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  • posted a message on Legacy Analysis: Reflections & Slivers
    Quote from Tylorp
    Not disqualifying it may be the peak of an upward trend. But I wouldn't look at it as 20 people, I'd look at it more as 41% decline. It's quite alarming.

    I pulled one month kinda at random just to get a feel for the numbers. I wouldn't be surprised to see other months pull much closer to each other.

    For what it's worth, there were MORE Legacy events in Feb 2013 than there were in Feb 2011 (39 to 47). Legacy is still very much being played.

    Quote from Morningstar81
    WotC has indeed become rather good at printing cards that affect Legacy without being broken in Standard. So sure, WotC does throw a bone to the Legacy community every now and then.

    Which flies in the face of your earlier assessment that WotC does not care about Legacy or Legacy players.

    However, that does absolutely nothing to make the format more affordable and available, or to attract new players to it. Unless WotC abolish the reserved list, Legacy will die out eventually. It may last a few more years in major European or US cities, but in smaller places it is already becoming impossible to find a Legacy game.

    In many small places in America you have to travel far to play in Standard or Modern events. That's just part of being a fanatic of something still off the mainstream radar like Magic: The Gathering. I don't buy this excuse for one second.

    Since WotC is carving a new Magic paradigm in Standard, centered around creatures and big spells, and is banning the appeal out of Modern (for some of us, at least), if they do decide to stick to the reserved list, then many current Legacy players will have nowhere else to go.

    And again with the digs at Modern. 20 BANS IN ONE MONTH OF LEGACY. That is far beyond anything they've done thus far for Modern. And it's not a question of deciding to stick with the Reserve List. They have made it clear that they will not consider it at all, despite how vocal some of you may about it. As I stated above, even if the average number of players per event has dropped, there were much more Legacy events run in Feb 2013 than two years prior. Taken as a whole, the numbers of participants in Legacy events during the entire month pulled rather close to even. Seems like you have plenty of places to go, sorry if you might actually have to travel a bit for it. Players have been having to do that often for many many years for many many other formats.

    If WotC had reprinted a few decent spells in M14 (e.g., Thoughtseize and Lightning Bolt) then maybe some of us could look to Standard with the hope of finding something appealing. Alas, that was not the case.

    You were never going to "look to Standard". You would look to new sets to pick out which singles to order. And Thoughtseize? Lightning Bolt? One was just reprinted only a few years ago and shouldn't even be something you are crying about, and the other is pricey but is FAR LOWER on the list of overpriced Legacy staples. Sorry if it's harsh, but if you aren't willing to shed a few twenties to pick up a care you really want/need for Legacy, you shouldn't be trying to play Legacy.
    Posted in: Articles
  • posted a message on Legacy Analysis: Reflections & Slivers
    Quote from Morningstar81
    You can pick up the trend by looking through TCDecks. Apart from SCG opens, the average number of players per tournament and the frequency of mid-large tournaments (60+ players) have dwindled down significantly since 2011 (which is as far back as you can go).

    Feb 2011 Average Players per event (not counting SCG Open): 50.9
    Feb 2013 Average Players per event (not counting SCG Open): 30.2

    So Legacy is going to die because 20 less people per events are showing up over the last two years? Also note that the site is missing information for some of the events, and that because it carries no data for the years before 2011 it's impossible to track this as a trend. There simply isn't really enough information to make such a claim. I'm interested to see whether the numbers from 2011 are part of a downward trend, or the peak of an upward one.

    What I've expressed is a conclusion that many a Legacy player has come to in recent times. I've heard quite a few Legacy players express their concern over the future of the format, and with half a mind to cash out.

    I'm not saying that you haven't. I am questioning whether this is newsworthy material for an article, though. Even for MTGSalvation.

    Maybe all is fine and dandy with the format where you play - good for you if it is - but in many other places, people are concerned, and feeling neglected by WotC.

    Maybe things are a little sparse around the area where you play -my condolences if that's the case - but in many other places people are still playing plenty of Legacy events.

    I feel that is a good enough reason to write an article, particular given the historical date.
    If you disagree with my assessments or opinions, then we must agree to disagree.

