Well, ****.
Apparently I've been testing wrong. Glad I didn't buy anything yet :P.
What you can do though is in a Show and Oath deck include a Channel. If you luck into drawing the Channel with Emrakul first turn that's pretty much game if they resolve, because the Channel allows you to cast Emrakul, which means you get the extra turn. When I run GG Oath I tend to also include a Tinker for the Bot; just extra ways to win besides Oathing up Emrakul or the Bot.
Noble fish and various beats decks like GWB are crazy good right now. It really depends on what people are playing by you, but MUD can do decent depending on how much hate folks are packing, Oath is pretty good, and Dredge can usually get you far also.
Has anyone noticed that in the P3K set they tried making it very historical using real people for the different kingdoms? They did make an error they made four of the five Tiger Generals for Liu Bei Lord of Shu (white) the fifth Ma Chao they made an error and made him a (red) and just made some generic Shu General basic white card wtf? I don't know how the company dropped the ball on this?
Yeah my friend pointed that out to me also not too long ago. Interesting that they did the different kingdoms and that they left some out.
Ok so most places that do vintage events let you use proxies, so just proxy up the power and expensive cards you can't swing to purchase. Vintage is a format where power is allowed so if you aren't using it you tend to be at a disadvantage. However, most places I play at allow proxies, so just proxy up the power and cards you don't want to buy or buy the collector's edition set power if you want a good proxy. As far as the format not being diverse and people winning in turn one or two that is definitely not true, at least not by me. The average game lasts about 4 to 5 turns and right now, and if they are playing a deck like Landstill or heavy control it can be waaaay more than that. Decks right now are pretty diverse by me, but aggro/beats decks are currently the "thing" to play. Using Tarmogoyf, Stoneforge Mystic, Meddling Mage, Noble Hierarch, etc.
I would say for your first deck keep it simple like a beats deck or noble fish; which funny enough is what is popular right now. I have played Landstill, MUD (Workshop), and Oath and Oath is good but its often a hit or miss deck depending on the meta game by you; same for Shop decks. Dredge decks will often make top 8 but again it depends on your meta often times as to what hate people are packing in their sideboards. Its worth pointing out Dredge can pretty much win without any power, you just need the Bazaars, which you can just Proxy if need be. (Its one reason among many that Dredge is so popular)
As for your question about the meta itself I would say it changes by me every 3 to 6 months depending on if a new set releases something "OMFG this is broken"; and no Grafdigger's Cage isn't as ridiculous as some people thought it would be, you just have to have a sideboard that is prepared for it like Dredge.
I'm definitely not a Vintage Savant, but that's my 2 cents.
As for Legacy the only main barrier is the dual lands, but also cards like Tarmogoyf, Dark Confidant, etc. can run you a lot if your deck uses them; however, they are nothing compared to the power nine.
From a financial perspective, goyph at $100 is a sell/trade now. If you trade for more dual lands, i would do that. As mentioned Snapcaster are good for long terms speculation.
If your really love your goyphs and have a strong attachment to them. Just keep them.
That's true. You don't want to regret selling them. Getting Duals for them is a great deal but otherwise I don't know.
Its funny that Goyf is moving out of legacy because he seems to be moving into vintage. Tons of vintage decks are running Goyf now. I would hold onto him if you can, but if you really need the money you can always buy him back later.
Most vintage games last on average 4-5 turns so even though most decks have a way to win turn one or two it virtually never happens for many reasons, as already stated above. I play Oath for the most part and it can be very fast; turn one oath of druids, which pretty much means turn 2 win, unless your opponent counters the oath and you don't have a counter to respond with, or they bounce/destroy your oath on their turn. Storm can be equally fast. Hell Gush can win turn two with a tinker on turn one.
Pretty solid deck there. Depending on your meta Cage can cause some serious problems for your opponents so you may even want to run 2 or 3 main and 1 or 2 SB. Snapcaster is a great card, but cage and him don't get along very well.
Personally, I think the problem here is Legacy. I think the people who play Legacy/people who know more about Legacy disseminate the "hurr durr, vintag is to hurd and to much monies" fallacy TOO much. Considering that upkeeping a Legacy deck costs more than just getting into Vintage kind of proves it. Proxies make it all the more viable to do as well, since, a majority of the time, they're taking up the most expensive cards like P9, Workshop, Bazaar, etc. With a 20th Anniversary set, like the thread Necrogenesis had posted, it'd REALLY knock down the stupid money complaints.
Typing that really made me realize how stupid Legacy is as a format.
I also have noticed that almost everyone I have asked about Vintage who don't play it think it is a one turn format where you need $500+ cards to play and grossly misunderstand the format. Some are willing to listen to me, but at least half let the info I say go in one ear and out the other. I also noticed that a lot of these players do not want to proxy P9 on basic lands; they either want the real card or a version that looks like the original. (And no these players still aren't willing to pay $50 for a CE Mox). I know atm all they really can do is bite the bullet and either buy CE or use basic land proxies. I have all the power and I fully would approve of a "Gamma" set and you can even have original art or do new art for all I care.
Yeah my friend pointed that out to me also not too long ago. Interesting that they did the different kingdoms and that they left some out.
This article has a pretty good list of some currently popular decks:
http://www.starcitygames.com/magic/vintage/23829_The_Long_And_Winding_Road_Play_Noble_Fish.html
I would say for your first deck keep it simple like a beats deck or noble fish; which funny enough is what is popular right now. I have played Landstill, MUD (Workshop), and Oath and Oath is good but its often a hit or miss deck depending on the meta game by you; same for Shop decks. Dredge decks will often make top 8 but again it depends on your meta often times as to what hate people are packing in their sideboards. Its worth pointing out Dredge can pretty much win without any power, you just need the Bazaars, which you can just Proxy if need be. (Its one reason among many that Dredge is so popular)
As for your question about the meta itself I would say it changes by me every 3 to 6 months depending on if a new set releases something "OMFG this is broken"; and no Grafdigger's Cage isn't as ridiculous as some people thought it would be, you just have to have a sideboard that is prepared for it like Dredge.
I'm definitely not a Vintage Savant, but that's my 2 cents.
As for Legacy the only main barrier is the dual lands, but also cards like Tarmogoyf, Dark Confidant, etc. can run you a lot if your deck uses them; however, they are nothing compared to the power nine.
Hope that helps.
I do the same.
I also have noticed that almost everyone I have asked about Vintage who don't play it think it is a one turn format where you need $500+ cards to play and grossly misunderstand the format. Some are willing to listen to me, but at least half let the info I say go in one ear and out the other. I also noticed that a lot of these players do not want to proxy P9 on basic lands; they either want the real card or a version that looks like the original. (And no these players still aren't willing to pay $50 for a CE Mox). I know atm all they really can do is bite the bullet and either buy CE or use basic land proxies. I have all the power and I fully would approve of a "Gamma" set and you can even have original art or do new art for all I care.