@Sloth
I WISH I could be uninvested, trust me
Kpaca has toned it down, but only recently
Everything about his early game was forced, and it even still kinda is
He said if he was a wolf he wouldnt be posting as much, and that is a straight-up lie
both those sloths can be wolves with Konan if he is a wolf, just based off those posts
Lagoon has been playing follow the leader all game
Baa Baa Black Sheep
Font, you’re a married woman. Stop thinking about me in bed.
I laughed, thanks
Wake's first language isn't English so her grammar and sentence structure can be a bit hard to understand
In my experience, Rod as town does this ‘thing’ where he seems to be able to pick out scum with reasonable success (Prison, Matter), but his reasons for it are ridiculous and shouldn’t actually be seen as reasons by anyone. I can’t tell if somehow there’s a method to his madness, or if it’s just blind luck.
and I am not excepting Rod as town till he stops being lazy
nothing I ever do is forced; that’s the brilliance of it.
so i guess my question is this: how do you think scum handles the evolving tom wagon if tom's scum and the tom voters are town?
Considering how little value scum tom would/had brought to the table (taking away all factors of role wifom) I wouldn’t be surprised if some went for an early bus, in fact that was my first thought but as I’ve said the only one I bring into question is tubba. So really, I wouldn’t be surprised if they are going on my wagon. Saying how scum handle a wagon without knowing who said scum are is just a guessing game.
but if you think scum aren't piling onto him, you also have to admit that they aren't defending him, either
I wouldn’t defend a slot that has brought little to the table as scum either that would look bad on a flip. If scum are defending town they’re doing it by saying lynching the gif poster is bad. However they can’t do that anymore so it gives more wiggle room.
think the way they slid onto this particular wagon, egging on kpaca's tunnel, was just kinda slimy. and that's never a w/w interaction
We can agree to disagree on this.
but everything after that seems... jumbled, and it's jumbled in a way where i can't really get myself to see what you're seeing.
Then you should be asking me more questions on what you don’t understand. You do know 2 of the votes on my wagon are empty because the reasoning has been proven wrong and they’re just sitting
you stated that tubba was the only person you were scumreading on the ZDS wagon, but ZDS is near the very bottom of my list, and townreading him is like a super spicy take in comparison to the rest of the thread. and at times it just seems like you're... not really considering the things
I feel like I can be throwing this right back at you. I’ve mulled over a lot of things in my head and yes I am not going to spam post and I keep some thoughts to myself but to say I haven’t considered things is so blatantly incorrect. Yes I get that my read is ‘spicy’ as you put it but that doesn’t stop me from having it. I have offered open discussion on my reads and if no one wants to take me on them and just vote me then truly I cannot do much. I know you are not meaning to make this offensive, but considering I read the whole front to back minus 5 pages in about 2 days and had to catch up, my weakest point in the game mind you. Sure, I could 'miss' some things. But to say I don't consider? Come on now.
Even after reading your explanation; I do not understand how your read on Tom is basically "other peoples' interactions with Tom has made me scum read Tom".
I will probably vote you when I am done rereading, I am refraining currently as for all I know you are L-1 by the time I get to page 36.
Anyway back to the game: Nothing I say implies Tom is town. In fact I was trying to say Tom is nullest of nulls because of his gif posting. Saying that scum can jump on tom because it is an excuse does not imply that tom is town and I don't understand how you would get to that answer yourself. The whole base of the idea that I am also scum because I wanted to get the jump on a tom townread is...interesting? Sure in theory it is a good idea to get a jump on a popular or influential player but tom isn't that. There's no way I can believe that someone thought the idea that went through my head as scum is trying to get a headstart on townreading tom of all players here.
Not popular? You're going to break tom's heart.
I can talk for a little bit.
The idea is, if you think tom is null, then why do you want to stop pressure on him? Especially when you weren't even fully caught up, and couldn't have even known if the pressure had fallen off. So why try to convince Tubba to back off then? Well, I don't really see a town thought process. You could have theoretically been annoyed with the tunneling on tom, like a lot of people, but nothing you said actually indicated that kind of annoyance. And if your problem was that it was annoying, well, why talk to Tubba about it instead of pursuing something else?
At the same time, you seemed to have believed that looking at people voting on tom (if he's town) could have been a good place to start to scumhunt. This could have served as a jumping point into the game for you, and let you real time some reads with people. But you didn't do that. Instead, you outlined the thought process (i.e. this is how and why I would look for scum in the people pressuring tom), thus explaining to scum how you intend to catch them /before/ you even let them do the things you'd want to read them on. Like, you're saying "this is how I would scumhunt" instead of actually scumhunting, and telling scum how to not get caught by you at the same time.
It's just a totally bizarre way to approach the game as town, and makes more sense for you as scum to be trying to define your process and scrounging for some sort of content.
Lastly, the pretty obvious conclusion to "hey, I'm actually townreading everyone voting tom, except maybe Tubba" is "maybe Tom is mafia, and that's why there's no mafia voting him." But you never actually made that connection or even seemed to think about it? That backs up the idea of you tmiing Tom as town.