    You still haven't addressed my point on how WotC "doesn't care about Legacy and doesn't acknowledge you guys at all" when many new cards are Legacy playable, many of which become staples for many decks and strategies, and the existence of Mental Misstep is due exclusively to an desire to shake up the Legacy metagame.
    Posted in: Articles
  • posted a message on Legacy Analysis: Reflections & Slivers
    Quote from Morningstar81
    So what should I say if my opinion is that Modern is disappointing and that the direction in which Standard is going is somewhat stupefied in comparison with what it was?
    I didn't even expect the last one to be polemic in the slightest given that WotC has been rather public about its effort to simplify the game.

    Simplify is not the same as stupefy. A dictionary can help anyone figure that out.

    Unfortunately I can't play Magic by myself, and the number of players in Legacy tournaments has dwindled down significantly over the past two years.

    Cite your source for this, please.

    Plus, the current buzz is that SCG is switching from Legacy to Modern, which may just be the nail in the coffin for Legacy.

    Again, source please? Because...

    Quote from Ben Bleiweiss Twitter »
    "SCG has no intention of running Modern Opens. We feel Legacy is a better format, and plan on continuing it in 2013."

    Moving right along...

    That Magic is reaching is 20th birthday but WotC only seems to care about the last 10 years of its history.
    Again, this is not a problem that troubles me alone, but a problem that troubles a large portion of the Legacy community.

    They are ignoring the first 10 years of history by not reprinting a batch of cards that they promised not to reprint? Because I don't see then pretending those first 10 years didn't exist. I could swear Coldsnap (which came out in the last 10 years) was a follow-up/conclusion to Ice Age and Alliances (sets which came out in the first 10 years). Many older cards from the first 10 years have seen reprints in the FTV sets (such as Ancient Tomb, Hymn to Tourach, and Beserk). I mean, I can understand why the low quantity and high price point of many Legacy staples is troublesome to Legacy players, but how is this a problem any different now than it's ever been?

    Again, unless there's something else you haven't explained properly yet, this reeks of more crying about the Restricted List.

    Er... I thought that the point was pretty clear - I find it hard to have to quit something into which I've been invested for 16 years of my life.
    If I had been playing Magic for 2 or 3 years, the prospect of quitting wouldn't be nearly as impactful.

    That depends on, among other things, how much money you've invested into Magic during that time.

    Magic isn't going anywhere anytime soon. Legacy isn't going anywhere anytime soon. Legacy and Modern are two very different beasts, and attract players for very different reasons. I play and love both formats. I don't feel you've produced any reason for which someone may logically come to the conclusion that Legacy is in any danger that hasn't already been a hurdle Legacy has faced for years (the price of entry and the Reserved List). If anything, in the last 5 years I've seen cards made which not only see Legacy play on a regular basis but sometimes turn the entire metagame on it's head - no small feat for a format as old and as rigid as Legacy. That Mental Misstep was formulated almost EXCLUSIVELY to affect the Legacy metagame flies in the face of what you claim to be worried about, regardless of the outcome.

    Link: Ben Bleiweiss Twitter - Oct 26, 2012
    Posted in: Articles
  • posted a message on Legacy Analysis: Reflections & Slivers
    Quote from Morningstar81
    Sure, that is your opinion. I've expressed mine.

    You've expressed yours in a way so as to present in as fact.

    "There was nothing inherently wrong with this, if they had done a good job in shaping up the Modern format, but unfortunately that was not the case."

    "While in Legacy and Vintage WotC have been managing the Banned & Restricted list with sense and sensibility, in Modern they have been about as subtle as a hippopotamus"

    Modern still has about half the ban list that Legacy does. And within one calendar year, Legacy once saw 20 bans. That doesn't sound very subtle at all. What IS missing is unbannings, which I do agree is something Modern is ready for.

    Look, the column is called "Legacy Analysis" for a reason, it is devoted to the Legacy community.
    I've expressed opinions that are shared by a large portion of that community. I am perfectly aware that other Magic communities have different opinions, and in no point in my article did I express disrespect for those communities or their opinions - I have simply stated my own opinions and those of my community.

