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  • posted a message on [Primer - Updates to the primer as of May 24th, 2013] Angry Birds
    That's interesting. I assume you are testing it on TappedOut and not IRL? I've been a long-time user of Tapped Out and think it is a great site but also feel that their draw algorithms aren't perfect. I generally do not have issues drawing Sanctuary in real life testing.

    Quote from weltkrieg »
    Any idea how Island sanctuary interacts with sylvan library?


    That's a very good question. For reference, Sylvan Library's text is:

    "At the beginning of your draw step, you may draw two additional cards. If you do, choose two cards in your hand drawn this turn. For each of those cards, pay 4 life or put the card on top of your library."

    And Island Sanctuary's is:

    "If you would draw a card during your draw step, instead you may skip that draw. If you do, until your next turn, you can't be attacked except by creatures with flying and/or islandwalk."

    If I had both down, my first inclination would be to take my first draw and skip one or both of Sylvan Library's additional two. However, one of the rulings for Sylvan Library states:

    9/16/2007: If you choose to draw two cards, then replace one or more of those draws with some other effect, the rest of Sylvan Library's ability still happens. If you've actually drawn only one card that turn, you must choose that card and either pay 4 life or put it on top of your library. If you haven't actually drawn any cards that turn, the rest of the ability has no effect.


    I believe this means I would still be required to choose the card I drew (since it states cards drawn that turn and not simply cards drawn from Sylvan Library) from my hand and place it on top of my library or pay 4 life. Unless I'm missing something, I don't think Sylvan Library would actually end up being that great with Sanctuary. And it is in the wrong color unfortunately.



    But what is your take on the new list? I personally feel the addition of the one-drop birds and Cloud of Faeries over Stormscape Familiar as my "accelerant" give this deck something it was missing before.

    It's as consistent as ever but more aggressive on the front-end. And this isn't simply about being a faster deck. It's about setting up into the mid-game roll sooner. Sky Hussar comes online sooner and can easily be giving us extra cards by turn three. It's also far more viable to drop Island Sanctuary earlier because we've already developed a board presence with our creatures. Even Pride of the Clouds can serve as a great early beater with the one-drops. There have been times where I've gone:

    Turn 1: Land, one-drop
    Turn 2: Land, Cloud of Faeries, Pride of the Clouds

    That generally forces the opponent to respond as that is a pretty aggressive board to start with.

    It's also still a very forgiving dual-colored deck as can be seen by a mana base of mostly basics. More duals could be added I suppose but I rarely get color screwed. As much as I can get away with it, I like to stick with basics because that is protection vs. Wasteland.

    I'm not trying to hype the deck like I believe it is the best thing ever but it does feel solid and consistent. It's definitely fun to play and not too shabby for the budget price and rogue-ishness.

    I've been out of the tournament scene for quite awhile now due to school and work but I'm going to a tourny in a week and I'm taking my trusty Angry Birds with me. First time I've played Birds in a tournament in forever. Not 100% certain on what my SB will look like but I think I'm going to stick with an E-Tutor sideboard for versatility, especially since I'm not real familiar with the meta at my local joint right now.

    I will post a tournament report, good or bad, after the drop!


    EDIT: I've also semi considered Back to Basics for this deck. A lot of major Legacy decks run nearly only duals and this could be pretty insane. The deck might need some retooling though to fit it in. Thoughts?
    Posted in: Budget (Legacy)
  • posted a message on [Primer - Updates to the primer as of May 24th, 2013] Angry Birds
    I would not run Reconnaissance in my tournament list personally. It is a fun card if you are building a more aggressive but casual birds list because you can swing all-out with your birds for damage and untap them afterwards to use as blockers.
    Posted in: Budget (Legacy)
  • posted a message on Ambush! U/G Forestwalk Aggro
    Quote from weltkrieg
    It was no god hand. it happened to me like 6 times in a row, but I kept barfing up gsz, quirion druids, priest of titania, etc.

    In further playtesting, You're either not running enough one drop mana elves (I run a minimum of 8 and sometimes even 10 to 12), or not enough lands. I keep not drawing enough of them.

    Elvish visionary is by far the weakest card in the list so far.

