Wild Nacatl shouldn't be unbanned either. I like to play against aggro decks, but i would be really upset if i had to face Naya decks for the rest of the format because of them being the only ones viable then.
See this is the problem with that statement:there aren't any PURE aggro decks that zoo is really strong against in modern the Supposed aggro decks are either really CONTROL decks or have a good matchup against zoo.
Counterspells are not an answer they are never an "Answer". If he resolves do you just fold? When you let jace exist in the format you have to play decks that answer him. And that basically limits you to playing blue, playing RB or playing white.
Also of course you can play any deck. One of my favorite archetypes is stax. Does that mean I can build a stax type deck in modern? Sure I can but does that also mean it would be competitive? That's a different question.
We might have more decks but we would have fewer competitive decks and that's the problem with those cards. I don't get why people keep saying that unbanning will add more decks as a positive point. It adds those decks and makes even more not viable.
so basically the only deck that really gets harmed from jace being unbanned is mono-green? is that even a real deck in modern? and just because a deck is not competitive this is a bad thing there are a lot of decks that aren't competitive in modern.
yes in standard,but standard is or WAS a lot different then modern plus not only is there VF there is Abrupt Decay which hits most of the Faerie players permanents.
also bocephus you seem to think that "unfair" means aggro and control when in fact it means decks that use combos to win the game instead of relying on creatures which is what that term actually refers to when used in the context of MTG.
I haven't said anything about bitterblossom. In fact I've said in this thread that unbanning bitterblossom probably won't be a big deal. I'm talking about unbanning cards that make decks strictly better than those extant in the format:
cloudpost
stoneforge mystic
jace the mind sculptor
What happens to tron players? What happens to people that want to play blue but not use jace?
Then.....those players will just do that anyway? I mean it's not as hard as people make it out to be to just kill jace...especially and specifically in blue where you have the best answers to him--> counterspells.
Let's take a look at some of the cards that could come off the banned list and wouldn't hurt or would actually make the format more diverse, like how does Wild Nacatl being on the banned list help diversify the format where are all the cards that it was holding back? the cards that it supposedly held back are harmed more by lightning bolt being in the format are you saying LB shoul be banned? How does AV being on the ban list help to make the format more diverse? It really makes it less so IMO seeing as it makes true control almost impossible to play as without actual card advantage control dies too fast because of lack of answers, How does JTMS being on the banned list increase diversity in the types of answer cards that are played as Jeff said previously though he and I disagree that this is a bad thing also cards being on the ban list for being the boogeymen in standard is ridiculous when and where will it stop? once they ban things like thragtusk? people need to quit fearing the boogeyman and realize it's just a card/deck and probably has answers that you could play to beat it if you wanted to do that instead of being caught in this mentality of "I can't beat this but what I can do is whine for it to be banned" that so many people "cough" Bocephus "cough" seem to be stuck in.
The core of what you say sounds all right, but to be honest it'S just another of these posts screaming "make modern legacy without real duals and a few cards".
Modern is currently very diverse and balanced, considering how much smaller the cardpool is in comparison to legacy. Legacy has way more to offer for Tempo and Combo players and has Counterbalance and Jace to fuel control, that makes it another format.
Modern has it's own successfull decks in these fields (namely: Twin, Pod, Eggs, soon Elves / UWR Wafo-Tapa, U Tron) and if you don't like these, then you jsut have to play another format.
If I want to face creatures in nearly every deck I play Modern or Standard. If I want to make sick plays like T2 kills with elves, miracle'ing every 4th turn, having a top-counterbalance lock or want to throw around Tendrils then I have to play Legacy.
I really don't get why there are so many people complaining about modern. Thats like you'd be a huge Diablo 3 fan but all the time you'd lament how bad Star Craft is or vice versa. And don't give me that "It's a PTQ format"-stuff, because currently it's not and if you wanna bash modern then at least do it when it is
Why should I have to play another format that I can't afford, to play decks that I like? this is insane first you preface your comment with modern being really diverse and then you tell me that to play I have to play one or two certain decks, how is that diverse? I really think a lot of the argument about modern being so "diverse" because of the ban list is a sham when there are certain cards every deck has to play if it's in those colors any way, Also modern should not be anything like standard just because it shares some of the same card pool,because it is an eternal format it should feel like it is completely it's own thing.
I'm confused... How is "they've seen worse before" a valid response? It doesn't matter if they have seen worse before, if I want to limit my daughters exposure then the fact that she's seen it before is largely irrelevant. I still want to limit it.
The problem is no it isn't irrelevant once you've seen something you can't unsee it by pretending it doesn't exist and you shouldn't censor others so that you can do so if anything it's up to you to keep your daughter out of any stores that you don't feel are suitable and if you can't find one that's YOUR hard luck.
To all those claiming this card is amazing: Would you play Mind Control in the current standard environment? Would you play Soul Ransom over Mind Control if they were both in standard? Why would you play Soul Ransom over Mind Control?