    Declaring a format as a failure or disappointment, and using terms such as "stupefied" comes across as rather insulting and disrespectful. Just so you know.

    As I said in the article, the wonderful thing about Magic is that it can be almost whatever game the player wants it to be.
    Those of us that enjoy Legacy enjoy cheap powerful spells, and we're concerned that, with the current direction of Standard and the state of Modern, if Legacy dies out, there will be nowhere left to go for us.

    I've been playing Magic for 16 years now, so excuse me if I don't enjoy the prospect of quitting the game, and excuse me if I feel that the needs of a community of players like me are being neglected by WotC.

    Your cards aren't going anywhere, are they? The format isn't going the way of Extended, is it? I've never had much unreasonable trouble finding Legacy games and tournaments online or in person. Last I checked, even with the issues of availability, people still play Legacy. And as even mentioned in your article, cards comes down the pipe which affect Legacy as a format (Abrupt Decay and Deathrite Shaman).

    So what exactly is the problem that troubles you so? That a Core Set doesn't have something splashy for Legacy? Since when has a Core Set been anything other than a very simple primer of Magic: The Gathering? That the Restricted List is a thing? Heaven forbid a company keeps a promise it made to the public. I find myself wishing sometimes that it didn't exist, but in the same breath I find myself commending Hasbro/WotC for turning down a potential gold mine for the sake of integrity. Furthermore, "Modern Masters" wasn't particularly affordable for most players, so I fail to see how a "Legacy Masters" set is going to be any different (I in fact would expect it to be worse). Unless of course it isn't the PRICE of the format staples that is worrisome but the QUANTITY of cards available that is holding Legacy back. But then that would render even more of your observations/opinions of the disappointment/failure of Modern moot.

    By the way, I've been playing since '94. Not sure what that's supposed to mean to you, but seeing as how you felt throwing out how long you've been playing is supposed to mean something I felt obligated to do the same.
    Posted in: Articles
  • posted a message on Legacy Analysis: Reflections & Slivers
    Quote from Tylorp
    Also don't lash out at modern because the reserve list is strangling legacy. If you don't like the format don't play it, but don't rag on the people who do.

    This. I feel like most people who decide to bang on Modern and how it's been managed thus far are both frustrated Legacy players and ignorant of the growth of Legacy's ban list in it's first few years. With VERY few exceptions, I feel the Modern format is in capable hands. Initial bannings were to ensure the format wouldn't just be the same old Legacy/Extended meta-game. They've been pretty clear about what they want and don't want for the format.

    EDIT: Going over it again, I'm struck by his assumption that people play Modern simply to get the slight flavor of an eternal format with the lower cost point. This is untrue, and another indicator of the general selfishness of the writer. The whole of the article, beyond the M14 evaluation, is just whining about the Reserve List and Modern.
    Posted in: Articles
  • posted a message on [Deck] Modern Burn (8/2011 - 2/2013)
    This seems like a lot of work for no benefit. You are going to slow roll the first few turns, generally the most important to a deck like this, and deploy a wacky manabase just to get max value out of one card? It works in Zoo because Zoo is stretching for colors anyway. It doesn't work here. Seems like a waste of time.
    Posted in: Modern Archives - Proven
  • posted a message on [Primer] Living End
    Quote from Red4win
    So i was looking back at the cascade cards and saw this in the rulings. "5/1/2009: If a spell with Cascade is countered, the Cascade ability will still resolve normally."
    Is this correct?

    Yes. Cascade is a triggered ability, and it is put on the stack when you cast the spell. At this point, even if the original spell is countered, the ability is still on the stack waiting to resolve.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on [Primer] Living End
    Quote from IxidorVersionTwo
    In the current meta, our worst match-up is UR Combo decks (Storm and Splinter-Twin). Ghostly Prison is your best friend if you can produce white mana by turn 3.

    I hate that it is a blank on Tron decks, but everything else about it makes sense. I will add this to the list of things to try next.

    Quote from Sirdanile
    Main brindle boars and I can see this working out without being terribly painful, also good against burn/aggro if your meta is full of it.