Amy, if you know Konan, I'd be happy to talk about her(?) with you and figure out if this is alignment indicative. I'm at a pretty strong d1 scumread here (like 65/70%, compared to a baseline 25%), but I'm up for being talked out of it if you think I'm misinterpreting her.
As someone who votes on assumptions of TMI slips far too much they are rarely true, even though I would like them to be true more. So I stop mislynching people and looking like a dumb ass.
The more you spell it out the more I like the smell of this; but also this:
I'm also a little spooked by Sloth having such a strong townread on me. There's an argument to be made that I was easier to read that normal at the beginning of the game due to the health issues, and sloth would have been hyper aware of that because he was also watching my thought process in a hydra ish game at the same time. But I've also, uh, literally just fooled him and I kind of expected him to be more concerned about it going into this game.
Arguably, he would know that I would be expecting him to be more cautious about townreading me, and would try to play into that as scum, so him not doing is a sign that he is in fact town, but that's weak and I probably shouldn't have even taken the time to type it out.
Anyway.
Why would it bother you that someone is town reading you?
wisp's reads are ?????????????????? and i actually think that makes me feel better about his alignment lol
this konan wagon swelled up way faster than i would have expected and i need to look at some stuff to see how i feel about it
welcome to the game tom. thanks for giving me one more slot to read, ********
sloth not voting feels kinda wack
wakemeup in particular needs to start playing the game, she keeps almost being here but then she isn't
these rapid fire thoughts brought to you by my adhd
The only game I ever played with wisp his reads were nonsensical and he threw his vote around like Rey Mysterio wrestling Brock Lesnar. He was town in that game.
Kpaca, I'm going to level with you, I'm kind of just treating you as an obstacle to work around at this point. Like, you're probably town, but you're so abrasive and hard headed about this Tom thing (repeatedly saying "answer the question" without actually saying what the question even is, for example) that trying to work with you right now seems pointless. I don't mean this to be dismissive, but I do want to express my frustration. Is there something I can do to help communication between us.
Ter, you're being kind of condescending, I think. I would appreciate it if you could be a little kinder.
There's a bunch of other stuff that isn't great, from me included.
You last point was great, and I may very well have been not allowing myself to get out of the tunnel, but I often need to resolve the tunnel somewhat in order to move on. I kind of have a one track mind like that. Even if my resolution doesn't allow me to make a final decision on the alignment of the tunnel in question, I have to at least close my open ended question. You were correct to call me out on this though, and should be willing to call me out on it as you feel necessary.
tl:dr The game is starting to feel a bit toxic, let's try to remember we're here to have fun.
I guess I felt like I asked the question a couple times, and am getting no answer. So have just decided to repeat myself at this point to call attention to the fact that tom is just completely ignoring the request. I’m kind of trying to be an obstacle I guess, because I really think we should all be voting for Tom; and quite frankly I’m getting a little frustrated with the prevailing attitude of “we don’t care he’s acting scummy”. If everyone else wants to focus elsewhere; fine. But I’m not quite interested in focusing my attention elsewhere.
I am also happy to engage in ways I can help engender our communication :).
That's all fair.
I think what you're missing is that Tom is playing for Tom to have fun, and will do it regardless of his alignment. He used gifs and tried to express his reads through them because that's what he found fun. I think you're being a little unfair when you say he's contributing nothing: he did give some reads, and the Terraine was /a/ take, though admittedly not one I found particularly useful.
I think this is something we can talk about after the game, but right now, I don't think anything actually frustrating you about tom is alignment indicative, and I think tom is more likely step it up on his own, if he's town, if he's given space. Like, right now he's just getting more and more obstinate in response to you trying to shove a yeet onto him.
I also think you personally, if you are town, are getting so into your tom tunnel that it's affecting all your other reads, and hurting your ability to solve. Like, we're talking about this right now, and you're being frustrated with me, and instead we could be talking about my clearly awesome case on Konan. Or, if I'm you think I'm wrong on Konan, we could be talking about that here, and I could be the one getting pulled out of a tunnel (I don't think that's going to happen, but a woman can dream, heh).
Do you get what I'm saying?
So; I wanted to start here. And I know that my tom question gets answered a few posts after his. Tom could have done this "because he wanted to", but I wanted him to verbalize that. Not have other people verbalize it for him. In my mind there are a few different prevailing theories (though unnamed) to how mafia analysis is done. Some people seem to pay attention to inconsistency in text, textual analysis you could say. Some people look for inconsistency in behavior; behavioral analysis. And some people focus on mind set; "mindset tells" if you will. Now everyone for sure utilizes all three at different points, but in my estimation generally most people play utilizing one of these three more than others. I have always been (to varying degrees of success) a mindset tells player. So a lot of what I do is trying to paint a picture in my head of what kind of mindset the person typing things at the other end of their computer might be. I very much wanted to be able to get a feel for "why" Tom is doing what he is doing. So if what he was doing was "refusing to answer questions; continuing to be obstinate" I wanted to call that out and highlight it.
I take obstinance in the face of a yeet as a not necessarily town mindset.