This card is not mind control,mind control costs five,this does not that means you would have to have 6 up at least for removal if you played MC versus 5 for this,it also did not have two modes that both gave you card advantge it had one that was a one to one trade at least, this is that but cheaper and better and about the whole "black in the mana cost", what makes that so bad when we have all the dual lands that we do? MC could never 2-2 them this can.
I,m laughing at all the forum sages who think this card is garbage,this card is honestly really good, why is this card so good?
Because it does two things you already wanted as a control deck it either draws you cards at the detriment of your opponent's hand or it steals that thrag,resto, or olivia that they just played meaning they get to deal with it instead of you having to which I've heard is very good.
So what if they discard two to get it back that puts them down two cards and if you weren't about to die anway that means you have card advantage you know that one thing that every control deck wants? And if they were about to kill you,you could have done two things awnser their threat or died
so maybe if you didn't have another awnser then it wouldn't have mattered anway?
and if you weren't about to die you get to see more cards wich means you might be able to get some removal or if you have it in hand already you could just kill their creature in response staying at least card advantage neutral unless it was a thragtusk in which case you just came out ahead.
But anway if you guy's dont want yours I would love to take them off your hands for you,for when they go up in price to about 15-20 dollars:tongue:.
I agree with OP the game has gotten all about the red zone,this game used to be the intelectual rival of chess but now...well now it's on the same level as pokemon, and this is coming from someone who for years played WW,but as I started to play older formats I really do enjoy that "play smart,earn your win" style that pokebattles do not give you I mean how hard is it to swing in for the win,especialy because the player going first always has the upperhand.
I think that a lot of the time this "pendulum effect" garbage is used as a way of shutting up a minority voice that differs from the casual player way of thinking,mostly by those that preffer EDH,but guess what the minority aren't always wrong and blue is a color even if people like Maro wish it weren't, and the pendulum will never swing back.
Counters,Discard, and Land Destruction are important and vital parts of the game even if to some they are "unfun" and the players that have been atrracted to this game by this "new world order" that Maro envisions won't stick around like the older player's have.
See this is the problem with that statement:there aren't any PURE aggro decks that zoo is really strong against in modern the Supposed aggro decks are either really CONTROL decks or have a good matchup against zoo.
Then.....those players will just do that anyway? I mean it's not as hard as people make it out to be to just kill jace...especially and specifically in blue where you have the best answers to him--> counterspells.
Why should I have to play another format that I can't afford, to play decks that I like? this is insane first you preface your comment with modern being really diverse and then you tell me that to play I have to play one or two certain decks, how is that diverse? I really think a lot of the argument about modern being so "diverse" because of the ban list is a sham when there are certain cards every deck has to play if it's in those colors any way, Also modern should not be anything like standard just because it shares some of the same card pool,because it is an eternal format it should feel like it is completely it's own thing.
The problem is no it isn't irrelevant once you've seen something you can't unsee it by pretending it doesn't exist and you shouldn't censor others so that you can do so if anything it's up to you to keep your daughter out of any stores that you don't feel are suitable and if you can't find one that's YOUR hard luck.
2.Boros charm: one of the best cards for aggro in standard right now it hoses control and doesn't afraid of anything.
3.Orzhov charm:unconditional creature kill but pretty lame otherwise.
4.Dimir charm: 3 almost awesome modes tacked onto one card is still pretty good.
5.Selesnya charm: this one still looks good on paper,howerver in practice it's still pretty lame and I don't think i've ever lost to this card.
6-10 the rest all pretty much suck so.....:rolleyes:
This card is not mind control,mind control costs five,this does not that means you would have to have 6 up at least for removal if you played MC versus 5 for this,it also did not have two modes that both gave you card advantge it had one that was a one to one trade at least, this is that but cheaper and better and about the whole "black in the mana cost", what makes that so bad when we have all the dual lands that we do? MC could never 2-2 them this can.
Because it does two things you already wanted as a control deck it either draws you cards at the detriment of your opponent's hand or it steals that thrag,resto, or olivia that they just played meaning they get to deal with it instead of you having to which I've heard is very good.
So what if they discard two to get it back that puts them down two cards and if you weren't about to die anway that means you have card advantage you know that one thing that every control deck wants? And if they were about to kill you,you could have done two things awnser their threat or died
so maybe if you didn't have another awnser then it wouldn't have mattered anway?
and if you weren't about to die you get to see more cards wich means you might be able to get some removal or if you have it in hand already you could just kill their creature in response staying at least card advantage neutral unless it was a thragtusk in which case you just came out ahead.
But anway if you guy's dont want yours I would love to take them off your hands for you,for when they go up in price to about 15-20 dollars:tongue:.
I think that a lot of the time this "pendulum effect" garbage is used as a way of shutting up a minority voice that differs from the casual player way of thinking,mostly by those that preffer EDH,but guess what the minority aren't always wrong and blue is a color even if people like Maro wish it weren't, and the pendulum will never swing back.
Counters,Discard, and Land Destruction are important and vital parts of the game even if to some they are "unfun" and the players that have been atrracted to this game by this "new world order" that Maro envisions won't stick around like the older player's have.