    This is what I've done. I'm relying on Shock/Fetches and need the life. So far I'm digging it.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on [Primer] Living End
    Sojourners are an option I've look at before, but they just aren't splashy enough for the cost, Esper or Jund.

    I am realizing that I have to pay much more attention to my life total playing with so many fetches and shocks. Once I've settled on some solid numbers I'll post another list, but Brindle Boar has come off the bench. This mainly affects you when up against something like Burn or Affinity. Affinity we just pray we can take the turn or 2 of swings before we can wipe, as usual. It'll just be a hair closer than we may be comfy with. Burn, however, pretty much picks up game 1 unless you've got boars in main (depending on your meta, may not be a bad idea with this build).

    However, it isn't all bad. So many one-mana card draws makes the deck feel more combo. I feel a bit better about spreading out my SB slots because of how deep I can dig in the early turns. And mainboard Leylind of the Void is a dream. Casting it isn't a headache, and it's almost always relevant.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on [Primer] Living End
    Adding Blue has always been on my list of ideas, and is indeed where I'm going with the Legacy version of this deck I'm working on. Vendillion Clique always seems nice when you've got a dead Living End stuck in hand. :p
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on [Primer] Living End
    No problem, best of luck to you amigo. I'm still tinkering with the mana base to get it just right. Ghost Quarter probably won't make the cut; in a more normal version of this deck, sure. Here, I've got too much else going on for it. I'm also kinda feeling a hurt for life gain. A pair of boars (or baloths!) are going to find a way back into this list, I'm sure.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on [Primer] Living End
    The last time I piloted this deck regularly, I was quite happy with it. This time around, I want to tinker around with it more. Here are some of the ideas I've got cooking under the hood.

    Glassdust Hulk: Yes, you heard me. Him. I never gave him an honest chance in this deck because I stupidly chose to remember him as a 3/2 or something instead of looking him up again. 3/4 is worthy. W/U isn't as hard to swing in this deck as you'd think (more on this later).

    Land Destruction: I've always only been half-in with the idea of Land D to disrupt the opponent. I've run mainboard Fulminators and Beast Withins, played with Avalanche Riders in the past, and even now I'm trying out running 2 Ghost Quarters main. But more decks than you think can handle pressure like that, and Land D certainly isn't a slam dunk against Tron variants. To this end, I've cut Fulminator from the deck entirely. Beast Within is still a part of the mix because of its versatility. Ghost Quarter gets a pass right now because its "free", doesn't really take a spot from anything else, and might do the trick just as well.

    Leyline of the Void: I'm kinda sold on running this main. My current build has loaded up 4 from the get go. It often makes Jund Charm and Faerie Macabre look bad. There is almost no downside to it, from what I see.

    Without further ado, this is what I've been testing lately...

    - Mana base is really where the most changes are. No more Scars block duals. One basic left as a nod to Path to Exile and such. 4th Forbidden Orchard to cover not only the additions of White and Blue to the deck, but the 4th Demonic Dread as well. A Shock Land based system working off of Arid Mesa. If Ghost Quarter falls through, Temple Garden and Godless Shrine will take its place.

    - I do not go for landcycling creatures or cycling 2 creatures. My goal is to fill up the yard faster, and spit it out faster (hence why I'm not running much Land D at all), and I can't do that paying 2 to cycle. Decks like Infect and Affinity scoop to you if you can get 2-3 in and out of the yard and shatter their aggro push. Tron decks will stomp you out if you let the game go too long, no matter how many dudes you get into the yard. And then there's yard hate; nothing like losing the last 2 turns of work to a Crypt or Relic.

    -Simian Spirit Guide. Want to power out one more cycler? He's your man. Want to power out a turn 2 Beast Within to disrupt your opponent's plans? He's your man. Want to feint tapping out to Violent Outburst at their EOT but still want a red mana to pop off a Ricochet Trap if you have to? He's your man. I've even cast the ****er in some desperate, DESPERATE situations.