    In 5 tests, I've yet to actually draw a wirewood symbiote, though I acknowledge it's potential power. This deck has an absolutely incredible t4 win, though, be it a bad one land hand or a hand full of forests, elvish visionary, and one archdruid.

    I'm not sure what can be done to make it more explosive, other than maybe add in another one drop mana elf or two. The ability to barf up your deck can't be underestimated.


    Wow, that is crazy! Yeah, I believe I was running only 8 one mana elves before. I've since tinkered with the list a bit for more consistent starts. I also concur on Elvish Visionary so right now I'm seeing if the deck functions alright without them.

    I agree. This deck t4's like clockwork. It's almost creepy how consistent it is at doing that. Haha! I just wish I could reliably accelerate it like a half-turn even.

    Anyways, here is the new list:



    Still play testable here!
    Posted in: Budget (Legacy)
  • posted a message on [Primer - Updates to the primer as of May 24th, 2013] Angry Birds
    Nope, you are absolutely right. The list I run has traditionally had 61 cards in it. The 61st card is essentially an extra land. Instead of running 19 lands, I've got 20. Overall, I'd say it has pretty balanced draws.

    Jitte is a very, very good card. However, you probably want to base its effectiveness on what kind of meta you have. I am actually probably going to cut back down to two or maybe three. I'm finding that I haven't needed four and that that might actually be too many. It's not exactly a card that you want to see two of in your hand.

    I've been tinkering with this list below:



    What I like about it is that it can be a little more aggressive off the start than any of my previous lists. What was dropped from the list then was Stormscape Familiar as he no longer feels needed as an accelerator and also Aven Mindcensor which may or may not be a loss for this deck. I found that he was helpful in occasional situations but often landed too late to be really that significant. Maverick hated him though!
    Posted in: Budget (Legacy)
  • posted a message on [Primer - Updates to the primer as of May 24th, 2013] Angry Birds
    Quote from shaunnerboy »
    I really like where this deck is heading, especially with judge's familiar being printed, however I haven't seen mention of mirror entity, and note that any pump up effects would still be in effect even after using (X) ability, also add defiant falcon and you now have a tutor for entity.


    That is a really cool suggestion/idea. I might have to try that out. I don't think it will probably see play in my personal list (mainly for the reasons that weltkrieg mentioned as that is how my Angry Birds is built), but I could see it in an alternative list with a different focus. Would you be interested in throwing a list together and sharing it? I'd love to see where you could take that idea.

    That said, I completely agree that Judge's Familiar breathes new life into this deck. But Gatecrash has also quietly introduced a new bird that I think deserves some attention: Cloudfin Raptor. He may seem a bit underwhelming but he's worth considering as a two-of (or maybe a three-of) for a couple reasons.

    1. He's nearly always a 1/2 flier for one which isn't bad. His draw back is usually negligible as we have a high concentration of cheap creatures in the deck to support him. He's not even that bad (maybe not great but certainly not terrible) in the late game as he's still another flier and he boosts Pride.

    2. Well, really the main reason he's worth considering is that he is currently, IMHO, the second best one-drop bird for our deck and what this deck desperately needed in the past was some one-drops. As one-drops five and six, Cloudfin aids Judge's Familiar in rounding out our curve. This smooths out our early game (allowing us to do something relevant on turn one) and lets us play more aggressively when we need to. Turn one bird, turn two Pride is a great play when we are needing to be a little more aggressive. At the same time, the addition of Cloudfin does not hinder the deck's ability to grind it out and win attrition battles when it needs to.

    3. And heck, if he sticks, in some games you might even have the chance to boost him beyond 1/2 in the mid game. Kor Skyfisher, Pride of the Clouds and Sky Hussar can all boost him to 2/3 or beyond, making him a threat of his own.
    Posted in: Budget (Legacy)
  • posted a message on Dubstep (updated, new list on page 5 as of 6/19/13)
    Hey so I thought I'd make a small comment and say that Quagnoth is another dude that is pretty tough to deal with or stop. If you're needing creatures that are more resilient, he seems pretty decent and might be a better replacement for Terra Stomper
    Posted in: Budget (Legacy)
  • posted a message on Ambush! U/G Forestwalk Aggro
    Thanks for the suggestions guys. Ulvenwald Tracker is actually pretty interesting with a Concordant Crossroads down or even if he is an early game drop that makes it to the field.

    weltkrieg, your example sounds like a god-hand. If I could pull that off consistently that would be amazing. Grin Haha! I actually tried Vitalize in an early list but felt that Quirion was better since it is an elf and tutorable with GSZ. It might be because I typically am not comboing out until turn 4 but I have to say I really haven't had an issue with running out of forests for my Quirions. However, dropping a Quirion for one more Wirewood Symbiote could resolve that issue.

