We don't have a dedicated control player at our table, but 3/4 of us know to run enough removal to keep things under control. We've been trying to teach our fourth player to do so. Dedicated control isn't really needed to keep things balanced.
I had a similar problem for a while. I'd be flipping through someone's trade binder, and suddenly I'd start seeing cards I wanted to build EDH decks with. I'd start trading off all my value for them, end up with about half a deck, then realize I didn't really wanna build it. So one day I sat down, looked at everything I had, and decided to build two decks. I've stuck to those decks, and slowly tuned them out, with Kaalia being much more competitive than Chainer.
And I can't agree. Clearly, they deserve punishment. However, it's a basic principle of justice that the punishment cannot be greater than the crime. If it is, I can't just say "they're evil, they deserve whatever comes to them."
I don't know what an appropriate punishment for rape is. But I know it certainly isn't, for example, the rape filled dungeons the US prison system calls reformation.
No, they don't deserve to be raped for raping. They deserve a large sentence, probably in excess of 10 years though I don't want to give specific guidelines, and they should be placed on a registered sex offenders list accessible by the public. The fact that they may be raped in prison isn't the fault of the punishment, it's a fault of the prison system.
They used their fingers. They were partying all week. Maybe the girl told them she wanted them to do something when she wasnt unconscious. I have had a drunk girl lay down on a coach and tell me to rape her before after drinking... It's not always that clear. Who knows what the other kids were saying. Who knows what went on at the parties in the days before... maybe that was actually something that was happening each night and this was just the first time it was recorded.
I dont know these details. Without knowing how malicious their intent was I can't bring myself to automatically label them as monsters and demand that their lives are ruined more... Keep that in mind. You may think that they arent getting enough jail time but their lives are already ruined. They are not going to college any time soon. They are going to have an incredibly hard time finding jobs when they get out of jail. They are now and forever labelled as rapists. Honestly if you ignore what would probably happen to them in federal prison from other inmates out of the equation, at this point their lives are probably going to be worse out of jail than in jail.
Their fingers still make it rape. It doesn't matter what she said while conscious. It doesn't matter if they were partying all week. It doesn't matter if they had been doing similar things before. If indeed their lives are fairly ruined at this point, then I see no problem with that. They raped someone; they deserve whatever backlash comes with it.
Even if they weren't calling themselves the rape crew, they knew it was rape. Are you really going to try and argue that 16-17 year old high school students don't understand what rape is?
They were tweeting it. I don't know if the tweets are still up, I'd assume not.
Oh right you probably dont care and you dont seem to realize that they are being punished and not once did I say that their punishment is too harsh. I am saying the public outrage is extreme. But you'd rather see them be castrated in public and left to rot in jail for the rest of their lives for being evil rapists than try to understand their perspective on the situation.
No one is outraged that they're not being castrated in the streets. We're outraged that media is trying to paint them victims. We're outraged that people like you are continually defending them.
Yes, they viewed it as rape. They called themselves the "rape crew".
For one, this standard is fairly open. While there are obviously tier 1 decks and tier 2 decks, you can walk into even competitive FNMs/tournaments with a rogue deck and a well tuned sideboard, and walk out top 8. Compared to CAWblade standard, it's amazing. Second, you should read what LBS said about interaction. Can't really put it any better than that.
Did they know what they were doing? Remember these are "kids". These are the same people that do planking, harlem shake videos and more recently some weird videos where they go into stores and wreck **** by pretending to trip... Are kids who purposefully destroy private property monsters too?
If they honestly didnt know that what they did was wrong then they are psychopaths but there is a difference between knowing something is wrong and knowing how wrong it is. I believe context is everything. You apparently did not notice that I never said anything about the frat guys rapping sorority girls... but you assumed they did. There is a reason that in this country we are supposed to be innocent until proven guilty. A guy shouldnt go to jail just because he has sex with a drunk girl that wishes him harm in the morning or regrets her decisions.
Source? I havent seen anything saying that.
You're comparing raping someone, then bragging about it, spreading the story along with videos of it around social networks, etc. to destroying private property? Humans are intrinsicly more valuable than anyone's material possession. They're not little kids. They're not 8. They're all 16-17, and knew perfectly well what they were doing. Stop trying to protect them by feigning their naivity.
I'd call them idiots that made a horrible decision.
If they didnt realize that what they did was wrong they would be monsters.
It seems that certain people in this thread dont want any distinction between degrees of rape... I for one think these kids did a less bad thing than a guy that is a serial rapist... Should we really charge, frat guys that have sex with sorority sisters after parties, with the same crime as a guy that jumps someone in a park and rapes them in his van? That kind of logic is how we ruin high school guys lives by charging them with child porn because their 16 year old girl friend sent him a nudie picture.
I disagree, I think them knowing what they were doing is what makes them monster. If they honestly didn't know what they did was wrong, that's a completely different situation. Yes, we should charge frat guys raping sorority sisters with the same charges as someone abducting and raping someone anywhere else. Context doesn't matter with rape. The comparison to a 16 year old's nude photos is awful, it's two totally different things.
