Seachrome Coast
2x Snapcaster Mage
3x Swamp
4x Think Twice