    My list hasn't changed too much. I'm running more Regal Forces and Sylvan Messengers. I'm still trying to get the mechanics down just how I would like them. If I could reliably speed this combo up maybe a turn, that would be fantastic. Not sure if it can be done, though. Any suggestions?
    Posted in: Budget (Legacy)
  • posted a message on Ambush! U/G Forestwalk Aggro
    Thanks for the constructive feedback. I think I was hanging on to Biomantic Mastery because I felt that the extra card draw was sometimes very helpful to the consistency of the deck. However, I have to concede that in most situations Regal Force is going to be the better card so I'm swapping out the Biomantics for two more Regal Forces.

    As to why I'm not running Sylvan Messenger... I'm not really quite sure. I run him in my Foodchain Elves list and love him. I'll definitely give him a try here. It's just a matter of tinkering and figuring out who he should replace.

    Right now I feel like my flex spots for any new cards are:

    Fauna Shaman -- He's nice but really not that crucial for this particular list, IMHO. I find myself actually using his ability (and feeling like I need to) in only rare situations.

    Ezuri, Renegade Leader -- He's great in a pinch as a win-con. His power is honestly through the roof but at the same time I rarely ever need or use him and in most situations he just feels like win-more.

    Concordant Crossroads -- I feel comfortable with three but I may be able to dip down to two and be just fine.

    The only suggestion I'm not sure about is Seeker of Skybreak. To me he seems a lot less useful than Quirion Ranger since summoning sickness effects his ability and he is more expensive. But I haven't run into your situation of running out of forests that much. Maybe I'm just playing the deck out differently than you? Would you be able to explain further your reasoning behind running Seeker of Skybreak? I find you usually have great reasons for all of your card suggestions. Thanks.
    Posted in: Budget (Legacy)
  • posted a message on Casual Decks and Things (deck compendium)
    Sorry for never responding back to your questions or posting anything else. My Master's schooling slammed me and I haven't had a chance to do anything MtG related until now.

    Reconnaissance lets you do a couple of things. When you attack, if your opponent blocks your creature(s) with anything, you may choose to untap those blocked creatures and remove them from combat to prevent them from taking damage and dying. However, what most people do not know is that you get priority again after damage is dealt during the end of the combat step. This allows you to untap your creatures and remove them from combat after they have dealt damage so thereby giving them pseudo vigilance because they are untapped and able to block or tap again to use any activated abilities.

    Honor of the Pure is a very good card and worth trying!
    Posted in: Casual & Multiplayer Formats
  • posted a message on [Primer - Updates to the primer as of May 24th, 2013] Angry Birds
    I don't think it is probably that great but has anyone considered or tried out Airborne Aid in a more bird-oriented list?
    Posted in: Budget (Legacy)
  • posted a message on Ambush! U/G Forestwalk Aggro
    Totally necroing this.

    So more than a year later, I've been revisiting this deck. I haven't had as much time for MtG so I'm not quite as up-to-date on the meta as I used to be but I've been tinkering around with this list and thought I could at least share it.

    This probably does not deserve to be in 'budget' anymore because it is pretty costly but here it is:



    Someone may able to take this list and do something with it. I felt like it had potential. Essentially, I took a standard Aggro/NO Elves list, took out the NO combo with Progenitus and shoved in my own weird concoction.

    This deck splashes a bit of blue to run Magical Hack and Mind Bend. The purpose of these cards is three-fold. Alongside Wasteland and Rishadan Port these cards do a great job of locking the opponent out of at least one color. If you're wondering how Hack and Bend work, you can read some of the earlier posts for discussion on that. They allow you to change one land type with another so that that land produces mana of that color and has that land type for the rest of the game. Against dual-lands this will only change one of the land types on the dual, but hey, you can screw over an important color for your opponent!