    - 1 Angel's Grace in the side because **** YOU HIVE MIND. It breaks my heart, but I'm cutting back on Ingot Chewer to make room for Wispmare. Rest is Peace is a thing, bro. Grip is a good all arounder, with backup from Sudden Death to help with the Splinter Twin match up. 2 Loaming Shamans right now where I would've had 2 Bridle Boars or something. Loaming Shaman saves the day in any game that goes long. He allows you to repeatedly wipe away a board, something that may often make a huge difference. I'd bring him in against counter heavy decks (as you can fire off and worry not; even if they counter it, you'll get it back), aggro (keep trying to drop dudes, I'll keep wiping), and generally anything that outlast me through 5 turns or more without me already being dead (Burn, Storm, Hive Mind, etc.).

    - I do miss Faerie Macabre and Jund Charm sometimes.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on [Primer] Living End
    Quote from PopeJP
    Edit: Over the course of typing this post I've come to the conclusion that Rakdos Charm isn't a good idea, especially on MTGO where people don't ever make the infinite tokens 'cause they actually have to go through the motions. If they know we can do it, they can play around it soooo easily. It's just as counterable as Living End but at least that makes it so we can survive until the next turn, minimum. Maaaybe you can side in Charm for game 2 for a surprise win, but you're still relying on your opponent to make the mistake of making 15-20+ tokens (depending on shockland/fetchland damage) when in reality he probably needs a lot less than that. If you win a game 2 with this you'd have to side it back out for game 3, 'cause there's no way they'd make that mistake twice.

    Yup. I just don't get the Rakdos Charm love. I've already been able to hose graveyards at will. Just doesn't seem worthy.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on [Primer] Living End
    Quote from WyvernSlayer
    My god, where have you been? We missed you. XD

    PTQ season on MTGO finished and I took a break from the deck, and Modern, for a little bit. Coming back in, looking to shake things out. I'm glad I'm remembered.

    I agree. All Melira really does is "double" our life total against infect. One copy of her will slow them down, but we lose an unacceptable amount of speed by swapping out Living End for her. I say just play the Simian Spirit Guide list if you don't want to die to infect on turn 2. It's not pretty, but it'll do.

    Melira does jack here; Replacing Living Ends with a Fog effect will actually do more than Melira does. If Infect is the fear, go with SSG, Dismembers, and Ingot chewers. SSG will do wonders, at the sacrifice of popping Living End for seemingly very little gain, usually 2 MAYBE 3 dudes (c'mon STREET WRAITHS!). The point is wiping them out, at instant speed no less. Played and timed properly, this would always always always blow out Affinity players, and it will hose Infect too.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • posted a message on [Deck] Modern Burn (8/2011 - 2/2013)

    Took down 5 rounds of single elimination (Overdrive 73) with this list, after having not played it in months. I made some blind changes and just diced it; I didn't expect it to go the distance, but I just wanted to get my feet wet again.

    -Maindeck Grim was neat in a few matches, but I think he's side material. I also feel Deathrite is worth side material, and I've yet to try out Vexing Devil.

    -The lone Miracle was a mistake. I never cast it, and I really only ended up eating a spot with it.

    -I like the idea of Rakdos Charm compressing Grip and Relic into less SB slots, but it's just not good enough. Yes, hitting enchantments matters. Sometimes Split Second does, too. And extra Relics become card draw when not needed for anything else; Rakdos Charm has the option for conditional damage. I may try it out, but I'm not quite sold on it.

    -Leyline of Sanctity is going into the SB at some point. Once I, you know, figure what the hell I'm doing with it.

    Just to pee on the fire a bit, I was watching semi-finals and noticed a Living End deck running Ghost Quarters. Even though it ended up folding to a Tron deck, the Ghost Quarters gave it some legs in that fight and held off the Tron player for quite a long while. That being said, Living End (a favorite of mine) has almost no problem with a few Ghost Quarters because it can still cast almost all of its spells off of it. Burn, however, has to have that colored mana. In the list above, only the Keldons would be cast off them (well, technically Rift Bolt and Wrath, but if you are hardcasting these spells you are doing it wrong). I don't doubt their capability at the right moments, but I don't think it warrants running them main.
    Posted in: Modern Archives - Proven
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