Of course there's a double standard! Men and women generally have different views on sex and with who, when, and where they'll engage in it. Men are genetically programed to get with as many partners as we can so we usually have a much more casual attitude towards it. Women are different and that should be respected, hence the double standard. We hear about men raping intoxicated women all the time, it's rare that it's a woman doing it to a man. Chances are it's much more psychologically damaging to a woman than to a man given the nature of sex (having something actually inside you is probably more intimate). Plus I'm sure many guys would be thrilled if a girl got them drunk in order to take advantage of them.
So for starters, no, there's not that big a difference between men and women. You state a biological drive to sleep with as many partners as possible, but those days are long past. The reason you still think women aren't as sex driven as men is because we live in a sexist society where men are taught to express any need they have, and women are taught only to serve. The reason you don't hear about women raping intoxicated men is because it's extremely hard for them to do so; the power difference in our society makes this a difficult task. I'm sure many guys would not be thrilled to be drugged and raped.
Well it would have to have all the necessary nutrients your body needs to survive. So for me, it'd probably be something like;
- large pizza w/ onions, bell peppers, olives, mushrooms, sausage
- large, fresh salad w/ lettuce, cheese, pineapple chunks, olives, and banana peppers
- pitcher of water
- half-pitcher of milk
- cup of homemade vanilla ice cream
- 2x whey protein shake
That's probably roughly 2000 calories, and gets me everything I need.
That's one reason not to rape... But what if one doesn't view rape as wrong? Not, saying i do but obviously these teens didn't. Do you think the potential negative consequences can help prevent these people from raping? If so. Why are you against preventing rape?
Then they need to be institutionalized and kept away from the public. This is rape culture in action. "We're trying to show kids that if they rape someone, they could ruin their career and/or future, so they shouldn't rape." Not only does this completely ignore the ACTUAL reason you shouldn't rape, it can easily lead to the thought process of "Oh well if I just don't get caught." There's only one good reason not to rape, and it's because rape is wrong. There should be no other reason being taught to anyone.
My group does Partial Paris, first one free. While it's very easy to build a deck to take advantage of this, none of us do. I'd personally prefer regular Paris mulligans, but that requires a lot more shuffling and most groups just wouldn't be down for it.
No, they don't deserve to be raped for raping. They deserve a large sentence, probably in excess of 10 years though I don't want to give specific guidelines, and they should be placed on a registered sex offenders list accessible by the public. The fact that they may be raped in prison isn't the fault of the punishment, it's a fault of the prison system.
Their fingers still make it rape. It doesn't matter what she said while conscious. It doesn't matter if they were partying all week. It doesn't matter if they had been doing similar things before. If indeed their lives are fairly ruined at this point, then I see no problem with that. They raped someone; they deserve whatever backlash comes with it.
They were tweeting it. I don't know if the tweets are still up, I'd assume not.
http://dailyoftheday.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/tweets_rape_me.png
They definitely don't understand rape, or it's implications.
No one is outraged that they're not being castrated in the streets. We're outraged that media is trying to paint them victims. We're outraged that people like you are continually defending them.
Yes, they viewed it as rape. They called themselves the "rape crew".
You're comparing raping someone, then bragging about it, spreading the story along with videos of it around social networks, etc. to destroying private property? Humans are intrinsicly more valuable than anyone's material possession. They're not little kids. They're not 8. They're all 16-17, and knew perfectly well what they were doing. Stop trying to protect them by feigning their naivity.
I disagree, I think them knowing what they were doing is what makes them monster. If they honestly didn't know what they did was wrong, that's a completely different situation. Yes, we should charge frat guys raping sorority sisters with the same charges as someone abducting and raping someone anywhere else. Context doesn't matter with rape. The comparison to a 16 year old's nude photos is awful, it's two totally different things.
"Monsters" can mean a lot of different things. I'd say these boys are, in a sense, monsters.
So for starters, no, there's not that big a difference between men and women. You state a biological drive to sleep with as many partners as possible, but those days are long past. The reason you still think women aren't as sex driven as men is because we live in a sexist society where men are taught to express any need they have, and women are taught only to serve. The reason you don't hear about women raping intoxicated men is because it's extremely hard for them to do so; the power difference in our society makes this a difficult task. I'm sure many guys would not be thrilled to be drugged and raped.
- large pizza w/ onions, bell peppers, olives, mushrooms, sausage
- large, fresh salad w/ lettuce, cheese, pineapple chunks, olives, and banana peppers
- pitcher of water
- half-pitcher of milk
- cup of homemade vanilla ice cream
- 2x whey protein shake
That's probably roughly 2000 calories, and gets me everything I need.
Then they need to be institutionalized and kept away from the public. This is rape culture in action. "We're trying to show kids that if they rape someone, they could ruin their career and/or future, so they shouldn't rape." Not only does this completely ignore the ACTUAL reason you shouldn't rape, it can easily lead to the thought process of "Oh well if I just don't get caught." There's only one good reason not to rape, and it's because rape is wrong. There should be no other reason being taught to anyone.