    The second role of these cards is to change Elvish Champion's landwalk ability to the type of landwalk needed to make your creatures unblockable against any opponent. Or you can just change an opponent's land to a forest if they don't run green. That means you screw over a land and enable Elvish Champion all for one mana.

    The third role of these cards is to have your opponent make the 'WTF?' face as they glance to and from from the Llanowar Elves on the field and the Mindbend you just cast, wondering if you are in your right mind.


    Okay, well since it's really not fair to post a non-budget list in the budget forums, here is another much more budget list of elves I have been tinkering with. This one is more combo oriented.



    Again, this deck takes an aggro elves deck, removes NO/Progenitus and does something else instead. I felt like this deck was pretty powerful too and I've spent quite a bit of time testing it against stuff like Goblins, Maverick, Miracles (not the strong matchup for this deck), etc.

    It has a pretty decent straight up aggro plan with a good alternate combo plan. It works by using the grossly expensive draw cards Biomantic Mastery and Collective Unconscious and Regal Force to draw mass amounts of cards. You ramp to the mana needed to cast these crazy draw spells using one or more of your 8x Priest of Titania (well, 12x counting Green Sun's) and chaining untaps through Quirion Ranger and Wirewood Symbiote which can be fetched cheaply with Sun's. At some point, drop a Concordant Crossroads to keep dropping Priests and tapping them for mana. Eventually you draw through your deck and win with a bunch of hasty elves.

    If left untouched, this deck pulls this off pretty consistently around turn four which in my opinion is a little slow for a combo deck but seems to work great here. Even if you don't "combo off," a successfully cast draw spell helps to generate a lot of fuel.

    Also, it may be worth it to swap out the two Fauna Shaman for two Imperious Perfect. Not 100% sure.


    Both decks can be play tested here for free (no account or software or anything required):

    Ambush
    Elf Bomb
    Posted in: Budget (Legacy)
  • posted a message on Dubstep (updated, new list on page 5 as of 6/19/13)
    Quote from pqrcf »
    I'm guessing its because we lay some heavy beats


    Yep, that is exactly why it's called Dubstep. It was supposed to be one of those stupid, cheesy names people roll their eyes at. Gotta love it. Tongue

    Harmonize is a good card and can maintain steam. Probably worth trying in the list especially since we can ramp up to it pretty quickly. I've never considered this deck for modern as that is not a format I really play but, hey if it's good there, that's cool.

    Vindicate doesn't hurt too badly if you're running a list with a fair amount of hexproof or shrouded beaters. Perish is pretty much the bane of all creature-based green decks. Not a whole lot we can do about that unfortunately. If your opponent is likely to have boarded that in, you just have to play more conservatively instead of floating all your creatures onto the board at one time.

    Arbor Elf is fantastic for extra ramp. But not as hot if you're meta is filled with tons of removal. I used only enchantment ramp because, for my meta, the extra resilience was needed at the time.
    Posted in: Budget (Legacy)
  • posted a message on Budget Food Chains
    I may be a bit biased as the Food Chain Elves deck Spooky linked to is my own build but I would have to argue that it is probably the best budget Food Chain deck that I have seen to date.

    That said a budget blue/green deck would be interesting. As much as we could profit from Primordial Sage, I don't like him because he requires us to dump six mana, keep on the field and then continue to combo off with other cards. The goal of these decks is usually to combo out by turn three or four. May I suggest Griselbrand as a possible alternative? He doesn't require you to lose mana as you'll sac him to the engine immediately after using his effect, rather than needing to keep him on the field while you continue to combo out. Plus he immediately nets you 7 cards provided you have the life to pay.

    I know in my own list, a resolved Griselbrand generally means you will win as he keeps you from fizzling.
    Posted in: Budget (Legacy)
  • posted a message on [Primer - Updates to the primer as of May 24th, 2013] Angry Birds
    Nice! Looks like a pretty fun and aggressive list. Have you considered running something like Reconnaissance in place of that Island Sanctuary and maybe a couple Battle Screech or Aven Mimeomancer? It's a nice one-of enchantment that would let you alpha strike every turn and then untap your birds to use as blockers... and also pull back attacking birds that were blocked so you can re-use them. Seems like it'd be pretty powerful with what your wanting to do with your deck.
    Posted in: Budget (Legacy)
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