@kpaca
Its a dumb question. Technically the answer is "i was gonna roleplay because by setup its harry potter characters that know theyre in a mafia game but then osi randed me <some ******** without any lines>" but actually the answer is "i wanted to"
You're a dumb question.
On a more serious note, even if it was dumb it was clearly something that was important to answer. "This is a dumb question" would have provided more insight than an out and about refusal to answer. unvote while I continue to catch up on the last ten pages. I'm not placing you in the town pile yet, but this answer is not the worst thing you could have produced.
well the way I see it @Tom
is that Kpaca is explicitly lying about his meta
this isnt about pressure, this is about trying to yeet a possible wolf
I don't want to join either of the top wagons atm
so here I am
I haven’t dropped off but there is more that usual I want to say; I’ll be back home with a kaybaord tonight. Consider this a ptap and I’ll see y’all in about ten hours.
I guess my point is that I’m okay with being “old man yells at cloud right now”; while simultaneously being frustrated that more people aren’t yelling with me.
Sorry kpaca, but the tom thing has been going on long enough that I just don’t really care about it anymore. Pressuring him usually does nothing and I can’t recall him pushing the gimmick past day 1 anyways, with like one exception.
Just not something I want to focus on in the first half of day 1.
to me at this point it’s not about the gimmick. It’s about the why as well as the what he can provide for where he is at for this point in the game. He’s beginning to make it clear that he hasn’t done anything to further the goals of the town in my opinion.
Kpaca, I'm going to level with you, I'm kind of just treating you as an obstacle to work around at this point. Like, you're probably town, but you're so abrasive and hard headed about this Tom thing (repeatedly saying "answer the question" without actually saying what the question even is, for example) that trying to work with you right now seems pointless. I don't mean this to be dismissive, but I do want to express my frustration. Is there something I can do to help communication between us.
Ter, you're being kind of condescending, I think. I would appreciate it if you could be a little kinder.
There's a bunch of other stuff that isn't great, from me included.
tl:dr The game is starting to feel a bit toxic, let's try to remember we're here to have fun.
I guess I felt like I asked the question a couple times, and am getting no answer. So have just decided to repeat myself at this point to call attention to the fact that tom is just completely ignoring the request. I’m kind of trying to be an obstacle I guess, because I really think we should all be voting for Tom; and quite frankly I’m getting a little frustrated with the prevailing attitude of “we don’t care he’s acting scummy”. If everyone else wants to focus elsewhere; fine. But I’m not quite interested in focusing my attention elsewhere.
I am also happy to engage in ways I can help engender our communication :).
But nothing else lol.
nothing I ever do is forced; that’s the brilliance of it.
This was just 8 different levels of bad. And by "bad" I mean bad for the scum. Your service of outing yourself to the town has been much appreciated.
vote: Konan
I'd like a look at Killjoy tomorrow.
Even after reading your explanation; I do not understand how your read on Tom is basically "other peoples' interactions with Tom has made me scum read Tom".
I will probably vote you when I am done rereading, I am refraining currently as for all I know you are L-1 by the time I get to page 36.
The more you spell it out the more I like the smell of this; but also this:
Why would it bother you that someone is town reading you?
The only game I ever played with wisp his reads were nonsensical and he threw his vote around like Rey Mysterio wrestling Brock Lesnar. He was town in that game.
Is that his town meta?
So; I wanted to start here. And I know that my tom question gets answered a few posts after his. Tom could have done this "because he wanted to", but I wanted him to verbalize that. Not have other people verbalize it for him. In my mind there are a few different prevailing theories (though unnamed) to how mafia analysis is done. Some people seem to pay attention to inconsistency in text, textual analysis you could say. Some people look for inconsistency in behavior; behavioral analysis. And some people focus on mind set; "mindset tells" if you will. Now everyone for sure utilizes all three at different points, but in my estimation generally most people play utilizing one of these three more than others. I have always been (to varying degrees of success) a mindset tells player. So a lot of what I do is trying to paint a picture in my head of what kind of mindset the person typing things at the other end of their computer might be. I very much wanted to be able to get a feel for "why" Tom is doing what he is doing. So if what he was doing was "refusing to answer questions; continuing to be obstinate" I wanted to call that out and highlight it.
I take obstinance in the face of a yeet as a not necessarily town mindset.
You're a dumb question.
On a more serious note, even if it was dumb it was clearly something that was important to answer. "This is a dumb question" would have provided more insight than an out and about refusal to answer. unvote while I continue to catch up on the last ten pages. I'm not placing you in the town pile yet, but this answer is not the worst thing you could have produced.
fair point.
Dangit wisp!
I guess I felt like I asked the question a couple times, and am getting no answer. So have just decided to repeat myself at this point to call attention to the fact that tom is just completely ignoring the request. I’m kind of trying to be an obstacle I guess, because I really think we should all be voting for Tom; and quite frankly I’m getting a little frustrated with the prevailing attitude of “we don’t care he’s acting scummy”. If everyone else wants to focus elsewhere; fine. But I’m not quite interested in focusing my attention elsewhere.
I am also happy to engage in ways I can help engender our communication :).
so you’re saying you don’t care who dies?